POLL: leaning system.

[*LK1* 10]

i hope this POLL will not be closed cuz it already exist an arma 3 wishlist thread. polls are just a deep tool to know what the community thinks about this features. and specifically this feature it's an important option that allow you to diversify the actions you can implement to face the enemy. so the way this features works is important, in a game oriented on the simulation.

the problem i see with the current system is simple: the current action by pressing Q&E is to quick, seems like your avatar has springs on his flanks.

there some people also, i wouldn't say many (but some of the players), it uses this action to avoid enemy fire while they face an enemy in front of them. they see you and they press Q or E while they are shooting, cuz of course you can do both movements in the same time. that's happens especially in CTF maps due to the different attitude these players have comparated with coop players, usually. i mean i know is not a biiig deal, but every aspect that could improve the game experience should be toke in consideration (personal thought).

moreover i don't think is nice or even realistic to see a soldier moving in some weird and twisted poses while is also able to aim and to fire a light machine gun.

so my little suggestion is to being able to act the leaning action gradually and only from a static position.

should works like: you want to lean and you press a key to activate this option, well now by moving your mouse left or right you can lean left or right, and if you move L or R but you want to aim at the second floor of a palace, for example, you have just to move high your mouse. if you want to shoot to a lower target, while you are leaning, just move the mouse L or R an even LOW. so pretty much you are able to lean and to aim in every direction.

when you want to deactivate it there could be 2 options: you re-press the key for the leaning system or you simply move the movements key like W or D since you cant move and lean at the same time.

so i gave 3 option on the poll:

1) you like the current system.

2)you like the system suggested.

3) you would like to see a different solution from the current avaible but not the solution suggested on the first post.

if you have voted for option 3 please explain with details which solution you would like to see in the game.

feel free(of course) to explain every idea flow on your minds.

if i saw a lot of people suggesting a specific and detailed feature i will try to add it on the poll. until that vote for option 3 if you dont like the 1 or 2.

oh i've forgot something: i know we can have a gradual leaning system with the trackIR but i would to see everyone being able to do this option in a better way. even without trackIR.

so what you guys thinks :bounce3:

Edited September 6, 2011 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[.kju 3245]

leaning is way overrated anyway

most important is movement and stance

if BI should improve something it is a proper cover system

[*LK1* 10]

they can improve both: movements&stance and leaning.

Edited September 6, 2011 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[.kju 3245]

no - resources are limited

and leaning is not important

[*LK1* 10]

personally i really i dont think that leaning is not important. since is a feature present in

which allow you to difersify, in a realistic way, your style of combat.

plus i dont see why we should rework the movements and stance, i feel good with the currents animations. resource are not limited. arma 3 will came out after 1 year.

Edited September 6, 2011 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[dmarkwick 261]

Improved fine movement is indeed something that could improve, not just leaning but crouching & rising too. The ability to raise your head to peep over grass, or a wall, while prone or crouching is sorely needed, and I guess it comes under the same movement family as lean. I use 3rd person to sometimes overcome these shortcomings, and we all know how people feel about 3rd person :D

Of course, TrackIR users have the ideal control solution already, just by moving their head. I would support this method, but I can't see how a keyboard/mouse solution would work. Unless you have a freelook system that "locks" your position when you release, and say a return-to-normal function by double-tapping.

So, as well as lean, we should be able to crouch down and raise up in analogue increments too. We could then use windows etc without going into one of only 3 positions, which often means either not being able to see/shoot, or lollipopping your position to everyone.

Also, I should say that IMO the ingame lean is not "deep" enough, and I refer to successful lean solutions like Raven Shield and Hidden & Dangerous 2, which both had good lean functions.

Edited September 6, 2011 by DMarkwick

[*LK1* 10]

The ability to raise your head to peep over grass, or a wall, while prone or crouching is sorely needed,

i wellcome this new opportunity.

I use 3rd person to sometimes overcome these shortcomings, and we all know how people feel about 3rd person :D

lol :o :o

Also, I should say that IMO the ingame lean is not "deep" enough, and I refer to successful lean solutions like Raven Shield and Hidden & Dangerous 2, which both had good lean functions.

basically these are the games i was thinking about when i proposed the leaning system. hidden & dangerous seems to offer the better solution. unlike raven shield which give a gradual leaning system but you can walk with that weird pose while you are shooting.

Edited September 6, 2011 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[b101_uk 10]

Surly if before you fix the leaning/shooting problem you have to have a pre-selection of being right or left handed, then from there your less favoured side you would be less accurate and have to expose more of your body to shoot.

[kylania 568]

No "movement modes" please. This isn't a console game. It's fine how it is, and if you want gradual lean just get TrackIR.

[*LK1* 10]

No "movement modes" please. This isn't a console game. It's fine how it is, and if you want gradual lean just get TrackIR.

what we have right now is a movement mode, by pressing Q or E.

personally what makes this game arcadish (a console game) is the possibility to

lean like you have a spring on your flank and to move like a contortion artist.

is a poor way to activate this movements mode.

as happens right now. but hey we are in the internet, we have different ideas :)

edit: the current leaning system does not make me so angry. just i would to see it improved.

Edited September 6, 2011 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[MissionCreep 12]

OK ... nevermind.

Edited September 6, 2011 by MissionCreep

[-FHA-Dynamo 0]

"leaning isn't important" are you kidding me? next to moving, leaning is one of the basic fundamental actions a combat operator does to keep him/her self alive on a battlefield. when moving from cover to cover, an operator always checks around the corner before moving. stepping out of a blind corner without knowing whats past it is a sure fire way to get shot.

i agree with the op that the lean speed is a bit fast. i wouldn't mind having the speed turned down by maybe 15-20% to make it more fluid and natural.

if there is one thing i would change other than speed of leaning, it would be to add the ability to transition between right and left shoulders. due to the multiple wars we have now, transition drills are being taught to soldiers as the need to be dynamic in a CQC environments has become a major factor in the combat affectedness of operators.

anyone stating that weapon transitioning or for that matter leaning is unrealistic, obviously has never been in a combat theater getting shot at.

if BIS doesn't change the current lean system, i don't really mind, it's better than not having it at all.

[froggyluv 2136]

leaning is way overrated anyway

most important is movement and stance

if BI should improve something it is a proper cover system

Lean I'm not say worried about but yes to cover system especially the ability for the gun's height to adjust when you pull up irons from behind a wall or object. RO2 feels great and instinctive without being over the top.

Arma it often feels like soldiers and objects inhabit 2 different dimensions in terms of being able to tacticaly adjust around them or lay your weapon on to rest as well as vaulting.

Edit: And yes i'm sure my wife would leave me if she spotted me with TrackIR -mic's bad enough.

[metalcraze 290]

moreover i don't think is nice or even realistic to see a soldier moving in some weird and twisted poses while is also able to aim and to fire a light machine gun.

FYI nothing stops you from moving and firing in "some weird and twisted poses" in real life

Lean I'm not say worried about but yes to cover system especially the ability for the gun's height to adjust when you pull up irons from behind a wall or object. RO2 feels great and instinctive without being over the top.

What if I don't want my height to auto-adjust? Can't look through ironsights without being exposed = silly

Edited September 6, 2011 by metalcraze

[froggyluv 2136]

What if I don't want my height to auto-adjust? Can't look through ironsights without being exposed = silly

What are you on about? Facing a smallwall while looking down your iron sights I'd like to be able to pop over and use as cover. First off, it only works if you are dead tight against it and there is a slight delay. I see no good reason you'd want to stay facing point blank against inanimate object for any length of time and either way the positives outweighs the negatives.

[*LK1* 10]

FYI

eh?

nothing stops you from moving and firing in "some weird and twisted poses" in real life

to be honest nothing stop you from jumping, farting, insulting your officiers,

and even....ah seriusly do i have to give you a response? must be kidding me.

lol.

[maturin 12]

It's true that the degree to which in-game soldiers can lean without moving their legs is unrealistic. However, having to reshuffle your feet to lean would likely make the movement even more clunky and spasmodic.

[katipo66 94]

leaning is way overrated anyway

most important is movement and stance

if BI should improve something it is a proper cover system

Agreed, I always thought leaning was a realistic feature, when in fact it isn't, not in arma anyways.

What is really annoying is if you crouch behind a wall you are unable to shoot from behind it unless you stand, At least that is one of the few things Red river got right is the ability to raise weapon just above the height of the wall if crouched and aiming

[daman3 19]

The game Vietcong has really realistic lean with the use

of the foot and in no way does it hinder the gameplay.

[*LK1* 10]

well basically that's why i see the suggestioni gave as a good compromise:

you go near a wall and you activate the leaning key, H for example.

now more you move your mouse left and more you lean left, with a limit which is the real capability of an human being that is in combat and he dont want to be the clown of the group, and in case you someone on a higher pos. you move your scope on him. when you want to move forward you repress H or the movements key.

probably due to my fault, i cant see a problem with this solution

unlike the current 1 which is a bit primitive

---------- Post added at 10:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:49 PM ----------

The game Vietcong has really realistic lean with the use

of the foot and in no way does it hinder the gameplay.

how it works.

Edited September 6, 2011 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[galzohar 31]

Lean speed may be too fast (need to see a video with that, though, since I must say I've never seen it abused!), but even more importantly how much you actually lean is too little, making leaning not the most useful thing even though it really should be. Both need fixing, even though they aren't really related.

More flexible control of your character can be nice, but really needs to avoid over-complicating things or killing developer's time that could be better used for other things. So I think we'll be fine with simply slightly improved lean on both aspects I mentioned.

[*LK1* 10]

lYGcB1acawM

something like this could be a good solution too, but in this case we should turn off the 3d. as you can see you can hide behind the trench and at the same time shooting the enemies with accuracy.

---------- Post added at 11:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:04 PM ----------

Lean speed may be too fast (need to see a video with that, though, since I must say I've never seen it abused

unfortunately i cant find a video showing this feature. just open your game
go on the editor and start press QEQEQEQEQE. you'll understand what i mean;)

[Steakslim 1]

Am I one of the few people who find leaning in ArmA2 extremely useful?

[*LK1* 10]

strange isn't it?

Edited September 6, 2011 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[PuFu 4600]

sidestep leaning would be better than the current leaning...but, i would always have the current lean form over no lean any day