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ArmA3 scenario first look

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first off, the new arma 3 scenario both intrigues me and worries me.

From the information we now have, the Europeans and the US are fighting a big ol' war. the enemies could possibly be the Chinese with Iranian help. NATO is apparently getting its ass kicked, and "being driven into the sea".

The prospect for a large scale force on force all out war is an amazing prospect for a scenario reminiscent of the second world war. however, in game we are being relegated to a small island far from the apparent front lines, on a ZMOG SPESHUL FORRSEZ MISSON. This HUGELY disappoints me, but it somewhat makes scene from a technological point of view. current and near future technology will not be able to handle a 100,000km2 chunk of Europe to play out a progressive war on. (i personally no longer like "island" type maps, and have come to like the inland maps that give the illusion of being part of something much larger.)

this sort of scenario also gives BIS and modders alot of room to expand the world and add in other armies and maps. I really want to see an expansion that focuses on the main front lines, with whole divisions maneuvering and such, with the chaos and confusion of being just a private in an apocalyptic war that will more than likely end all wars, or being a captain or fullbird Col trying desperately to hold onto a bit of land against a superior foe.

the phase 3 war is just a much more appealing scenario than some SF mission gone wrong. but, i will buy it, and i'm sure i will love it all the same. :cool:

The biggest irony here is this war happens in the future, with a bunch of new futury things. but if the war has been as devastating as they say and been going on for "years", its going to have a MAJOR economic impact on all players.

the general quality of everything is going to go down. the quality of equipment and men as depleted countrys push men out onto the front as quickly as possible. many soldiers would be going to battle with out many of the things we have today, like body armor and big expensive toys like lasers, fancy reflex sights/acog and zomg cool gunz.

in the case of the US, i can almost guarantee that we could not sustain our levels of proficiency and technology in such a war. its just far too costly

not to mention how fucked up the European states are (having withered war and occupation)

however, by the looks of it BIS are not going to take this factors into account, and everyone is going to have their best tech lined up all the time (and i might add, why the hell would the opfor deploy such a force on such a tiny island? they need that armor and close air on the front!).

so wile im at it, is there going to be better simulation of infantry body armor?

I am also quite interested in how the Russians are going to play a role. its possible the China Russian and Iran are all together, but i never though the Russians and Chinese had good enough relations to go to war on the same side. Perhaps Russia will be allied with the NATO counties? perhaps they will remain neutral?

what do you all think? anything else to add? more insight?

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I think it would be intersting to see Russia team up with NATO for a change. They always seem to be portrayed as the bad guys. From an international relations point of view, it would make much more sense for Russia to do so if China was one of the antagonists in the campaign since China and Russia have battled for territory in the past.

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I think the whole "island" feeling is sort of negated by the fact the landmass is 477 km^2

That's at least 2.5 times bigger than Chernarus.

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I think it would be intersting to see Russia team up with NATO for a change. They always seem to be portrayed as the bad guys. From an international relations point of view, it would make much more sense for Russia to do so if China was one of the antagonists in the campaign since China and Russia have battled for territory in the past.

You can pretend "Russia Federals" as a faction, too.

They key point is not what Russia will going to alliance with, rather, what Russia is planning for their own. If encounter against China do make a benefit more than sacrifice; NATO, leaded by US, must have known this before Russian do. It will be more like war of survivals than historical causes.

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That's at least 2.5 times bigger than Chernarus.

Hide & seek mission anyone? ;)

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The scenario is the worst thing in this future game.

It's like a cold war scenario in the future (USSR =Iran/China). :confused:

All I understand is that a coalition of china and Iran beat the NATO force without any big problem. Just imagine the logistical nightmare for this force (CHINA---> UE). I think future combat is really reduce in possibility (with nuclear weapon).

No country in the world will try to attack another with classic frontline.

I'm really disappointed with this :(

Aze

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The scenario is the worst thing in this future game.

It's like a cold war scenario in the future (USSR =Iran/China). :confused:

All I understand is that a coalition of china and Iran beat the NATO force without any big problem. Just imagine the logistical nightmare for this force (CHINA---> UE). I think future combat is really reduce in possibility (with nuclear weapon).

No country in the world will try to attack another with classic frontline.

I'm really disappointed with this :(

Aze

We have no confirmation that OPFOR is China/Iran .

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I share your concerns, a conflict focused on an island while a Continent wide conflict raes with battle lines shifiting potentially 100s of miles a day. The website does say there's some sort of military secret on the idland, which could be a plausible reason for an intense conflict in such a small area (I say small, I mean in terms of the world, clearly the map is impressively large). I guess it depends what the secret is, and for that we shall have to wait.

EDIT: Also I imagine if it is a Middle Eastern side then it's some kind of Persian Coalition, rather than Iran itself. The ARG was cenred around a group reffering to itself as the Persian Black Hat Boys.

Edited by .Taffy

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Ok but what can it be?

African country?

How they can build such future vehicle like the Ka50/Mi28 in 15 years!

MiddleEast country?

Same question.

And How can cross the sea without any Nato country stop them?

Russia?

Maybe the more serious candidate.

But it's no more USSR.

China?

I think Nato country have the time to stop them between China and UE!

But all classic conflict with nuclear weapon will finish in a beautifull mushroom cloud. :yay:

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We have no confirmation that OPFOR is China/Iran .

The information that we have from the ARG points to China/Iran. Who else would it be? Russia? South Africa? Trinidad?

I share your concerns, a conflict focused on an island while a Continent wide conflict raes with battle lines shifiting potentially 100s of miles a day. The website does say there's some sort of military secret on the idland, which could be a plausible reason for an intense conflict in such a small area (I say small, I mean in terms of the world, clearly the map is impressively large). I guess it depends what the secret is, and for that we shall have to wait.

I don't like the military secret thing. It sounds too much like a James Bond movie to me. I would've rather had the objective be that there is a strategic area that will cut their supply lines or something like that. Some important piece of land that is strategic because it will shift forces not because there is some super weapon there. Granted I don't know what it is but I'm guessing super weapon. *crosses fingers for chronosphere*.

I'll still buy it but I won't be as happy as if they would've gone 1985 World War III(CWC events cause WWIII? with Status Quo taking place after it?) with the objective being a strategic area or even an area where nothing THAT important happens and is more about the individuals there. I kind of like the way PROJECT ACES did it with Ace Combat 6. The player's character wasn't the center of the story but the story revolved around how the player's actions affected the lives of others. I think I'll still enjoy the game though. "Time will tell. Sooner or later... time will tell."

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I think the whole "island" feeling is sort of negated by the fact the landmass is 477 km^2

That's at least 2.5 times bigger than Chernarus.

Is that the land part of Cherno or including the water?

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Do we have official word on the size of the new island? Just because google earth says one thing doesn't mean we'll get it.

EDIT: Just to be clear I would love a map that size. At times I was even finding Chernarus to be kinda...small...

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I just hate the ELITE SPECIAL FORCES thing. OFP was great because it was chaotic and you were just trying to survive with a good plot. now its just executing special forces missions without any heart.

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Is that the land part of Cherno or including the water?

[iF THE ISLAND IS MODELLED ON A 1:1 SCALE]

The land part of Chernarus is about 180 km^2, while Lemnos' landmass is 477 km^2, so it's landmass is exactly 2.65 times the size of Chernarus!

With the ocean I think Lemnos might approach 600 km^2, a lot more space to use jets.

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[iF THE ISLAND IS MODELLED ON A 1:1 SCALE]

The land part of Chernarus is about 180 km^2, while Lemnos' landmass is 477 km^2, so it's landmass is exactly 2.65 times the size of Chernarus!

With the ocean I think Lemnos might approach 600 km^2, a lot more space to use jets.

They cant surely decide to split the Island.

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I just hate the ELITE SPECIAL FORCES thing. OFP was great because it was chaotic and you were just trying to survive with a good plot. now its just executing special forces missions without any heart.

If the Special Forces missions become more like they did in OFP when you played as James Gastovski crawling through bushes to avoid detection the they would be on the right track.

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Yes, less special forces machismo that reflects very little on what SF does and more of the "oh shit I am a corporal in something that is way bigger than me!" feeling.

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I don't think this will be a generic SF mission, maybe the first few missions, but it clearly states you're the last man standing until you (somehow) get an army to fight with you.

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I think it'd be worth it to go back to that map we got from the ARG:

http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/8541/mapmf.jpg

I have highlighted the real world geographical location of Lemnos as well as where NATO would be if those arrows are in fact movement of OPFOR. Note that the top left labels the plan as "phase 5" - it wouldn't be much of a stretch to assume that this is the point where our friend miller finds himself stranded on Lemnos.

It's not clear what is going on in the rest of the world, but I'd bargain that Russia is in fact with China and Iran on OPFOR (china and iran aren't confirmed, but has been hinted at in ARG).

- Russian front is stable

- Atlantic seems to be in OPFOR hands, which would make the most sense held by Russian naval forces.

China's role is probably to keep the US at bay in the Pacific. Japan was overstretched in WWII and did pretty well in the opening shots of WWII. A much more widespread and stronger military force would tie up the US and help explain OPFOR presence in the Atlantic. There are whole books devoted to the subject and I don't claim to be an expert, but I think it is possible, especially with China's current (real life) buildup of its blue water navy and developments like the DF-21 aimed at gaining power in the Pacific.

And what I think about NATO and how it got there, I think a reasonable explanation is that many countries fell neutral. Maybe in the intervening 20 years in the future, NATO fell out of favor as a relic from the cold war and too unwieldy for low intensity warfare. Some members wouldn't see much point in staying and decide to sit out WWIII.

Presence of Israeli gear is interesting too - I think it's a safe bet they wouldn't fall neutral ;) If their stuff is used by OPFOR, some radical changes have happened in the future...

Soooo yeah... back to Lemnos

The released storyline says that Lemnos is deep behind enemy lines, which would be correct according to its real life geographic location on the map. "well guarded military secret" is rather vague - I hope it isn't the cliche "hunt the nuclear/chemical/alien/super deadly weapon). It does seem like a rather insignificant island in the grand scheme of things, a good place to hide your secrets. As OP said, honestly a full out, large scale, conventional war setting on the mainland would interest me more, but I guess we're stuck with what we've got (for now) and it isn't half bad either :)

The biggest irony here is this war happens in the future, with a bunch of new futury things. but if the war has been as devastating as they say and been going on for "years", its going to have a MAJOR economic impact on all players.

the general quality of everything is going to go down. the quality of equipment and men as depleted countrys push men out onto the front as quickly as possible. many soldiers would be going to battle with out many of the things we have today, like body armor and big expensive toys like lasers, fancy reflex sights/acog and zomg cool gunz.

in the case of the US, i can almost guarantee that we could not sustain our levels of proficiency and technology in such a war. its just far too costly

not to mention how fucked up the European states are (having withered war and occupation)

however, by the looks of it BIS are not going to take this factors into account, and everyone is going to have their best tech lined up all the time (and i might add, why the hell would the opfor deploy such a force on such a tiny island? they need that armor and close air on the front!).

so wile im at it, is there going to be better simulation of infantry body armor?

this isn't true - the most obvious example is WWII where the Germans were able to pioneer military tech (rockets, jet engine, better armor and guns) while suffering heavy strategic bombing by the allies and fighting their armies pretty much up to the end of the war.

War, especially conventional war, is a stimulant to the economy and production - people aren't going to say no to expenditures and unless your infrastructure is completely destroyed, (which would take a very high intensity prolonged conflict - look at how ineffective the bombing throughout WWII, and in some aspects Vietnam were) you are going to keep building things.

Edited by Contrails
added more stuff about NATO

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I dont see the point in making a gigantic island/map. 2 smaller islands seem more reasonable since theres no point loading 477 km^2 of terrain and 3 million world objects just to use a fraction of the map on a mission.

The Flashpoint isles were large enough for every single game mode supported by the game, DM, CTF, Hold, coop, CTI. Chernarus on the other hand had lots of wasted terrain and flat, empty farmland.

I would rather get two maps like Everon and Malden (ok larger and more detailed) than a single map like Chernarus or Takistan again, i hate feeling like an ant on a flight simulator.

Put 1000 players online on a map the size of Everon and i wont feel lonely and bored anymore :D .

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im not liking this storyline so far. ive been crying for all out war for years now, instead of Arma 2 esc sneaking. im not buying if this is the case.

Edited by THEBLITZ6794

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Yes. We need a proper WW3 - not the stupid AA2 campaign all over again.

Special forces are boring.

An all out war of OFP CWC was awesome and varied. You were a cog in the machine, then you were a cog in the machine commanding a tank, then you were a cog in the machine flying a chopper, then you were a cog in the machine commanding a squad. And it had special forces kind of missions too - but not more not less than the amount other types offered

Why does BIS try to appeal to kidz and their "I wanna be special"?

ArmA2's campaign was awful. I remember in one of the missions I spent two hours just running from one marker to another without firing a single shot. Because I was a "Force Recon"

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CTI. Chernarus on the other hand had lots of wasted terrain and flat, empty farmland..

You see wasted terrain, I see ample opportunity for armor engagements.

The bigger the map the better. Maybe then things like MLRS would make sense, as well as other fire support assets.

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