Project Reality - WIP Discussion

[sommergemuese 0]

I think this pudding tastes well ;)

[BigMorgan 11]

...you cannot release your mod, and then say "You can only play this mod on these servers". That is not how this community works.

And when it happens, which it may, are long-time PR supporters going to grief servers that host it "without permission"?

I don't really care for that "NO, THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO DO IT!" attitude. If it comes down to it, perhaps PR should not release publicly, as there are other closed communities using addons that they don't share with outsiders.

Just my $0.02 and best of luck to the PR team.

[-10th- Rezza 10]

PR is a public mod why not release it publicly.Wheres the sense to it then?

I am pretty sure that a lot of ArmA 2 players are looking forward to PR:ArmA 2

Don't be so negative about it :)

[BigMorgan 11]

The negativity stems from this "you can only play the mod our way" idea. I'm looking forward to the content as well, but "stopping Rambo" is entirely up to mission design not server configs.

[galzohar 31]

Mostly up to the mission design, but then again anyone can make/modify missions, load them on his server, and call it a "PR server". For the sake of everyone, it is best if it was clear to anyone playing PR that this isn't really a PR server, but rather some "I want to change PR so this server might be running a ruined version of it" server. I don't really care about how they achieve it, but I'm sure they can achieve it in community-friendly ways if they want to (aka "you can do whatever you want but officially supported servers need to do it the PR way").

[fighterman 10]

looking good guys

[-10th- Rezza 10]

Love it galzohar

aka "you can do whatever you want but officially supported servers need to do it the PR way").

[Pain0815 10]

Tell us a few gameplay elements for arma pr, to get away from this server discussion.

All i need to know are there will be servers when pr is here for arma to play on.

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

(aka "you can do whatever you want but officially supported servers need to do it the PR way").

That's what I was saying. They cannot prevent the community from hosting their mod, but they can only release their mission to the official servers.

The only way to not allow public servers would be to create a closed community. In ArmA II, if you download something, you can host a server on your machine to play with friends. PR can't change that, because that's how the game works. What they CAN do is create "Official" servers that run the PR missions and play with PR approved admins, and make sure that the "Unofficial" servers do not have access to these missions and scripts.

[gossamersolid 155]

That's what I was saying. They cannot prevent the community from hosting their mod, but they can only release their mission to the official servers.

The only way to not allow public servers would be to create a closed community. In ArmA II, if you download something, you can host a server on your machine to play with friends. PR can't change that, because that's how the game works. What they CAN do is create "Official" servers that run the PR missions and play with PR approved admins, and make sure that the "Unofficial" servers do not have access to these missions and scripts.

The ArmA 2 community is very open about modding... trying to restrict your mod to you guys only (like you have achieved in BF2), won't work here.

[BeerHunter 0]

The ArmA 2 community is very open about modding... trying to restrict your mod to you guys only (like you have achieved in BF2), won't work here.

And apparently neither does allowing servers to pack themselves with various mods.

Haven't you read the reasons why lots don't play MP (or are frustrated with it)?

The PR team is trying to avoid that fiasco by keeping the servers PURE PR so you simply DL PR , install it and play..no need to go searching for all the various mods and waiting for them to DL and install before you can play.

[Gaz_pr 10]

As someone who is connected to the PR team; I'm commenting as a neutral (as much as possible);

Sometimes the community never ceases to amaze me. Ask yourself this. If you were a new player, would you be interested in having to go to a 3rd party site to download a random app that downloaded loads of various compressed files that run out of date after say 3 days? As an avid mod fan and dev, it took me 6 weeks and someone talking me through it to actually download another realism addon. That's crazy, especially for SP/CO-OP. If I hadn't have asked, I would have uninstalled ArmA2. Think what you wish, but that's from a VBS2 network admin, infantry soldier and dev for other things. I've also been the lead tester, moderator, and various other roles for a community larger than 45 thousand users. That's what makes me think twice about the comments on here somtimes. Especially when they haven't even tried the alpha.

I, as well as the team, make no apologies for wanting to offer one file as a main installer when it comes to release. As a network admin, I dread to think of the amount of confused emails I'd receive. PR started out as a niche mod. We have no problems with vocal users refusing to play it. We're trying to improve PvP, and some users wish to give the impression that we are trying to impede this. I do not believe this is as accurate as some would want to you believe. A lot of people are looking to PR as oh no, they are locking our servers!". In real terms we've done this (through decent experience) to ensure gameplay standards. You do not NEED to download it or even try it if you're not in the least bit interested in how it plays when you PLAY it. The last thing we want to do is actually take away from the modding experience; but please respect what the mod overall is trying to achieve, whichever way it attempts it.

Edited August 16, 2010 by Gaz_pr

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

And apparently neither does allowing servers to pack themselves with various mods.

Haven't you read the reasons why lots don't play MP (or are frustrated with it)?

The PR team is trying to avoid that fiasco by keeping the servers PURE PR so you simply DL PR , install it and play..no need to go searching for all the various mods and waiting for them to DL and install before you can play.

They cannot dictate what the community does. The community can not steal or edit their work, but if members of the community want to host their own server, PR cannot stop them. They can declare Official Servers, but they can't stop unofficial ones.

@Gaz: I agree with most of that, the only thing that I am trying to say, is you cannot limit who hosts your mod. You can limit who hosts your mission, but you cannot limit the mod unless you never publicly release.

Edited August 16, 2010 by Darkhorse 1-6

[Gaz_pr 10]

@Gaz: I agree with most of that, the only thing that I am trying to say, is you cannot limit who hosts your mod. You can limit who hosts your mission, but you cannot limit the mod unless you never publicly release.

A lot of people get REALLY tied up with this point. You would not know this unless experienced, but we do not 'limit' who hosts the mod (we only check for known griefers hosting). We only crack down on servers who destroy the teamwork and core function of a team based battle. We've pretty much always let a server operate how it wants to, unless it completely FUBARED gameplay and gave a quewed opinion of PR to new players. I think think point has been missed by quite a few :( This is something it seems PR has been 'painted with', and frankly it's completely wrong. Some people complain about this; I say it's improved gameplay. Only time will tell on the OA engine.

Another preconceptin is that we babysit servers. We don't! We have a game to progress guys :) We do not babysit servers. We will however look into, and act where needed, on servers that do not (1) encourage the core gameplay values of Project Reality. and (2) do not follow PR's mission statement. We don't 'strike from behind' either. It's counter-productive in the extreme! I hope I've dispelled some random assumptions!

Edited August 16, 2010 by Gaz_pr

[Big Mac 19]

A lot of people get REALLY tied up with this point. You would not know this unless experienced, but we do not 'limit' who hosts the od. We only crack down on servers who destroy the teanwork and core function of a team based battle. We've pretty much always let a server operate how it wants to, unless it completely FUBARED gameplay and gave a quewed opinion of PR to new players. I think think point has been missed by quite a few :( This is something it seems PR has been 'painted with', and frankly it's completely wrong.

I myself don't play too much PvP unless it's done in a mature manner, but it's a bit high and mighty telling someone what they can and can't do on their own server. Yes it is your mod, but when you release it publicly people can do pretty much what they want with it on their own servers short of altering it, stealing content from it,etc.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but when you say you crack down on servers who "destroy the teamwork and core function of a team based battle" do you mean by altering the mod or just playing with it their own way on their servers?

Edited August 16, 2010 by Big Mac

[=kct=blackmamba 44]

i agree abouth player balance between the teams in PVP gamemode,

and at the same time keep their issued gear realistic as possible.

in my opinion that way its more fun specialy cause u are playing against "Humans"

not the AI.

it woulndt be fair if one team haves uberpower and the other team gets pawned all the time.

that way everyone wants to be in the same team and the essence of pvp gameplay would be broken.

maybe when one team haves to defend a certain area u could give them an advantage

of having static weapens but thats a different story.

PVP is all abouth tactics, teamplay and speed.

i think arma2/oa gets much bether with these servers hosted.

cause after a while u know exactly how the AI would respond when engaged.

human players would try different tactics and your teams common sence will be tested.

i think u would be suprised how much more fun/realistic this type of gameplay would be

[craig.turner 10]

Welcome to the second of what will be a number of PR:ArmA2 Highlight Reels over the next week or so. Here's a few of the things that we'd like to show off today.

- British Army - SRV - Jackal 2

[R-DEV]Stigger has been plugging away on this vehicle over the last few weeks, and you can see it coming together very nicely already. Jackal 2 is a high mobility weapons platform, with a unique air-bag suspension system allowing rapid movement across varying terrain. It is designed to protect personnel against roadside explosions and mine attacks. It's used for reconnaissance, rapid assault, fire support and force protection. Jackal 2 has the capacity to support itself and its crew of three over a projected distance of 800km.

Jackal 2 is armed with a General Purpose Machine Gun (GPMG) as crew protection, and can carry either a Heavy Machine Gun (HMG) or Grenade Machine Gun (GMG) as the main weapon system in the fire support role. This will be a main british vehicle you will see driving around within PR:ArmA2, and a formidable vehicle that the Taliban faction will have to deal with.

Continued

- Panther CLV - TES variant (Theatre Entry Standard)

Another vehicle that is close to completion, and one which will compliment the British Faction in either woodland or Desert colours, is the Panther CLV.

Panther is air transportable and can be underslung beneath a Chinook helicopter. Panther is armed with a 7.62mm L7 general purpose machine gun equipped Remote Weapon Station. It can can be upgraded to a 12.7 mm weapon if required, and an appropriate day/night sighting system.

Panther will also be used as the Commander's vehicle for Engineer Troops, Anti-Tank, Mortar and supporting fire platoons.

Continued

- PR Mines & IED Package

The IED and mine package is going through alpha testing as we speak, and the work is starting to show huge promise. We have incorporated the PR:BF2 IEDs, and can confirm IED's will play a huge part in our Insurgency Mode. This work will prove a key element in asymmetrical warfare for PR:ArmA2.

Which brings us to the end of Part 2 of our week-long PR:ArmA2 Highlights Reel special, but please stay tuned for part 3 in a few days, where we will preview even more goodies available on release.

- The Project Reality Team

Edited August 16, 2010 by Placebo

[minimalaco 30]

Excelente

[BigMorgan 11]

So to return to the server issue, what thoughts have been given to the use of PR material in common, popular gamemodes/missions like Domination and Warfare?

Will servers running "Domi 2.0 PR" or "Warfare BE 2.XX PR" be "officially supported" by the PR community? Will users seeking to create a version of Domination using PR content be shunned at the PR website?

I'm trying to understand what you guys have in store as far as controlling "how the game is played".

With all due respect, and with true eager anticipation of any project of this magnitude and apparent quality, I feel like this mod team is saying to a lot of us "regular" Arma 2 players "You shouldn't use this mod".

[Mudkip 0]

Make it so I can't get a M110 and MAAWS and take a whole town by myself (Domination and Warfare).

[dunedain 48]

Make it so I can't get a M110 and MAAWS and take a whole town by myself (Domination and Warfare).

haha:p

I trully can't wait for first release.

[ck-claw 1]

If PR did puddings, this would be how they are made.

http://j.imagehost.org/0823/sophie_howard_topless_nuts_5th_birthday.jpg[/iM]

Yum Sophie Howard! :D

Good luck with the mod!

[maddogx 13]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but when you say you crack down on servers who "destroy the teamwork and core function of a team based battle" do you mean by altering the mod or just playing with it their own way on their servers?

I would assume they only disallow altered versions of the mod:

UK_Force;1719395']Like all mods we too fall under the Creative Commons Licence agreement' date=' of course this is more for people who wish to take PR out of ArmA2, thats when it gets into the Legal Area.

[url']http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0/[/url]

The Creative Commons "nd" (no derivatives) license clause basically means no one is (legally) allowed to release it in a modified form.

[NoRailgunner 0]

...still no real ingame video eg "PR devs" vs. "PR bughunters" ?

[horror1 10]

all this server debate is soooo senseless, lol.

why does anybody care how a mod team wants to make their own mod?

like every mod in every game, like it or hate it or ignore it.

pr is giving us some info about their mod and star wars fans could complain about the lack of tie fighters and so on but who cares?

this is it.

if ppl want to crack pr or use some modified pr mod, i dont doubt they can do it, i just doubt that anyone who likes pr and plays pr would even connect to such servers :)

so its more or less a debate wich leads to nowhere :)