Please don´t Dominate the Arrowhead...

[Zipper5 74]

Unkn0wn here is what you would classify as a hater. The rest of us are discussing.

[Defunkt 431]

There's really nothing to discuss, server-ops and players are both perfectly capable of deciding for themselves what they want to host or play, a topic like this achieves nothing (but attract haters).

[Zipper5 74]

Your post there just summed up why the MP situation is not improving...

[Defunkt 431]

Get real, people don't fork-out for server rental because they have no idea what they want to play on them, they already know.

[Zipper5 74]

Certainly seems they don't know what we want to play.

[tyler4171 10]

blame it on servers allowing more people than it can handle when mission grows complex

Ive been toying with my server cfg and the best stable although low amount is 15 players for my server, so i leave it at that (even for warfare). Becuase it can be pretty sad when my server is down the street and it gives lag becuase too many people join. So in short, tune the server to the amount that is stable, fun, and smooth!

[PuFu 4600]

Certainly seems they don't know what we want to play.

who's we there? Remember that most ppl are renting servers so THEY can play the game they want to. No matter what outside ppl might be whinning about.

Of course there are servers that are left open with little admining, and the missions that can last for as long, plugnplay without aditional intervention are prefered.

What i could say for everyone telling others how to run their servers is: join one of the communities and contribute towards the server montly fees, then you'll have a heavier word to what can or cant be played, or rent one yourself and play whatever missions you want to

[Unkn0wn 10]

Lol whats so fun about blowing up a radio tower then capturing 3 camps then doing it like a million times in a row in different towns?

I mean im not hateing on Xeno he makes cool scripts and stuff but nothing cool about domination.

Edited July 2, 2010 by Unkn0wn

[SWAT_BigBear 0]

To the OP,

If our server is playing Domination, as any other servers you will see playing it...please reframe from joining.

[Spartan 163 0]

LOL Ping envy!

[Arrowhead 0]

I don't mind seeing people play Domination, but the vast majority, come on. Arma 2 multiplayer has so much more potential. Try other missions too, maybe even dare I say, smaller less laggy missions!

[Zipper5 74]

Lol whats so fun about blowing up a radio tower then capturing 3 camps then doing it like a million times in a row in different towns?

I mean im not hateing on Xeno he makes cool scripts and stuff but nothing cool about domination.

If you had any idea the amount of work that went into Domination, or how incredible and complex the scripting is, how refined it is and how near-flawless the mission itself almost is, then you'd eat your words. There's a lot special about Domination, the only issue with it is how much it's been overplayed. It's a great mission, but it's nice to play something other than it for a change.

who's we there? Remember that most ppl are renting servers so THEY can play the game they want to. No matter what outside ppl might be whinning about.

"We" is everyone who is regularly complaining or becoming annoyed at the fact that MP is currently made up of 3 maps. I'd like to ask these server admins if they really, really enjoy playing these 3 maps over and over again as much as they let their server run it.

What i could say for everyone telling others how to run their servers is: join one of the communities and contribute towards the server montly fees, then you'll have a heavier word to what can or cant be played, or rent one yourself and play whatever missions you want to

I would have my own server doing what I wanted with it if I had the means to do so, but I don't. However, that doesn't mean that just because you own the server you should disregard what people are saying about it. If you buy something you want to get people to use it as much as possible to get the most out of it, therefore you should be happy with the feedback and criticisms given to you. The MP experience in BIS' games has gone downhill so significantly since ArmA's release, and I simply want to enjoy playing it again. I know from my experience that there are a lot of people who would agree with me, most would also be long-standing fans.

[Spartan 163 0]

If you don't like Domination then just make your own mission. Instead of crying about it do something about it. Come up with a mission that will put Domination on the back burner. Untill that happens your stuck with what others make.

The same thing happened in OFP when CTI came out. Then ARMA with Warfare. Now it is Domination. This is nothing new. If they like it they will play it if not they won't.

[Zipper5 74]

If you don't like Domination then just make your own mission. Instead of crying about it do something about it. Come up with a mission that will put Domination on the back burner. Untill that happens your stuck with what others make.

Well that's rather impossible since it seems a lot of you are only contempt with large-scale coop missions, and completely disregard the smaller 8, 12, or 16 player ones, let alone any mode outside of coop. I mean, just look at how many missions LDD Kyllikki made for Arma 2, for example. All of them are of excellent quality, and are small, fun coops, yet hardly anyone plays them at all outside of LLD Kyllikki, and I never see any of the main servers running them.

[Tankbuster 1746]

Not strictly true, Z5, though I fully take your point about Kyllikki's missions being inexplicably underplayed.

One of Domination's strengths is that it can be played by any number of players. When I first started it, and up until I got involved in the Rhapsody project, we played Domi with 4-6 players. Yes, it needs a little tweaking under the bonnet to make it practical for that number of players, but the fact it's so easy to tweak is, in fact, another of Domi's strengths.

If it might be so bold, a good Domi edit is worth it's weight in gold. In Rhapsody, I've managed to get a number of set-in-their-ways TvT players back into coop.

[whisper 0]

Domi is connect&play, any time, any length. It's fitting perfectly public playing needs, you don't have to bother with start time, empty slots, missing something if you log in late, etc...

Kullikki's mission are more for clan play, and were a fitting format in OFP days when we had restrictions on how to connect on a server, when etc....

"Blame" it more on JiP than Domi, if you ask me. Not that I find JiP a problem, quite the contrary, it's what made me going back to the franchise :)

[Zipper5 74]

It doesn't enforce teamwork though. Server admins not being there doesn't enforce teamwork. Server admins being there may still not choose to enforce teamwork. I'm fine with having servers available for those who like to lone wolf it, but that's about every server playing these large missions right now. I cannot find a single one of these servers that a) doesn't auto-kick me for my ping, but more importantly b) has any form of teamwork whatsoever.

It's just every man for himself, loading into a chopper, going to the enemy, dying, respawning, rinse and repeat. It's fine the first 50 times you do it, and it's fine when only a few servers are like that, but most of them are like that and I've gotten incredibly bored of it. It hasn't changed at all since.

[[kh]jman 49]

I have a feeling a deja-vu. This is an old argument and what I said a year ago is still relevent where OA is concerned imho.

http://forums.bistudio.com/showpost.php?p=1339291&postcount=10

[Zipper5 74]

Exactly! It hasn't changed in OA, it's just as ridiculous as that picture blatantly points out. 90% of the servers that have anyone on them and aren't locked are either playing Domination, Evolution or Warfare.

[Murklor 10]

Domi is connect&play, any time, any length. It's fitting perfectly public playing needs, you don't have to bother with start time, empty slots, missing something if you log in late, etc...

Kullikki's mission are more for clan play, and were a fitting format in OFP days when we had restrictions on how to connect on a server, when etc....

Oh I remember those joyfull days sitting in Gamespy trying to get the proper amount of players to start a round, then you start the game and half has dropped out... And you need to repeat the procedure to eventually start playing a mission an hour later :p

But yeah, its really the continous JIP that's the main draw of the mission. You know can just join, then start playing. If a city is nearly dead then no worries - a new will pop up soon enough. If you quit at any time, you're not missing that much.

When joining a mission that you do not know anything about, it can be of any length at any stage. You dont want to join in the middle of a grand hour long mission when you missed half of it. If you only got say one hour and have to play the last half hour of one mission and the first half hour of another mission you wont feel very satisifed.

Hey I just figured out a neat idea for the browser: a "progress bar" for the current mission! Based on current finished tasks/total amount of tasks. Well either that or mission designers should put in average length in the mission name, similar to player count/game mode.

[PuFu 4600]

"We" is everyone who is regularly complaining or becoming annoyed at the fact that MP is currently made up of 3 maps. I'd like to ask these server admins if they really, really enjoy playing these 3 maps over and over again as much as they let their server run it.

No, they don't. Or KH is not continuously running Domi. Evolution is for bided since A1.

I would have my own server doing what I wanted with it if I had the means to do so, but I don't.

Please don't bring your age in this. On one hand you are always saying you are more mature than others your age, but you are saying you cannot contribute to a server...

However, that doesn't mean that just because you own the server you should disregard what people are saying about it.

Oh YES, you can. The only ppl counting in a decission is the community members, and maybe some regular player around that community.

If you buy something you want to get people to use it as much as possible to get the most out of it, therefore you should be happy with the feedback and criticisms given to you.

You are having it UP so that your own community can use it. The fact that it is public is a free gift to all other players.

Of course outside criticism is taken into account, but it will only affect to a small % the final decision.

The MP experience in BIS' games has gone downhill so significantly since ArmA's release, and I simply want to enjoy playing it again. I know from my experience that there are a lot of people who would agree with me, most would also be long-standing fans.

That is also due to a lot of server going private(pass required) or just invisible. The reason is trying to have a certain level of quality of its gaming environment, without having someone do the police work, hold hands of different players etc.

It doesn't enforce teamwork though. Server admins not being there doesn't enforce teamwork. Server admins being there may still not choose to enforce teamwork.

It is not an admin work to spend all his free time doing police job..Sorry.

I cannot find a single one of these servers that a) doesn't auto-kick me for my ping, but more importantly b) has any form of teamwork whatsoever.

The ping discussion is something i don't agree entirely with you, especially because it's a server owner priviledge to do exactly whatever he pleases with his own paid server.

Of course some good sense should be used here as well, forcing a 50 ping is BS, but 150 or so, i find more than reasonable.

[Mojo 0]

The easy answer is to get with a group that doesn't play that way. They're out there - I know of at least one or two. (*C-ough-F*) ;)

It is the Server Admin's job to monitor and promote the type of play that is most relevant to his community's type of play. (sorry pufu, you're wrong on that one. :()

Zipper, as usual, has some good points. He didn't bring his age into it, he brought the size of his bank account into it - which is entirely valid. :D

However, there are some other aspects too - the lack of pubby server is due to the lack of fun playing with pubbies - it is a 1:1 correlation. It is not fun because they do exactly what sucks - run and gun and all that crap. So the server gets a few regulars that hang in TS and BANG! another pub server that goes private cause those regulars like playing a certain way and not getting 2 hours of work blown by some ID-10-T with a hard-on for sniping.

[Spartan 163 0]

Well that's rather impossible since it seems a lot of you are only contempt with large-scale coop missions, and completely disregard the smaller 8, 12, or 16 player ones, let alone any mode outside of coop. I mean, just look at how many missions LDD Kyllikki made for Arma 2, for example. All of them are of excellent quality, and are small, fun coops, yet hardly anyone plays them at all outside of LLD Kyllikki, and I never see any of the main servers running them.

So the "lot of you" are wrong for playing Domination and the large scale coop missions? :confused: Like I said if you don't like it make something better. If the "lot" like it they will play it. Just cause you don't like a mission does not mean others should stop playing it.

It's the players that make the game any way. If you have good players it does not matter what mission you play. The problem is most pubbers don't take the time to ask what is going on or trying to do the "team" thing. You spend 45 min fighting in an AO and ready to cap the last objective then you get nub pubber pilot in an AV8 with lgbs droping them right on your head.:eek:

Again this is nothing new. It happened in OFP and will keep goin on till someone makes a new mission everyone likes.

Time for me to get back to work on Namlesk Domination and Ovaron Island Domination.

[Zipper5 74]

It is not an admin work to spend all his free time doing police job..Sorry.

Lol, that is exactly the definition of a "volunteer administrator", is it not? Giving up your free time to manage and moderate things? If you can't do that then what, you're just an admin because you have access to the tools? :confused:

He didn't bring his age into it, he brought the size of his bank account into it - which is entirely valid. :D

More like the fact I don't have a bank account, nor a job, because it's very different how those things work over here compared to how most people here are used to, but I won't go into specifics. Long story short I cannot get money over here at my age legally.

All in all I feel as though I'm getting no where because the people who could change it seem completely contempt with the way Arma 2 MP currently is. They don't see anything wrong with the same maps being played over and over, they don't see that ping is not as important as in other games, and most importantly, they don't see any reason at all to change because they own the server.

Fine, I guess I'll just stick with SP for the foreseeable future. It's a real shame, because as OFP showed me - these games have huge potential for greatness in MP.

[PuFu 4600]

It is the Server Admin's job to monitor and promote the type of play that is most relevant to his community's type of play. (sorry pufu, you're wrong on that one. :()

I didn't say that an admin should not promote a certain gameplay style if you like. It is just that after some time, it is dead impossible to MANAGE everyone on a server, and play at the same time. Free time is limited in our world, i prefer less players, that i can play with, not tons of players that i need to keep in a leash via VON/Chat/Ban button.

However, there are some other aspects too - the lack of pubby server is due to the lack of fun playing with pubbies - it is a 1:1 correlation. It is not fun because they do exactly what sucks - run and gun and all that crap. So the server gets a few regulars that hang in TS and BANG! another pub server that goes private cause those regulars like playing a certain way and not getting 2 hours of work blown by some ID-10-T with a hard-on for sniping.

Than we agree that most organized games are played behind curtains, and that the public server that can be easily joined have very little chance of getting an organized game going, NOT because of the mission that is being played, but rather because of the PLAYERs.

@Zipper:

Lol, that is exactly the definition of a "volunteer administrator", is it not?

Not really. I am not that altruist as in spending my whole free time just for the sake of others, having the finger on the ban button, checking pings and desynk etc etc.

I guess if that was to happen, there would be NO public servers in the end.

OFP featured no JIP. That is in itself a big + for public organized games.

All in all I feel as though I'm getting no where because the people who could change it seem completely contempt with the way Arma 2 MP currently is.

I guess no one actually is. But i couldn't care less about players than can only ruin games than work with it, about players than have a hard on doing exatly the same as they are asked etc.

In the end i only care about my own gaming experience, together with the community i am part of. Not more, not less.

Edited July 2, 2010 by PuFu