space bar poll

[*LK1* 10]

edit:***keep in mind people has voted for the first option can even be satisfied if the second option become accepted and integrated on OA or with a patch for arma 2.***

i wonder why there is this option..you guys may know my position since i have flammed a bit on another thread :o. i guess in a game like arma is totally out of context.

as you may know if you press the space bar it appears a circular marker around the center of your monitor.if behind that marker there is an enemy you get the class of the enemy and his distance,for example "granatier 1200 m".it doesnt matter if that enemy is to far away to be seen with your eyes or even with binoculars,if you are lucky and you put that marker on a zone of the map where there is an enemy you have spot the guy/tank/my dad whoring the flag...whatever.

that thing has a bad implication on the gameplay:you cant be safe even "on that bush 800m from the enemy in a pretty good spot".it makes everything easier.people should use a binocular to spot the enemy and not a form of assisted spot procedure.and also it can be used to establish the distance from your pos. at 1 point of the map.pretty much a laser range finder.is the universal tool for newbies :D.

but in a game like this,1 of the beatifull things isn't to find a solder with your eyes/binocular not only cuz you haave an eagle view,but because you have understand where,a sniper for example,could be?

that space bar is killing everything i've said above.

i've read,since we were talking about this feature in another thread,why some people like it/ think is usefull and should stay in game.

basically because is difficult to establish the distances in game and to find enemies hiding on bushes.well i' ve already said,for me,this is 1 of the best parts of the game so i cant see these things as a problem.i mean is obvious is a simulative game.since some of you(of course is acceptable your idea im not complaining)has justified the space bar presence wit the arguments i've exposed above i have an objection:why we shouldn't accept other types of simplifications as standarized/easier ballistic for all weapons

in regular mode?or i dont know maybe a fixed aim even if we have runned for a km in regular mode ecc.?i know it sound strange to ask these things but..

why the space bar yes and not the other things?i can see an incoherence on this BIS choice to add the space bar function in the game.

so for me we could adds or removes things which have not an huge impact on the game depends on the difficulty level you want to play(for example crosshair).but that thing is very unjustifiable(for me of course) in a game like this if we consider the realistic nature of BIS games.so for me BIS must kick out of the game that function with a patch for arma 2 and from operation arrowhead.

there are 4 difficulty levels and some of the space bar functions cant be switched off but not both

i want to specify in expert m. you can't spot enemies with space bar but the range finder option stays.at least,to be coherent with the

name of the last difficulty mode,could be correct to remove that option in expert mode so we could have a realistic way to play it.

what you guys think...

Edited May 4, 2010 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[Thirdup 0]

I don't see a problem with making it a server-side setting (on/off).

I personally can't say that I find it "killing everything" about the game. I think that will largely depend on the type of play. My squad plays coop against AI. I've never gotten in the habit of using the spacebar and see no reason to ever use it (I like having to use my eyes). And I could care less if my squadmates use it. So to me, it's a non-issue.

But as I said, I could see where it would be a good server-side control for those admins who want more reality. So my vote would be for a selection not offered in your poll. I certainly don't want BI to remove the feature (I'm certain some people depend on it to play).

I seem to recall that disabling spacebar is an ACE2 feature. Like I said, I never use it so I wouldn't know.

Edited May 1, 2010 by Thirdup

[*LK1* 10]

i can understand your point of view.

I certainly don't want BI to remove the feature (I'm certain some people depend on it to play).

yeah but you know,even if you make a standard and more simple ballistic for every weapons,a fixed aim even if you have runned,jump function as in bf2 some people will depend on it and probably you'll find someone that love the new functions.question is:how many games arma 2 want to be at the same time...?

So my vote would be for a selection not offered in your poll.

i'm just curious,which?

[Thirdup 0]

i'm just curious,which?

Making it a server-side option for admins to turn on/off.

[*LK1* 10]

mmm yeah ok.

[RavoC 10]

Try Ace man, you won't bother any more and it's the best mod ever, watch Arma2.com homepage.. still community award is on there..

[*LK1* 10]

Try Ace man, you won't bother any more and it's the best mod ever, watch Arma2.com homepage.. still community award is on there..

yeah i know.i'm playing it.but i would the vanilla game without

that unrealistic feature since is a realism oriented title.

thx anyway ;)

Edited May 1, 2010 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[dr_eyeball 16]

You missed a 4th option which is to make it distance and time delay based.

It's a good feature for Recruit/Regular modes, just not finished yet to be sensible.

Increase the identification time delay based on distance or recent interaction/knowledge about that unit. There would be a maximum distance limit and that limit would depend on your current optics too.

So without optics,

at 10m it might be 1 second delay,

at 100m it might be 5 seconds delay,

at 250m or so it might be too far.

[CarlGustaffa 4]

Server side setting, like any other difficulty setting. Especially given the controversy of this particular one and that it isn't a difficulty setting at all, it's forced upon us.

Bloody good suggestion Dr Eyeball, but you forgot:

...and visibility/weather (fog/rain) and availablelight based. Maybe even "into the sun" based (how much bloom on screen du to sun). In NVGs, the distance should be significantly decreased. Some of this is already in ACE recognition. It should NOT be connected to the knowsAbout displayed on the map when extendedmapinfo is turned on.

Furthermore, it should ONLY show information about friendly side. NEVER the enemy side. That would deal with most cases of using this as a cheat/exploit. If you accidentally uses this to recognize a friend on the other side of the wall or terrain, chances are it won't matter as much as if you're able to space-scan an enemy.

Also it should be "press and hold space" rather than "press space to activate recognition".

For info, I voted #2 since there is no connection to difficulty mode. I haven't checked vanilla behavior in ages though.

The automatic range finder possibility should be completely removed as well, even if spacebarscan is allowed on the server. Even if we have turned it off on our server, there exist a feature where players can put a waypoint on the map, and have that show as a waypoint with a distance. Not as convenient as the magic range finder, but encourages the use of map and maybe learn a few things in the process. Note that this waypoint will always show in GPS equipped vehicles no matter the dificulty setting, something I actually find natural.

[stun 5]

What if the function was changed so that it only IDs targets that have already been identified or are within range i.e. within binocular range/visual range?

But a server side setting would make the most sense to me.

[jw custom 56]

yeah i know.i'm playing it.but i would the vanilla game without

that unrealistic feature since is a realism oriented title.

thx anyway ;)

So you are playing with ACE yet you wan't vanilla to not have the space bar scan.... hmmm so it's like i don't like then nobody else should have it :confused:

I would be fine with it being a server side setting.

P.S. good job on moving this subject to the suggestions forum, thats one step closer ;)

[*LK1* 10]

What if the function was changed so that it only IDs targets that have already been identified or are within range i.e. within binocular range/visual range?

But a server side setting would make the most sense to me.

could be a good idea but the best 1 is to remove it totally,i'm still searching for a space bar in RL and i can't find it :o

So you are playing with ACE yet you wan't vanilla to not have the space bar scan.... hmmm so it's like i don't like then nobody else should have it

pretty much yeah,since is a suggestion forum i should be allowed to do it.and i guess is not a realistic feature so what is doing there the space bar?

edit i really would to know what you think about this objection:

why we shouldn't accept other types of simplifications as standarized/easier ballistic for all weapons

in regular mode?or i dont know maybe a fixed aim even if we have runned for a km in regular mode ecc.?i know it sound strange to ask these things but..

why the space bar yes and not the other things?i can see an incoherence on this BIS choice to add the space bar function in the game.

in other worlds which is the discriminative factor to say space bar yes other simplifications nope?

Edited May 1, 2010 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[jw custom 56]

could be a good idea but the best 1 is to remove it totally,i'm still searching for a space bar in RL and i can't find it :o

There's so many things in this game that doesn't work the same IRL.... it's called a game for a reason. Not everybody is playing this game the same way, thats the beauty of it, some play it more hardcore using ACE and other realism mods while other people enjoy playing with crosshairs and unlimited stamina etc etc.

pretty much yeah,since is a suggestion forum i should be allowed to do it.and i guess is not a realistic feature so what is doing there the space bar?

I didn't say you wasn't allowed to suggest the space bar removal i'm just arguing against it.

I still can't understand why it bother you that people that don't play with ACE can use the space bar scan :confused:

[NeMeSiS 11]

I dont use such fancy new features (I thought it was for commanding or something), but i see no problem with making it an option.

[*LK1* 10]

There's so many things in this game that doesn't work the same IRL.... it's called a game for a reason.

yeah but is called simulative game for a reason,and for the same reason we don't have a lame key to jump around like in bf2 we shouldn't have the space bar.

Not everybody is playing this game the same way, thats the beauty of it, some play it more hardcore using ACE and other realism mods while other people enjoy playing with crosshairs and unlimited stamina etc etc.

as you can even understand,and in RL is always a truth,nothing has only positives effects but also negatives.and for me that space bar has also negative implications.not only the 2 i've exposed in the other thread.

1 bad implication is that to divide a comunity of course and there arent so many server of arma 2 which make easy to find a mission you'll really like to play it.now as i can understand which objection can derive from my words i must specify 1 thing:if the space bar doesn't exist i guess (and i guess is a

credible assumption)people will continues to play arma2.even if we have bought this game with the most different intentions(modding,sp,MP coop,MP PvP)noone has bought this game to play it in the most arcadish way possible.

so as a result of these settable options we have a divided comunity.

we should be able to turn off and on things like the crosshair for example..because it has a credible reason to stay in game(is not so arcadish as people can think),because most( or all) of the fps have a crosshair so some of you can even be affectionate at this option.but for the space bar is very different.

I didn't say you wasn't allowed to suggest the space bar removal i'm just arguing against it.

mm yeah but it was strange,everyone complains about things which they dont like it and that can ruin a game..so is a bit strange as question but np :)

I still can't understand why it bother you that people that don't play with ACE can use the space bar scan :confused:

is arma 2 not bf2.ACE should be used to get more realism from game but no to fix such arcadish things in a simulative game.i dont ask for example to have the sniper tool to calculate the MOA and wind,is something very specifical

and a bit complicated for a newcomer that why it should stay only on ace.

but space bar should be totally removed cuz is arcade and lame.arma 2 is and want to be realistic not something in the middle fro mace and cod6.and ace should be an ultra version of arma 2 yep!but shuldn't be something that fix bugsor arcadish features.if arc. feat. and bugs are present is just a BIS problem from my point of view. is strange to wait ace to remove it instead to ask at the BIS to fix it/remove it.

Edited May 1, 2010 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[stun 5]

could be a good idea but the best 1 is to remove it totally,i'm still searching for a space bar in RL and i can't find it :o

Problem is in real life your visual acuity is so good you can identify targets from a good distance. Computer games can't emulate this so you are practically on top of someone before you can ID them.

So you can't compare computer games to real life at every level.

[jw custom 56]

but space bar should be totally removed cuz is arcade and lame.

Thats YOUR opinion, there's many many people who doesn't feel that way!

We could go on and on about things that isn't realistic and end up with a game not many people would play. It's just fine as it is now, people who want more realism can go for ACE and other mods.

I like ACE and i only play with ACE but thats no reason for me to force it on everybody else.

[*LK1* 10]

Problem is in real life your visual acuity is so good you can identify targets from a good distance. Computer games can't emulate this so you are practically on top of someone before you can ID them.

not truth. in game your visual acuity is more good,dude is something known from everybody.

in RL there are some"graphic effects"( joking but you know what i mean)

which are not present in games.new games has an effect called bloor which make the visual more blurred,this effect is much more accentuated in RL

in RL you have a color scale very huge and bigger than games.what makes something difficult to recognize is not only the bloor effect in RL but the

little differences between 2 colors.ever played softair?have you a friend on the army playing arma 2?ask him.in RL is difficult to find someone at 70/100m from your pos hiding in a bush,in arma 2 is less difficult.

in arma 2 you can even set low quality graphic options(and in lower graphic options is more easy to spot enemies..)in rl guess is not possible.

oh well in arma 2 there is also the lame ridicole zoom effect...but this is another story :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Edited May 1, 2010 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***

[Zipper5 74]

I feel that it should be up to the player or server admin if he/she wants it to be used or not. Adding an option in the difficulties to enable or disable it would get my vote. I wouldn't want it permanently removed from the game, or permanently forced in it, though.

[*LK1* 10]

Thats YOUR opinion, there's many many people who doesn't feel that way!

?of course is my opinion,i speak only for myself im not the spokesman of the truth..:rolleyes::rolleyes:

just 1 thing,which it's an opinion is that it should be removed the space bar,which is not it's that is totally unrealistic.not everything is an opinion.

---------- Post added at 01:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:48 PM ----------

I feel that it should be up to the player or server admin if he/she wants it to be used or not. Adding an option in the difficulties to enable or disable it would get my vote. I wouldn't want it permanently removed from the game, or permanently forced in it, though.

mm maybe but what about to totally disable this option at least for expert mode?why makes that difficulty level for "experts" if the lame space bar is still active?

[Zipper5 74]

mm maybe but what about to totally disable this option at least for expert mode?why makes that difficulty level for "experts" if the lame space bar is still active?

Everything else about those difficulties.

But sure, I guess it could be disabled for the higher difficulties, so long as it's left as an option to be enabled or disabled for Regular and Recruit.

[mosh 0]

could be a good idea but the best 1 is to remove it totally,i'm still searching for a space bar in RL and i can't find it

:rolleyes: (quoted because things like this make me laugh)

I voted no. It is up to player and/or admin... not you.

Edited May 1, 2010 by Mosh

[jw custom 56]

just 1 thing,which it's an opinion is that it should be removed the space bar,which is not it's that is totally unrealistic.not everything is an opinion.

There's tons of unrealistic things in the game, where should we draw the line?

Notice game is in bold, this is a game after all!

[Zipper5 74]

JW makes a good point. People seem to forget that these are games. The Virtual Battlespace series are the hardcore milsims. If you want something to be forced to be more realistic for yourself, then fine. But if you want to force it to be more realistic for everyone, then there's an issue. People want to play it as a game, people want to play it as a milsim. Both should be left to enjoy it as they please.

[*LK1* 10]

There's tons of unrealistic things in the game, where should we draw the line?

simple.if something has an huge impact on the gameplay here you have your line.

if something is just a features not avaible in RL but that makes the game more realistic in game,because there are of course differences from RL and game,

is ok.but want i dont like are little concessions to the people which want this game easier,i dont agree.

example?why there is a crosshair in game?simply because is more difficult to aim at something through a monitor than in RL.if you can see on your monitor the same picture you are looking now through your window you will understand...if you point that bottle on the ground at 10 m from you in a game

and you have a (19")that bottle is 1 cm maybe not more, in RL life that bottle is larger.

so since we will not play through an huge monitor which make your soldier big like in RL you really need a crosshair.this is a feature not avaible in RL

that ironically makes the game more realistic.

but we cant justify the space bar in this way..is simply arcade and nothing else!you guys like it anyway?good for you cuz i cant :(.

Edited May 1, 2010 by ***LeGeNDK1LLER***