Patch 69645 - changes under the hood

[Alex72 1]

Thank you BangTail. Nice to see it isnt just me. Im on an AMD X2 6000+ though but still its a stutter fest.

I notice this mostly on Isla Duala. Anyone can test just putting a unit out in the middle of duala and then just start walking or running? When i move it stutters (not lagging) and it never settles. Only if i look straight down it settles and is smooth as silk. But if i look forward it stutters all the time. Older patches it stutters for a second or two to load in the surroundings and then its all smooth until running too far where it needs to load in new material. But this one never stops stuttering.

Tomorrow i have my i7 though and maybe that hyper threading stuff works to remove it. :)

PS. Changing pre rendering frames etc did not do anything but making movement (turning etc) more creamy like. Still same stutter. Mostly on Isla Duala though. Maybe something on that map that needs to change just for this patch? Hmm weird.

EDIT: Found out what caused the massive stutter on Isla Duala and probably the rest - the grass! Removed the grass and no more stutter. Previous beta does not do this on my pc so its something new in the latest one.

Edited April 25, 2010 by Alex72

[bangtail 0]

Thank you BangTail. Nice to see it isnt just me. Im on an AMD X2 6000+ though but still its a stutter fest.

I notice this mostly on Isla Duala. Anyone can test just putting a unit out in the middle of duala and then just start walking or running? When i move it stutters (not lagging) and it never settles. Only if i look straight down it settles and is smooth as silk. But if i look forward it stutters all the time. Older patches it stutters for a second or two to load in the surroundings and then its all smooth until running too far where it needs to load in new material. But this one never stops stuttering.

Tomorrow i have my i7 though and maybe that hyper threading stuff works to remove it. :)

PS. Changing pre rendering frames etc did not do anything but making movement (turning etc) more creamy like. Still same stutter. Mostly on Isla Duala though. Maybe something on that map that needs to change just for this patch? Hmm weird.

I always test at the center of Cherno bcause I know it's one of the more intensive places CPU/GPU wise.

It's quite a coincidence because I tested it a few days ago and it was smooth and then today (after the patch), I was going from ~50 FPS to 9 FPS every 3 seconds.

This is exactly the behaviour that my 975 used to exhibit without the -cpucount=4 switch. I re added the -cpucount=6 switch and the stuttering immediately vanished.

Thankfully, the cpucount switch does seem to work for most people which is good. Some people seem to have to resort to disabling HT in the BIOS. That wouldn't be an acceptable solution for me tbh but it is there as a last resort.

Edited April 25, 2010 by BangTail

[Alex72 1]

I have to say though that this beta is on the right track. Although i have this stutter wich seems to be the grass (on my pc anyway) but if i disregard that the performance seems to be better.

About AI: Anyone else noticing the old AI squad leader runs far ahead of his squad syndrome again? Tested with HC module and sent a 12 AI unit strong squad forward and i noticing the leader was pretty far in front of the rest of the team. Squad set to FULL speed - FILE. Changed to LINE on the fly but seemed still the leader kept running far ahead. Will test more.

[SaOk 112]

Yeah, I was just looking at it. I guess yesterday it was a coincidence.

I don't know what triggers it. Sometimes they are fast.

I also dont have an idea why it happens. I never have slow scripts at start of the mission but then the script performance oscillates slowly - there can be up to 1-2 minute pause and suddently all works great again for minutes until the lag starts again.

I also noticed that after the global pause in every script, all comeback as a big command package ingoreing the current (~number)-command they have.

Edited April 25, 2010 by SaOk

[jw custom 56]

It's quite a coincidence because I tested it a few days ago and it was smooth and then today (after the patch), I was going from ~50 FPS to 9 FPS every 3 seconds.

This is exactly the behaviour that my 975 used to exhibit without the -cpucount=4 switch. I re added the -cpucount=6 switch and the stuttering immediately vanished.

I have a 920 and i have never experienced that and i don't use the -cpucount parameter!

Though i'm experiencing slightly stutter on Utes with new beta!

[nomdeplume 0]

Hadn't had any problems until I decided to hitch a ride with a chopper from Staroye which then went south to the coast and turned west to land at the SW airport. Textures disappeared from big chunks of the land to the west and the framerate dropped - if I looked behind me to the North/East everything was fine, but the area with the missing textures made the machine really crawl. Also tried looking down which was okay for a bit but the white textures started to spread and eventually the display driver crashed so I had to kill the game.

Win7 x64, i7 920, nVidia GTX 295 w/ 197.45 drivers.

[Protegimus 0]

...

About AI: Anyone else noticing the old AI squad leader runs far ahead of his squad syndrome again? Tested with HC module and sent a 12 AI unit strong squad forward and i noticing the leader was pretty far in front of the rest of the team. Squad set to FULL speed - FILE. Changed to LINE on the fly but seemed still the leader kept running far ahead. Will test more.

Ah, that ties in with AI no longer observing change:

[60711] Changed: Units now never enter cover while moving in compact (Delta or File) formations

from beta 60718.

Better for AI to use cover when moving, but doing so then allows the squad leader to get too far ahead...maybe they are taking a second look at how all the:

[60129] Fixed: AI subordinates now move faster (use less cover) to catch up when leader is way ahead of them.

[60102] Fixed: AI subordinates should now respect formation more when moving in combat.

[60101] Fixed: Group leader was often running far ahead alone in combat.

[60092] Fixed: AI leader did not wait for a player to cover him when moving in combat.

changes from beta 60141 work together to continue to improve the AI.

Re. stutters (please bear with the slight tangent, it might be useful information) when doing lots of performance testing with ArmAIIMark we found that performance was very sensitive to memory bandwidth - returning more performance from bandwidth improvement than CPU speed or GPU type, perhaps someone experiencing the problem can test further?

Also interesting note about the core i7 BangTail, I tested limiting ArmA II to CPU fewer cores with -cpucount= when I first read about it and always saw significant degradation - you've certainly the systems to push ArmA on though!

Could just be 7's prioritised I/O sucking of course!

Anyone notice more leaves and stuff blowing around too?

Protegimus

Edited April 25, 2010 by Protegimus

[gulag 10]

Less stutter and some + frame rate, but when I use the binoculars on large areas of terrain texture disappears, I use ati 5850 with 10.3, Win7 64bit, Q9550, 4g ram.

Edited April 25, 2010 by gulag

[KeyCat 131]

Tried to spend some time with the 69645 Beta but unfortunatley it introduces some wierd lag/stuttering on my machine so I have to revert to older Beta.

FPS wise there isn't any big difference but it feels like I'm walking/running with rubberstraps somehow tied to my ancles, this also on Utes!? The little time I spent with 69645 Beta it felt like it was related to my HDD access (also tried to defrag my D-drive) my specifications below...

Windows XP Pro

Intel C2D E6850 @ 3.41 GHz

2 x 1 GB RAM @ 1066 MHz

2 x Seagate ST3250620AS SATA-II 250 GB HDD

GeForce GTX 260 896 MB with drivers 191.07 WHQL

Standingby until next release...

/KC

Edited April 25, 2010 by KeyCat

[Alex72 1]

Protegimus: Tested now a lot and the grass is what causing the stutter on my machine in the new beta. Compared to the other patches where grass has a usual performance hogging effect and its all steady "lag". Still, its smooth when i play the same islands on the older patches and weird irregular but constant pretty hard stutter when grass is on now in this beta. Turn it off and its ultra smooth. Even better than previous betas without grass (usuall have it on NORMAL however).

Another side thing about effects: I was in a fire fight just now. Big one. And i was shot at like crazy - but didnt see any suppressing effects. Would really like it to be heavier effects when a lot of bullets pass close to me. VBS2 makes it tunnel vision with darkened edges plus when bullets are REAL close you even unwillingly "flinch" aka the camera quickly but slightly shakes one single time when a bullet passes real close. Really love that as it makes you crap your pants. However in ARMA2 we should have the blurred vision etc when too much "heat" layed upon us. In this beta i cant see that - only when i shoot close to my feet but not from enemies. Could be looked into as well. (sorry not a performance report).

[MavericK96 0]

Great to see this fixed! I had posted videos about this a year ago, but better late then never, after all it was just visually annoying, not game-breaking.

Is this referring to the "warping" terrain a ways in front of you when you look sort of at the ground? I remember noticing this problem from a long, long time ago.

[bangtail 0]

I have a 920 and i have never experienced that and i don't use the -cpucount parameter!

You're one of the few.

[bensdale 0]

I have a 920 and i have never experienced that and i don't use the -cpucount parameter!

Though i'm experiencing slightly stutter on Utes with new beta!

have you disable HT in the bios options?

[Drew 10]

well the disapperaing ground/white ground has made an apperance for me using this beta patch...anyway to fix this?

ATI 4850 with latest drivers~

[langgis08 10]

moved to: http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?p=1616090#post1616090

Edited April 26, 2010 by langgis08
wrong thread

[Inkompetent 0]

SP Scenario , me squad leader (5 subordinates), formation column, walking straight forward, obstacle => fence in front of us (the simple, usual wooden one, out in the fields)

pressing "forward" until my player has to climb over the plank but any subordinate just walks through the plank as if it wasn't there, they don't climb neither they crawl on ground.

it's not a new issue, it's not game breaking, but ... it's very nasty and killing feeling of realism, of course... I thought that would be fixed somewhen, but when ... ?:confused:

THen please post this in a relevant thread ;)

[Alex72 1]

have you disable HT in the bios options?

JW did not disable HT and never had problems. Theres how different systems are heh. :)

Drew: For now the only thing that fixes the ground texture issue is to slide the view distance slider up and back down to what you had. Should remove the problem.

[jw custom 56]

have you disable HT in the bios options?

Nope HT is on :)

You're one of the few.

Dunno about that, read quite a few threads about performance issues with core i7 where people posted they didnt have those problems with their core i7!

[bangtail 0]

Nope HT is on :)

Dunno about that, read quite a few threads about performance issues with core i7 where people posted they didnt have those problems with their core i7!

I never have any performance issues either with regards to the i7 - provided I use cpucount.

It was widely discussed here way back when and many people had trouble with it. I suspect it is so well known now, there is little reason to discuss it further.

I never saw a thread where people discussed the problems they weren't having, but hey, that's just me ;)

Edited April 25, 2010 by BangTail

[jw custom 56]

I never saw a thread where people discussed the problems they weren't having, but hey, that's just me ;)

lol yeah that was what i said u bugger :p

There have been many threads where people were talking about the core i7 being the root to their problems, in those threads people including me replied and said we never had those problems ;)

[bangtail 0]

lol yeah that was what i said u bugger :p

There have been many threads where people were talking about the core i7 being the root to their problems, in those threads people including me replied and said we never had those problems ;)

Just out of interest, what MB are you using?

[jw custom 56]

Just out of interest, what MB are you using?

A gigabyte GA-EX58-UD4P.

[bensdale 0]

hmm i have also a i920 and without Cpucount 4 or disabel HT in the Bios options, mi ArmA II stutter a lot.

I noticed that with Win Vista 64 my ArmA works with HT on and without set cpucount.

With Win 7 64 works this not. I must set cpucount or disable HT (same effect for me) for a fluid gameplay.

here is a link about win7 and I920:

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=95989&highlight=win7

which OS you use?

Edited April 25, 2010 by bensdale

[bangtail 0]

A gigabyte GA-EX58-UD4P.

Never actually used that one but I am very partial to GB and I've experienced it on all of the boards I've used (and several different i7s).

It's not a big deal at the end of the day as adding 'cpucount' takes all of 1 second but I'd really like to know what changed in that patch that borked it on the 980 because I definitely did not have it before I applied the patch.

Are you on a 64 bit Win 7. I never got it under 32bit XP so maybe that is the catalyst?

[EricM 0]

Haven't voted yet as I have more test to do, but running the benchmark mission 1 multiple times, I get up to +40% performance increase with the new patch, going from 23-24 fps to 32-33 fps.

At first, I get the missing ground texture bug aswell, but as with other people found, cranking up the draw distance over 3500 and then reducing it to 1600 for instance solves the problem for all subsequent tests.

Rebooting the game makes the bug come again.

Running :

Q6600 @2.6 stock

G8800 GTX - 768 Mo

Win7 64B - SSD disk.

For me this patch is clearly on the right track. No stuttering either, but the SSD might help there.

Edit : with a bit more testing in the editor, flying the f35 over chernarus, I get around from 7 to 9 fps more on average (this is huge for me) and a much improved fluidi feeling due to better loading management (reduced micro stutters).

Edited April 25, 2010 by EricM