Why is this game not more popular?

[tacticalnuggets 24]

You assume too much.

I always have great ping, unless I try and join some random Australian or Russian server. Even in American servers, (I am UK based), I get less than 70 ping. Which in Arma 2, is fine.

Then you have the fact that there will be about 7-8 servers with 15+ players, the top few will have 30+ players. Below that, the numbers will slowly decrease from about 15 down to about 5, below that is fairly low. Although I quite enjoy playing with a small number of players.

And then there is the fact most of the hardcore community do not touch public servers. Arma 2 IS a squad based game. If you want instant accesible action, with no commitment required, go and play Call of duty or bad company. They are designed for quick and easy access, and do a very good job of it. Arma 2 is designed to cater very different needs.

BIS have not done anything wrong. Just because you do not like it, does not mean they screwed anything up. Even since operation flashpoint, the game has always had a steep learning curve. Most people get on with the game just fine. BI are not about to re design everything they have because one guy, who showed up 9 years late, decided he doesn't like it.

And lol. Just lol:

Since when were you the head of BI's financial department? That is probably the worst sentence I have ever read on these forums. No offence.

Regards,

Richie.

That is just plain sick! I dont know how somebody could actually rationalize wanting a game to be harder to access, because you think if they make it easier than there will be more people enjoying themselves? I have been playing BIS games since ofp so you can take that one back if you want to.

Your argument is weak, and simply disturbing because it implies that you dont want a thriving multiplayer community. The numbers are terrible. Because you have disturbed me so much, I am going to begin recording player numbers online 3 times a day, afternoon, evening, then morning.

WTF is up with people thinking that just because I care about x community that I am one of them? I already have ace mod, I already know about yoma, bla bla bla bla bla. Its apathetic people like you richie who simply cheer on BIS when they have made bad decisions. You know very well that a large portion of the community enjoys multiplayer. You know we are suffering, clans and tournaments are low as well. Why do we have to go through that pain because BIS refuses to step out of the dark ages into a better multiplayer system? I have simply stopped making missions because there is nobody to play them with. Why should I purchase OA if I know that it will have the same problem as arma2 multiplayer wise?

I know a great deal about economics, and if BIS begins to cost more than it makes then it will be shut down. Its simply a matter of time.

Living life alone is not worth living... Thats what I choose to describe the amazing but relatively dead game of arma2. Those AI will NEVER be the same as a squad of human players.

Dont you dare use your elitist attitude on me richie. I simply support this game too much to let it die.

[Guest]

Elitist attitude? What part of any of my post was elitist??? Elitist would be me saying that the community is too "smart" or "intelligent" for mainstream gamers.

I welcome all the 13 year olds, kids, teenagers, and grandads to play this game. Good for them! But DESIGNING the game to be accessible for a 13 year old? That would not work.

And as far as your whole argument goes, you make it sound like the end of the world. The game will not die. I hope you are not one of those people who also believes PC gaming will die too.

If BI needed financial advice and support, they would probably ask for it. I think they know what they are doing and are happy doing it. When masses of people ask for change, they change.

When one guy makes some really, really far fetched claim/complaint/suggestion/rant, they won't be taking much notice.

I apologize for assuming you are new to the community, it's just the fact you only have 20 or so posts, would seem to suggest you are new too/not in touch with the community?

Richie.

[NoRailgunner 0]

There is no solution if you only circling around opinions - some people say A2 is great, some people say A2 has still many bugs & issues that need fix/polish/tuning by BIS (not community!) and others say A2 is dying.

If a game is done right many players (regardless what they've played before) will like it and will learn how to love it. ;)

Now try to look at A2 as a newbie and see what you get - take a look at the missions/campaigns and armory. Can you get this special feeling and the spirit that would make you stay for longer only playing vanilla A2? Or do you get this feeling if you use commuity made missions and addons/mods?

Who knows perhaps devs need a break, come back + play their games? Sometimes you can't see the wood for the trees.

[TimRiceSE 10]

Living life alone is not worth living... Thats what I choose to describe the amazing but relatively dead game of arma2. Those AI will NEVER be the same as a squad of human players.

Uh.. really, if youre longing so much for human contact, turn off the computer and go outside.

[BigMorgan 11]

I really have to think only "mainstream" gamers are to blame - and they're not kids. I'm a member of a "gaming community" that has members who primarily play CSS, MW2, and A2. A lot of the most-mature and oldest members of our little clan won't play A2 because they like "constant action". Arma 2 is "too slow" and makes them "wait too long".

Sadly we A2 fans are in the minority of our fellow gaming hobbyists: we have an attention span longer than a housefly's and the willingness to follow a learning curve rather than playing a game that works the exact same way as every other.

[galzohar 31]

Want to clarify what you mean by 'set it up'?

Find a server running a mission that would be fun to play with enough players, download and run the required mods for that server, join in and see that the server is actually what you expected and if not repeat the process, and then play.

13 year olds are not the only people having problems getting everything set up. Not everyone have some clue about comptuers and internet even if they were generals in the army, and setting up Arma 2 without someone telling you exactly what to do (multiple times usually) definitely requires more than just "having a clue". The "13 year old" is a moot point, it could just as well be a 30 year old with the same problem (except a 30 year old would just dump the game rather than repeatedly asking his 19 year old friend to set it up for him).

[Bulldogs 10]

I'm confused about the arguement here. Are you saying that you think BIS should change the game completely to get more people to play it?

What changes would there be?

Sure you could always tweak and add features, but if you mean to completely change the game so that call of duty players would want it, well, that would be kind of stupid.

BIS made the game this way becase it's how they wanted it. They wanted it to be a mil-sim. I can understand wanting other things, but that's what other games are for.

Regardless if it's economically sound or not, changing the core of the game would defeat te purpose of creating the game in the first place.

[dmarkwick 261]

I'm confused about the arguement here. Are you saying that you think BIS should change the game completely to get more people to play it?

What changes would there be?

Sure you could always tweak and add features, but if you mean to completely change the game so that call of duty players would want it, well, that would be kind of stupid.

BIS made the game this way becase it's how they wanted it. They wanted it to be a mil-sim. I can understand wanting other things, but that's what other games are for.

Regardless if it's economically sound or not, changing the core of the game would defeat te purpose of creating the game in the first place.

Well that's only one opinion of why the game is not more popular. You're right in that the gamplay itself should not change, that would be a dumb move :)

But among the other replies here is the one of initial release status, it performed generally poorer than it should have in initial reviews. People who "do their homework" on this game before buying come right up against these poor reviews, and decide, understandably, not to bother.

If the game got great reviews, it would sell better. That's a simplistic view, but accurate nontheless. It's not the ONLY fix, but it'd be a good start :)

To get better reviews, the game should be released in a less buggy state. Now, to be clear, non of the bugs ever bothered me any, I either never came up against them (being campaign bugs for example) or could always work around them. But as far as reviews goes, it's the reviewer's duty to point out these shortcomings.

[Bulldogs 10]

Completely agree. I never had any issues with it, but if it's buggy (which we all know it was on release) it's going to get bad reviews and that always going to hurt sales. That and I'm sure BIS wouldn't o out of their way to grease reviewers palms.

[An Fiach 10]

Find a server running a mission that would be fun to play with enough players, download and run the required mods for that server, join in and see that the server is actually what you expected and if not repeat the process, and then play.

13 year olds are not the only people having problems getting everything set up. Not everyone have some clue about comptuers and internet even if they were generals in the army, and setting up Arma 2 without someone telling you exactly what to do (multiple times usually) definitely requires more than just "having a clue". The "13 year old" is a moot point, it could just as well be a 30 year old with the same problem (except a 30 year old would just dump the game rather than repeatedly asking his 19 year old friend to set it up for him).

I can understand the mod issue, but finding a server?

[avibird 1 154]

I know what will make this game more popular add a jump key to the game just kidding guys.

The bottom line most players today want player vs player modes right out of the box that works and is well balanced. Most players who like ARMA prefer COOP gameplay with focus on mission objectives. BOHEMIA needs to make some good player vs player modes for small to moderate size missions in scale with team objectives. This would bring the player vs player crowd back in but will make them focus on real teamplay.

The thing about player vs player games most people don't have a real clue about teamwork. Yes some games like brothers in arms 1 & 2 and all the BF games use somewhat teamwork but it's not the same as playing coop in OFP/ARMA games. If BOHEMIA can make some good missions with team objectives it will be a win win for both crowds.

Some of the player vs player guys will see that this game was designed for COOP PLAY and it plays best this way. However, some will still lean towards player vs player modes but the overall numbers of players online will go up for both crowds. The key is for BOHEMIA to make well balanced missions for players right out of the box to help the player vs player crowd to grow and stay with this game.

I know warefer is player vs player somewhat mode but it's just to big and still has AI with to many respawns for my taste. player vs player modes should have no respawns or limited per team.

I can't understand why some of the COOP players don't want this game to be more popular with the player vs player guys.

Other key reasons why this game is not more popular is:

1. bugs from the release

2. bad performance issues with most hardware and a lot of time to get the game running right for most players

3. No good system for addon/MOD's and it can be hard to find games

4. poor/lack of advertisement with mainstream players

5. Not true reviews of the real gameplay from the start due to 1 & 2 above.

You must be open to hear the truth. Some of you can't. You think the only way to play this game is COOP play and on a PC. The question was why is this game not more popular well here it is. Some of you are going to rip my A for this post but the truth hurts. Do I feel COOP PLAY is the best way to play this game YES,YES and YES but most online players do not feel this way.

[Defunkt 431]

What AVIBIRD says is absolutely right. People, and most importantly the early-adopters who try out new games and might then make recommendations to their clan/buddies, are put off before they can even find out what the game is or isn't because it does not meet their baseline expectation of a MP game, namely it does not offer balanced PvP out of the box.

[Asmodeuz 54]

Why not put a review at Metacritic, or someplace else, meaning spreading the word now.

Myself, I can't find much bad to say about this game, only random crashings with servers I tend to join game, this also has something to do with mods being used.

The worse thing now, is that I'm not able to play as often as I wanted :)

I believe that there's people thinking silently, maybe even visiting some forums to read about This game and hoping someone gives the spark "hey, this game is anything but like it used to be on release date and how it was written about: now patched up, getting mods that one can't even dream about in wildest manner, supported by a community that still somewhat keeps even the one and only Operation Flashpoint breathing! so why don't you now get rid of your fears and give it a try??"

Hell, yea'

[AndresCL 10]

The learning curve

[avibird 1 154]

The learning curve

The learning curve would not be as bad if some of the vet players would come out of their locked rooms and help the new players in public rooms. What happens in most public rooms there is no real leadership structure or order which just makes most public rooms unplayable for most new players because it's ARMA not some BF/COD game that you can just pop in and go with the flow. Most new players will get frustrate and stop playing yes some will get hooked but most will not.

BOHEMIA needs to make some small to mid size coop and player vs player modes/missions that work right out of the box to get the new blood hooked and then the new players will learn the real power of this game. Player made content and yes the MOD's but most new players will never get to this point because of the lack of player vs player modes to get them hooked into the gameplay.

[dmarkwick 261]

The learning curve

I don't think it's that. The game as played out the box is pretty straightforward. There's no more learning curve than Fallout3 or some other mildly complex game (albeit F3 has a more pronounced and intrusive learning level you have to play through first. But regardless, think of the bootcamp & armoury etc). BIS should always remember the new-to-the-franchise user and always have it this way IMO, turning the game up to full realism should always be the option not the default.

[galzohar 31]

Like said many times, the learning curve is not the main reason, as most players quit before they even reach the point where the learning curve is anywhere near becoming a problem for them. Unless you call installing/finding mods/missions/servers that are fun to play with/on a "learning curve".

There is a reason I also said "finding a server" and not just getting into said server. Unless you're a Domination fan you'll have a very hard time finding a populated server running something good, and even if you like domination, then finding a server with people, not to mention people that will actually play with you on some kind of level or at least not TK you and destroy your base, is not trivial.

[Guest]

To many people are blaming BIS for the issues.

According to half these posts, it is clearly the communities fault. Stop making mods and nobody will have issues connecting to servers, will they.

...

[tacticalnuggets 24]

To many people are blaming BIS for the issues.

According to half these posts, it is clearly the communities fault. Stop making mods and nobody will have issues connecting to servers, will they.

...

LOL! You sure are funny. Its not the games fault for making it insanely difficult for new people to join a game, or organize a group, or figure out what to do. I guess it isn't the games fault either for using a system that assumes people will manually install mods and addons. Its not the games fault for having a backwards multiplayer system, its the customers responsibility to mod that to. LOL

[Guest]

LOL! You sure are funny. Its not the games fault for making it insanely difficult for new people to join a game, or organize a group, or figure out what to do. I guess it isn't the games fault either for using a system that assumes people will manually install mods and addons. Its not the games fault for having a backwards multiplayer system, its the customers responsibility to mod that to. LOL

You're a clever bunny.

Why don't you go make a game? Oh no I forgot!

You don't know how too...

[bummer 10]

My opinion why its not more popular:

Still looks like ofp , graphics arent that good looking on medium computers or its just not playable.

Motion blur , it just sucks , you cant see worth beans as you swing to meet a threat!

Mouse lag , when you do swing its not very fluid since the delay causes over movement. it can be adjusted down but it's still there.

I didnt play arma because i was burnt out on ofp and thought this would be an upgrade , i really dont see it though.

not sure if this is safe to say here but if this game looked like dr and had its fluid movement i think it would be much more popular.

these are the things keeping me from really getting into this game.

ps i wouldnt even try online due to these limitations since it would just be an exercise in futility anyway.

My 2 cents!

[An Fiach 10]

Like said many times, the learning curve is not the main reason, as most players quit before they even reach the point where the learning curve is anywhere near becoming a problem for them. Unless you call installing/finding mods/missions/servers that are fun to play with/on a "learning curve".

There is a reason I also said "finding a server" and not just getting into said server. Unless you're a Domination fan you'll have a very hard time finding a populated server running something good, and even if you like domination, then finding a server with people, not to mention people that will actually play with you on some kind of level or at least not TK you and destroy your base, is not trivial.

Have to disagree with you there. I haven't looked for much lately, been offline for month and only played warfare recently, since it is new to me. Haven't had an issue finding servers to play on though.

---------- Post added at 01:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:49 AM ----------

You're a clever bunny.

Why don't you go make a game? Oh no I forgot!

You don't know how too...

There's that maturity you were bragging about.

---------- Post added at 01:55 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:53 AM ----------

My opinion why its not more popular:

Still looks like ofp , graphics arent that good looking on medium computers or its just not playable.

Motion blur , it just sucks , you cant see worth beans as you swing to meet a threat!

Mouse lag , when you do swing its not very fluid since the delay causes over movement. it can be adjusted down but it's still there.

I didnt play arma because i was burnt out on ofp and thought this would be an upgrade , i really dont see it though.

not sure if this is safe to say here but if this game looked like dr and had its fluid movement i think it would be much more popular.

these are the things keeping me from really getting into this game.

ps i wouldnt even try online due to these limitations since it would just be an exercise in futility anyway.

My 2 cents!

Post Processing affects motion blur, you can turn it off and I'm on a medium computer and it looks and runs fine. I find it odd you would say that this game would be more popular if it more resembled a game that was a total failure....

[Guest]

What else am I supposed to say? All he has been doing since he joined these forums is trolling about how bad the game is. No matter what I answer he always responds with "BIS made a crap game, it should be this that and the other"...

Why do people act so hypocritical? Fine, express your opinions on how bad you think the game is. But if you don't know how to do better yourself, don't start telling people how THEY can do it better. Especially not an established profesional games developer.

Opinions are fine!

Demands are not! Unless you can do better yourself, you have no right to tell other people how to do things.

I give up posting in this thread. Either way, we all lose, we are all arguing on the internet, and we are all about as contructive as a wooden plank.

Everybody just wants a cheap shot at everybody else, to make themselves look smart I guess. We all fall into this category, don't deny it.

Richie.

Edited February 20, 2010 by Guest

[An Fiach 10]

What else am I supposed to say? All he has been doing since he joined these forums is trolling about how bad the game is. No matter what I answer he always responds with "BIS made a crap game, it should be this that and the other"...

Why do people act so hypocritical? Fine, express your opinions on how bad you think the game is. But if you don't know how to do better yourself, don't start telling people how THEY can do it better. Especially not an established profesional games developer.

Opinions are fine!

Demands are not! Unless you can do better yourself, you have no right to tell other people how to do things.

I give up posting in this thread. Either way, we all lose, we are all arguing on the internet, and we are all about as contructive as a wooden plank.

Everybody just wants a cheap shot at everybody else, to make themselves look smart I guess. We all fall into this category, don't deny it.

Richie.

Relax, it is pretty realistic, but it is just a game :p

[Guest]

Relax, it is pretty realistic, but it is just a game :p

Of course, that's how I see it. :)

At least you can come up with logical explinations. You can see problems, and provide solutions.

Nuggets has logic, but he also presents invalid problems, with solutions that make no sense.

"I have a problem, I have a square, and need to put it in a circle hole."

"I know a solution, make the hole triangle instead"

That's my point. His argument has no sense. It has logic, and I can see his point, but the way he is going about it is wrong.