Why is this game not more popular?

[[evo] dan 79]

TBH, nothing has changed since DayZ besides the nr. of new players joining public servers.

You still get the complete fuckwits who shoot everyone as soon as they get control of their avatars, the ones who shoot the guy in front of them after about 1-2 mins in when they see that they cant run and gun, the ones who drop of the server after you spend 5 mins explaining them what to do, the GBU magicians and of course last but not least the guy who is patient enough to walk for half an hour, follow orders, doesn't complain if he didn't get to fire a shot before he died and after all that says that he loves the game.

^this

Before DayZ choppers were noob magnets, now dayZ is here, choppers are still noob magnets (I learnt to fly in editor - people who want to fly should do that, some servers even say that "if you want to learn to fly - fly in the editor"), nothing has really changed - mostly the numbers.

[igneous01 19]

DayZ has exposed Arma to the "mainstream", which can only be good for the game.

concerning the most recent changes done to the stats of certain weapons present in dayZ mod (the ak74 nerf, and the pistol shotgun damage nerf) as well as the sudden spring up of commands related to dayZ (eye direction, intersection, moonIntensity) would suggest that, while I like the new commands and multiplayer tweaks, dont like the idea that weapons should be nerfed in a game that attempts to simulate actual ballistics. I am hoping this isnt intentional, and I also hope things dont get any worse (sudden cut back of features, like 3d editor, in arma 3).

so, I question what mainstream is going to do to this series, mainstream sabotaged every other gaming title over time (the first 2 call of duties, the first 3 ghost recons, rainbow six, swat), maybe it has already begun?

Atleast ACE team is still around, I like that they try to make Arma more like VBS2, rather than as Arma.

[nodunit 397]

The funny thing is that many dayZ players do not approve of the weapon changes, and the only person that said it was positive in the thread was boo'd out.

http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/48168-weapon-damage-re-upped/

Edited July 28, 2012 by NodUnit

[Beagle 684]

The changes are positive all round in sake of realism, just a bit problematic in small parts. Despite the impression its not just DayZ wepons that got values changs closer to real life. We just got used to it to long that all rifles were the same, now the are not anymore. It was wrong all the years that a AK74 had the same power like a M16 depite the fact that a 5.45x39 has only 75% of the power of a 5.56x45. The change in accuracy was also long overdue. There is a reason why a Ak74 is cheap and a M16 is not and why a Makarov pistol is onyl a undelayed blowback while a 9x19 usually is delayed in some way.

DayZ will have to adopt.The changes affect DayZ in a heavy way while you barely notice it in ArmA most of the time.

The effects of the chages take place beyond 200 meters and AK should never have been very effective at that range nor shoud M16 be really battlefield effective beyond 300m. Remember, battlefield is not pratice range.

Edited July 27, 2012 by Beagle

[Phantom Six 25]

I can deal with the changes. It didn't really bother me too much. I did try a little practice shooting on this shooting range mission firing at a stationary AI human. I didn't really noticed the weapon nerf until some people started posting pissed off comments about it. So I guess it doesn't bother me much unless it was ridiculous (whole clip for a kill) kind of thing. This was just trying out rifles. I haven't tried out the SMGs and pistols though, but pistols were already pretty weak before. Same goes for SMGs at times, they're okay-ish.

I haven't played DayZ probably for 2-3 months already so I don't know how much it affected those guys.

[Beagle 684]

I can deal with the changes. It didn't really bother me too much. I did try a little practice shooting on this shooting range mission firing at a stationary AI human. I didn't really noticed the weapon nerf until some people started posting pissed off comments about it. So I guess it doesn't bother me much unless it was ridiculous (whole clip for a kill) kind of thing. This was just trying out rifles. I haven't tried out the SMGs and pistols though, but pistols were already pretty weak before. Same goes for SMGs at times, they're okay-ish.

I haven't played DayZ probably for 2-3 months already so I don't know how much it affected those guys.

You will notice it more with russian Assault rifles compared to NATO ones but it is in a absolutely reasonable range. The whole issue is more of a DayZ problem.

[Phantom Six 25]

Well. I was trying out the Russian Assault rifles in the firing range mission actually. I wasn't really affected by it so its not a big concern to me. As for the SMGs, I haven't give those a go yet, but compared SMGs previously and now, how much of a difference are they? Same goes for the pistols.

As for the DayZ community, I saw screams of outrage everywhere xD

[iceman77 18]

Though the claim that the Arma series is niche, for only a certain, small crowd of people... I would blame it on marketing.For example, I have many friends that play Arma now that didn't even know it existed other than when they'd come over to my house and see me playing it.My friends were into COD/BF for the longest time until they actually played Arma.

When you like games <insert genre here>... and the masses are playing <insert game here>, and said game(s) are heavily advertised then it's only natural to lean towards whats "popular". Whats popular must be the cream of the crop right?Certainly since they have big commercials and billboards in the gamestops everywhere, it (they) must be the best choice...

Claims that Arma only appeals to a certain small crowd is very wrong.If the masses only knew about and gotten a chance to play Arma then games like BF/COD would suffer a heavy loss in player base.Every pc gamer I know who were fans of BF and/or COD are now playing arma because of me.I can personally say i'm responsible for 9 purchased copies. Moral is... if I can bring in new players so can some good advertisement, the games here, it just needs to be displayed for the masses.My 2c

Edited July 28, 2012 by Iceman77

[BasileyOne 10]

The changes are positive all round in sake of realism, just a bit problematic in small parts. Despite the impression its not just DayZ wepons that got values changs closer to real life. We just got used to it to long that all rifles were the same, now the are not anymore. It was wrong all the years that a AK74 had the same power like a M16 depite the fact that a 5.45x39 has only 75% of the power of a 5.56x45. The change in accuracy was also long overdue. There is a reason why a Ak74 is cheap and a M16 is not and why a Makarov pistol is onyl a undelayed blowback while a 9x19 usually is delayed in some way.

DayZ will have to adopt.The changes affect DayZ in a heavy way while you barely notice it in ArmA most of the time.

The effects of the chages take place beyond 200 meters and AK should never have been very effective at that range nor shoud M16 be really battlefield effective beyond 300m. Remember, battlefield is not pratice range.

AK ammo is about 15x-200x less expensive than M885/M995[depend particular sub-type in both cases], in some expense of loading variation/accuracy and less optimal[for accuracy/spread] pressure curve.

basically, AK was:

1. made for GLOBAL wars["all-out", like WWI/WWII and etc], and anthropometric ally pointed to AVERAGE customer, including women's and kids.

VERSATILITY and all-around-caps - is fundamental for Military hardware in SU/RF. cuz you CANNOT afford to produce SO many variety of things in wartime and barely do it even in peace, usually[seems].

2. made balanced in terms of "bang-per-buck" ie they[sU Generals]pick "do we need 2% better accuracy or 4% better handling at expense of 40% reliability ? or should we're better have [fully]equip 10x soldiers for price usual for ONE Western, instead ?" quesstion in quite obvious way, seems.

3. Soviet AR's made around different concept of usage, purpose. rather than "assault carbine" in West, it closer to Westerm LMG&SMG meaning, except probably, marines[rapid-fire aimed sing shot with persistent dodging require kinda more training than Western "hold breath and release trigger, looking at tgt.

about pistols/sidearm rounds - 9x17 round, used in PM[and some american pistols].

small recoil allow inbelievable things in guns engineering. look at Bizon SMG for example. preferably on live edperience - grab 9x17 Bizon and shot it and then get Bizon, chambered for TT round or 9x19[both produced infrequently].

and then compare it from different part of mosaic - SR-1 pistol and derivatives/followings/improvements, initially purposed as PM replacement[in variant w/o built-in supressor].

Edited July 29, 2012 by BasileyOne

[Phantom Six 25]

Though the claim that the Arma series is niche, for only a certain, small crowd of people... I would blame it on marketing.For example, I have many friends that play Arma now that didn't even know it existed other than when they'd come over to my house and see me playing it.My friends were into COD/BF for the longest time until they actually played Arma.

When you like games <insert genre here>... and the masses are playing <insert game here>, and said game(s) are heavily advertised then it's only natural to lean towards whats "popular". Whats popular must be the cream of the crop right?Certainly since they have big commercials and billboards in the gamestops everywhere, it (they) must be the best choice...

Claims that Arma only appeals to a certain small crowd is very wrong.If the masses only knew about and gotten a chance to play Arma then games like BF/COD would suffer a heavy loss in player base.Every pc gamer I know who were fans of BF and/or COD are now playing arma because of me.I can personally say i'm responsible for 9 purchased copies. Moral is... if I can bring in new players so can some good advertisement, the games here, it just needs to be displayed for the masses.My 2c

I told some people about ARMA around my school :P None of them are interested. The ones who are interested where I'm from already knew about ARMA without me having to tell them, but then, I guess I'm still a high schooler in a community for of kiddos so that's a different story. They weren't interested because it wasn't some fast pace run/gun twitch shooter. Most of the kiddos around where I'm from don't have the patience for what you can do in ARMA. Well, now they're interested... just for DayZ.

ARMA does need a bit better advertisement out around though, but then again it takes a lot of patience to get into ARMA for people who don't have patience would be a problem.

[^Th0mas^ 10]

Sick. In a few days DayZ will probably reach 1000000 players.

[ArmaLeg 1]

I only heard about ARMA 2 through Youtube, I watched a couple of videos, I then download ARMA 2 Free and I thought it really was a great game, I may of had the game but I decided to buy the game officially and I bought all the Expansions with it, this game is worth buying if you like realistic war games, there may not be music in game or special announcements but real life does not have that either, it is a military simulation more than a game, people don't think it is popular because it does not have the similar gameplay to any other shooter games, to me, this is a unique game and I can't wait for the new Expansion as well as newer mods.

[BasileyOne 10]

as long as BIS-related pulishers not active in promoting/advertising/selling anymore in past and today, probably BIS would need 2 find another way/strategy to advertise/distribute/sell it.

basically i prefer approach, picked by Runic, but personally that mean im screwed, cuz its [untolerable]complicated compared to "just buy a box in offline store" counterpart in retail version case].

IMO, Google+ and Facebook along with Youtube and Google ads programm advertisement could bring more customers than ALL efforts in years before.

as we're can see on DayZ example.

probably BIS should setup related competition for such resources/networks with minor, but cute awards and sign advertisement contract with Google[and/or US DoD/Navy did that in exchange of [minor]discount 4 VBS3;].

[jblackrupert 14]

Publishers that actually do their job would help a lot.

In North America Meridian4 did virtually nothing to promote the game and a lot of stores couldn't get copies for several months after the release date.

Working closely with Amazon to distribute copies would be help a lot.

[jumpinghubert 49]

its like a stupid brain virus to think, all products have to be for all people to be "good"

[BasileyOne 10]

yeah, working with young, less-fat/lazy publishers could help too.

but in my opinion, Runic Games did right step moving all-around, including own system of distribution, along with selling thru Steam, Impulse and others.

less distribution/sales being locked-down by/on someone, the better. same about game development advance, thats why [lagging and encumbered]PhysX usage in Arma3 cause serious issues, likely to experienced by Epic games in past days. same about dependency on API's, development tools and etc. watch for EA workarounds on-topic, especially about Qt usage[considering EA Microsoft division, in fact and Nokia/Troll-tech acquiring].

its like a stupid brain virus to think, all products have to be for all people to be "good"

skilled salesman can sell anything to anyone, sure ;)

point is that not about stupidity or rhetoric, nor advanced marketing science&psychology, but about their common sense and living experience[including related/similar].

so, to simplify, trick not to "sell as much as you can to anyone you can", but prioritize on "good customers" and remain "good supplier" for them, ie long-term/fail-safe buziness-plan/shedule/strategy[which is some studios/pubs lack :/]

Edited July 29, 2012 by BasileyOne

[ranubis 2]

Best game ever

[galzohar 31]

Best game ever

Maybe, but it doesn't answer the question at hand.

[BasileyOne 10]

Maybe, but it doesn't answer the question at hand.

sometimes question is best answer.

and the answer is "why? why, God???!"

but seriously, "not more popular" was obvious - big fat lazy consumers and/or publishers and otherwise BIS-hostile environment, which causes fluffy BIS personnel feel himself so lonely, so offended by marketing/sales #'s.

while in fact, numbers isn't bad, yet, many games wasn't hit 1/10 of such "success", honestly.

remaining constructive, PR and Logistic[not ads, sadly]was a problem.

just recently friends in PL and De - simply can't buy Arma2Co boxes for insta-lan-party of corporate weekend :/

[luizsilveira 5]

Interesting this thread has been going for years.

I didn't see it all, but mostly saw people blaming the "niche" target or lack of marketing (which are both true). The *huge* amount of bugs is a big no-no for many people as well, and it counts towards very bad marketing (via reviews etc.).

However, what I'm finding the largest problem is simply the clunkyness of the UI, especially with the modding. I'm trying to get some games going with some friends and it easily takes two evenings for an average computer user to set it up. He will get multiple errors and whatnot, will have a bit of time to understand the command line mechanic, etc. It's just horrible.

Now try to tell a guy who is used to console "plug and play" and he will need two evenings battling the game just to set it up to play, plus a chunk more of time every time the many updates come frequently... and you'll hear a laughter. And so far I'm talking about playing with friends, I won't even mention the nightmare it is for a below-average user to find a public server (along with running the required mods etc).

In the case everything goes to par, which I doubt, if the guy doesn't have an "Arma friend" he will find himself in a public server with absolutely no clue of what to do or where to go. Yes, playing more single player could have helped, or playing the tutorials. This could even be mentioned when launching the multiplayer lobby for the first time: "attention, it is HIGHLY recommended that you run the tutorials and at least one or two single player missions before joining multiplayer, even if you are a FPS veteran". Even in Arma Free this could be an issue and the lack of pointers for the beginners could easily be bad marketing again (the guy downloads the free, could like the game, but hates it and won't buy it because he is lost inside it).

It's a shame seeing so many people giving up playing just for the sheer difficulty of setting it up. And don't give me the excuse that "it's the mods". Of course it's the mods, the game is supposed to be highly moddable (it's one of its assets) so modding and playing with mods should be dead easy. But it's not.

[IceRain 1]

I have been playing fps games for many a year and have been an avid flight simmer for just as long but for some strange reason I never heard of Arma2 until some guys on a game forum began playing DayZ recently. I'm thinking that there is not enough marketing of this amazing product or the above would not be so. Yesterday I was talking to some flight simmers about Arma2 (they had never heard of it either) and when they looked at it they fell in love as it is more of a sim than a game.

Spread the word and they will come.

[luizsilveira 5]

[...]

Spread the word and they will come.

They will come. And then they will go away again pretty quickly - for example, when they get into playing coop campaigns and soon find out the save games don't work, even years after the problem was pointed out. Now try to play a mission like Manhattan without the save games :j:

Funny to ask "when will Arma 3 be finished" when clearly Arma 2 is not finished yet (but certainly not for the lack of patches).

That seems to be one big reason this game is not more popular. Because it has amazing features that are mind bogging to a few people but fail miserably at the most basic levels - working savegames, for example.

[^Th0mas^ 10]

I think ArmA 3 will be more popular than the previous games because it looks like it will be easier to controll players in the new engine. Also because of DayZ, ArmA is now more well known.

[nikiller 18]

hi,

Could you point a couple of quotes out? I think there aren't that many pricks on these forums, or at least I don't see them that often. Might just be my selection of forums. And yeah, the community's vocal minority is a problem, I've seen some disdain towards it on other sites.

Same here, I think there is not too much morons on the forum. Check DayZ forum and you will see BIS forum isn't too bad.

On topic:

- Prejudices. A lot of people know the game is buged and clunky because of bad reviews and they will not try to enjoy the game, just focus on the bugs. That's why ArmA3 must be bug free as possible when it releases.

- Learning curve. Setting the game and learning how to play it properly is very long, most of people want instant fun.

- Bad advertising.

- Bugs.

cya.

Nikiller.

[BasileyOne 10]

I think ArmA 3 will be more popular than the previous games because it looks like it will be easier to controll players in the new engine. Also because of DayZ, ArmA is now more well known.

also players in OFP:R had further "easied" control, but thats not extended playerbase much, actually[while helped a bit, sure].

point is - when game is CHALLENGING players, HOW MANY players will STAND challenge ? or at least how much of them, try to pretend to be able?

most "players" to do quick rush 2-3-5 min games on smartphones, home chillers, car audios IC's or vacuum clearners built-in games.

so every single game developer must[and most actually do, according to amounts/scale of [related]interviews/explanations you can found on youtube],question himself "how far you can go ? and how you would ? what you shouldn't do whaever means ? what is basic values for both you and you company ?" its quite [and impressively different]unique statistic, quite represent diversity of both gamedev insutry and human society, presently, scoped in

basically i think - they all converge in.

social games, MMO's, MMOFPS, RPG's, VR, real-world institutions[including government-issued/controlled].

they all become PART of you life, physically connected by indestructible means.

if you brain didn't exploded upon/until reading this part, its clear solution - EVOLVE. do something DIFFERENT. and BETTER, probably.

from "mainstream" dev's studios, i liked CryTek emphasis/strategy much, but more interested/curious about some off-spings, focusd on purely net-centric, distributed, p2p[or b2c/c2c or anything2anywhint ;]model for both content creation, distribution and horse-powering back-end/universe 4 all this, ie crowd-sourcing the crowd-sourcing as whole new meaning for ling of crowds which IMRPOVE everyday meaning of crowds to levels, unprecedentedly before.