11/26

[Baff1 0]

After the Velvet revolution, the state fabriques and compagnies were privatized. Because everyone shouted that the state is the worst employer and thing like that. So there was a privatization in wich theoraticly everyone could gain something. The reality was diferent. And it crippled our country. For example the czechoslovak merchant fleet was completly sold by a robber (that men was once an example to everyone, everyone taked him like a good capitalist and our example). Many thing got wrong in that privatisation. So it ended that czech governament, nor people owned something and all was bought by foreigners.

How much of it was owned/capitalised by foreigners before the Velvet revolution please?

If I again give Ukraine as my comparison we can see that much of their country was capitalised by foreigners under the communist system. (And still is).

Edited November 8, 2009 by Baff1

[derk yall 0]

In that I am not realy sure but I think that big compagnies were owned by the state. The small ones was owned by people wich worked in it. By dont know now exactly how it was.

EDIT:

So It was how I thought, the presence of foreign goods on our markets were in the old era part illegaly, part legally, but there was an embargo on them. And that there was a small change that a foreigner owned a fabrique or compagnie in there.

Edited November 8, 2009 by Derk Yall

[vilas 473]

Sorry, that is false. There were several revolutions in 1989 wich called for the change of the governament. The leader of these revolutions promised a better life and told the people about a west, where everyone is rich and so. People believed them. So, people believed lies, the regime changed, later the economy was destroyed by western companies wich doesnt wanted concureces here. There wasnt a bankrupt or thing like these. There were only false promise about the west, but because of these false promise, or we can tell lies. People finded themself cheated. that plus the destruction of the economy by foreign compagnies had bringed the hate.

Also to all, dont compare apples and oranges.

Capitalism, socialism, communism = economy

Dictatorship, democracy, etc = means od directing a country.

yeah, we too, we were told we will fight communism and all will be rich :/

concerning destroying concurence (competition in English as i remember) way - i told site 3 or 4 (talking about 20% unemployment), my uncle was co-director in one such company which was sold by corrupted politicians to west company against interest of company, and company was destroyed

Edited November 8, 2009 by vilas

[oyman 0]

i have come to the conclusion that vilas is jealous of the american way of life

[vilas 473]

yes...

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=89875&page=4

shootings in schools, streets, mad militias in forests with automatic rifles waiting to kill everyone etc.

i am very jealous to get bullet or be homeless if for example by accident loose job...

and very jealous of rat-race and having kid killed in school by gunman

there is nothing better than living in culture of aggression

instead of reading high-demanding literature of for example Dostoyevsky

i am for people having equal chances, i am against invading other countries, i am for independence of nations and their ownership of oil - thats all

Edited November 8, 2009 by vilas

[sparks50 0]

I find it strange that this is still discussed. Communism is dead. Capitalism has brought huge chunks of the third world into the middle class, clothes, safety and food.

"Communistic" states have.. Well, largely fallen down on their own weight in corruption.

Many regimes, using violent means to prolong their period of power.

Communism is a beautiful idea, the human kind is just not mass loyal or pure in thought to handle it.

And USA is not a good example of individualism and capitalism. It still retains a strong government (starting wars, holding slave labor through taxes etc.)

If communism was so great why there were fences and armed guards on the borders.

They sure as hell weren't there to protect from the evil west when it was people from the inside of the border getting shot trying to leave.

DDR called it a necessary measure for the safety of the German Democratic Republic, because of the "aggresive military actions" by the west.

How stopping people from traveling out would aid to that, is anyones guess.

[vilas 473]

I find it strange that this is still discussed. Communism is dead. Capitalism has brought huge chunks of the third world into the middle class, clothes, safety and food.

"Communistic" states have.. Well, largely fallen down on their own weight in corruption.

Many regimes, using violent means to prolong their period of power.

Communism is a beautiful idea, the human kind is just not mass loyal or pure in thought to handle it.

And USA is not a good example of individualism and capitalism. It still retains a strong government (starting wars, holding slave labor through taxes etc.)

DDR called it a necessary measure for the safety of the German Democratic Republic, because of the "aggresive military actions" by the west.

How stopping people from traveling out would aid to that, is anyones guess.

no, you forgetting CIA operations , feeding oppositions with promises, and than opposition was feeding us - citizens who never realized that in US there might be homeless man without social care, we all thought US = Dynasty movie of Carringtons and other TV series about the rich

and soldiers kept people because usual people could not believe there is poverty in US

thats why

and your US not keep soldiers ?

hah ?

DDR was also very strict and maybe even more strict than USSR

every country has borders, soldiers, walls, etc. every,

but US loves using term "communism", while in europe there are countries like Sweden, France, Germany when social is, and people live happy (comparing to other people on world)

i think best choice is way of those countries

and i used "communism" example only to show "lies" of US propaganda , to show that all those propaganda movies including all Rambo and etc. were aiming like we lived in hell here in east europe , it was not hell, it was other way of economy (with other problems , problems in other areas), but west was making new and new weapons, CIA operations to destroy us calling us evil empire

well for me evil empire is country which sends soldiers to other countries and allows kids to be killed because every cyco can buy AK in shop

Edited November 8, 2009 by vilas

[sparks50 0]

no, you forgetting CIA operations , feeding oppositions with promises, and than opposition was feeding us - citizens who never realized that in US there might be homeless man without social care, we all thought US = Dynasty movie of Carringtons and other TV series about the rich

But if they were better off in the old country, why did they never return?

well for me evil empire is country which sends soldiers to other countries and allows kids to be killed because every cyco can buy AK in shop

I live in a country in Scandinavia that largely bans all sorts of assault rifles without direct authorization from the police.

That doesn't stop bad people from using those weapons in robberies, murders and other crimes though.

Edited November 8, 2009 by sparks50

[pj[cz] 2]

i am for people having equal chances, i am against invading other countries, i am for independence of nations and their ownership of oil - thats all

Yes and that is why you are clearly advocating communism? (by the way comunism is purely political while socialism is the economical term mmmkay?)

Please give me a brake, in comunism there were no equal chances. You may have been another einstein and if your dad had a bad meaning about the government you could have cleaned basic school toilets for the rest of your life because the regime will never let you to college. Yes you will have your "free" flat. You will even have "free" health care. But those things were never free. Those things vere hardly bought by labouring of others. And this kind of regime was so good for slackers. You had a job no matter how you suced at it :O The majority of homeless people in Czech republic today are people who dont want to worl and instead of that they rely/relied on the regime. Well tough luck, you need to work and try hard to get stuff, that seems a logical way to me. If you imply that a man with 10 cars should be killed that you sir ARE a terrorist lol. A man with 10 cars should be admired for what good things he has done, or thrown into jail for what he has stolen :) Any of the regimes su**s at delivering justice, but i would take capitalism/democracy any day over communism/socialism. You cant judge a country for having a few homeless, unemployed (20% is brutal and that was caused pretty much by the government failing and corrupcy), because all countries have those, just you dont see homeless people in every czech movie as opposed to USA movies.

My on-topic part would be that i think terrorism can be raised only in places with poor education. Dont tell me that killing other innocent people can solve anything? It willl never, it wil only get those people mad and then get ready to take their terrorism. The whole idea just sounds retarded to me. If internet was so widely spread in afghanistan it surely would have been a lot harder for taliban to get their new recruits

/Sarcasm:

And as far as i remember the freedom of speech / internet, arent exactly the most spred things around dictator/totallity/communist regimes :)

[vilas 473]

But if they were better off in the old country, why did they never return?

DDR is other issue, there was not good in DDR as i know (Stasi)

also it is important WHO leaved country

people who leaving country in cold war were :

- people with religious reasons (there are people for whom church, gods and etc

- people who wanted more money, for them "color TV" was best and "car is all"

those people not looked at global solidarity of society, they not looked at "what will happen if i will be very ill", they looked "i will have better car"

in systems like US - all goes good till you have a problem

like todays news about Obama signed act

there was interview with doctor in US, what he thinks, she (doctor) said:

US is dream, only dream, when you get sick on serious illness, loose job, you loose home and noone will help you and you beg for food

people who emigrate are also some specific category of people:

- money reason (sometimes most greedy and less familiar , less loving family, but more money)

- people without choice in place they live now

i was also thinking about emigration, but because i hate corruption we now have and problems because i fought with some corrupted officers and since some years i only have problems because i put to light some facts

but in general problem is that people from US (look at first posts of Ludwig) everything what is not american - call communist

when one Sweden citizen here told about his good live in Sweden , he was called communist, heh

so US builds "communism" wall -myth

for me ideal is Swedish/French/German half-socialism, but for some american (maybe republicans) "all what is not love to US is bad communism" and they surprise to have terrorism

now Obama changes attitude to US of many people, cause they see familiar face , not full of hate republican who wants smash other nations by US Army

I live in a country in Scandinavia that largely bans all sort of assault rifles without direct authorization from the police. That doesn't stop people from using those weapons in robberies and other crimes though.

but stupid kid won't buy AK to shoot people in market ?

criminals ALWAYS have guns, but someone who has no contacts in mafia, cannot buy gun

for sure canot buy AK

while in US freak can buy AK and kill people in market cause his girl not want him (today program on 911 on Discovery)

Please give me a brake, in comunism there were no equal chances.

in Poland people from poor families and farmers children had lower exams (extra points) on studies "za pochodzenie" (for birth)

i had more, cause when my father died in accident , i had holidays financed by state and food in school

in capitalism i would never end school, cause we had no money (only mother worked, and she was teacher, very low paid job, usual worker has more )

Dont tell me that killing other innocent people can solve anything?

sometimes opens eyes of society

if not terrorism, some societies would not look at their governments hands (nations fighting for independence for example, than society of A not cares about minority let's say B, if B not do something "spectacular" , A simply not cares)

those are historical proofs

do you think that gov. of A would care to talk to minority B, if B not put bomb ?

concerning 10 cars:

i can give you example from PL, there was company when owner was cheating workers for money , he was telling that company lowers down and they must work harder, they worked harder to save places of job

he fired some people to justify his lies

what was truth ?

completly different, only accountant knew the truth that company had big profit

he found that this way he earn milions more

so when i see rich - i think it is someone who cheat and steal, other way it was impossible in our countries, or someone who corrupted to get contracts from state or had contacts with secret police and had contracts

maybe on west man with 10 cars is "better working" but in our countries it is mostly "mafia, thief-cheater, bitch, corrupted politician"

in our countries there is very small percentage of honest hard working rich

Edited November 9, 2009 by vilas

[Hans Ludwig 0]

yes...

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=89875&page=4

shootings in schools, streets, mad militias in forests with automatic rifles waiting to kill everyone etc.

i am very jealous to get bullet or be homeless if for example by accident loose job...

and very jealous of rat-race and having kid killed in school by gunman

there is nothing better than living in culture of aggression

instead of reading high-demanding literature of for example Dostoyevsky

i am for people having equal chances, i am against invading other countries, i am for independence of nations and their ownership of oil - thats all

Welcome to America vilas. We invade other countries because we are the only country, other than the UK, that have a spine and stand up too aggressors.

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[vilas 473]

Welcome to America vilas. We invade other countries because we are the only country, other than the UK, that have a spine and stand up too aggressors.

and thats why you are hated and will have another 9/11 if you won't change approach to the world

thanx god more americans chosen Obama, if all were republicans i would praise terrorists and wish you more planes in buildings

but choosing Obama americans show they have also other face, than full of aggression, hate, arrogance, guns, and invading other countries which were not aggressors, but have oil and other raw materials which you want to steal

Hitler was also invading other countries and thats why we hate him

and shooting in that military base was also because of your attitude,

guy wanted retired, guy wanted to not go to Iraq, you forced him, you get result of forcing man not to do what he wants

if you were fighting agressors and bringing freedom, you won't be supporting (CIA) some movements and dictators in south America , but for you "freedom" is only when "according to your way"

if poor people suffer from right-party, than you support dictator, but when there is left-party movement, you invade

when workers suffer, you support rich

when rich get kick in teeth, you fight poor and even cooperate with drug mafia (70's, 80's)

when in african poor country (where there is no oil) milions of people slaughter each other - you not invade

when there is oil - you "bring freedom"

shame that all republicans were not in 2001 in those WTC, world would be better without you

and america would be less aggressive and better looking, maybe less shootings in schools and better situation of poor/ill people

history of 60's, 70's, 80's is full of examples of supporting only rich owners , and fighting when poor people fight for their freedom (for example with owners which treated them badly) but than interests of your concerns/companies could be in danger

your "freedom" is sick when normal man looks at history of last years , your "dream" is sick when someone has for example accident, loose job and stay homeless

in Christianity "meter of humanity is how you treat weak and poor"

jungle law of animals is "strongest will survive" and that things stand some people as animals, not humans , while in other countries for example orphans have help

on site 4 i gave examples of fairy tales and relations in work, comparing old people grown in socialism (who help each other) and yuppies (rat-race) grown in your companies here

one people are helpful, other are rat-race retards, only give them guns, they will shoot other people as "competition for money and position near boss ass to lick"

some people read Dostoyevsky and other "moral literature about sense of life, humanism, relations between humans, conscience" other watch how one person shoot to other person (even your aggressive tales as Coyote and Road Runner, Tom and Jerry, Papay etc.)

for one man "hero" is person who is doctor saving people (for example in "positivism" literature from 1880, for others Rambo-like)

although i am not catholic, i use Pope words about meter of humanity and jungle law to judge animals

also prof. Robert D Hare books about "Without conscience" psychopaths and normal human being

http://books.google.pl/books?id=xfIEVtzj52YC&dq=robert+d+hare+without&printsec=frontcover&source=bn&hl=pl&ei=Ovb3SqO5DJaQsAb6jbDZAQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CB4Q6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=&f=false

in 80's you supported talibs, cause they were fighting USSR, although they had the same religion-crazy ideas , if you were not supporting them (of course i don't deny fighting them because of their religion-craziness ) but i am against invading other countries which are not religion-crazy-bombers

and you should also react when milion hootoo (or tootsy) slaughtered milion tootsy (or hootoo), but they had no oil...

man can slaughter man... when he has no oil

have US war criminals payed for civilians killed in NK, Vietnam, and other wars ? how many soldiers of US sit in prison for "collateral damage" ?

how many Iraq children have cancer because of usage of uranium ammo ?

every nation should have right to decide about their future, even when this future is not WalMart, McEat and Colt and oil companies, if people are not satisfied with their government and do revolution to change their future - they have will to change their future and their interests, not yours interests , wonder what will happen to Chaves , wonder what will happen if in one or other country people will turn against owners because for example there is high level of corruption and no food somewhere ? intervention?

better try to avoid next kids die because cyco get AK in hands, better avoid situation when boy shoot someone cause he lived in forest with half nazi militias , better do order with your own citizens who hide with rifles in forests and say about "supremacy"

thanx god not all americans are republicans, and i believe that this half US people can change future to positive

and more altruism, less "money-hunger"

for example when in my block of flats one old lady without family needed help and painting room i did it and not took money, just for "thanx Peter"

when my neighbor , old man needed to change furniture, i helped him and done shelf, could you do something like this ?

they were not my family, they were old an "useless" people, but not in "European" philosophy, it is just matter of humanism, that for example old disabled person ask for help

not jungle law "i am stronger, i f** weaker"

Edited November 9, 2009 by vilas

[Baff1 0]

Vilas I'm sure you are a nice guy who helps the elderly and infirm, but do not imagine for one minute that world is not filled with nice people such as you who do exactly the same. In every nation, in every society. In this regard all philosophies of all cultures are in perfect unison.

Political systems may differ. Religions may differ. Economic circumstances may differ. Human nature remains the same.

We didn't support the Talibs in the 80's mate. The Taliban movement only started in the 90's after the Soviet withdrawl was complete. It is a poltical movement born out of that power vacuum.

We supported a load of different warlords back then, just as we do now. Only now the level of support we offer is much much greater than just the odd special forces team.

Pakistan supported the Taliban movement in the 90's.

No one here ever liked them.

They got bad press from day one for their fundamentalist ways. We had them marked down as "bad guys" long before 9/11.

When they blew up all those monuments in the mountains and started kicking girls out of school and outlawing music?

That's about when we decided they suck. It was all the way back then that our governments first declared their opposition.

We did however massively appreciate the clamp down they made on heroine production. It wasn't all bad.

I find it strange that this is still discussed. Communism is dead. Capitalism has brought huge chunks of the third world into the middle class, clothes, safety and food.

An achievement which largely pales to the scale on which communism has done the same.

In just ten years China alone brought a number of people out of poverty equal to the entire population of the continent of Africa. Something the combined capitalist countries of America and Europe have been unsusccessfully tying to achieve for hundreds of years.

One isn't better than the other, they are both similar methods of doing exactly the same.

There are corrupt capitalists and corrupt communists. Failed captalist economies and failed communist economies.

Political rhetoric and posturing about the inherant superioirity of either system, is just that, rhetoric and posturing.

A governmental system is a strong as the individual people who run it. World events pay little attention to which party is in power.

What is a great system one decade is often a miserable system the next. A good king replaced with a mad one. A bumper crop replaced by a famine.

(No matter how smart you are, no matter how advanced your culture, every once in a while God rolls the dice).

As for having another 9/11 if countries such as ours don't change our approach, almost any amount of 9/11's is better than just one more 1939. One more 1916.

Yes, we will have another 9/11.

But then that's not really the worst future we can imagine for ourselves. It's a substantially lesser evil than another Pearl Harbour for example.

I'm not American myself, (British), but I go in for invasions. I prefer to have wars in other peoples countries and not my own. Terrorism is a small price to pay.

Compared to another Blitz, 9/11 is a joke.

And it's not all about self-defence either. Some of it is purely economic. Purely about greed and better living standards. More food. Lesser child mortality, longer life. I need oil in my car to drive the little old people to the hospital as often as I do.

Flowers in my garden to brighten my wifes smile. Books in my schools. Money in my pocket.

I must protect not only what is immediatley mine to keep it, but all that I interact positively with. All my intrests abroad. Trade routes, allies, natural resources. All those things that makes my way of life the way it is because the alternative isn't good.

---------- Post added at 08:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:52 PM ----------

Welcome to America vilas. We invade other countries because we are the only country, other than the UK, that have a spine and stand up too aggressors.

Not exactly, you missed out Russia, France, The Netherlands, Denmark, Australia, Canada, India, Iraq, North Korea, Turkey, Israel, Lebanon, Indonesia...in fact far too many to mention.

But as Vilas points out, all those countries who stand up to aggressors most often are widely perceived to be the greatest aggressors themselves.

It just depends who's side you empathise with more.

Edited November 9, 2009 by Baff1

[jakerod 254]

Welcome to America vilas. We invade other countries because we are the only country, other than the UK, that have a spine and stand up too aggressors.

Yeah like that genocidal maniac in the Sudan or Rwanda... oh wait we didn't do jack shit either of those places.

I'm sure that those 12,000 Afghan civilians that have been killed by the war support it to. Or maybe those 93,000 civilians in Iraq back it up. I'm not totally against the wars just about why they occurred and how they went about them.

The point is we aren't the knights in shining armor that you think we are.

[Baff1 0]

We are to our children.

[sparks50 0]

In just ten years China alone brought a number of people out of poverty equal to the entire population of the continent of Africa. Something the combined capitalist countries of America and Europe have been unsusccessfully tying to achieve for hundreds of years.

Thats the achievement of capitalism I was talking about. If China was isolated in the world and not able to sell their products to the global market, they would have been just as bad of today as fifty years ago.

Millions moving up to middle class in China: fueled by western consumerism.

Most of Asia is a good example on this. Hopefully bigger parts of Africa will be able to join in on it too one day, when Asian workforce becomes more expensive.

Edited November 9, 2009 by sparks50

[Baff1 0]

No mate.

China has an internal demand.

Western demand is the cream. Internal demand is the staple.

Hence when the west went into recession. China did not.

It's economy has continued to grow because it is not dependant on western/external customers. In fact it might be truer to say that it is Chinese communism that has underpinned American capitalism.

That is after all where a large portion of the loans that keep America's (currently disasterous) capitalist system functional, come from.

Yes, western consumerism has been a driver of the Chinese economy, but it is communism that built the economy able to take advantage of that demand.

The chinese communist regime brought the nations infrastructure, social cohesion and organisation to a level that has raised millions of it's people out of poverty.

They did it on their own. It's their achievement, not yours.

Edited November 9, 2009 by Baff1

[vilas 473]

China grown cause west companies decided to move there production, and now China hold us by our balls

our engineers have no work, cause no plants, our workers have no work, cause single t-shirt, screwdriver is Made in China :/

your big companies (not your societies ) gave up our independence to China, cause now China decides about all, and now we all have problems

China produces all, and what do we do ?

do we have industry or unemployed workers and THAN more spend on social care ?

but as i told before - i used only "communism" as example of "good vs. evil propaganda of movies and brain wash"

for me Sweden, France, Germany and such like are "example to follow"

shame that some US people divide "what is not jungle law is equal communism and communism must be destroyed"

i wonder what Walmart workers think ;)

i hope one day in future China won't choke us, now they hold our balls (production)

we should try to move little to our own independence (from t-shirt to foto camera) , cause if they will cut something, we will left without pants and shirt on us

and concerning what i said before... hmmm... US was not supporting arabian extremists fighting USSR in 80's ? nor Saddam ?

do you have no access to facts ? even on one of your Rambo or "Spies like us" there was such scene

[Baff1 0]

The U.S. was supporting assorted tribal warlords in Afghanistan during the 80's.

None of them however were Taliban. As the Taliban movement started in the 90's in Pakistan.

It would perhaps be a mistake to think of the Afghans as one people?

It is also likely that none of the Afghan tribes supported by NATO countries in the 80's were religious fundamentalists. They had their own Islamic support networks and traditionally have shunned western influnences completely.

Anecdotally, 150 years ago when super cheap Chinese mass production was a similar threat to our domestic industries, it was the opium from Afghanistan that we sold them that is widely acredited with destroying their national production. Along with a little bit of military intervention of course.

Edited November 9, 2009 by Baff1

[vilas 473]

talib or not talib - religious insane arab in turban who want kill everyone who is not like he - for me one kind

[riffleman 20]

talib or not talib - religious insane arab in turban who want kill everyone who is not like he - for me one kind

what you think about Taliban Mr vilas.Taliban is bigest. threat for india,pakistan and afghanistan.

The terrorist factory in swat and waziristan of pakistan.

[-martin- 10]

Eh, sorry but when there was socialism every people had free school, there werent unemployed people and the state gived free houses. After the velvet revolution in 1989 the "west" infact destroyed our economy because they doesnt wanted concurence in these countries.

Also to corect some mistaes, yes sometimes there were lines for food or thing like toilet paper (happened only once, the factory burned and the west didnt wanted to send it to us). but it wasnt all the time only in ocasions.

No state canged your job, no-one told you to change you location of living etc. Also the people had money without debs or bills. If you hade no work the state offered you one. If you had been injured the state gave you a free threatment. You could suceed.

It sure that it wasnt ideal and there were also bad think like political prosecution, but these same thing happened also on the west.

East != USSR

West != USA

Capitalism != democracy

Communist != dictatorship

Capitalism, communism etc. are economical ways, so they cant be compared to the way the countries are ruled (democracy, dictatorship, )

I totally agree with that, anyone who says thats not true is just a liar, also there were no drugs and so many crimes like there are today, now I come to my city in the Czech Republic and I see kids walking with their pants on their knees smoking grass and trying to speak English, makes me sick...

[maturin 12]

Communism DOES equal dictatorship. That's the whole point. Utopian enforced equality and total party control of the economy and government. Which generally includes complete domination of all aspects of human life (works wonders on drug abuse and crime) unless the system is defunct.

Publicly owned assets and social welfare is what != communism.

I get that the world today is fucked up, but people from most other countries who look fondly back on national legacies of mass murder by way of protest are considered crazy.

Edited November 10, 2009 by maturin

[riffleman 20]

It is for people who work in industry or in big units.where they find discrimination.you all need to understand large population problem.where communism can develop.

[Hans Ludwig 0]

Yeah like that genocidal maniac in the Sudan or Rwanda... oh wait we didn't do jack shit either of those places.

I'm sure that those 12,000 Afghan civilians that have been killed by the war support it to. Or maybe those 93,000 civilians in Iraq back it up. I'm not totally against the wars just about why they occurred and how they went about them.

The point is we aren't the knights in shining armor that you think we are.

I said aggressors. I thought it would be pretty intuitive what I meant by that: Blitz, Dunkirk, Pearl Harbor, 9/11, Tripoli, Pancho Villa, etc... etc... What happens in Africa is the African Union's problem to deal with, not the rest of the world. Please, don't act for one damn minute you actually care what happens in Africa. Because if you did, where was your out rage and you wanting to join an army, any army, to help out in Rawanda? The only reason you brought it up because it's the politically correct thing to say now days - it's what is in fashion, makes you feel good to acknowledge and clears your conscience.

Now, lets get back on topic, even though this thread got off topic along time ago to our communism is l33t poster.