Enemy Accuracy way to good.

[Majormauser 0]

and the chances are that the 505 version is release and patch 1.02 is released on the very same day that fixes these problems and people will come to the thread and say i told you so when they dont experience any of the superhaman dection AI

Edit: in fact i think patch 1.01 final has fixed some of it up for me so far.....havent had any turrets follow my every move behind concrete walls while crouched and no shadow visible for the enemy to follow.

I can only hope. But I have confidence in BI they made ArmA 2 and its awesome.... except for that invisible sniper hiding in the grass.

[SnR 1]

Ive been over 800m away Ghilie suit in thick scrub.

Line up my target, Bang contact down.........then a barage of AK puts dust all around me i have no chance.

Puts ghilie suit away returns with Cobra,:)

[usmc123 1]

Can't wait for some of you that don't have the game, to play and see how asome the AI is at shooting at you. LOL. 75% of the time You don't even know what hit you.

Then you can come to this thread and say how great it is... And that the inhuman reaction time is Great.... And realistic and fun... Don't forget the fun part...

LOL.

I have the game and I think the AI is stellar. If you place shots downrange from a concealed position, move, fire, repeat you will be successful. I tested the concept in the open, put myself on a rooftop next to a chimney and fired a shot that killed a soldier, I moved to the back of the chimney and the AI suppressed me. I know they suppressed because rounds impacted the chimney in multiple spots and I saw tracers flying past me. I also tried killing a few insurgents in a patrol, I got the first shot off, killed a guy, they looked around at this time I was fleeing. I found another spot, shot my rifle, kill. Ran to another spot but I crossed the road and was shot by the patrol.

The AI is fantastic this time around, I see no reason to gripe or pretend that it is ridiculously good. After all the ArmA playing time this game is a welcome change. I would rather see rounds impacting all around me than killing off an enemy patrol without them firing a shot. I.E. ArmA I

It is obvious why the enemy sees you in the ground vegetation, because if you lower your terrain detail (I think it is terrain detail) it removes all of the grass and vegetation and leaves bushes and trees. This is what the enemy sees. If you want to be on a level playing field than try playing without grass.

[thyco 0]

Ive been over 800m away Ghilie suit in thick scrub.

Line up my target, Bang contact down.........then a barage of AK puts dust all around me i have no chance.

Puts ghilie suit away returns with Cobra,:)

ive had that and ive also had it where i can fire off 2 thirds of a m16A4 mag in single shot before they finally found my position becuase they were not looking in my direction ( it was a warfare game and the soliders in question were NAPA though whether this means anything)

Was about 250-300m away and kneeling due the fact that were in dead ground and unable to be shot at if i went prone.

[afp 1]

I would rather see rounds impacting all around me than killing off an enemy patrol without them firing a shot. I.E. ArmA I

That's because AI should run undercover and then return fire (not that accurate) if they detect an attack, and not to stay in open and fire laser beams to you...

The algorithm should be like 30% chances return fire imediate rest of 70% to look for cover first then return fire. Hope they will do something like this in a future patch.

[whisper 0]

From my experience, one should avoid taking shots on a group from the same position. At first shots (and unit killed), nme AI group will first lay supressive fire in your more or less general direction, depending on how easily spottable you are. the more you stay in place, the more they refine their information about you and end up sniping you easily (if the suppression didn't get you before).

Though, if you move away unseen, and change firing position (2 or 3 different firing spots), it'll keep them guessing.

Once they know ""there's someone on top of this building", you're basically over, unless they have some other target to deal with. And that's a huge help : you're more often than not not alone against them, and friendlies engaging nme groups will help you tons to permit you to change spot when you are suppressed.

now, with high skill, the AI is really, really lethal

[Majormauser 0]

I have the game and I think the AI is stellar. If you place shots downrange from a concealed position, move, fire, repeat you will be successful. I tested the concept in the open, put myself on a rooftop next to a chimney and fired a shot that killed a soldier, I moved to the back of the chimney and the AI suppressed me. I know they suppressed because rounds impacted the chimney in multiple spots and I saw tracers flying past me. I also tried killing a few insurgents in a patrol, I got the first shot off, killed a guy, they looked around at this time I was fleeing. I found another spot, shot my rifle, kill. Ran to another spot but I crossed the road and was shot by the patrol.

The AI is fantastic this time around, I see no reason to gripe or pretend that it is ridiculously good. After all the ArmA playing time this game is a welcome change. I would rather see rounds impacting all around me than killing off an enemy patrol without them firing a shot. I.E. ArmA I

It is obvious why the enemy sees you in the ground vegetation, because if you lower your terrain detail (I think it is terrain detail) it removes all of the grass and vegetation and leaves bushes and trees. This is what the enemy sees. If you want to be on a level playing field than try playing without grass.

That would be to easy. But I enjoy the graphics and to have to turn something off makes me hang my head in sorrow that we would have to goto that level to FIX it.

[nedley 10]

You must not know the server config can change these settings.

‘Class difficulties’ allow you to customise the accuracy and skill (spotting the enemy, reaction time) using a numeric format.

Most servers will not have this changed, though the ‘Shadows’ server (release TBA) will have 50% enemy accuracy and 75% friendly accuracy I believe.

This should prolong those fire-fights, give the game a more intense feeling (bullets flying everywhere) and mean that the player is not too disadvantaged without being able to spot the enemy and the limited cover in the rural areas.

No more 5 kills – 15 deaths on veteran mode with full grass!

Although in Arma 1 setting the enemy accuracy too low meant the enemy didn't even engage with weapons, only grenades. Lets hope its fixed.

Edited June 8, 2009 by nedley

[walker 0]

Hi all

Since the ability to change basic AI accuracy and skill is available in the ArmA I as a user configuarable file. Others can tell you what it is under both Vista and Windows 7.

WARNING DO NOT CHANGE ANY OF THIS UNTIL YOU MAKE A BACKUP COPY! AND YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING

In XP it is under either:

\My Documents\ArmA\windows username.ArmAProfile

Or more usualy

\My Documents\ArmA Other Profiles\folder with your player name\file with your player name.ArmAProfile

In

class Difficulties

Under both

	class regular

And

	class veteran

As:

	skillFriendly=0.850000;
	skillEnemy=0.850000;
	precisionFriendly=0.850000;
	precisionEnemy=0.850000;

I do not think this will have changed much in ArmA II but if some one could check and confirm it is still there it would be usefull.

BY THE WAY DO NOT CHANGE ANY OF THAT UNTIL YOU MAKE A BACKUP COPY!

And it is easy to change.

I would also suggest that a MOD is the correct way to modify basic accuracy and skill rather than having BIS messing about with the exe for what is when it comes down to it personal preference. This gives the ability for people set it up as they need and turn it off and on as required.

Please remember that in MP the server dictates all this.

BUT!

If people want to argue for changes to the core abilities of ArmA II they have to do so with EXPERIMENTAL PROOF.

Scientific Method

And I am sorry but all the witness reports and videos people make is not experimental proof. The very least you need is an example experimental mission.

We should all be using scientific method to support our arguments

So use this as a Template

----------------------------------------------------

For the attention of:

Who needs to take notice, who is the intended audience

Name of the Experiment

Instructions to reproduce the "..."

Required Resources:

A list of what is needed to repeat the experiment.

At the very least a link to the experimental mission as a download

Machine Specs Used:

Use Belarc Advisor or some such

Player Settings Used:

Screen Shot of settings etc.

Summary

A description of what to expect

Method

Describe how to do the experiment

Observations

What you have observed to happen

Results

The effects of the experiment

Further:

Any additional thoughts or advice

Cause

Your hypothesis of what is causing the effect

Solutions

Suggestions on how to solve it if it is a problem

Known Workarounds

Problems

Problems with each workaround

Additional Material

Materials that provide additional support for the results

------------------------------------------------------------------------

You do not need to include each field and you can add you own; it is guidline not a bible.

Kind Regards walker

Edited June 8, 2009 by walker
At the suggestion of Killerwatt I added specs and settings

[Killerwatt 0]

Maybe an additional paramater listing game settings should be added to that list

[walker 0]

Done

Thanks Stewart

[Junker 0]

not sure if this was mentioned in this thread but mission makers can script the AI skills with the setskill command.

Sets ability level of person (commander unit). Value of skill may vary from 0 to 1. Possible valueas are:

* aimingAccuracy

* aimingShake

* aimingSpeed

* endurance

* spotDistance

* spotTime

* courage

* reloadSpeed

* commanding

* general

I do know server settings can override these settings if the super AI is enabled..

because i make missions for our own server i have knowledge of the server settings so adjusting the enemy AI tanks and unit spotting distance to that of the servers view distance it is possible to get in view range of those units before they spot you..

Edit : problem with the view distance, If the enemy was sat at 1400m from me i would have to set veiwdistance to 3500m to see him :(

Edited June 10, 2009 by Junker

[kt187 10]

I just wanted to say an Expert maksman....strach that the best shooter in the world would have the most diffcult time hitting a man at 375 yards with An Ak-47, the gun is grossly inaccurate seeing how all the parts are loose.

Second why in the hell would you hide behind a bush when you fired at the enemy and they have an open shot at you???????

3rd. No the AI needs to be better and dont lie to me and say they are too accurate, no such thing unless with AK-47 or pistol. Not Ak-74 which is much more accurate.

4th.......375 yards is not far away and you can easly be seen, maybe not in COD 4, but in real life and espicaly in this game.

5th you cant find the enemy because they dont have tracers in there rifles....run away, at 375 yards you have a chance.

One more thing about the bush, just because you dont see them doesnt mean they cant see you.................

6th The game looks sweets.

Edited June 10, 2009 by kt187
mistake

[Thunderbird 0]

No need to establish any script and don't bother yourself with your "profile" files, it's all config related.

To be more precise, it needs the modification of some specific values within your weapon configs in order to make the AI become slightly more "human" by editing the ROF/AI precision values.

A little addon is just around the corner, hang on.

Regards,

TB

[walker 0]

Hi all

Has anyone done the experiment to see how many rounds a human player has to put down range to hit a target from each rifle?

It would be interesting to compare this to a side by side experiment to see how many rounds the AI takes to hit a target.

There are a lot of myths people come up with as to what the capabilities of AI should be in ArmA, often based on experiences that come from negative training ego shooters like COD/Stock Battlefield/CS etc.

My pronouncements on this count for nothing like any other myths.

It is the experiment that proves how the world is not opinion.

Do the experiment.

Kind Regards walker

Edited June 10, 2009 by walker

[CarlGustaffa 4]

@Junker: does setSkill array command work in Arma2? As you can see it is listed in the comref (also listed as a non working command under Arma1), but is not listed under the full (as opposed to the only new) list of the Biki Arma2 commands.

[Sonar 0]

The AI skill has always been an issue, along with the accuracy over range of Comblock weapons. AK's are notroiusly innaccurate above 250metres but how many of us have been killed by AI at 500+ metres in A1. Its like the T72 Vs M1A1. The Gulf war showed that M1's would wipe out T72's in and head to head fight, but in A1 different story. Im for balancing, but I also want realism.

[walker 0]

Hi all

@ Sonar with all due respect

To make a statment that the AI if using communist block weapons should not be able to hit you at 500m can only be true if you can show an experiment to prove they are doing something that a player cannot achieve.

So I say to you, if you have ArmA II go on prove it. Make a repeatable experiment that proves what you say is true.

As to your statement

...AK's are notroiusly innaccurate above 250metres....

I would submit it is not I believe a valid one.

We obviusly still have people who do not know the difference between the AK47 and the AK74 and AK107 used by most OPFOR in ArmA II.

You would have thought people could at least use Google or even Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AK-47

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AK-74

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AK-107

Educate your self.

Comparing the AK47 of myth and legend with the AK74 or AK107 prevalent among OPFOR in ArmA II is like comparing chalk and cheese.

The bullet is different

The mechanics are different

The accuracy is vastly different

As a weapon the AK74 is straight up comparable with the M16/M4.

You are caught up in the mythology of the AK47.

You are thinking that:

1) The AK47 of myth and legend you see in civil wars and conflicts around the world fired by everyone from wizened Afghan sharpshooters to drugged up child soldiers in Africa and manufactured from bits of old pipe and petrol cans or at best the worn out weapons sold from conflict to conflict, by the the likes of Viktor Bout, and exported from every pirate and dodgy factory around the world and used in every conflict since the Korean war, and loaded with bullets from every backyard factory and bazar workshop, and with recovered spent cartridges, filled with everything from fireworks fuel and old match heads to even sand and charcoal.

....is the same as the:

2) The AK74 designed and developed and manufactured in the Izhmash factories in Russia.

...is the same as the:

3) The AK107 designed and developed and manufactured in the Izhmash factories in Russia.

They are not.

So can we please stop having the myth of AK inacuracy perpetuated on this forum? This is not stupid COD land.

Kind Regards walker

[Xenios 0]

No, the Gulf War showed what the world's best equipped, organized and trained military could do to a poorly trained and led militia using mostly T-55s and and a few T-72s constructed in Iraq with rejected Soviet parts. And for ammo they only had cheap half-charged steel penetrators. It wasn't the same as going up against Russian or even ex-Soviet or ex-Warsaw Pact forces. Not even close.

And the AKs in Arma were AK-74s--with balistics much closer to 5.56mm than to the old AK-47s and AKM. In Arma 2, we have AKMs, AK-74s, and Ak-107s. They're not all the same.

But all this has been discussed a million times before on these forums.

EDIT: I see Walker has made the same points as I was typing this.

[CarlGustaffa 4]

With all these complaints about too accurate AI, I'm suggesting that BIS lower the accuracy part for AI for the lower difficulties. If you're a hard core fan and play only on veteran, you are well enough into Arma to know where to adjust the difficulty by yourself.

The game shouldn't be so hard on newcommers as to scare them away...

[Majormauser 0]

With all these complaints about too accurate AI, I'm suggesting that BIS lower the accuracy part for AI for the lower difficulties. If you're a hard core fan and play only on veteran, you are well enough into Arma to know where to adjust the difficulty by yourself.

The game shouldn't be so hard on newcommers as to scare them away...

Its not that its hard... its the silly limitation that the AI can see through low grass but your Player can't. Plus the AI can instantly see and target you through brush and cover 750 yards away plus be very accurate... enough to wound. Even with this said the game has many amazing and fun moments. The realism is what ArmA is I accept that its hard.... just has to be fair.

Fair = Realism

[ebud 18]

You'd think there would be some more sliders for units so something like this could be configurable for each unit :( Oh well.

[LockDOwn 0]

It's because the AI cheats, nothing blocks their view, they know where you are everytime you fire a shot.

Wasn't BIS bragging about their AI? This seems to be a game killer issue due to lazy programming.

[Scrub 0]

Wrong. Look through some threads, you'll find vid after vid showing that AI track you based on your movement from last know position and direction. They hear you, echolocation, firing, moving, even talking on the Direct channel in VON. They suppress the area they believe you are in. If you lose them for some time in cover, and comeback out in their frontal arc, they will quickly re-acquire as any human scanning for a known hostile will do. They may need a tweak or two because they are soo good, but they do not cheat. **except for the grass, that IIRC will be a patched item.

And about the 'lazy programming' part, I'd like to see you to say that to Suma's face :D. This monster of a game was created by anything BUT lazy individuals.

Edited June 11, 2009 by Scrub

[mr_centipede 31]

About cheating AI,

found this vid http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6mI410K_ZU

I would guess this kind of test that walker have been preaching about