Arma has it lost or gained?

[sickboy 13]

Quote[/b] ]The few times I have played P v P it has been a lot less like real war than I would want it to be. It was pretty much just one guy taking out the entire attacking force or one guy taking out the entire defending force. It wasn't anything like the coops I play where there are squads together but more like random guys all over the place. That is one of the flaws I find with all P v P games from Perfect Dark (which I understand was never mean't to be squad based) to things like the Delta Force games and many others.

Personally I like the squad-based things in Coop more.

I dont believe that the definition of a gamestyle should be extracted from the playstyles on servers in the wild.

IMHO true Coop and true PvP are not likely to be found on public servers.

To my opinion, PvP can be really great, and so is Coop.

However, the end result is completely in the hands of the players with whom you play.

Are you playing on a public server with barely serious players around, or are you playing at one of the more tactically advanced communities out there.

Makes a world's Difference I believe.

[ANTH 0]

Quote[/b] ]

HamishUK, read my post again m8. If happy ArmA-customers buy ArmA2, no suprise. If unhappy ArmA-customers buy ArmA2, big surprise...

Your right there for sure it will be interesting to see what sort of figures arma 2 sells at. I bought 2 Arma copies, like many of my friends did one was the Czech version (because it came out first) and then I bought the English version because I cant read Czech and im a glutton for punishment.

I will never do that with arma 2 so your right, I would read countless reviews and watch videos of anims and so on before or even thought about buying it.

Overall my conclusion to pvp in arma is:-

[Maddmatt 1]

Quote[/b] ]...at least don't go make up crap like that

I think the interview Jerry Hopper did with BIS lead programmer confirmed this "crap". You can interpret it as you wan't. Flashy textures, 5 more flies in the woods, AI's doing handsignals while refusing passing a bridge or sniping you from 500m or 10 more scriptcommands to bug up the missions with is not anything revolutioning compared to ArmA. You could even see it as very subtile changes made to that game compared to Ofp -> ArmA and that is what this thread is about...

I heard the interview. But nobody said that

A new AI system is far from a subtle change, at least to me. I guess you don't consider the new AI, 3D editor, dynamic campaigns and so on to be anything special

What makes you think the handsignals are the only improvement to the AI? It's a whole new AI system.

So read previews so you can base your comments on facts rather than your imagination

[Abbe 0]

I responded to the thread starter's question if BIS intend to get their old, bigger then ArmA, fanbase back with ArmA2. From what I see and hear, especially the interview I was refering to, this will not happen. I'm not happy about anything concerning this fact but fact it is.

The only thing in our imagination is the features of ArmA2, we as a community haven't seen one single thing of importance from that release yet. Sure, you've  heard about a lot of stuff but so did I before ArmA was released...The scary stuff is what I didn't hear prior to that release and still got, six year old bugs, very poor performance and weird animations. I'll jump up and down over the AI system when I've got a copy of ArmA2 on my harddrive...I'm afraid a lot of old fans won't even come that far.

I don't doubt for a second that with the right addons and the right people on a closed server (if you own hardware enough ofcourse and can stand certain, let's call it features, the AI have...) you can have Coops that blows anything away in the entertainment market. That was not the question in this thread and is not very interesting at all. This we have known for quite some time now. No argument at all...

[max power 21]

Quote[/b] ]...at least don't go make up crap like that

I think the interview Jerry Hopper did with BIS lead programmer confirmed this "crap". You can interpret it as you wan't. Flashy textures, 5 more flies in the woods, AI's doing handsignals while refusing passing a bridge or sniping you from 500m or 10 more scriptcommands to bug up the missions with is not anything revolutioning compared to ArmA. You could even see it as very subtile changes made to that game compared to Ofp -> ArmA and that is what this thread is about...

HamishUK, read my post again m8. If happy ArmA-customers buy ArmA2, no suprise. If unhappy ArmA-customers buy ArmA2, big suprise...

I realize i have to clearify my stand. I like BIS. I love Ofp. I adore the idea behind the game and the little guys fight against the big dragons. I hate the fact ArmA2 might be the last game BIS will ever do. I hate the fact I haven't met one single person in real life who has liked this game. Not even remotely. This is what we as a community has to deal with...if we bother.

That's not what Suma said. He was saying that we shouldn't expect full flight simulations, full driving simulations, and full ballistic simulations. He was saying that people who are expecting anything like that will be disappointed. He didn't say that nothing will change. One thing that has been explicitly stated is that the AI will have 100 times the precision, so passing bridges should not be a problem. I think you maybe should stop filtering out the facts that don't support your own argument.

[Viper23rd 0]

Regardless of how ArmA plays, as for changes towards OFP and it will make towards ArmA2, it's still a matter of taste.

I for one love playing ArmA, because it's something I completely live in and enjoy to the fullest, which I'm sure is how most people enjoy it as.

Most people from ArmA were hardcore OFPers as well, and this community likes coops, at least, most do. Most of the people who go to these forums are mature and would prefer a coop over some silly (T)DM any day.

If you don't like the game, then I'm sorry, it's your taste, go play something else.

Yours,

[Maddmatt 1]

The only thing in our imagination is the features of ArmA2, we as a community haven't seen one single thing of importance from that release yet. Sure, you've heard about a lot of stuff but so did I before ArmA was released...

There are a couple videos around demonstrating the AI. So saying we "haven't seen one single thing of importance from that release yet" isn't true.

Since a version of it will be in the VBS2 VTK, we'll soon find out how well it's really coming along.

I get what you're saying, but I think you don't know all the details.

Well we'll just have to wait and see to find out what really happens. Hopefully I'm right

Those of us that are still around with ArmA will at least have some awesome mods to play with

[twisted 127]

I have already commented that Arma has gained. but since the conversation has moved to arma2 i must agree on the fact that arma2 must gain even more. the change should be pretty damn big to give people the impression they are playing a true sequel and not just a final patch of Arma 1.2

I'l lbuy it for sure, but would like to feel that BIS are pulling out the stops in arma2 to constantly gives their customers a greater combat simulator experience.

[PheonixFury 0]

I can speak on behalf of several friends who stopped playing ARMA shortly after it came out on account of the rank system, which serves only as a barrier to fun for someone who has an idea of how they want to play but doesn't want to grind out points for days in order to reach that level, only to have it reset when the map finishes.

[cain2001 0]

Sad part is, people have complained and thrown so much shit at bis so when a group of guys acually try to post and give them good feedback they just dont have the time nor intrest to sit and read about "how they failed". The PvP gaming in ArmA is poor for various reasons. Myself i solved this by switching game.

[ANTH 0]

Regardless of how ArmA plays, as for changes towards OFP and it will make towards ArmA2, it's still a matter of taste.

I for one love playing ArmA, because it's something I completely live in and enjoy to the fullest, which I'm sure is how most people enjoy it as.

Most people from ArmA were hardcore OFPers as well, and this community likes coops, at least, most do. Most of the people who go to these forums are mature and would prefer a coop over some silly (T)DM any day.

If you don't like the game, then I'm sorry, it's your taste, go play something else.

Yours,

Sorry Viper23rd but useless crap like what you have posted here really irritates me! most people don't just like co-ops. There are many other games that involve team play.

You obviously know nothing about the past community to even write this s**t lets list to name a few of the big games that used to be played every single day of every hour.

co-op

ctf

c&h

cti

rts

dm

Most of the hardcore players did not even get involved in this forum because most people don't even bother. Why should they with one way comments like yours. There's many people on this forum like you that think about nothing else but co-op and screw the rest it bugs the life out of me.

It may look like most people like co-op to you if you look at the server list lately but that's because 95% of the pvps hate what bis have done to arma...

End of the day to put my point across of this type of thread I see time and time again on this forum, is that the game was not just about co-op it never was.

[max power 21]

I can speak on behalf of several friends who stopped playing ARMA shortly after it came out on account of the rank system, which serves only as a barrier to fun for someone who has an idea of how they want to play but doesn't want to grind out points for days in order to reach that level, only to have it reset when the map finishes.

Evolution is not an official ArmA mission. What features are present in Evo have little to do with ArmA, other than to say that ArmA has a lot of community development potential and flexibility.

[Hit_Sqd_Maximus 0]

I don't know if any derivative of OFP will get the same fanbase as the original. When OFP was new and fresh there were hundreds of players on 24/7 and the online play was very intense in CTF maps. I remember getting sweaty palms and being really stressed when your team would spend most of the mission battling those pesky flag defenders. Then finally seeing an opportunity to go for the flag right after watching someone be killed by a defender who placed a hidden satchel charge near the flag. After you grab the flag you jump in a jeep and jeep and drive as fast as possible while the other team fires at you in desperation and if your lucky make it back to the home base. That was probably the most entertainment I have ever gotten out of a PC game.

However, I think a lot of the original players just got burnt out. We spent countless hours playing that game, making new vehicles, texture mods, maps, ect. Now we pretty much had to start from scratch again with some of the same old bugs from the original. Granted it's a lot prettier, but it's just the same thing.... without the enjoyment. I pretty much stopped playing after watching everything on the island get destroyed because of some cheat.. is that thing still working? I was also tired of seeing that evolution mission on almost every populated server. If I wanted to play a game where I was a person I'd play the Sims...

I guess I'll have to check it out again this weekend and see what's new.

Do the queen's gambit players play separately from the other players?

[Bunkers 0]

Another thing is the PvP players have a pretty solid selection of games to choose from. If you're a coop tactical military-sim kinda guy then where would you go if you ditch ArmA? It's pretty unique.

[HamishUK 0]

ArmA is far from perfect. In fact as I said before it's a very rough diamond. Built on the older (modified) OFP engine I have read?

I am no fan of the offline campaign but that's my personal opinion.

I am no fan of the UI. I feel the game is incredibly clunky and feels dated compared to many newer games. There is a real mish-mash of kit and lack of accuracy in many areas.

That said I have had a huge amount of fun on both Coops and PvP. I have spent countless hours writing missions for my friends. I have added many of the excellent user mods to add depth to each mission.

As a vanilla product I was non-plussed. As a PvP / Coop game with mods, retextures and many of the superb user created missions out there I am hooked.

I will definatley buy ArmAII as IMO I see ArmA as one giant Beta that will pave the way one hopes for a much better game with ArmAII. I feel (rightly or wrongly) BIS have used this to their advantage but I care little when I am working as a team with a few friends to clear an objective.

Oh and not forgetting the helpful community who have answered many of my questions no matter how trivial!

[Maddmatt 1]

I can speak on behalf of several friends who stopped playing ARMA shortly after it came out on account of the rank system, which serves only as a barrier to fun for someone who has an idea of how they want to play but doesn't want to grind out points for days in order to reach that level, only to have it reset when the map finishes.

Then play another damn mission

Evolution is the only mission that has that point system, it's not even an official mission. There are plenty of good missions to play that don't involve that stuff.

This Evolution craze has gone so far that people are stupid enough to believe that it is everything ArmA has to offer

It never came with the game and it wasn't made by anyone affiliated with BIS.

I'm sorry to say this but the IQ of the average player around here has really dropped since the OFP days

[Viper23rd 0]

Quote[/b] ]Rubbish from ANTH

Thank you for attacking me Anth,

I was hoping we could keep it civilized but I guess some people aren't that mature. I know from experience a lot of people love coops and will play them over any other gametype any time.

Of course there are other gametypes that involve teamplay and I support those people as well, it's your game, so you choose in which games you wish to participate.

I don't like (T)DMs for one, the same way I don't like games such as: Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc.

I play Armed Assault for realism and I know a lot of the people that come to these forums do as well, there are a lot of persons that are part of a realism unit too, which mainly play coops, not DMs or TDMs, perhaps for fun now and then.

Maybe I'm wrong but I thought Armed Assault was supposed to be a kind of combat simulator, not just some 'FPS'. If you wish to play regular FPS' then I suggest you press the red cross in your top right, start up Call of Duty/Battlefield/random and run around spraying people.

And by the way, I'm not new to Armed Assault so I have my experience here. Thank you sir.

Yours sincerely,

[Second 0]

I play Armed Assault for realism and I know a lot of the people that come to these forums do as well, there are a lot of persons that are part of a realism unit too, which mainly play coops, not DMs or TDMs, perhaps for fun now and then.

Maybe I'm wrong but I thought Armed Assault was supposed to be a kind of combat simulator, not just some 'FPS'. If you wish to play regular FPS' then I suggest you press the red cross in your top right, start up Call of Duty/Battlefield/random and run around spraying people.

Now this then.

It's sure Ullltra realiiiiism war-simmism to play against opponents who doesn't have a glue about anything (i'm referring to AI), they just know how to shoot. Well it's nice to able to slaughter hundreds of AIs with 10-30 human players... It's like killing spear wielding black-people with machineguns. Now, PvP is like Western Front in WW1. Everyone shoots everyone with machine guns, others are just better than others.

In PvP i get(got) thrills as opponents are good and usully better than me (i'm unlearning ArmA in fast tempo, year back i was better). In coop i just shoot morons and finally act like moron myself.

But to be honest: Constant use of respawn has made both coop and PvP very bad, no thrills anymore so in PvP i act like moron aswell after couple of deaths. ArmA is like rest of generic-FPS-gang to me currently.

[Viper23rd 0]

The experience you get from Armed Assault depends on the way you play it, sure Player versus Player is a lot of fun, but Player versus AI can still be fun, for me it still scares me when I look around the corner and find an opponent there, regardless if it's an AI or a real player.

You can also have coops in PvP form, unit versus unit or a joined coop (unit + unit versus AI).

Play what you like to play, opinions differ, enjoy the game and don't give off on other people's way of playing, only thing you should keep in mind.

Yours,

[ANTH 0]

Exactly you enjoy co-op screw the rest, you may have experience in arma but I was talking about the previous game ofp>arma>arma2 and how its evolving.

So with your major experience in arma you will not know how successful it was in the past game. This is why your post made my blood boil with that one minded thought process of how you love co-ops, so its a great for you because the game is basically a co-op fest now bar a minority.

As I look at the server list now at 16:32pm. I laugh 46 players playing Sarhina life, evoulution blue and red and domination.

edit* and what the hell makes you think I love cod, bf2 and cs genre there is no other game like ofp/arma and bf2 and cod dont even come to close to what ofp/arma was like.

[Viper23rd 0]

First off, you might want to take your words back, I have been playing Operation Flashpoint as well for years, only a few months after release, playing in a realism unit, so I know my fair share of OFP/Armed Assault and how it evolved.

I'm a major fan of realism and roleplaying, SahraniVille/NogVille is something I enjoyed as well as coops.

Just for your information, I indeed said 'I don't like (T)DMs.'

Meaning I personally don't enjoy playing them, if that means in your eyes 'screw the rest' then so be it.

The people I play with enjoy coops as much as I do as well as roleplaying maps, and we never play any TDM/DM/CTF, that kind of stuff. There are other games for that which have those gametypes implemented much better.

I'm now resigning from this thread, in the hope it can continue the way it was going - so back on topic. Have a good day mister Anth, and the rest.

Yours sincerely,

[Second 0]

The experience you get from Armed Assault depends on the way you play it, sure Player versus Player is a lot of fun, but Player versus AI can still be fun, for me it still scares me when I look around the corner and find an opponent there, regardless if it's an AI or a real player.

You can also have coops in PvP form, unit versus unit or a joined coop (unit + unit versus AI).

Play what you like to play, opinions differ, enjoy the game and don't give off on other people's way of playing, only thing you should keep in mind.

Yours,

This is true. Mostly my grieves with ArmA's MP are mostly my own faults. I don't play in private servers, i don't setup my own public servers in fear of cheaters... I'm basically caught in limbo eating my own leg and whining how it hurts every time i bite my leg.

OFP had lots of good coop missions (ofp.info was my main place to visit), that was in year 2006 when i got my internet... I don't know much about earlier times. Did only play in LAN now and then before that.

I just wanted (again) to tune down this elitis ArmA-war-sim attitude, which to my eye is mostly just talk. ArmA has possibilities like mushrooms in rain (minus AI), but last times i've checked MP-community (in public) isn't much using them. This is ofcourse big problem in all games i think, most gamers are like childrens: They like only things they know, which includes missions/maps which they have played hundreds or thousands of times. Like children, they should be forced to try out new things (me little nazi)

[SlipperyJim 0]

There are a billion games out there already that serve the DM/ TDM crowd. I, for one, am glad that BIS has cared so much about the coop community.

Of course it feels like there is a shift to make a more mainstream game and I suspect they will move back to the adversarial masses on Arma 2. Just a personal theory.

[ANTH 0]

There are a billion games out there already that serve the DM/ TDM crowd. I, for one, am glad that BIS has cared so much about the coop community.

Like arma/ofp?? cant think of one to be honest although I am watching ofp2 very closely.

[KeyCat 131]

Can someone enlighten me why some of you feels that ArmA is such a "disaster" when it comes to PvP? I play co-op's as well as PvP and don't really understand what the fuzz is all about?

Sure PvP it's not as fast paced like CS/CoD4 but it was never meant to be (and it's equally "slow" for both sides)!

/KC