Army Backpack

[bravo 6 0]

Can we have some Vanilla soldier with usable BackPack for ARMA2? Or even possibility to add BackPacks to soldiers?

Since ArmA2 is ment to be a CQB simulation wouln't be nice and usefull to have usable backPacks for certain missions?

The idea is to be able to add this backpack as object or weapon like binos, NVgoogles, Laser so the Soldier could use it  with the possibility to fill the backPack with extra ammo/weapons for better, longer CQB.

Would be nice to have different feedback and opinions about this subject.

edit: in this pic we can see some units have BackPacks, but are these backpacks usable?

[Sergei_Q 0]

Erm, why would you take a backpack with you to CQB? It hardly makes a fighter more agile in narrow corridors or tight doorways. A long range patrol in unsupplied areas sounds more like it.

There's only so much a human can carry without getting fatigued or slowed down. Right now the soldiers can carry a rifle, an RPG, a pistol, ammo for them, body armor etc. and still sprint like it was nothing, which is a bit ludicrous - a civilian with no armor and guns should be able to run faster - or sprint longer - than a Western soldier in full combat gear. Likewise carrying all the ammo and weapons that you can find should slow you down. Unless encumbrance was implemented, I don't see any reason to do this.

But ammo backpacks have already been done in OFP, so there's nothing preventing it right now.

[NoRailgunner 0]

Backpack would fit into ArmA2 story "Razors long way home". These packs should have an impact on moving(animations) and of course additional action entry: take/put down backpack.

[bravo 6 0]

@Sergei_Q your question should be asked and answered by the veterans who really were in those guerrillas and CQB such as in Fallujah per example.

They used these backPacks more often then we think. (you can check on videos if you want)

Note: I'm not asking for all units to have it. I'm suggesting to make this possible as fully usable backPacks in MP in vanilla ArmA2 and not just eyecandy.

@NoRailgunner i'm sure if BIS really want and think this would be interesting they could create animations for those cases.

[bravo 6 0]

Just think a little about this..

The Game is meant for CQB. AI now do suppress fire, there for waste more ammo.

In real life humans waste ammo a lot!(even if they do it just for cover)

With this AI improved i think more and more that its really necessary to have this BackPack fully working and operational when ArmA2 comes out.

The latest CQB war we can compare is Iraq, Fallujah.

Just search the web and see for your self if what i say is not real, also think if this is not really necessary.

[Callsign 128]

Isn't the plot based around a team of marines who have been sent to assist the democratic government of Chernarus? If so then surely the team would need to carry enough equipment for an extended period of time. So in terms of realism it applies and also as a functionality point of view backpacks are needed. Surely for BIS this should be an almost no-brainer!

[Commando84 0]

making a backpack system would that mean they would probably need to redesign the inventory system a bit..

dunno if they can make it but it would be cool if they made it more pockets if your soldier carry a backpack and if soldier isn't carrying backpack it has less slots in inventory..

Now how many pockets should backpack add? weapon, ammo?

I think it should add around the same amount a soldier in arma 1 can carry. either 6 satchel charges or Rpg ammo or a m16 and its magazines and a few grenades like its in inventory in arma 1.

[sandzibar 0]

well.. it might be in arma2

vbs2 loadout screen. (yes i know, not strictly arma2 at all.. but both dev teams must talk to each other)

similar to your pack from here no?

Making this huge assumption because the VBS2 webpage also has stuff on My hand signals and destructible buildings, that we should also be getting in arma2. Coincidence? maybe.

[CameronMcDonald 146]

Screw the ALICE pack though, I'd like to see much more modern CamelBak equipment in there, e.g. Motherlode, and the combination hydration/assault pack carried by the medics.

[dslyecxi 23]

Let me say it like this. If BIS doesn't put this into ArmA2 by default, we (the ACE team) will have it available for ArmA2 in no time flat.

ACE in ArmA1 already supports this kind of rucksack system, integrated into the gear menu. This includes being interfaced with the ACE stamina system - each piece of gear has a set weight, and the more you carry, the quicker you will tire out. Volume (ie: ruck capacity, and the volume of items) is also in the process of being simulated. The system works great already, it's a big step above what the WGL rucksacks were like.

It would be cool if ArmA2 had this kind of functionality by default, but even if it doesn't, we'll have you guys covered.

[Inkompetent 0]

Well, not entirely, Dsl. The difference would be, that in the VBS2-screenshot you saw the guy carried both an ALICE rucksack and a SMAW. Without a proper system we can't do that, so please, BIS! Proper rucksack-system for ArmA2!

[dslyecxi 23]

Well, not entirely, Dsl. The difference would be, that in the VBS2-screenshot you saw the guy carried both an ALICE rucksack and a SMAW. Without a proper system we can't do that, so please, BIS! Proper rucksack-system for ArmA2!

I'm well aware of that limitation. However, the end result is 80% the same. Point being, even if it's not official, it will still be an option from the mod community.

[urbanwarrior 0]

would be good if you could pass ammo between each other aswell, so everyone could carry 1 belt of m240 ammunition. The ability to drop the rucksack would be good aswell because then you could all leave your bergen's at a harbour area or camp and just unzip the daypacks to take with you wherever your going

[Perun 0]

I think it doesn't matter how will these backpacks look like, the main thing is how will be the engine made, graphic is easily modifiable. I think that the main thing is that they have to have a feedback to characters movability.

So the player will mind if he takes backpack to battle or he leaves it somewhere in forest and come back later if he survives.

[smellyjelly 0]

I've been thinking of the inventory, and rather than making a new topic I thought I'd post it here.

Ok, so it seems everyone wants Arma II calculate both the size and the weight of the weapon in the inventory. However, Arma already basically limits the size: One primary weapon, one secondary, several magazines for both  and binoculars.

The weight system should basically just effect your stamina. With the size limit it'd be impossible to give a soldier more than one AT launcher or any other heavy object, so why bother implementing a limit and a "You're carrying to much weight" message?

Anyways, what I really wanted to talk about is the organization of the backpack and the ability to pick up miscellaneous items.

I'm not too sure how real soldiers organize their equipment, but if my idea is realistic enough, this is how I hope it's done in Arma II. Each soldier would have their belt with the pouches and a backpack. Both could be used for carrying magazines, grenades, and other equipment like binoculars, however, you could only use the stuff in you're belt.

When you run out you would have to open up you're backpack, then restock the desired items in your belt to use it. Basically the backpack would be used to carry all the extra stuff when your pouches are full.

I also think it would be interesting to be able to hold more than just weapons and stuff in you're backpack. BIS said that they would add missions where you have to pick up a case of beer for some teammates, so maybe you could use the backpack for carrying stuff like that. The ability to carry keys or files could offer a wider range of missions than just "kill these people".

I'm sure that could be modded into Arma, but the inventory isn't very friendly to stuff like that because you may need to sacrifice ammo or a weapon.

[dslyecxi 23]

The weight system should basically just effect your stamina. With the size limit it'd be impossible to give a soldier more than one AT launcher or any other heavy object, so why bother implementing a limit and a "You're carrying to much weight" message?

I'm not sure I follow you here. A volume limit has a place alongside a weight system.

Quote[/b] ]I'm not too sure how real soldiers organize their equipment, but if my idea is realistic enough, this is how I hope it's done in Arma II. Each soldier would have their belt with the pouches and a backpack. Both could be used for carrying magazines, grenades, and other equipment like binoculars, however, you could only use the stuff in you're belt.

ArmA's current system basically represents a soldiers load bearing vest. All of the items in your inventory are typically things that would be carried directly on your vest, in mag pouches, grenade pouches, general purpose pouches, medical pouches, dump pouches, etc.

Quote[/b] ]When you run out you would have to open up you're backpack, then restock the desired items in your belt to use it. Basically the backpack would be used to carry all the extra stuff when your pouches are full.

This is pretty much exactly how the ACE inventory system works. The rucksack is an additional carrying capacity - you can have an unlimited number of items in it (in theory), but in practice it is limited by volume and weight of the items.

Quote[/b] ]I also think it would be interesting to be able to hold more than just weapons and stuff in you're backpack. BIS said that they would add missions where you have to pick up a case of beer for some teammates, so maybe you could use the backpack for carrying stuff like that. The ability to carry keys or files could offer a wider range of missions than just "kill these people".

Again - already done in ACE.

Quote[/b] ]I'm sure that could be modded into Arma, but the inventory isn't very friendly to stuff like that because you may need to sacrifice ammo or a weapon.

It has been modded into ArmA, as mentioned above, and the interface for it is friendly and easy-to-use. Additionally, you do not need to sacrifice anything to use the system - it compensates for everything. There is no downside to using it.

Now, as to whether any of that type of stuff will be in ArmA2, I don't know, but as I said, we will have it in ArmA1 and we will port it to ArmA2 if need be.

[Balschoiw 0]

Wearing a backpack should come with a movement limitation in speed, dexterity and agility.

Just like the real deal.

Additional weapons are imo a bit nonsense as you hardly ever will be given a second primary weapon in real life. Additional equipment, yes. Additional ammo, yes. A shovel for digging foxholes (me wants to make use of deformable terrain), yes, but no 2nd primary weapon. This would simply turn Arma 2 into a comic.

[Lou Montana 101]

Agreed, but what about bringin a second M16 to an unarmed friend ? can't be ignored  

[SHWiiNG 0]

Just A little note about this ACE thing.

I have no idea what ACE is but the problem with Addons and in some cases mods, is that one has to manually implement scripts into mission files. Therefore restricting brilliant new features of a mod or addon to user made Mission, which is quite a pain.

Engine integration is what the community needs, a way to implement its ideas into the engine.

Open source gaming is something im not expecting from BIS but some method for integrating new features easily.

[Pillage 0]

...but the problem with Addons and in some cases mods, is that one has to manually implement scripts into mission files. Therefore restricting brilliant new features of a mod or addon to user made Mission, which is quite a pain.

Engine integration is what the community needs, a way to implement its ideas into the engine.

ACE is a replacement mod and most of it's features are as you say an 'Engine integration', the ruck system is fully integrated into the gear menu and the backpacks themselves are linked to the classes. So loading the campaign a minute ago I had a fully working ruck. Stamina, wounding, rucksacks, and I could go on but that would be telling, these things require no input by the mission designer and will work on existing missions.

[Frank-O 0]

I think a backpack is a good idea, and it's great that the ACE team, Dslyexci is willing to support such a concept whether it gets used or not in ArmA2.

It's also always bothered me that there's no reward to carry just 4 clips and 1 round AT into combat. (comfort gear layout)

Here's my 2 cents.

1. Primary wpn.

2. Secondary wpn. Only missile launcher for now.

Open it up for 2nd rifle (stowed), missile launcher, backpack (9 boxes)

3. 1x6 box inventory can support another backpack that takes up 6 boxes (backpack holds 9)

Each packpack increases the rate of exhaustion by 50%.

Your wpn starts wobbling faster by 50% per backpack, max 2 backpacks.

Items in the backpack are not usable in combat unless you action it, and transfer it to the Gear inventory slots.

this would achieve a few things.

A. Keep the existing interface.

B. Approximate the idea of stowed(but usable) vs carried (not usable in cbt).

C. Approximate the idea of encumberance. More you carry, more you slow down.

D. Each box of inventory above 6 boxes (what's in the rifle clip) affects you 10%. So if you carry 4 clips. An AT round, and 2 satchels, you tire faster by 40%. (using a total of 10 boxes)max 50% slowdown.

Carrying 2 backpacks (1 in missile launcher slot, 1 using 6 box inventory) slows you down to half speed after 100m.

Is this the beginning of the Supply/Ammo Specialist role?

What is rate of encumberance? Say after 100m, carrying 8 inventory boxes. you slow down to 80% speed. Carrying 1 fully loaded packpack on top of that, you slow down to 50% speed after 100m.

After 500m if you persist, you start crouching until you rest for 2 min.

After 1km if you persist, you start crawling until you rest for 5 min.

Dropping gear so you only take up 6 inventory boxes removes these limitations. So for those of you deathly afraid of bad chopper pilots, you can still run from Arcadia to Corazol if you want...just with half your gear. However, the 2 and 5 minute rest clocks are still running. You will be able to start running after the rest clocks run out.

[dslyecxi 23]

I think a backpack is a good idea, and it's great that the ACE team, Dslyexci is willing to support such a concept whether it gets used or not in ArmA2.

You're talking about stamina and such... that's another feature of ACE, actually. The weight of your gear influences your stamina, as does your movement speed, posture, and the type of terrain you're moving over. Carry less and you will have more "energy" so to speak, carry more and you'll tire faster. You can drop your loaded rucksack to the ground at a rally point before an attack if you want, taking only the ammo and supplies you need for the immediate moment so that you'll be able to move more rapidly without tiring yourself out. Or just carry less to begin with, or whatever. It's up to you.

[bravo 6 0]

great to ear all these ideas and positive feedbacks about this particular subject that will bring more realism to the gameplay

[Frank-O 0]

@ Bravo 6

Huge fan of Linoleum on OFP. When's your next masterpiece on ArmA?

***

Apologies for the long post before. When is ACE ready for release?

As you can surmise, I was bored one afternoon and actually ran from Dolores to Pita. Never made sense to me that i was laden with gear doing it.

My suggestions about the backpack is that;

1. Gives you more inventory boxes to store stuff

2. Gear inside in inaccessible, or harder to, during battle.

3. Encumberance and slower rate of exhaustion if you carry less.

Which post explains this better? This one or the one before? heh