Evolution V1.0 Large scale respawn coop

[dmarkwick 261]

To reiterate my earlier point and to support other's statements here, I'd like to suggest an AI spawn idea.

On our server we're getting pretty fed up of clearing part of a town ready for an offensive, then finding that 2 BMPs, a UAZ and a T-72 as well as a dozen or so footsoldiers have magically appeared from nowhere, often beaming in as we're crossing open areas that we've previously scanned as empty. So much so that we're reverting to 1.5a.

The general feeling is that we've got no problem with the notion of backup, but it has to be logical. I'd suggest that a helo is spawned at Pita (where a good job of conveying the notion that it's the enemy's support center is already in place) loaded with backup troops and flies in, either fast-landing them down or parachuting them in. Or maybe a column of troop transport convoying in from an uncleared part of the map.

This would allow for ambush and guard tactics also, so we would be encouraged to bring along more Stingers just in case and to use AI to watch roads etc.

We're also aware of the beta status of this mission and that it's all in a constant state of improvement and experimentation, so there's no big problem with all that we'd just like to make our findings and suggestions made public.

[stobbsy 0]

To reiterate my earlier point and to support other's statements here, I'd like to suggest an AI spawn idea.

On our server we're getting pretty fed up of clearing part of a town ready for an offensive, then finding that 2 BMPs, a UAZ and a T-72 as well as a dozen or so footsoldiers have magically appeared from nowhere, often beaming in as we're crossing open areas that we've previously scanned as empty. So much so that we're reverting to 1.5a.

The general feeling is that we've got no problem with the notion of backup, but it has to be logical. I'd suggest that a helo is spawned at Pita (where a good job of conveying the notion that it's the enemy's support center is already in place) loaded with backup troops and flies in, either fast-landing them down or parachuting them in. Or maybe a column of troop transport convoying in from an uncleared part of the map.

This would allow for ambush and guard tactics also, so we would be encouraged to bring along more Stingers just in case and to use AI to watch roads etc.

We're also aware of the beta status of this mission and that it's all in a constant state of improvement and experimentation, so there's no big problem with all that we'd just like to make our findings and suggestions made public.

Ive been thinking the same recently. Clearing towns is too easy at the moment. We are currently finishing the mission within 4 hours where at one time it used to take 14 hours.

1 of the most enjoyable moments I've had when taking a town was when there was a bug with Cayo and it kept on respawning not too much but also not too slow. Felt like a proper war, people would die and people would be ferried via heli to Cayo for round 2 and kill more tanks and armour that had appeared while we were being ferried. Also while on the ground fighting, people were being heli carried to my position to reenforce us, made it feel more real and had an ambiance. I would also like to see more Strongholds in and around towns like mg nests and artillary batteries and some sence the town has been fortified against us.

Might be an idea to have the side missions like this, ie convoys going to reenforce a undersiege town from an enemy stronghold, Extra armour also for armour missions. Maybe could have a guard a convoy mission while it travels from airport to a recently taken town to reenforce it and enemy ai try to destroy it enroute.

Also there doesnt seems to be much armour around some towns even before the A10 and armour killing vehicles have been in.

[dmarkwick 261]

1 of the most enjoyable moments I've had when taking a town was when there was a bug with Cayo and it kept on respawning not too much but also not too slow. Felt like a proper war, people would die and people would be ferried via heli to Cayo for round 2 and kill more tanks and armour that had appeared while we were being ferried. Also while on the ground fighting, people were being heli carried to my position to reenforce us, made it feel more real and had an ambiance.

A bug in Cayo? That would explain it as it's Cayo we're having spawning problems with. We can be watching from the south, working out a plan of attack then Wham - a T-72 and a BMP and 20 troops magically appear right in front of us. It prevents any organised planning if this happens.

Also, it takes us a while to properly clear a town of enemy, we do it on foot street by street, more than enough time to respawn a new platoon in, we'll never get it cleared.

Quote[/b] ]I would also like to see more Strongholds in and around towns like mg nests and artillary batteries and some sence the town has been fortified against us.

Yes, and also some minefields for some of the more obvious attack routes

Quote[/b] ]

Might be an idea to have the side missions like this, ie convoys going to reenforce a undersiege town from an enemy stronghold, Extra armour also for armour missions. Maybe could have a guard a convoy mission while it travels from airport to a recently taken town to reenforce it and enemy ai try to destroy it enroute.

Also there doesnt seems to be much armour around some towns even before the A10 and armour killing vehicles have been in.

Seems to me you could ramp up the next town's armour by looking at the rank of people currently playing, give them some responsibility commensurate with their rank

But please - lose the magic respawns. As it is I've hacked the current 1.5j incursions code out because we were fed up having troops spawn right behind us in cleared ares. Not just troops but UAZs etc. If incursions are to be used then make them logical as well, i.e. have them move in stealthily from some uncleared area, encouraging player patrols.

[KenO 0]

Its been said many times already but it is well deserved to be said again...

Awesome mission Kiljoy, and thanks especially for sticking to it and producing very significant updates and fixes.

I always wanted to see the favorite/most popular map/mission in a game be a coop; its no small feat, what you have accomplished with evo. Congrats! I liked it so much that I leased a dedicated server in my region and host 1.5a 24/7, and I am really looking forward to the ArmA patch and Evo update.

I wanted to echo the comments about randomly spawning enemy...I genuinely agree that we need to fill up the masses of empty space between cities. One of the best moments i had with the mission so far is when I was with a large group attacking Somato, I was somewhat late to the main battle and after our first wave was nearly wiped out I saw the most amazing sight. A BMP followed by a large amount of enemy infantry were circling around to flank the initial attack (wound up being essentially a counter attack). I thought to myself then that this is truely one amazing game. Since then, I've come to realize that this is a rare situation, most of the time the enemy are clearly defending. In the mean time, other units nearby usually sit around with their thumbs up their buts, seemingly oblivious to what is happening a block away. Instead of suddenly appearing troops, it would be nice to have (as others have implied) a resupply/reinforcement column or air cav reinforcement of enemy strongholds and please get those other city garrisons in the fight. I see this as being a simple thing to conceptualize, but I apologize if this is obvious and just hard/impossible to script. If it is possible, please...every so often, have a reinforcement column dispatched from the extreme northern end of the island and travel down the roads until it encounters resistance or retakes a city. An ebb and flow to the main city objectives is sorely needed, IMO.

The other thing that dismays me is why enemy units are always out in the open streets in cities and usually quite stagnant until fired upon. Get the stationary troops into buildings and other fortifications. There is nothing more immersive than being opened up on by an MG or two firing out of a second story window. Additional patrols within and around the cities would help too.

Lastly, to 169th_ICE and his ilk. I cannot believe that anyone could have the nerve to take without permission and then to add insult to injury by touting their derived works on the same thread that gave this wonderful mission to us all. I for one will not frequent any server that is hosting a non-sanctioned copy of Kiljoy's work. THAT is the least we can do to thank him for all his hard work and dedication.

[KilJoy -SFG- 0]

Good points Ken0, ill check out nearby occupied towns reinforcing those under attack seems like a more realistic approach. Some have mentioned it before here too. I think once communication is destroyed in a town this will halt any more reinforcements. nice to tie in the radio towers to some function other then point farms.

[KenO 0]

Kiljoy, your cut-off communication idea is great. I think that will also go a long way toward adding in balance to the reinforcements idea. An uphill fight until you cut off the enemy supply lines either through interdiction on the roads behind enemy lines or through their lines of communication. Seems very believable to me.

I also just wanted to say that I am really anxious to try out the improvements listed earlier in the thread. I was wondering if the desync improvement mentioned is related to the warping that sometimes occurs, where enemy units seem to lurch forward then sometimes back again? or is that related to server/client bandwidth settings? or possibly a combination of both? I have been trying to optimize my server.cfg file to provide the best gameplay I can, but I seem to be stuck with the occasional warping.

[Shins 0]

Excellent idea Ken0 and Kiljoy. I think random magic spawning-behind-you enemies would be a real shame in such a great mission. Would spoli it for me i think (i've only tried 1.5a and it's what's running on my server atm). Having a reinforcement column coming from SLA strongholds would be fantastic.

The idea of Radio towers being the key to those reinforcements is outstanding. Especially now that towers will be randomly placed in cities.

Really looking forward to the next release.

Just so this post isn't a total waste of space have a suggestion :

What about a new 'Spy' mission? A player could select a mission "Spy" from the mission hut and then he becomes teamswitched (automatically using the teamswitch function) to some previously unavailable and now playable SLA role. So, the player walks out of the mission hut and he now looks like (and in fact /is/ an SLA) soldier.

He could then catch lift over to the outskirts of an enemy town and do a recce. Scouting out the town to see what's there and maybe even where the radio tower is.

You could have a random timelimit applied to how long he looks like an SLA soldier to simulate being 'found out' by the real SLA. When the timelimit runs out he becomes Blufor again and is rumbled.

Just an idea.

[Peabrain 0]

If you are talking about enemy reinforcements from nearby towns, then how about them spawning in those towns and then actually move from there (by road) to the town under attack?

Btw, if you implement enemy reinforcements, then it would also be realistic to have new friendly spawnpoints (Forward Operating Bases) appear as you capture towns/terrain.

What I mean is that you would for example spawn from the town you just captured and perhaps have vehicles also spawn there after a certain amount of time to simulate the logistics of moving equipment from the main base to the FOB's.

P

[trut 0]

great idea about reinforcing columns, I dont like that "spawn before my eyes" concept. it ruins a lot of atmosphere created.

just be careful that the columns do not all go over that big bridge south of bagango, i think. its easy to sabotage the whole idea by taking down one or two bridges.

well, this brings me to another point. the bridges are obviously key infrastructure points, just like in real combat. why not make them heavily defended with armor, checkpoints, static MGs, AA and AT soldiers... I assume in real war situations those bridges would have a big checkpoint at either end.

this could bring yet another twist.

"there's a column coming in from pita, sir, if we could, just take down that heavily defended bridge in corazol, and we're saved..."

I totally agree with KenO. the global mechanics of the mission are great, it is a great "global war" mission. after the addition of reinforcing columns idea, I don't think there is a need for any more new ideas on a global level.

but there is still room for improvement in "micromanaging" the units. units placement inside buildings, on patrols, in realistic checkpoints, ready for combat would bring much more immersion and realism.

nothing like a sniper on the roof . even if you've seen it in all the movies... or a dug in t-72 near the crossroad or a checkpoint.

also, some more cooperation between units in the same town. for instance, when a blufor enemy is spotted its only natural that some troops two streets away will come in running, while the others will just dug in and wait for you. but not with thumbs up their butt as someone put it

[mant3z 1]

OMG it's sounds very promising.

I'm too:

+sniper's on the roof's

+soldiers in buildings

+enemy reinforcments (spec naz :P)

+hevy guarded bridges and comunication devices

+well hiden enemy secret base

but I'm against:

-spy mission

...eh 5h more in work and I can back to evolution

[JAMF 0]

Quick question: The right doorgunner in the UH-60 MG not receiving it´s "score/kills", is that a bug in the mission, or in Armed Assault?

BUMP!? If it is an Armed Assault bug, it can be reported. It's not nice for the right sided "non-AI/Human" player to be hosing the tangoes and not get his share in the kills.

[stobbsy 0]

Script Error at Party time Kiljoy only bug I found so far in latest version.

Amount of Engineers and Medics might be overkill though, would maybe reduce to 3 of each. Still very hard to do lvl 20 missions with 30 points :P

Might be worth putting a thing on the Enginners Farp that they cant deploy say 1000m of an occupied town. Was nice making a Farp at Cayo, parking on it with nade Humvee and hummer rearming/repairing immedietely while shooting at ai in Cayo (saying that the same can be done with rearm/repair trucks). It was also metioned on the server maybe altering the medic and Farp deployment so you have to take a vehicle such as a 5t truck of some kind or a m113 ambulance to the site of deployment before being able to deploy.

Glad to see the boats auto repair/arm at harbour now. I see that some Artilary around some towns now.

Oh tried the defend base mission seemed to work ok, completed it. Tried Air Patrol mission, but only found 1 KA50 before completing mission.

Furax0 tried same mission, said he had 4 or 5 Su's but mission didnt end.

[Shins 0]

There's arty now? Cool beans. Do the AI use an artillery script like Mr Murray's or something?

[mattxr 9]

I see that some Artilary around some towns now.

Some towns if thats the case then, that is cheaters bombing the shit out of towns lol. There is no Atry, and if you see arty it is a cheater lol, weather the be helping or destroying the game is another matter lol.

[mattxr 9]

I just patched my game nicly to 1.07 and joined into a server playing Evolution 1.##L and i was playing nicly untill when i was flying it kept cutting me to the startup screen gicving me a rank also when i was killing people i checked my score in at 190 few min later it said 360, and everyone accused me of cheating, banning me and taking my ID calling me a BF2 noob and the fact was i wasnt doing anything wrong. Its just sad to see people think that on a bloody unofficial evo map which could be full of any sorta bugs. fcking reciculus.

[Bioxx 0]

I think it goes without saying that this is an awesome map and I look forward to the many improvements you are working on. However I am wondering, is there any reason I can't seem to open this map in the editor? I'm trying to learn mission making in arma. I used to know quite a bit back in OFP years ago but i need a refresher and your map has so many different things built into that I believe I'll be able to learn a lot from it. I've extracted the pbo into the correct folder but when i tell it to load in the mission editor, nothing happens. I understand that you don't want other versions of your map floating around and thats not my plan. I'm just wondering if you somehow locked the map or something.

[stobbsy 0]

I just patched my game nicly to 1.07 and joined into a server playing Evolution 1.##L and i was playing nicly untill when i was flying it kept cutting me to the startup screen gicving me a rank also when i was killing people i checked my score in at 190 few min later it said 360, and everyone accused me of cheating, banning me and taking my ID calling me a BF2 noob and the fact was i wasnt doing anything wrong.   Its just sad to see people think that on a bloody unofficial evo map which could be full of any sorta bugs.   fcking reciculus.

What server? AFAIK the only official 1.5L test version ie modified by Kiljoy is at the www.suicidesquad server and if you post on there forums and explain what happened can maybe get you unbanned. Was the admin somone voted in or a SES member?

It has been mentioned in a cheating thread somewhere (cant be bothered looking where ) That it is hard for admins to differentiate between cheating and bugs especially with so many "elaborate" cheating methods and hacks.

BTW my last post regarding artillary and other bugs was aimed at Kiljoy and the 1.5L version which does include some Artilary around Delores. Hope that clears that up.

The test versions only work with the beta 1.07 which in its self has bugs such as you get damage when you get out of a humvee.

Above is a quote from Kiljoy on page 58 of this thread, confirming that there are some 1.5A-L missons out there that are TEST versions that Kiljoy has alone modified. The only place I know of to play these afaik is the before mentioned server and Kiljoy himself plays there and gives the map himself to the server runner. He may or may not have asked other servers to also test, I've no idea.

[mattxr 9]

I just patched my game nicly to 1.07 and joined into a server playing Evolution 1.##L and i was playing nicly untill when i was flying it kept cutting me to the startup screen gicving me a rank also when i was killing people i checked my score in at 190 few min later it said 360, and everyone accused me of cheating, banning me and taking my ID calling me a BF2 noob and the fact was i wasnt doing anything wrong.   Its just sad to see people think that on a bloody unofficial evo map which could be full of any sorta bugs.   fcking reciculus.

What server? AFAIK the only official 1.5L test version ie modified by Kiljoy is at the www.suicidesquad server and if you post on there forums and explain what happened can maybe get you unbanned. Was the admin somone voted in or a SES member?

It has been mentioned in a cheating thread somewhere (cant be bothered looking where ) That it is hard for admins to differentiate between cheating and bugs especially with so many "elaborate" cheating methods and hacks.

BTW my last post regarding artillary and other bugs was aimed at Kiljoy and the 1.5L version which does include some Artilary around Delores. Hope that clears that up.

The test versions only work with the beta 1.07 which in its self has bugs such as you get damage when you get out of a humvee.

Above is a quote from Kiljoy on page 58 of this thread, confirming that there are some 1.5A-L missons out there that are TEST versions that Kiljoy has alone modified. The only place I know of to play these afaik is the before mentioned server and Kiljoy himself plays there and gives the map himself to the server runner. He may or may not have asked other servers to also test, I've no idea.

i was in TS with the SES admin anyways, just i was getting flamed by all the players getting called a BF2 hoar and all sorts.. in the end, the way they were flmaing me just made them as bad although i would also understand if someones score doubled every 5min or so.. in the end nobody knows what it was could to be an intro bug.

[KilJoy -SFG- 0]

so on first connection you were givin points that you never scored Matt? Or during game you gained points from nowhere? or both?

You were flying what vehicle when you were put at the start-up screen? Do you mean the intro played over and over? after you had already connected? I'm confused, please give a clear chronological order of events so i can debug.

[Lolsav 0]

@Killjoy

Me and Gary (you know him) were trying to connect JIP and we couldnt. We would load the mission and get stuck at intro screen, with the lobby as background. The only option was to disconnect.

Meanwhile Matt there was getting an immense ammount of points when he had us trying to connect. In fact evrytime someone connected would give him that result.

He came on TS per my request so he could tells more about what was happening. I did ask him if he had any unoffcial addon on his addon folders that could somewhat trigger those events. He did stated he had none, since he had just installed the beta.

Thats all the info we can supply for now.

[stobbsy 0]

@Killjoy

Me and Gary (you know him) were trying to connect JIP and we couldnt. We would load the mission and get stuck at intro screen, with the lobby as background. The only option was to disconnect.

Meanwhile Matt there was getting an immense ammount of points when he had us trying to connect. In fact evrytime someone connected would give him that result.

He came on TS per my request so he could tells more about what was happening. I did ask him if he had any unoffcial addon on his addon folders that could somewhat trigger those events. He did stated he had none, since he had just installed the beta.

Thats all the info we can supply for now.

A few people seem to be getting this loading problem.

Also had problem of getting mission and no waypoint. Everyone had same who was trying to get missions. Ended up doing a #shutdown. Problem 1st appeared when I aborted mission and got another, new mission was a destroy 20 and wp was at the defend 30 place and all there was was a friendly vulcan and some friendly infantry. didnt kill, aborted again, after this noone got waypoints to missions.

Also sometimes when I reconnect or respawn, can only get basic gear from ammo crates eventhough I had Major Rank.

500 lives I dont think is working. When you 1st die, you get a hint of lives left, after this initial death no hint whatsoever.

[frederf 0]

KilJoy, the Shift+MapClick to make a squad waypoint is a very welcome feature but sometimes it gets in the way visually. Could you add a way to "Unassign" a squad waypoint like by clicking in a certain square of ocean or Ctrl+MapClick on the map?

[KilJoy -SFG- 0]

This has come up before. I will add a method to clear it. But probably not on when on missions.

[silent_hillel 0]

hmmmmm

i didnt know BoB was slumming in ArmA...

[M.Andersson(SWE) 4]

Nice playing with you KilJoy...

Seems like the server crashed though.

Didnt get the time to try the PARA AI´s

but i will.

Like the upin with the missions. 10p, 20p and up...