Handsignals Command System Released!

[General Barron 0]

Wow. I don't visit this board too often, but I'm glad I did this week, or I might have left this all unanswered.

@Fury6

Quote[/b] ]All that crap I said about the radio keying break sound is already done in that mission... so I dragged up this old thread for nothing.

Not at all. That was a great suggestion, and I'll definately incorporate it in future versions. The Vietnam mission uses actual sound samples for the radio effects, but for the editor's template I wanted to keep things flexible (hence no voice acting). Mic out effects will work great here. Thanks for the suggestion .

@lendrom

Quote[/b] ]So it would be welcome if some of frequently used commands were bind to one key.

This is absolutely brilliant! I'm DEFINATELY putting this on my 'to do list' (yes, I actually have a list where I write down all the good suggestions I get). I'm thinking it would be best if there were a way for the player to customize his shortcuts himself, perhaps in an external config file. One way or another though, I'll be sure to work this in there.

I agree the controls are a little slower than the default OFP ones, and this is my primary concern to improve. I would stress the point that has already been made though: using Fwatch during play DRASTICALLY improves things.

Quote[/b] ]Carrying wounded - was this project you showed screens on OFPEC forum some years ago totally abandoned?

It sits collecting dust in my HD. I ran into some snags configuring the anims. I really, really hate anims and their mysterious configs, so I haven't felt like trying to figure it out yet. "One of these days" I might...

[su27 0]

This system is amazing. However, it would be good to think about some kind of general replacement for existing campaigns.

PMC Fury is a great infantry campaign - just imagine - PMC Fury with unit replacement like ffur and HS system with the brand new squad behaviour and new formations.

But i get a headache when i think about changing all 100 missions to HS...

P.S. I can't see any difference in running HS missions with or without fwatch. Can anyone explain me how fwatch extends sample missions?

[General Barron 0]

Quote[/b] ]I can't see any difference in running HS missions with or without fwatch. Can anyone explain me how fwatch extends sample missions?

When you are using fwatch, you can activate the buttons on the command dialog using the # keys at the top of the keyboard.

That is to say, when the command dialog that you normally click with the mouse is up, you can use the number keys on the keyboard to "press" the appropriate button. This makes it easier because if you command your squad thru the radio menu, you have to press 0-0 each time you want to use a menu option; whereas the dialog stays open after each button press. It is also faster than clicking with the mouse.

It sounds like a tiny feature, which is what I thought it would be when I was making it. But it turns out to actually help quite a bit for some reason. I'm currently working on adding even more extra control via the great program fwatch.

Quote[/b] ]it would be good to think about some kind of general replacement for existing campaigns.

PMC Fury is a great infantry campaign - just imagine - PMC Fury with unit replacement like ffur and HS system with the brand new squad behaviour and new formations. But i get a headache when i think about changing all 100 missions to HS...

I totally agree. I had plans to try and make a program to convert existing missions to use this system. I guess its time I started working on it.

[-)rStrangelove 0]

I totally agree. I had plans to try and make a program to convert existing missions to use this system. I guess its time I started working on it.

Now that would rock.

Would be nice if everyone could edit & save several cfg files to make different styles of missions. (nam_units.cfg, ukf_units.cfg, bas_units.cfg etc ...)

I guess something that would be needed for such an approach would be the ability to extract an empty cfg file from a chosen campaign/mission with a list of all used units and vehicles in it.

After that one could fill in his fav unit codenames and save his cfg file with a different name.

That would be awesome.

[su27 0]

There is one thing I miss in ofp. Usually I have two or more grenadiers with grenade vests or bags in my team.

There should be an option to order them to make a short bombardment of specific target. You can quite precisely point to a target by clicking on map.

I think it would fit perfectly into your system.

[nubbin77 0]

I used an old version of this before and really liked it. It looks like there's beens some improvements in this version. I'm going to download tonight and check it out again. Does this version include Fwatch built into it? or is that something you guys added in seperately for your own missions. If so, could any of you post a mission with it so I can see how you implemented it?

Thanks

[lendrom 0]

There is one thing I miss in ofp. Usually I have two or more grenadiers with grenade vests or bags in my team.

There should be an option to order them to make a short bombardment of specific target. You can quite precisely point to a target by clicking on map.

I think it would fit perfectly into your system.

AFAIK General Barron made a script for Grenadiers indirect fire but its not implemented in HS system... yet?

The problem with automated converting standard missions to HS are mission specific conditions (triggers, scripts). For example I havent came up with good solution for missions created with Keycat's GroupLink. GroupLink works with only one group that is being chased and default HS team consists of 5 groups (player, radio, 3 teams). Also all events based on conditons in scripts which depend on something happening to players team can be messed up by automatic conversions (imagine that you have script that sends reinforcements when count group player < 5). The same goes with scripts execed on whole players group (foreach) etc. So when it comes to more advanced missions i dont think simple program would do the job. But of course it could be a useful tool for a start converting a mission...

BTW I was thinking about releasing one of FDF's missions converted to HS but I cant contact its author for permission....

[mrn 0]

Quote[/b] ]For example I havent came up with good solution for missions created with Keycat's GroupLink

A crude example is to just have the target group as the players'. I've found that as long as you have some non-GL2 units preferably on a guard waypoint can create a good atmosphere (artillery and backup called) along with some intense firefights. Units on a guard WP will travel a decent distance to assist others under attack. Patrols on move-move-cycle waypoints just need a "detected by trigger" switch to put them on guard and they change behaviour totally.

Using ECP 1.085, Handsignals, GL2 and the DAC system is the way forward from what I've played with so far. Completely immersive and utterly terrifying.

I just need a good scenario for a mission now.

[lendrom 0]

Yes MrN, your way is quite good but not perfect. You cant for example sacriefiece one squad for tieing in fight most of your enemies while realising mission objectives yourself at that time because enemy will follow YOU not your suicide squad . But that's not that big deal unless you are making US - Japanese war with Kamikaze . I typed about GroupLink just to show an example of 3rd party scripts that would need some hand work after automated conversion.

Recently I played some skirmishes with HS at ECP 1.085 DMA Army replacement, JAM HD combined with setdammaging at minus values, Lechistan island with beautiful grass providing cover and reducing visibility, guard waypoints and its a great experience, almost different (but even better) game...

[su27 0]

Quote[/b] ]You cant for example sacriefiece one squad for tieing in fight most of your enemies while realising mission objectives yourself at that time because enemy will follow YOU not your suicide squad .

Actually, it is not true anymore

Using DAC you can make enemy react to certain units the same way he reacts to player's team. So if you send one team to attack enemy, the enemy sends all reinforcements to support defence in the attack area. Then you can attack with your team from the other side. It's tested

Quote[/b] ]Recently I played some skirmishes with HS at ECP 1.085 DMA Army replacement, JAM HD combined with setdammaging at minus values, Lechistan island with beautiful grass providing cover and reducing visibility, guard waypoints and its a great experience, almost different (but even better) game...

A few days ago I installed retextrued cwc island with nordic nature (from ffur euro pack). My mouth still stays open It's like OFP2. The wood is the wood at last.

BTW. What about incorporating HS System into the dynamic campaign-like missions (Dynamic Afghanistan, DMA Lybia, DMA SP Template)? It should be quite simple.

[mrn 0]

Quote[/b] ]after automated conversion

Indeed. Automated could be tricky because it does fundamentally alter the way a group behaves, a mission would still need to be playtested due to the way HS alters the way a mission plays.

Quote[/b] ]Recently I played some skirmishes with HS at ECP 1.085 DMA Army replacement, JAM HD combined with setdammaging at minus values, Lechistan island with beautiful grass providing cover and reducing visibility, guard waypoints and its a great experience, almost different (but even better) game...

LOL, been there recently too. Drago is also a good place for these missions. I confess to getting a little frustrated with the 5 second lag thing though. One minute the missions runs fine, move the scenario to another location and get hit with an intermittant lag. I ended up settling on Leusderheide for open plan battles.

@GB

I ended digging around your scripts to solve a problem I was having. I discovered how complicated this system is so I thank you for putting the time and effort into it.

Just so you know the problem I was having was to get the whole group to start in formation after being dropped off in multiple choppers. If I started the mission with everyone in formation either the choppers would go nuts or the group would not be in the choppers and end up around the players start position.

It ended up with just having to find the right time to run start_in_formation.sqs. Would it be possible to alter how this starts, ie if the unit is in a vehicle wait until the whole group is out of the vehicle?

This is only really applicable if using larger groups. This is what I find fascinating about this addon, the ability to break the 12 unit group limit.

[General Barron 0]

Quote[/b] ]Does this version include Fwatch built into it?

Yes. You do not have to do anything, Fwatch is already built in. Just start with the template mission as per the readme. Future updates will also be backwards compatable--that is, missions made with v1.0 will benefit from the improvements in v1.1, without modification.

Quote[/b] ]AFAIK General Barron made a script for Grenadiers indirect fire but its not implemented in HS system... yet?

What I had made didn't work properly. I have since rewritten the whole thing, and it works pretty swell. However, I still need to do some more research to get it working with non-BIS grenades, and to turn it into a releaseable script. It is planned for the next version though.

Quote[/b] ]The problem with automated converting standard missions to HS are mission specific conditions (triggers, scripts).

Exactly. For the most part, I don't know if I can make a program to "automagically" fix these conditions. I think the best I can do is make the program check for these possible problems, and then identify them to the editor (which scripts/triggers they are in), with advice on how it could be a problem, possible solutions, etc. So basically, unless it is a "simple" mission, you will need a certain amount of editing knowledge to convert it.

Quote[/b] ]For example I havent came up with good solution for missions created with Keycat's GroupLink.

Not to pick on Keycat (he does excellent work), but this is why its good design practice to make scripts as customizable as possible (regarding who they can run on, etc). If you could designate which group(s) to run grouplink on, this wouldn't be a problem. Actually getting scripts to work like this is usually pretty tough though.

Quote[/b] ]BTW I was thinking about releasing one of FDF's missions converted to HS but I cant contact its author for permission....

I'd go for it. If you tried but can't contact him, it's generally considered okay to use his work, as long as due credit is given.

Quote[/b] ]It ended up with just having to find the right time to run start_in_formation.sqs. Would it be possible to alter how this starts, ie if the unit is in a vehicle wait until the whole group is out of the vehicle?

I'll see what I can do about this one. Glad to see you could find what is what inside the scripts though. Hopefully I commented things enough to help you find your way.

[CameronMcDonald 146]

Would this system be usable for US Regulars? I was hoping to use it, if you don't mind, GB.

If not, what's the difference? Anyone know?

[Revan999 0]

now this hosted on ofpfiles

http://operationflashpoint.filefront.com/file....m;57095

[Col. Rotten 0]

Wow Great work Baron! I'm very impressed (especially if you are the same Baron who made the Dodge challenger car, my all times favorite car of OFP )

Greetz

Rotten

[zwobot 22]

Well I'll dig this up again with a suggestion, and I reckon - or at least I hope - it will be rather easy to implement:

When you issue an command to the squad, a team or the RTO you should be able to issue a command to the same squad element again without having to navigate to this specific element again.

Example:

When you tell Team 1 to "watch direction" the command list should not be reset to the Squad, Team and RTO selection page but should remain in the Team 1's "main" menue where you can select "Move" "Get down" and so on in order to tell Team 1 to rush that direction or whatever.

Do you know what I mean?

I tried to work this out by myself but I do not have enough clue with dialogues and/or multi-using radio triggers

[General Barron 0]

Thanks for the suggestions. Actually, I've been working on v1.1, and your suggestion has already been implemented (and yes, it was easy ).

Here are some of the improvements I have/am implementing for v1.1:

-Menus stay at the current menu after an order is given.

-No delay between issuing orders--orders are instead added to a 'queue' as you click on them, and then issued in sequence.

-Enhanced Fwatch functionality: now you can assign nearly any key to nearly any HS-related task. This is configured via an external file, edited by the player, which stays the same across missions.

-Expanded options for mission editors (more teams available, naming of teams, etc).

I really like the Fwatch bit (wasn't even my idea). It makes the game super-easy to control. For example, you can assign "tab" to open up the command dialog, "backspace" to go back to the root of the command menu, "F1" to order a rally, etc etc. Again, all of this is fully customizable by the player.

I don't have a release date, especially since I just started school again. But know that there is progress being made towards a new and improved version.

[lendrom 0]

-No delay between issuing orders--orders are instead added to a 'queue' as you click on them, and then issued in sequence.

I wanted to suggest this as well but i didn't wanted to demand too much . Anyway it's very nice to hear you're working on the improvements (tab to open menu sounds great). I can't wait to try it in action!! I think its high time for me (or someone else - im not a good mission maker - I can only imagine how Sui could put it to a good use ) to make some good missions for HS to promote it the way it deserves it.

And one more little thing. I know it was asked before, but any chance for ECP compatibility? I mean especially one thing. I can't beat the HS Houdan Raid using ECP because i can't change the position of marker that im supposed to use to direct arty and reinforcements. I tried it with FFUR and it works. But still i prefer ECP and it would be nice to be able to use it with HS system.

Again thanks for what you did so far and I'm still hoping to see more!!

[funnyguy1 0]

Well, what about combining it with the Battliefield Communication System by Chaos Studios? And I mean COMBINING? The same goes to CoC arty...

edit: I forgot about the great CoC command engine 2...

[lendrom 0]

Funny thing funnyguy I was just recently wondering if HS could be combinded with CoC Command Engine 2 and tried to figure it out. The problem again is in overwriting the OnMapClicks as both scripts use it. I havent been into it too much but i guess the solution can be achived relatively easy by removing the support part of HS and replaceing it with CoCCE2. The second thing is making player able to use CoCCE2 only when he's holding a radio.

And now for something completely different: (sorry i couldnt help using this smiley )

[funnyguy1 0]

Well, I`m trying to combine all above mentioned scripts into one mission, but I`m really bad when it comes to mission making...

If only we had a pack containing all this stuff for mission making or a mod...(+ unrelased indirect fire from GB and suppresive fire by pla mod...) who would need ArmA then

pozdrawiam

[General Barron 0]

Re 'onmapsingleclick':

The HS system uses a special script set that makes it easy to manage multiple 'uses' of this command (I'm actually really proud of that script, and think everybody who uses the command should use it). Integrating other scripts that use 'onmapsingleclick' into the HS system is entirely possible--it's just a matter of hunting the command down in the other scripts, and replacing them with the appropriate function call. I can't do much about the ECP though (scripts are outside of the mission directory), except disable the scripts that use 'onmapsingleclick'.

I'll look into integrating CE2--I think it should be fairly simple (har har...). I haven't tried Chaos's comm system (sounds similar to what is already in HS), but I'll check it out.

[zwobot 22]

I have re-read nearly the whole topic but I haven't found anyone mention some problems with rushing squad/teams.

When you order a team to rush it is very hard to get it in formation again before the rush is completed (350m or what distance). A part of the team always doesn't come back in formation and sooner or later gets lost in woods, jungles whatever.

Is this a feature/bug of Ofp or has it something to do with the rush script?

I think I will inquire this by searching the addon scripts for AI's CombatMode settings which could be a cause for this.

[funnyguy1 0]

I prefer using CoC arty but it uses It`s own menu called "If menu"...the question is how to make "if menu" part of the menu that appears after "use radio" command...

Any updates soon?

edit: Could somebody give me a ressuply script where ammo creates are dropped by helo, not spawned over the area? Is there one that can be used along with HS?

@ GB, would be great to have an "evac" script in the new hs relase.

[Garcia 0]

I dunno if this have been answered before, but I don't feel like reading through this whole thread

1: How do I make the signal method to shouting at start (don't want to force to only use shouting (I've seen that option ), but just force to start with shouting).

2: For some reason when I tell the squad to move, my unit won't shout anything, but I do hear the other units repeating what I was supposed to say.

3: How do I remove the targetbox that shows when my squad spots a enemy?