a.i. Tactical Combat Link - TypeX

[snkman 351]

Well guess it's not too obvious.

If i remember correctly there is a bug with A.I. artillery support in the latest version ( v.1.0.21 ) which results in a script error.

Normally you set up A.I. artillery support by simply using any kind of crewed artillery vehicle / mortar in the mission.

[Machiya 19]

A query about inits from MadCheese (author of the C2 Mod),

"I am using < this setVariable ["TCL_Disabled", true]; > to pre-init Player controlled elements, but I am not clear on the effect.
If used both squads and HC level groups AND units. I had some issues with a TCL error hint telling me to never initialise multiple times.I'm a bit confused with the whole thing."

I assume only squad (not unit) TCL_Disabled are effective [I don't know much about High Command level Groups.

 

[Machiya 19]

A couple of Zeus thoughts.

• A Zeus 'Hold WP' or 'Garrison WP' making a squad 'TCL_Hold' would be great.
• A Zeus 'Seek and Destroy' WP ought to make a TCL squad push inside the 300m zone.

I was trying to think of a way that you can use Zeus WPs to automatically alter TCL_Status or a squad. One less thing to worry about.

• I could think of something that would naturally work for 'TCL_Defend' -- other than a Zeus Guard WP (but that comes with a pile of BIS hard-coded stuff).

[Machiya 19]

Dug this link out from Shay_gman & Spirit's GAIA AI in MCC,

https://mccsandbox.fandom.com/wiki/GAIA_cycles

[snkman 351]

Quote

"I am using < this setVariable ["TCL_Disabled", true]; > to pre-init Player controlled elements, but I am not clear on the effect.

So we are talking about Zeus here?

Guess with "Player controlled elements" he means playable A.I. unit(s)?

Well group type(s) should be used on group(s) only and not single unit(s) of a group if i understand this right?

 

I've already included a A.I. spawn initialize delay which could be pretty handy especially for Zeus users.

Right now T.C.L. will initialize spawned / Zeus created A.I. unit(s) / group(s) after 5 seconds.

This timer will be changeable to what ever you need it just to get some more time to use / set any of the T.C.L. A.I. group type(s) bevor T.C.L. will start to initialize the A.I. unit(s) / group(s).

 

Quote

If used both squads and HC level groups AND units. I had some issues with a TCL error hint telling me to never initialise multiple times.I'm a bit confused with the whole thing."

The T.C.L. error will appear if multiple group type(s) was used on the same A.I. group!

E.g.: If you set the same A.I. group to TCL_Hold + TCL_Defend or any other 2 or multiple group type(s) at the same time.

 

Quote

 

A couple of Zeus thoughts.

A Zeus 'Hold WP' or 'Garrison WP' making a squad 'TCL_Hold' would be great.

A Zeus 'Seek and Destroy' WP ought to make a TCL squad push inside the 300m zone.

I was trying to think of a way that you can use Zeus WPs to automatically alter TCL_Status or a squad. One less thing to worry about.

I could think of something that would naturally work for 'TCL_Defend' -- other than a Zeus Guard WP (but that comes with a pile of BIS hard-coded stuff).

 

I don't think there should be any requirements for Zeus A.I. when it comes to all the T.C.L. group type(s).

Guess the way of how i did it so far really should fit pretty well.

Zeus A.I. group(s) with waypoint(s) will be fully Zeus controlled so if you like to prevent Zeus A.I. from moving just give them a waypoint and thats it.

If you delete the waypoint(s) A.I. group(s) movement will be controlled by T.C.L. again.

So every time you give Zeus A.I. waypoint(s) will switch them to be Zeus controlled movement and no waypoint(s) = T.C.L. controlled movement.

[Machiya 19]

re. AI inits

Yes, it's a Zeus thing, but also about a handles for other MODders to interact with TCL (e.g. like turn it off, so they can do something, and then turn it back on again).
Essentially, it might be good to be able to re-init a unit, even as a function.

re. Zeus Waypoints

OK. 

[ryals718 1]

Any way to disable the AI from firing flares? I'm trying to build night missions and the AI seems to fire them about every 5 seconds.

[snkman 351]

Sure.

You could first try to lower A.I. flare using chance and see how it works for you.

 

Go to: UserConfig > TCL > TCL_Feature.sqf

 

Look for:

    // ------------------------------------------------------------
    // T.C.L. Flare: ( Chance )
    // ------------------------------------------------------------
    // 0 - 100, default is 50%
      // TCL_Feature set [8, 50];

Remove the // to activate the setting and change the value ( chance ) from 50 ( 50% ) to 5 ( 5% ).

    // ------------------------------------------------------------
    // T.C.L. Flare: ( Chance )
    // ------------------------------------------------------------
    // 0 - 100, default is 50%
       TCL_Feature set [8, 5];

If A.I. after this change still is using flares too much for your needs just set the value ( chance ) to 0 ( 0% ) to disable it.

[fycj 9]

Any ETA about the new version? I really want to try it lol

[kremator 1065]

It will be ready, when it's ready!  Please don't ask for updates / new releases - it is against forum rules.

[snkman 351]

@fycj

True... It really would be time for it...

But i choosed to add some new features which mainly delayed the next version.

Still have to do much more testing and stuff but maybe i will be able to release some kind of W.I.P. build within this week.

[Guest]

Is v1.0.19 compatible with CBA? 

Also, what exactly happens when you load TCL and CBA together? Does TCL not work?

[snkman 351]

11 hours ago, russian spy said:

Is v1.0.19 compatible with CBA? 

Also, what exactly happens when you load TCL and CBA together? Does TCL not work?

Well there should be no problem with C.B.A. since T.C.L. use its own "Init" Event Handler.

[Guest]

OK, thanks. Thank you for your modification. The CQC is epic.

[AirShark 147]

Quote

But i choosed to add some new features which mainly delayed the next version.

speaking of features are you porting the GL4 ones... like simulate death, advance, suppression and rearming... there is a lot of stuff that need to be ported 😛

[snkman 351]

2 hours ago, AirShark said:

speaking of features are you porting the GL4 ones... like simulate death, advance, suppression and rearming... there is a lot of stuff that need to be ported 😛

Umm... Not porting really...

Guess i can tell creating things from scratch most of the time makes it much more efficient.

Also guess i can say that when it comes to coding my knowledge and understandings from GL4 to now has been very improved which is why i don't like to use some old stuff even if it was written by myself.

But yes you are right some ideas of GL4 are pretty nice.

 

The new feature(s) i'm working on right now are:

A.I. Flanking ( Highly Enhanced )

A.I. Rearm

A.I. Heal / A.I. Medic Support

A.I. Surrender ( Guess will not be in the next version because right now it's kind of very early alpha stage )

 

A.I. Advancing and A.I. Suppression already is in the mod since 1. release.

[AirShark 147]

nice features you are working on there...

I wonder if A.I. Rearm support other weapons class  rather than just vanilla... not many people are using Vanilla content these days including myself so it will be cool if you add part in the userconfig where we can add more class names to it for other mods support 😛

A.I. Heal / A.I. Medic Support  im sure this one will use the vanilla medical system... but I wonder if it will be compatible with ace mod

A.I. Flanking ( Highly Enhanced )  the symphony of GL4/TCL... the most important part in the whole mod I cant wait to test it 

A.I. Surrender if I remember correctly the chance will be adjusted via Ranks right  ? ..I hope you add more options for it in the user config like the ability to Flee 😜 

Quote

A.I. Advancing and A.I. Suppression already is in the mod since 1. release.

I cant see any options for it in the userconfig 

[snkman 351]

23 minutes ago, AirShark said:

I wonder if A.I. Rearm support other weapons class  rather than just vanilla... not many people are using Vanilla content these days including myself so it will be cool if you add part in the userconfig where we can add more class names to it for other mods support 😛

Well the way of how it works so far should support any type of weapon vanilla and modded.

 

1. A.I. unit(s) which run low on magazines ( primary weapon ) will search for any dead unit(s) nearby which have the same magazine type they need and take them.

2. If no dead unit(s) with the same magazine type are nearby A.I. unit(s) will search for any object ( vehicles ) nearby to rearm.

3. If none of the above was found A.I. unit(s) will search for any dead unit nearby and take its weapon + magazines. This means you may will see WEST unit(s) using EAST or RESISTANCE weapon(s) and vice versa.

 

So there should be NO class limitations.

 

23 minutes ago, AirShark said:

A.I. Heal / A.I. Medic Support  im sure this one will use the vanilla medical system... but I wonder if it will be compatible with ace mod

Well this is a pretty simple feature...

A.I. unit(s) which are unable to walk or badly injured will use their first aid kit.

If they are out of first aid kits and a medic is in their group they will call the medic to support them. Thats it...

 

23 minutes ago, AirShark said:

I cant see any options for it in the userconfig  

True...

There are some features which are not listed in the UserConfig yet!

But next update will have almost all of them available.

[chrisb 196]

GL4 worked more or less as it did in A2 when I used it in A3 at release of Alpha. Just a few error popups would be annoying, which they sorted in GL5. Taking ammo, swapping weapons etc all worked as it did in A2, surrender also worked too in A3 as did flanking. Syncing units also worked in 3. Most of the ai mods I mixed from A2 worked reasonably o.k. in A3 early on. But zeus was always a problem, but I got a A3 version of 'findcover' so that sorted that out really.

 

Overall the ai mix I used in A2 works fine in A3, it will be interesting to see a side by side comparison of this mod v GL4/5 plus some others. The only problem was zeus really, and you really need zeus for tactics and a more engaging combat. But lets hope that will change with TCL, GL4 ai were always wanting to get stuck in too much, but were easily pulled back a little.

 

I have a number of videos on my YT channel showing GL4/5 working well in A3, plus other ai mods too. (I think there are still some public ones there)

 

Was a shame about zeus though.

 

Oh, and when I say zeus.. I mean the ai mod, just incase some are confused.. 😉

[snkman 351]

11 hours ago, chrisb said:

I have a number of videos on my YT channel showing GL4/5 working well in A3, plus other ai mods too. (I think there are still some public ones there)

Well depends on what you understand by working well.

GL5 is a port of GL4 where as far as i can tell no code has been changed / modified to make it work properly in ARMA 3.

Im not talking about class name changes and stuff like that i'm talking about the pure system code.

Guess the main purpose was to just port it.

 

To make A.I. work ( move ) half way properly you have to use some disableAI commands which wasn't available right from the beginning of ARMA 3.

Quote

"AUTOCOMBAT" - disables autonomous switching to COMBAT when in danger Available only since Arma 3 v1.56.

"TARGET" - stop the unit to watch the assigned target / group commander may not assign targets.

If you don't use them A.I. unit(s) kind of refuse to move very often.

Also those commands was one of the reasons why i came back to modding.

Waited for them since A2 where B.I.S. started to make A.I. modding kind of hard by using their hardcoded A.I. "COMBAT" behaviour.

 

Example:

By default ( vanilla ) A.I. group(s) as soon as they have an enemy they will switch to behaviour "COMBAT" automatically which is fine.

But in some cases you like to make them use "AWARE" instead of "COMBAT" behaviour to make them move faster by not using UP > DOWN stance all over the time or by not using B.I.S. micro A.I. cover usage.

 

The only way to switch A.I. group(s) with enemy contact back to "AWARE" behaviour is by using the disableAI "AUTOCOMBAT" command.

The same distance lets say 500 meters with behaviour "COMBAT" takes A.I. group(s) around 1 - 2 minutes while "AWARE" A.I. group(s) need half the time. They kind of rush to their enemy which sometimes could be pretty good especially during a hunt situation.

 

This is just 1 example out of many!

 

Guess from a players point of view it may looks good but if you debug / spectate A.I. movement in almost every kind areas, locations, environments and distances with enemy without enemy by using diffrent behaviour and combat modes you will pretty fast see whats going on and where the problems at.

 

I'm still fighting with A.I. movement ( right now ) but i can tell without those commands it would be much much worse!!!

 

To figure out what exactly to disable ( what caused the problems ) took me months i guess...

 

[AirShark 147]

there is something annoying I found in GL4/TCL along time ago, sometimes the Ai is disembarking for no reasons from armed vehicles/static turrets during combat I tested it today with the Zsu-23 if more then 1 airplane flys around it they disembark and run away... even if there is 4 Zsu-23s and only 2 airplanes they disembark and flee away

I wonder if you can improve Ai static Turrets crew/Armed vehicles crew for example like Tank crew by obliging them to stay on their armed vehicles if any enemies nearby when the vehicle is damaged... sometimes for small scratch like damaged tracks will force them to disembark and get their selfs killed... and TCL/GL4 to be honest makes that a little bit worse 😛
 because you are trying to make new features/improvements my suggestion is to force them to stay in their vehicles/turrets unless Fatal explosion will happen or there is no spotted enemy nearby when the armed vehicle/turret is damaged.

[chrisb 196]

9 hours ago, snkman said:

Well depends on what you understand by working well.

GL5 is a port of GL4 where as far as i can tell no code has been changed / modified to make it work properly in ARMA 3.

Im not talking about class name changes and stuff like that i'm talking about the pure system code.

Guess the main purpose was to just port it.

 

To make A.I. work ( move ) half way properly you have to use some disableAI commands which wasn't available right from the beginning of ARMA 3.

If you don't use them A.I. unit(s) kind of refuse to move very often.

Also those commands was one of the reasons why i came back to modding.

Waited for them since A2 where B.I.S. started to make A.I. modding kind of hard by using their hardcoded A.I. "COMBAT" behaviour.

 

Example:

By default ( vanilla ) A.I. group(s) as soon as they have an enemy they will switch to behaviour "COMBAT" automatically which is fine.

But in some cases you like to make them use "AWARE" instead of "COMBAT" behaviour to make them move faster by not using UP > DOWN stance all over the time or by not using B.I.S. micro A.I. cover usage.

 

The only way to switch A.I. group(s) with enemy contact back to "AWARE" behaviour is by using the disableAI "AUTOCOMBAT" command.

The same distance lets say 500 meters with behaviour "COMBAT" takes A.I. group(s) around 1 - 2 minutes while "AWARE" A.I. group(s) need half the time. They kind of rush to their enemy which sometimes could be pretty good especially during a hunt situation.

 

This is just 1 example out of many!

 

Guess from a players point of view it may looks good but if you debug / spectate A.I. movement in almost every kind areas, locations, environments and distances with enemy without enemy by using diffrent behaviour and combat modes you will pretty fast see whats going on and where the problems at.

 

I'm still fighting with A.I. movement ( right now ) but i can tell without those commands it would be much much worse!!!

 

To figure out what exactly to disable ( what caused the problems ) took me months i guess...

 

 

Yes I agree, I think GL5 was just a straight port, but they removed error popups, which helped. Also it worked pretty good, overall. From a players point of view, well mine anyway, although I didn't play it much.

 

The things you point to as possible improvements for modders/devs like yourself, i.e. (disable) cover, autocombat, path etc, etc that were introduced in A3. These for me, seem to be there for modders/devs, to make the game faster, which is what A3 seems to be, when compared to earlier titles. I wouldn't think these were helpful in a realistic way. Forcing ai through using some of these commands is great if you want the game to feel fast, maybe a perceived excitement (battlefield'ish).

 

I can't see,  -this disableAI "COVER"-, or suppression, to be useful at all, for a tactical ai (just imo), unless your after a faster game. Plus switching to auto combat 'as is default', that seems right for the way we play the game (non story driven sessions), infact its more or less a must.

 

That said, for heavily scripted missions (maybe story based/driven), whereas you have to get the ai to point 'a' or point 'b' at a set time, or to move the game onwards quicker, then I can see why you would use these commands. But looking at what they do seems to just be aimed at pushing the game forward/faster, or isn't it ?

 

How do you see these helping make the game more tactical, it would be good if they do, but we're yet to see other mods use them that way. I see A3 played much faster than previous titles on the whole. I can't see that as a good thing, well, for me at least.

 

Have you an example of a scenario, where you'd find these really helpful in a tactical way, not story driven mission, but with a terrain set out as occupied by ai forces ? i.e. once set out they act in a more independent way ?

[froggyluv 2135]

"Why AutoCombat Bad Chief?"

Because real soldiers sometimes need to move quickly to get to real cover. Not Pop up/down rotate 180 like the whack-a-mole subroutines that are Arma Auto Combat

[chrisb 196]

1 hour ago, froggyluv said:

"Why AutoCombat Bad Chief?"

Because real soldiers sometimes need to move quickly to get to real cover. Not Pop up/down rotate 180 like the whack-a-mole subroutines that are Arma Auto Combat

But ai have been doing that (with help) for years. Going to cover is something that is well documented in videos, real cover, cover that is well out of the way too i.e. they travel to cover whilst covering other units.

So it isn't really that new, or new at all. Just requires mods, well not even mods, just zeu_findcover pbo plus a little tampering.

 

 

[froggyluv 2135]

That video does a poor job of showing anything really other than some basic AI maneuvering. You need to show distance, location and general orientation of the enemy to make a determination how well the AI is behaving. Narration notes or at least timestamps to make your points are helpful as well.

 

And again, there are circumstances where AI need to really just haul ass such as incoming artillery, armor or grenade. Im 48yo in real life and i could run circles around those stooges. Thats why the BI devs provided all of the newer Disable Ai features -they realize that the AI needs more but they simply arent funded to do so. Giving scripters the tools was a very nice gesture