Arma 3 As an E-Sport

[ReVee 10]

While I know that a post regarding this has already been made,the last reply was 280 days old.

This post is to give a guideline as to *how* Arma 3 as an E-Sport could work. No reason to do this, but sometimes it's good to post ideas as they are.

Setting:

- Small/Cordoned off areas. Maybe one town, or two towns close by (if a town is used). Docks/Solar Farms/Etc..

Objectives:

-Avoid TDM altogether.

- Capture the Flag, Sabotage/Search and Destroy type games

- Attack/Defend

- VIP/Escort

Team Sizes:

- 8-10 man teams (Standard Squad Size)

- *If* Vehicles are utilized, 2 players must be designated as drivers. Only when they are killed may another soldier take the wheel.

Needed features (Modded in or otherwise);

- Spectator Mode (Better Utilized than now)

- Loadout Restrictions

- Referee (Zeus?)

[KaneSvK 1]

While I know that a post regarding this has already been made,the last reply was 280 days old.

This post is to give a guideline as to *how* Arma 3 as an E-Sport could work. No reason to do this, but sometimes it's good to post ideas as they are.

Setting:

- Small/Cordoned off areas. Maybe one town, or two towns close by (if a town is used). Docks/Solar Farms/Etc..

Objectives:

-Avoid TDM altogether.

- Capture the Flag, Sabotage/Search and Destroy type games

- Attack/Defend

- VIP/Escort

Team Sizes:

- 8-10 man teams (Standard Squad Size)

- *If* Vehicles are utilized, 2 players must be designated as drivers. Only when they are killed may another soldier take the wheel.

Needed features (Modded in or otherwise);

- Spectator Mode (Better Utilized than now)

- Loadout Restrictions

- Referee (Zeus?)

Good idea,it would actually convince me to start playing MP. I cant stand wasteland and similar scenarious. This would make available more serious (making sense) mp scenarios. I d love to have similar experience as old Americas Army 2 had, only more realistic with Arma mindset. Sadly i think there arent many ppl who see it that way. I got succesfully detered from MP ever since there is extreme majority of wasteland and other silly (no offense) scenario servers

[martin_lee 33]

Haven't really played with the Zeus much but that does seems have a great potential to work pretty well as a referee :D

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

The only way i see Arma 3 becoming E-Sports, is to have a realistic style TTWF (Tee Times Warfare). CTI (Capture The Island) Tee Times, is one of the best TVT (Team Vs Team) game you can find on Arma 3. It involves 2 teams fighting for a series of flags, but only certain flags can be capped depending on who owns what, giving the game an almost strictly tactical approach. This would be great because you would be able to see how teams work together, or in separate squads to accomplish a set of challenges, with one goal. It also shows how certain vehicles are used and in what circumstances, and the tactics in which those vehicles are used.

[almanzo 144]

TacBF?

[RushHour 11]

Would love to see this!

Just imagine the first dsync live on air.

People asking when the pilot will take off in which he responds he´s already at the LZ.

Add in the hovering cars in the skies, the random deaths, the lag spikes that we all come to love by now.

So i´d say hell yes. Proper entertainment.

-

No but seriously, i think CTI or Conquest would work great for E-sports. TacBF would be cool too, assuming people actually play it.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Would love to see this!

Just imagine the first dsync live on air.

People asking when the pilot will take off in which he responds he´s already at the LZ.

Add in the hovering cars in the skies, the random deaths, the lag spikes that we all come to love by now.

So i´d say hell yes. Proper entertainment.

-

No but seriously, i think CTI or Conquest would work great for E-sports. TacBF would be cool too, assuming people actually play it.

The flying car glitch for me only happens on Altis life, and it was EXTREMELY stressful, especially knowing you have worked so hard for gear, and if one of those hits you, its all over. However, on EUTW (Europe TeeTimes Warfare) servers, i've never had that kind of lag. I get around 70-55 frames, and that's on my laptop. Even when things get intense.

[RushHour 11]

However, on EUTW (Europe TeeTimes Warfare) servers, i've never had that kind of lag. I get around 70-55 frames, and that's on my laptop. Even when things get intense.

Yea i don´t think i´ve seen the lightspeed flying cars in EUTW´s servers but i´ve seen the superlong dsyncing moments, the one vehicle situated 200m up in the sky for no reason at all, the prolonged lag spikes where the game just crushes your computer down to 5 fps for a solid 10 seconds regardless of how much cream you have in the box etc.

[Westonsammy 1]

Could never see ArmA becoming an E-sport, it is not competitive enough and is too dynamic. Most E-sports games tend to be built completely around small-team, competitive multiplayer, while ArmA is built around huge-scale sandbox gameplay.

[paecmaker 23]

Could never see ArmA becoming an E-sport, it is not competitive enough and is too dynamic. Most E-sports games tend to be built completely around small-team, competitive multiplayer, while ArmA is built around huge-scale sandbox gameplay.

But that depends on the mission maker, its easy to cordon of one or two villages and the surrounding area and just have two basic squads fight over small zones.

Heck I would love watching two tactical teams fight over the control of a small village.

[JamesSaga 1]

I would love to ShacTac Vs other pro communities in large missions, with some proper structure to them rather than straight up death matches.

Eg attack and defend and maybe a NATO force Vs a hidden terrorist cell in a built up, populated area.

[ReVee 10]

As far as I can see, Arma as an esport would have to be small area based. Yeah, a large map is nice but for something made to be competitive would have to be cordoned off to a small area like Oreokastros or Kavala.

[JamesSaga 1]

Or in a team based objectives to make focus points on the map

[roshnak 41]

To make Arma 3 work as an esport (i.e. a game where people take competition seriously) you would have to make it a different game.

[Sneakson 1]

There was an e-sport thread about six months ago and I concluded that ARMA definitely can't become a big e-sport.

The devs don’t have the time to support it well, there aren’t enough users interested in doing what has to be done in order to turn ARMA into an e-sport and there won’t be enough viewers.

Battlefield isn’t an e-sport and that should be saying something about how difficult it will be to actually make happen.

However AOE2 (Age of Empires II) has become a small scale e-sport over the last few years thanks to many dedicated individuals and the biggest channel has 30k subs and that’s something ARMA could do eventually.

A lot of things need to happen though.

Someone needs to start off by designing an “ARMA_DUST†mission. An elegant mission that’s fun for the first time and for the hundred time and is easy to understand and exciting to watch.

Then someone needs to start organizing small tournaments and many players have to be interested in competing in the tournaments. It has to become serious enough for a meta-game to arise and teams to establish themselves. Then when tournaments are going regularly and there is a solid stream of competitors someone has to bring outside attention to it by streaming and threading it on other sites and then enough viewers have to accumulate to start making some ad money to support everyone involved including the mission designers, tournament managers, streamers and competitors. It would require much effort.

It could happen however it’s not going to happen autonomously and interest in ARMA is quite low in gaming communities.

Edited May 7, 2014 by Sneakson

[ReVee 10]

There was an e-sport thread about six months ago and I concluded that ARMA definitely can't become a big e-sport.

The devs don’t have the time to support it well, there aren’t enough users interested in doing what has to be done in order to turn ARMA into an e-sport and there won’t be enough viewers.

Battlefield isn’t an e-sport and that should be saying something about how difficult it will be to actually make happen.

However AOE2 (Age of Empires II) has become a small scale e-sport over the last few years thanks to many dedicated individuals and the biggest channel has 30k subs and that’s something ARMA could do eventually.

A lot of things need to happen though.

Someone needs to start off by designing an “ARMA_DUST†mission. An elegant mission that’s fun for the first time and for the hundred time and is easy to understand and exciting to watch.

Then someone needs to start organizing small tournaments and many players have to be interested in competing in the tournaments. It has to become serious enough for a meta-game to arise and teams to establish themselves. Then when tournaments are going regularly and there is a solid stream of competitors someone has to bring outside attention to it by streaming and threading it on other sites and then enough viewers have to accumulate to start making some ad money to support everyone involved including the mission designers, tournament managers, streamers and competitors. It would require much effort.

It could happen however it’s not going to happen autonomously and interest in ARMA is quite low in gaming communities.

I agree wholeheartedly (and that's the thread I was referring to).

I've actually started designing a mission that kind of fits that. Basically a defuse mission where it's NATO V CSAT based in Oreokastro. If I ever learn scripting it will be fantastic haha.

[kilroy the nerd 14]

Don't clans sometimes set up battles against each other, like United Operations vs. CIA or something along those lines? At least, I remember things like that happening in Arma 2, so I don't see why it wouldn't happen in 3.

I think a major question would be numbers. In very few places without making up a shoothouse or something on Altis is it practical to do a 5 v 5 like CS, but what are the odds that competitive teams will be up in the 30s and above, if most existing teams are used to small gameplay like CS, CoD, TF2, or similar?

Off-topic though, that gives me an idea for a mission request. Y'know, what with all the castles...

[rübe 127]

Don't clans sometimes set up battles against each other, ...?

This was actually a big thing back in OFP/resi-times for several years. There were several leagues in Europe/Germany with ladders and what not. ESL comes to mind, but there were some more. And for sure there were a lot of well organized clans. And for sure there also were a lot of great maps and various game modes, that worked in such a setting (usually 6vs6 players or even more).

Not fast, simple or fair enough for e-sports? Maybe.

But boy, did we have a blast at that time.

I don't really know why this (and maps such as Arudy, Frontline et al.) isn't a thing any more. Maybe thanks to join-in-progress (which came with Arma I suppose?) and the adapted maps that had to work with this? It certainly wasn't all that bad, waiting in the lobby for a great match to start - even on public servers...

Watching some videos nowadays of well organised clans (usually playing coop vs. AI from what I can tell), I just can imagine how awesome clan-fights with such (large) teams would be. :rolleyes:

[Sneakson 1]

An arma_dust would have to do something that other games can't do be the most interesting.

A balanced and elegant zone control mission across the whole of Stratis involving big numbers of players, say 50 vs 50 and a money accumulation system for extra soldiers and support is the easiest to imagine… similar to watching a strategy game being played except with humans controlling every unit. However something that easy to come up with doesn’t click with me.

It would have to be smarter… and smaller in scale. Something eye-catching.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

It depends on what the definition of competition is. I operate in a small squad known as ANVIL. We play wasteland, and usually when we do, we get things done. End of the round, we have around enough gear to supply a full on Platoon or more with arms, ammunition, nvg's, diving gear for some, multiple APC's and HELO's. Anvil consists of me and literally 3-4 other people. That being said, competition... that word is far stretched. Being competitive in a sense, for Arcade games, is completely different than being competitive in a more Tactical, and large environment such as Arma 3. It's like watching NASCAR, and comparing it to something far more vast and competitive, such as The Amazing Race. In a sense, it's the same thing, with different layouts. You could watch players duke it out on a small Desert map simply to plant and disarm a bomb. Where as you could watch 2 main teams, and a handful of small groups fighting for survival and supplies on a 244+ island like Altis, and coming out on top with enough supplies for a Task Force. The point... For Arma 3 to even touch E-Sports, would have to be based on a Dynamically Controlled Environment (<---Counter Productive Phrase. Lol), and that's... i don't know, close to impossible anyways. And than there are some issues that come with Arma itself... So over all, its all questionable.

[karbiner 11]

Why is'nt Valhalla/FT-2 mentioned yet? If clans play versus other clans FT-2 is often the mode they go with. There have been plenty of Valhalla tournaments for arma 2 and they are also here for Arma3 if you look hard enough. Currently the 6th edition of Arma Tactical Combat will start in a couple of months and thats a big 50vs50 domination kind of campaing(15 battles, 1 every week).http://www.arma-tactical-combat.com/ If you have a team consisting of more than 10 members you can try to apply, maybe there is still room for your team in the 6th edition, otherwise you'll have wait till the 7th edition which is half year later :)

Back OT: Arma 3 is not fit for real e-sports that will be featured on lan events etc. 5vs5 requires small maps, making a lot of elements that come with arma obsolete, like bulletdrop and all the vehicles.

And to be honest, the whole e-sports scene is dying. Even Call of Duty had a very respectable and hardcore e-sports scene till World at War, after which it went downhill very vast because the devs gained dollarsigns in their eyes $.$ Then there is Couner-Strike, Global Offensive is doing well but I don't think it will last as long as cs1.6. After that we have Dota2 and Starcraft but who cares about those if you want to play FPS? And as long as triple-a developers care more about sales than anything else we will never see a great and memorable e-sports game again since all they do is shit out annual shit which they charge you 60,- euro for every time.

[Sneakson 1]

Why is'nt Valhalla/FT-2 mentioned yet? If clans play versus other clans FT-2 is often the mode they go with. There have been plenty of Valhalla tournaments for arma 2 and they are also here for Arma3 if you look hard enough. Currently the 6th edition of Arma Tactical Combat will start in a couple of months and thats a big 50vs50 domination kind of campaing(15 battles, 1 every week).http://www.arma-tactical-combat.com/ If you have a team consisting of more than 10 members you can try to apply, maybe there is still room for your team in the 6th edition, otherwise you'll have wait till the 7th edition which is half year later :)

Back OT: Arma 3 is not fit for real e-sports that will be featured on lan events etc. 5vs5 requires small maps, making a lot of elements that come with arma obsolete, like bulletdrop and all the vehicles.

And to be honest, the whole e-sports scene is dying. Even Call of Duty had a very respectable and hardcore e-sports scene till World at War, after which it went downhill very vast because the devs gained dollarsigns in their eyes $.$ Then there is Couner-Strike, Global Offensive is doing well but I don't think it will last as long as cs1.6. After that we have Dota2 and Starcraft but who cares about those if you want to play FPS? And as long as triple-a developers care more about sales than anything else we will never see a great and memorable e-sports game again since all they do is shit out annual shit which they charge you 60,- euro for every time.

E-sports is dying? StarCraft is doing better than ever to my knowledge, being broadcasted on Swedish national channel 1 and as long as StarCraft is doing good there will be big events that other games such as CS:GO, Halo and Street Fighter also can sneak their way into.

Considering how great the interest is in Youtube channels featuring Call of Duty, DayZ and really all games between the heaven and the earth competitive or not I believe the only reason we're not seeing more big e-sporting is because we've had some bad years in gaming now.

Haven't seen many multiplayer shooters other than ARMA, Battlefield, Call of Duty, CS and Halo over the last many years and the multiplayer strategy genre is totally dead other than StarCraft II.

The only games we seem to see nowadays are indie horror titles en masse.

Destiny comes out later this year though. If it's anything like Halo then it's going to be big considering they're going multi.

[RushHour 11]

lol E-sports is dying :) Now that´s something you don´t read every day.

[karbiner 11]

There are not as much hardcore e-sports titles as there where 7-8 years ago. It has been on a downhill slope and I don't see light on the other side of the tunnel. Most new games ofcourse hold some competitives ladders but they won't last for years or even months. And like I also said the strategy games are hanging in there with SC2, LoL and Dota2 but shooters? Sure they're doing well on the consoles but I don't want to call this

anything even remotely competitive, its rather disgusting and terrifying and us proper pc gamers should'nt even compare ourselves with that filth.

[clydefrog 3]

Arma 3 could never be an "e-sport" just for one main reason, it is abysmal at handling lag and the desync which makes it useless for fair competitive play.