The A-164 WIPEOUT Fixed Wing Aircraft

[izaiak 1]

when you see the range of the PIP's FLIR for the commanche ... You will need to fly at 200m overhead your target to see something ... :(

But it is a good idea and plus with a dynamic view ( search on feedbacktracker or VBS 2 video ).

[xendance 3]

Are the memory points for the A-164 rockets/missiles configured properly?

plane selectionPosition "Rocket_1" and plane selectionPosition "Rocket_2" both return [0,0,0] when plane is an A-164.

But with Neophron plane selectionPosition "Rocket_1" returns [-4.3218,-0.220851,1.06955] and for Rocket_2 it returns [4.28913,-0.220851,1.06955].

[predatorVMT 10]

I just did a few more tests to check how effective the cannon ammo is.

It is definitely a lot better than it was before, but after testing i still believe it needs just a little more kick.

At the point i took this screenshot the APC, a FV720-Mora, took 50 direct hits from behind. It took around 40 more bullets to completely destroy it. I'd say this is a bit too much. From that distance 50 rounds should be enough to level that thing specially from the behind. Now this raises the question, hitpoints are too high for certain parts of these APC's or the Gatling cannon rounds are still a bit weak. Maybe it is a combination of the two.

50 direct hit??!!!!:butbut:

HOW many run do i need to make to destroy this in the BF??!!!!:confused:

In Arma 2, i only took a few hit from A-10 to disable APC. Should i compliment the APC's armor or should i complain about the effectiveness of A-164's main weapon?:j:

[Wiki 1558]

Please, vote for it.

http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=19369

[x3kj 1247]

if flying slow it's beneficial to extend flaps half or full (depending on speed) to counter sink rate

[carlostex 38]

50 direct hit??!!!!:butbut:

HOW many run do i need to make to destroy this in the BF??!!!!:confused:

In Arma 2, i only took a few hit from A-10 to disable APC. Should i compliment the APC's armor or should i complain about the effectiveness of A-164's main weapon?:j:

It actually took 90 direct bullets before it exploded. While i agree the 30mm cannon values should get a slight kick, the Arma 2 values on the A-10 were way too high.

The values i suggested above should be balanced enough. Here they are again:

CALIBER: 6 --- penetrates deeper

HIT: 100 --- provides a 25% improvement

INDIRECTHIT: 12 --- the same as it is right now

INDIRECTHITRANGE: 2 --- the same as it is right now

[xendance 3]

It actually took 90 direct bullets before it exploded. While i agree the 30mm cannon values should get a slight kick, the Arma 2 values on the A-10 were way too high.

The values i suggested above should be balanced enough. Here they are again:

CALIBER: 6 --- penetrates deeper

HIT: 100 --- provides a 25% improvement

INDIRECTHIT: 12 --- the same as it is right now

INDIRECTHITRANGE: 2 --- the same as it is right now

Why were you counting hits until the explosion? Instead you should count what gets disabled after certain amount of hits.

[merlin 17]

As far as the targeting pod discussion is concerned I think there is a very real possibility to add it, particularly if you look at BI's efforts to implement ground stabilization in the UAVs. It's something i think would be very doable in an expansion or maybe even along the lines of the helicopters DLC. Targeting pods would make the CAS aircraft a great deal more capable and would open up self-designation for laser guided bombs and other ordnance. This was something i really appreciated in Mandoble's missile addon and i thought it added a lot of depth to an often overlooked aspect of gameplay.

[the_demongod 31]

Hey guys

I was planning on messing around with the config to see how the cannon could be improved

sadly I have no idea how to do this. I can't find anything about modifying vehicle weapons online. Anybody know a place where I could get some help on this?

[PuFu 4600]

yes, the editing section - addons | configs and scripts

[the_demongod 31]

yes, the editing section - addons | configs and scripts

I've been scouring the forums but the descriptions aren't great. The hardest part is learning how inheritance works, and how to know what to inherit from.

If you know how and could help me, that would be great. Here's my thread: http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?181267-reloadTime-with-A-164-Cannon

Edited July 30, 2014 by the_Demongod

[cym104 10]

As far as the targeting pod discussion is concerned I think there is a very real possibility to add it, particularly if you look at BI's efforts to implement ground stabilization in the UAVs. It's something i think would be very doable in an expansion or maybe even along the lines of the helicopters DLC. Targeting pods would make the CAS aircraft a great deal more capable and would open up self-designation for laser guided bombs and other ordnance. This was something i really appreciated in Mandoble's missile addon and i thought it added a lot of depth to an often overlooked aspect of gameplay.

That's why I like the js_jc F-18 mod, the premitive yet effective JDAM intergation couped with good A-G radar makes it a very handy solo machine.

[nuxil 2]

anyone else feel like the wipeout looks like a bad lod ? espesially the engines. :\ ?

[das attorney 858]

I've been scouring the forums but the descriptions aren't great. The hardest part is learning how inheritance works, and how to know what to inherit from.

If you know how and could help me, that would be great. Here's my thread: http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?181267-reloadTime-with-A-164-Cannon

Check the reply I just sent for solution.

[pils 49]

The 30mm Gatling is a nice weapon ... as last resort in case you fired everything else away :P

No seriously, I know the Devs tweaked it but it's still crap.

Main reasons:

- Lacks anti armor power. Even light armored vehicles, choppers and other fixed wing aircrafts take loads of hits to kill.

- Low rate of fire. Yea for Arma 3 the rate of fire is high, but compared to the real life counterpart it's nothing. I know about the engine limitation, but afaik there should be still quite some room for a higher RoF before the limits are reached.

- In Arma 3 all medium caliber cannons which fire HE rounds are too weak against infantry. Take the Mora and fire some 30mm HE at infantry. You need either direct hits or extremely close hits to kill infantry. You need like 4-5 hits of 30mm HE to kill infantry in case you hit ~0,5m away. Afaik the Wipeout 30mm is a bit better, but still too weak against infantry.

But oh well, the other fixed wing cannons are even worse. E.g. the Buzzard 20mm is imho a bad joke and completely useless. Especially because of the low rate of fire.

[the_demongod 31]

actually the rate of fire can be increased, it's not limited by the engine afaik.

class CfgWeapons {

class Default;

class CannonCore: Default {

class Mode_SemiAuto;

class Mode_FullAuto;

};

class Gatling_30mm_Plane_CAS_01_F: CannonCore {

class LowROF : Mode_FullAuto {

reloadTime = 0.015;

};

};

};

Use this config to create a little addon. You'll find that, although still not nearly as powerful as RL, at 4000 rpm the A-164's gun is a much more formidable weapon.

[carlostex 38]

With all due respect to Peral's work, i was trying his A-10C and i find the cannon rounds way overpowered. Maybe he based his values on default Arma 2 config. I'm not sure about that.

I did a little math to try and calculate the best hit value for the A-164 Wipeout cannon, currently is 80. This feels a little bit underpowered.

The hit value for the bullet B_30mm_APFSDS is: 120.

The hit value for the bullet B_30mm_HE is: 30.

I'm gonna use these as reference because the Wipeout bullets should be at least as good as 30mm APFSDS rounds due to their DU core.

In real life the GAU-8 uses a anti-armor combat mix ratio of five-to-one, in other words every six bullets the cannon fires the first five will be API and the sixth will be HEI. So because one round is HEI it's not fair to give the Gatling_30mm round the full 120 hit points. This is because the engine cannot simulate a magazine with mixed rounds and proper ratios.

So i calculated a balanced approach to this:

We're gonna divide the APFSDS hit points by the bullets in the combat mix:

120 / 6 = 20.

Now multiply the result by the number of (AP DU rounds in the combat mix: 5):

20 * 5 = 100.

OK so we have the hit points for the DU bullets, only the HE round is missing so same operation:

30 / 6 = 5.

Since the combat mix only has one HE round we only need to add 5 hit points to the total.

(API) (HEI)

100 + 5 = 105 total hit points

So in my opinion BIS should change the default value of 80 to 105.

I think this is a pretty fair change, and it should result great as i feel the soft vehicles and APC's take too much hits, before disabled/destroyed.

[the_demongod 31]

All you need to do is up the fire rate to 4000 RPM. This is the speed (3900 actually) that the A-10C's cannon fires at in real life. I made myself a mod that does this and only this and it makes the cannon far more effective against MRAPs, and makes killing APCs possible in a single pass if you are lucky and/or skilled. MBTs still can't be killed which is accurate (the A-10's gun was originally designed to kill tanks, but that was in the cold war = weak armor. It can no longer kill tanks easily with its gun and in the future the tanks will be even more resistant). Or perhaps a combination of increased firerate and damage.

To be honest I think it's the tanks that need to be made weaker; comparing Arma 3 to DCS, the APCs are realistically weak, but the tanks are way too strong in Arma. In DCS it is not easy to kill tanks, but shooting a 2 second burst (rather long) into the top of a tank at close-ish range (1 nm = ~2 km) can sometimes score a kill in one pass.

[five_seven5-7 56]

All you need to do is up the fire rate to 4000 RPM. This is the speed (3900 actually) that the A-10C's cannon fires at in real life. I made myself a mod that does this and only this and it makes the cannon far more effective against MRAPs, and makes killing APCs possible in a single pass if you are lucky and/or skilled. MBTs still can't be killed which is accurate (the A-10's gun was originally designed to kill tanks, but that was in the cold war = weak armor. It can no longer kill tanks easily with its gun and in the future the tanks will be even more resistant). Or perhaps a combination of increased firerate and damage.

To be honest I think it's the tanks that need to be made weaker; comparing Arma 3 to DCS, the APCs are realistically weak, but the tanks are way too strong in Arma. In DCS it is not easy to kill tanks, but shooting a 2 second burst (rather long) into the top of a tank at close-ish range (1 nm = ~2 km) can sometimes score a kill in one pass.

How´s cannon firing dispersion compared to DCS, shouldn't dispersion increase to include a better area when diving above enemies?

[carlostex 38]

All you need to do is up the fire rate to 4000 RPM. This is the speed (3900 actually) that the A-10C's cannon fires at in real life. I made myself a mod that does this and only this and it makes the cannon far more effective against MRAPs, and makes killing APCs possible in a single pass if you are lucky and/or skilled. MBTs still can't be killed which is accurate (the A-10's gun was originally designed to kill tanks, but that was in the cold war = weak armor. It can no longer kill tanks easily with its gun and in the future the tanks will be even more resistant). Or perhaps a combination of increased firerate and damage.

To be honest I think it's the tanks that need to be made weaker; comparing Arma 3 to DCS, the APCs are realistically weak, but the tanks are way too strong in Arma. In DCS it is not easy to kill tanks, but shooting a 2 second burst (rather long) into the top of a tank at close-ish range (1 nm = ~2 km) can sometimes score a kill in one pass.

Yep i am aware of rate of fire being too low. But i still feel the hit value is a bit low. Probably the combination of HP increase + RoF will provide the best experience. I'll probably try an addon myself.

[the_demongod 31]

How´s cannon firing dispersion compared to DCS, shouldn't dispersion increase to include a better area when diving above enemies?

I haven't done much testing to be honest. One major distance is the fact that the A-10C has CCIP allowing it to engage accurately at ranges up to 2 nautical miles (~3.7 km). In Arma it's pretty hard to engage at these ranges because we have to account for drop, etc.

And it varies a lot more in DCS than it does in Arma (if memory serves). In DCS the round dispersal is quite low at very close ranges, whereas at long ranges the bullets spread out all over the place as they slow down.

I certainly think that the splash damage should be greater, because the GAU-8/A in DCS kills infantry and light vehicles extremely easily, whereas in Arma it seems you need to get almost a direct hit on infantry to kill them. This is really hard now, but is much easier with my 4000rpm mod.

[das attorney 858]

This is really hard now, but is much easier with my 4000rpm mod.

You should re-read the comments by Fennek in this thread after the one where I made the mod config for you.

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?181267-reloadTime-with-A-164-Cannon&p=2743277&viewfull=1#post2743277

This wouldn't be a good solution for 90% of users imo.

Remember that the game can only fire one bullet per frame.

If your game is at 60fps, your fire rate will only be 3600rpm (60*60) so the last 400rpm is moot and the gun will never fire at 4000rpm. To put it in context, a lot of users report their FPS as between say 25 - 60 frames per second.

So their fire rate would vary between 1500 and 3600 rpm. Never the 4000. Ok so you could take the frame limiter off to get 4000rpm if your PC is really quick, but you aren't always guaranteed to get over 66 frames per sec required to keep the fire rate as advertised. Plus you will most likely get screen tearing if you use trackir which looks really shitty.

So by putting the fire rate that fast, you are actually reducing the effectiveness of the gun when lots of things are happening on your PC, so it's worse than it looks on paper.

This is why BIS lower the fire rate and supplement the damage accordingly. This way, the engine can be at a lower FPS (as not all users can keep frame rate consistently high) and the gun will perform roughly the same whether fps is low or high.

Upping the fire rate is only good if your PC can reliably keep the 66 frames per second when firing. Otherwise the gun can end up crappier in a lot of situations.

You could experiment with the "submunition" ammo class, but BIS tried that for their miniguns and there were framerate and or network problems in MP

[the_demongod 31]

This wouldn't be a good solution for 90% of users imo.

Remember that the game can only fire one bullet per frame.

If your game is at 60fps, your fire rate will only be 3600rpm (60*60) so the last 400rpm is moot and the gun will never fire at 4000rpm. To put it in context, a lot of users report their FPS as between say 25 - 60 frames per second.

I remember that conversation, but I think the config on the Wipeout's gun somehow circumvents this issue. I definitely know what you mean when we're talking miniguns such as the M134s on the AH-9, when my fps is low I get horrible firerates.

But I think the way the wipeout's gun spawns rounds in bursts prevents this from happening. I have never noticed the rounds being limited by the fps, and I do not have a high-end computer by any standards (I usually run between 25-40 fps).

[das attorney 858]

The burst limiter is a entry just to standardise the amount of projectiles per burst and nothing more. The same config entry as on SMG's and so on to make a 3 round burst.

You can test if you want by adding a "fired" eventhandler to the Wipeout and checking the time stamp for each round. It's totally dependent on FPS from what I've seen.

[the_demongod 31]

The burst limiter is a entry just to standardise the amount of projectiles per burst and nothing more. The same config entry as on SMG's and so on to make a 3 round burst.

You can test if you want by adding a "fired" eventhandler to the Wipeout and checking the time stamp for each round. It's totally dependent on FPS from what I've seen.

Maybe it's not 4000 rpm, but my FPS usually fluctuates a lot (especially on Altis) and I don't really notice it affect the RPM, but I shall test it more.