ASR AI 3

[lordprimate 159]

Fuck yea

[Raptorstzx 10]

Well, i'm gonna try again!

Thanks for the reply and the new version too!

[madjosch 12]

May I politely ask about vehicle AI improvement progress as discussed here ?

It would be a huge help for many people I guess. Also ASR_AI could become 'THE ONE' AI mod for every use.

[seba1976 98]

Thanks for the update! Can't wait to try it.

---------- Post added at 08:43 ---------- Previous post was at 08:41 ----------

It would be a huge help for many people I guess. Also ASR_AI could become 'THE ONE' AI mod for every use.

It already is, mate. :cool:

[Robalo 465]

May I politely ask about vehicle AI improvement progress as discussed here ?

It would be a huge help for many people I guess. Also ASR_AI could become 'THE ONE' AI mod for every use.

I'm not sure what exactly is wrong in order to apply fixes for the vehicles. At least I did not come up across anything obvious. Given in Arma3 they're all advanced vehicles with thermals and fire control systems it is expected they are very deadly so I don't know if I want to go into finer tweaking for them. But of course, if you point out some obvious issue that I might be able to address with a quick fix, no problem doing it.

Adjusting the number/types of the vehicles in a mission might be a better solution instead of dumbing their capabilities.

[autigergrad 2034]

New version is up.

Enjoy!

Outfreakingstanding.

Thank you sir. Anxious to try this out when I get home from work today.

[raptoer 66]

Is that a vanilla issue ? I'm not worried, I don't rely solely on danger.fsm or the ammo configs for bullet detection.

I don't think we can really change how danger.fsm gets called, the engine handles that.

I'm actually working on a modification of ASR AI, and I have looked through most of the code. I have noticed that you seem to use diag_ticktime, which I'm pretty sure is incorrect in these instances. diag_ticktime gives wall time, but if either the server lags or I alt-tab in single player, this will be desynchronized with game time, thus producing unexpected behavior.

I intend to modify the way the AI react to danger, and leave everything else as is. Right now I have a design for what I want them to do, and a much fancier cover selection algorithm. It uses the models instead of asking the engine to find an empty position. I am worried that my cover selection algorithm might be too slow though, as it uses line intersections with objects, and will use on average about 10 per piece of cover evaluated, but it could be much more for certain pieces of cover. Fancier is not always better with these kinds of things.

I would have never considered trying to make an AI mod without ASR AI to use as a base, and perhaps some of my ideas will end up being merged into it later. I've forked the project on github, but I don't know how fast my changes will come in, my time has been stretched rather thin lately.

[Azza FHI 50]

@Robalo - thanks for the update! we just had a popup error, it must be ASR coz that is the only thing that changed recently.

http://imgur.com/cPdAlD2

Also, the problem with AI being a bit dumber on HC is still a problem after 1.48, especially when reacting to nearby bullet impacts (i.e not reacting at all)

see the last post of this thread for more http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?183918-Dedicated-Client-Headless-Client-feedback-(dev-branch)&p=2964008&viewfull=1#post2964008

[spyderblack723 407]

@Robalo - thanks for the update! we just had a popup error, it must be ASR coz that is the only thing that changed recently.

http://imgur.com/cPdAlD2

Also, the problem with AI being a bit dumber on HC is still a problem after 1.48, especially when reacting to nearby bullet impacts (i.e not reacting at all)

see the last post of this thread for more http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?183918-Dedicated-Client-Headless-Client-feedback-(dev-branch)&p=2964008&viewfull=1#post2964008

It's not just HC's, been experiencing the same thing every once in awhile on my local dedicated server. Edited July 26, 2015 by SpyderBlack723

[Azza FHI 50]

hmm, perhaps, but in our test missions any AI that are on the dedi server and not HC react perfectly everytime. 1 bullet impact near their feet and they go crazy looking for the shooter. In the exact same scenario but with the AI group passed to the HC, you can shoot 20+ rounds and they do nothing. They only react when you hit them, and after that they seem fairly normal

[phronk 898]

Great scenario of ASR AI at work:

I was firing at a squad patrolling and then took cover behind a wall. They knew where I was, but of course lost visual after I was behind the wall. However, they still decided to toss a grenade over the fucking wall and killed me. They used their prior knowledge of me going behind the wall and figured I'd be dumb enough to still be there (And they were right) and decided to use a grenade. Very cool. ArmA 3 is always surprising me, 2000+ hours in...

[tourist 617]

Hi Robalo,

I've been using your essential mod since A2/OA and was glad to see an ASR AI for A3 as well. Back in A2/OA I had what I'd call a "Perfect+Believable Difficulty Balance" achieved by combining ASR AI with Ace2, a customized GL 4 and some pbos from COSLX.

In A3, there also is ASR AI, a Group link mod, an ACE3 in the making and meanwhile AGM or CSE as appetizer. So far so good. But recently I had some very frustrating Single Player missions where I was hit with pinpoint accuracy by AI, through bushes and high grass whereas I couldn't see shit despite using your cool mod and I wondered about the right profile settings in ArmA3Profile.

Is it still possible to set different values for friendly and enemy AI like in A2 via the profile or not? Some say yes, some no, some say you can do so for servers - but what about SP? Is there a combination of the new settings with the old ones advised or are they mutually exclusive and alternatives to each other? Here's what I have now for regular difficulty; I didn't change the other difficulties:

};

class regular

{

class Flags

{

Armor=0;

FriendlyTag=1;

EnemyTag=0;

MineTag=1;

HUD=1;

HUDPerm=0;

HUDWp=1;

HUDWpPerm=0;

HUDGroupInfo=1;

StanceIndicator=1;

AutoSpot=1;

Map=1;

WeaponCursor=1;

ClockIndicator=1;

3rdPersonView=1;

CameraShake=1;

UnlimitedSaves=1;

DeathMessages=1;

NetStats=1;

VonID=1;

};

aiLevelPreset=3;

skillFriendly=1;

precisionFriendly=0.5;

skillEnemy=1;

precisionEnemy=0.30000001;

skillAI=0.69999999;

precisionAI=0.30000001;

Which setting will be applied ingame? Is it necessary to combine them or, to the contrary, does it make the settings ineffective? What still works in Sp, what not?

Hope you can clarify which settings can be used in conjunction with ASR AI,

tourist

[domokun 515]

Back in A2/OA I had what I'd call a "Perfect+Believable Difficulty Balance" achieved by combining ASR AI with Ace2, a customized GL 4 and some pbos from COSLX.

As someone who still enjoys CO and loves tinkering with mods, AI mods in particular, I'd be very interested in your balance.

Any chance that you could share your lit of PBO and config values?

PM if you're worrying about hijacking this thread.

[Azza FHI 50]

A few patches ago BI changed the AI skill system in the profile that you are referring to.

These values are obsolete

skillFriendly=1;
precisionFriendly=0.5;
skillEnemy=1;
precisionEnemy=0.30000001;

These are the values that are used

skillAI=0.69999999;
precisionAI=0.30000001;

You will notice the different preset numbers "ailevelpreset=3;" with the other difficulties. It must be set to 3, as is yours, in order for the custom values to take effect.

What we have found for a well skilled and challenging AI suited for 20 players in game is as follows:

NOTE- We do not use zoomed optics bigger than 2x, this is a big factor. It makes the game too easy no matter how hard the AI are.

1. Server profile

AiLevelPreset=3;
skillAI=1;
precisionAI=0.6;

2. ASR settings

General = 1, aiming = 5, spotting =7

3. You MUST set the "general" skill level of AI via script to 1 or move each units skill slider to full in 2d editor (same thing). This is different to the 'general' skill that ASR changes. Setting the general pto max plays a major role in how smart the AI are, and ASR does not change this 'general' skill.

You can do this by:

Init.sqf

{_x setskill "general"} foreach allunits;
[/Code]

Or similar

This is what we have found over the past year of tweaking, i hope it helps someone else.

[seba1976 98]

@Azer1234: I was under the impression that, when using ASR_AI, the individual skill slider for units you put in the 2D editor didn't matter at all...

[Azza FHI 50]

I also thought this, untill we found that it wasnt being overwritten. Then i asked in this thread and robalo confirmed that the original "general" does not get overwritten.

The "general" that asr refers to is actually only changing 'courage','reloadspeed', and 'commanding'.

Thats correct robalo?

[Robalo 465]

I don't think we can really change how danger.fsm gets called, the engine handles that.

I'm actually working on a modification of ASR AI, and I have looked through most of the code. I have noticed that you seem to use diag_ticktime, which I'm pretty sure is incorrect in these instances. diag_ticktime gives wall time, but if either the server lags or I alt-tab in single player, this will be desynchronized with game time, thus producing unexpected behavior.

Please explain, why is it incorrect ? It's not like I'm comparing apples with oranges, it's diag_ticktime (now) versus diag_ticktime (later) just to check for some time passed. I think I used this because there were issues with the time command in certain situations but can't remember what exactly. I need to understand the issue and see if it really needs a fix.

I intend to modify the way the AI react to danger, and leave everything else as is. Right now I have a design for what I want them to do, and a much fancier cover selection algorithm. It uses the models instead of asking the engine to find an empty position. I am worried that my cover selection algorithm might be too slow though, as it uses line intersections with objects, and will use on average about 10 per piece of cover evaluated, but it could be much more for certain pieces of cover. Fancier is not always better with these kinds of things.

I would have never considered trying to make an AI mod without ASR AI to use as a base, and perhaps some of my ideas will end up being merged into it later. I've forked the project on github, but I don't know how fast my changes will come in, my time has been stretched rather thin lately.

Sounds good, curious to see what you will do.

---------- Post added at 18:10 ---------- Previous post was at 17:58 ----------

@Robalo - thanks for the update! we just had a popup error, it must be ASR coz that is the only thing that changed recently.

http://imgur.com/cPdAlD2

Also, the problem with AI being a bit dumber on HC is still a problem after 1.48, especially when reacting to nearby bullet impacts (i.e not reacting at all)

see the last post of this thread for more http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?183918-Dedicated-Client-Headless-Client-feedback-(dev-branch)&p=2964008&viewfull=1#post2964008

Problem seems old and vanilla, was it ever ticketed ? I haven't used a HC in a while. From the last post it seems the AI on HC has enough knowledge but they just don't act on it. So not even my extra fired EH hearing aids would help.

[kecharles28 197]

Updated mod v0.9.26 available at withSIX. Download now by clicking:

[Robalo 465]

It's not just HC's, been experiencing the same thing every once in awhile on my local dedicated server.

Check the server FPS when that happens, it's probably too low.

Hi Robalo,

I've been using your essential mod since A2/OA and was glad to see an ASR AI for A3 as well. Back in A2/OA I had what I'd call a "Perfect+Believable Difficulty Balance" achieved by combining ASR AI with Ace2, a customized GL 4 and some pbos from COSLX.

In A3, there also is ASR AI, a Group link mod, an ACE3 in the making and meanwhile AGM or CSE as appetizer. So far so good. But recently I had some very frustrating Single Player missions where I was hit with pinpoint accuracy by AI, through bushes and high grass whereas I couldn't see shit despite using your cool mod and I wondered about the right profile settings in ArmA3Profile.

Is it still possible to set different values for friendly and enemy AI like in A2 via the profile or not? Some say yes, some no, some say you can do so for servers - but what about SP? Is there a combination of the new settings with the old ones advised or are they mutually exclusive and alternatives to each other? Here's what I have now for regular difficulty; I didn't change the other difficulties:

aiLevelPreset=3;

skillFriendly=1;

precisionFriendly=0.5;

skillEnemy=1;

precisionEnemy=0.30000001;

skillAI=0.69999999;

precisionAI=0.30000001;

Which setting will be applied ingame? Is it necessary to combine them or, to the contrary, does it make the settings ineffective? What still works in Sp, what not?

Hope you can clarify which settings can be used in conjunction with ASR AI,

tourist

The ones in red are useless, it's just one setting now. I gave my preferred settings only few posts ago (preset 1 or skill 0.7, precision 0.5). Even after achieving balance, frustrating situations will still happen when you feel the AI are cheating. But that should not be the norm.

I also thought this, untill we found that it wasnt being overwritten. Then i asked in this thread and robalo confirmed that the original "general" does not get overwritten.

The "general" that asr refers to is actually only changing 'courage','reloadspeed', and 'commanding'.

Thats correct robalo?

Correct. Did you see the general skill have a big impact ? I did not want to run another setskill command just to redistribute a value to the other subskills. Plus it is nice to leave one extra tuning option available via that slider, even if it's just for the "general" skill.

Edited July 27, 2015 by Robalo

[jcae2798 132]

I havent tried the update yet, but been experiencing odd behavior i thought it would best be checked here (AI experts :P)

Very randomly i have AI units assigned in my group that jump out vehicle after asking them to board (they board and then right away get out). I have not been able to pin point why this is. It seems maybe after some firefights they will not board the same vehicle. Damage is not the problem as even if i repair (if there was damage) or manually set damage to 0, they still do the same behavior. If i spawn a new car however, they board and stay in it just fine. Any ideas? Would it be related to ASR? This is in SP.

Thanks all

EDIT

I should add if i recruit new AI they will board and stay just fine. It's only existing AI.

Edited July 27, 2015 by JCae2798

[tourist 617]

@Robalo: thank you for clearing up my confusion.

@domokun: I sent you a PM with my A2 AI modlist and userconfigs for these mods.

Edited July 27, 2015 by tourist
double posting

[soulis6 24]

It might be related JCae, but i was just about to post that I've been seeing some strange behavior with AI and ASR lately. I'm not sure if it's solely because of ASR, as i've also got ACE, TFAR, Blastcore, and a couple others going, but it definitely stops if I turn off ASR.

What I am seeing is:

-After placing enemy AI in the editor and starting, or placing them via Zeus, they will stand/move normally for little bit, but then suddenly turn and move towards some invisible waypoint for a few seconds, then stop play the 'grab' animation, like they were collecting ammo from some invisible box.

-This was causing weird/bad side effects, like them leaving vehicles to try and 'rearm' or whatever they're doing, or running from the rest of their squad before returning.

-Sometimes after this they will go back to their starting locations, and sometimes they would just hang around this new location, and keep returning to there even if they were ordered somewhere else.

-Was seeing them also just randomly and for no discernible reason face one direction and one direction only. If I gave them a new waypoint or forcibly rotated them in Zeus they would just turn right back around to watch that direction again.

I have no idea what might be causing this, and it's possible ASR isn't to fault, but like I said, these issues did go away when I turned off ASR and kept everything else the same.

Love ASR btw, just wanted to see if anyone else has seen this or if it's a known issue, or if it's just some special mix of mods I have that's causing this.

[autigergrad 2034]

It might be related JCae, but i was just about to post that I've been seeing some strange behavior with AI and ASR lately. I'm not sure if it's solely because of ASR, as i've also got ACE, TFAR, Blastcore, and a couple others going, but it definitely stops if I turn off ASR.

What I am seeing is:

-After placing enemy AI in the editor and starting, or placing them via Zeus, they will stand/move normally for little bit, but then suddenly turn and move towards some invisible waypoint for a few seconds, then stop play the 'grab' animation, like they were collecting ammo from some invisible box.

-This was causing weird/bad side effects, like them leaving vehicles to try and 'rearm' or whatever they're doing, or running from the rest of their squad before returning.

-Sometimes after this they will go back to their starting locations, and sometimes they would just hang around this new location, and keep returning to there even if they were ordered somewhere else.

-Was seeing them also just randomly and for no discernible reason face one direction and one direction only. If I gave them a new waypoint or forcibly rotated them in Zeus they would just turn right back around to watch that direction again.

I have no idea what might be causing this, and it's possible ASR isn't to fault, but like I said, these issues did go away when I turned off ASR and kept everything else the same.

Love ASR btw, just wanted to see if anyone else has seen this or if it's a known issue, or if it's just some special mix of mods I have that's causing this.

It might be ACE. My group played last night with ASR, Blastcore, and TFAR and the AI worked beautifully.

I'm actually VERY impressed with the lastest version. I'm running regular difficulty and it was nice not having T-800 terminators that spot you 10000 meters away..in woods....in a snowstorm...at night...with one bad eye....and then proceed to kill you with one shot.

I think there is a very nice balance with this latest version. Kudos to Robalo.

[Iroquois-Plissken 10]

It's impossible for me to load a save when ASR_AI is activated, is this normal ?

Thanks for the awesome work !

[Azza FHI 50]

Check the server FPS when that happens, it's probably too low.

The ones in red are useless, it's just one setting now. I gave my preferred settings only few posts ago (preset 1 or skill 0.7, precision 0.5). Even after achieving balance, frustrating situations will still happen when you feel the AI are cheating. But that should not be the norm.

Correct. Did you see the general skill have a big impact ? I did not want to run another setskill command just to redistribute a value to the other subskills. Plus it is nice to leave one extra tuning option available via that slider, even if it's just for the "general" skill.

The general skill seemed to make a fair bit of difference. Our theory to creating tealistic AI is simple, have everything maxed out to 1 except aiming and spotting. This way they are very aggressive and smart, but dont have terminator accuracy.

---------- Post added at 07:22 ---------- Previous post was at 07:19 ----------

It might be related JCae, but i was just about to post that I've been seeing some strange behavior with AI and ASR lately. I'm not sure if it's solely because of ASR, as i've also got ACE, TFAR, Blastcore, and a couple others going, but it definitely stops if I turn off ASR.

What I am seeing is:

-After placing enemy AI in the editor and starting, or placing them via Zeus, they will stand/move normally for little bit, but then suddenly turn and move towards some invisible waypoint for a few seconds, then stop play the 'grab' animation, like they were collecting ammo from some invisible box.

-This was causing weird/bad side effects, like them leaving vehicles to try and 'rearm' or whatever they're doing, or running from the rest of their squad before returning.

-Sometimes after this they will go back to their starting locations, and sometimes they would just hang around this new location, and keep returning to there even if they were ordered somewhere else.

-Was seeing them also just randomly and for no discernible reason face one direction and one direction only. If I gave them a new waypoint or forcibly rotated them in Zeus they would just turn right back around to watch that direction again.

I have no idea what might be causing this, and it's possible ASR isn't to fault, but like I said, these issues did go away when I turned off ASR and kept everything else the same.

Love ASR btw, just wanted to see if anyone else has seen this or if it's a known issue, or if it's just some special mix of mods I have that's causing this.

Turn off AI rearming by setting it to 0 in ASR userconfig, if you dont want them to rearm when they think they need to