Ukraine General

[arttem 1]

Not exactly related to Ukraine situation, but writing sober minded and meaning Miloš Zeman is very funny. Try to find Miloš Zeman drunk (or "opilý") on youtube. :D

It's a legal president of the country. And it's his words. Many people here post many things from doubtful sources. And it's ok. Whats the problem? It's not important for me what he is doing outside his working hours.

[derk yall 0]

I mentioned it to lighten up the discution. He was drunk during his working hours, that's the funny part. No need to be so grumpy.

[mistyronin 1181]

( BBC ) Deadly clashes at Ukraine port base as leaders meet

About 300 separatists attacked a military unit in Mariupol near the Azov Sea, throwing petrol bombs. Troops opened fire, killing three, Mr Avakov said.

The operation is continuing - Ukraine has sent in reinforcements including helicopters. There was no independent confirmation of his statement.

According to Mr Avakov, 13 of the attackers were wounded and so far 63 have been detained. He said none of the interior ministry troops had been killed.

It is the heaviest casualty toll in any single incident so far in eastern Ukraine.

Edited April 17, 2014 by MistyRonin

[arttem 1]

Live with Putin.

Here anybody can ask question http://www.moskva-putinu.ru/#page/question

Sry it seems there is no parallel translation. Live:

[Tonci87 163]

Live with Putin.

Here anybody can ask question http://www.moskva-putinu.ru/#page/question

Sry it seems there is no parallel translation. Live:

How does it work, can anybody send in questions or can only those in the studio ask?

[arttem 1]

How does it work, can anybody send in questions or can only those in the studio ask?

Anybody. Usually he starts to answer interesting questions close to the end.

http://i.imgur.com/JWAdSf5.png (104 kB)

[mistyronin 1181]

Live with Putin.

Here anybody can ask question http://www.moskva-putinu.ru/#page/question

But that's quite a typical PR strategy, even a lot of dictators had similar programs.

In fact even in countries like Finland or Sweden they only answer the questions that they want and how they want.

Russian media was switched off in last month there. Whats wrong with Kremlin again?

Yeah that's why even in the nazi concentration camps some jews could listen to the BBC... ( there is an awesome Auschwitz Anthropology study published in the book "En el corazon de la zona gris", in Spanish but, where you can find more info about that ).

Even in the opaque North Korea foreign media find its ways.

Edited April 17, 2014 by MistyRonin

[Tonci87 163]

Well it would be very nice if someone finds a source where they translate questions and his answers.

[arttem 1]

Well it would be very nice if someone finds a source where they translate questions and his answers.

Going forward, I can say, that you can now officially call "polite people", that took part in the Crimean operations - the Russian military. :)

[mistyronin 1181]

From @lennutrajektoor Tweet:

Vladimir Putin: #Odessa wasn't part of #Ukraine until 1920. Meanwhile in Odessa.

[Rydygier 1309]

What German press think about Polish thoughts about Russia regarding to situation in Ukraine... :)

In occupied for centuries, partly by Russia, Poland, the fears of invasion are particularly high. Warsaw wants at the same time also, of course, make on the Ukrainian crisis a political capital.

Poland will not receive the next days the expected 10 thousand of Nato troops. Warsaw greatly enjoys, however, announced by Anders Fogh Rasmussensa increase the presence of NATO troops.

In late March, Foreign Minister Radoslaw Sikorski demanded displacement into Poland two battalions (sic!) (about 10 thousand. Soldiers) ", reminiscent of the" Tagesspiegel ". Poland was also the initiator of convening in early March, the NATO Council and invoking Article 4 of the Washington Treaty has led to recognition of security threats by Russia.

Should be "brigades", I think...

"The background for this is the widespread belief of Polish politicians that "little green men" in Ukraine, are the the Russian soldiers," writes the capital city newspaper. In this context, in its opinion, is becoming more actual thesis of deceased tragically in a plane crash near Smolensk Polish President Lech Kaczynski.

"In the summer of 2008, when the Russian army marched into Georgia, Kaczynski went in solidarity with the presidents of the Baltic States and the then President of Ukraine Viktor Yushchenko to Tbilisi, where he announced that after the Georgia Russia can attack the Ukraine, then Poland", recalls "Tagesspiegel ".

Journal explains that the fear of a Russian invasion led to an increase in acceptance in Poland, broad-based weapons program provided for 2022. Investments in the modernization of the Polish army is expected to be in the next eight years, 25 billion of Euro.

Retrofitted to be mostly obsolete air and missile defense systems. According to the "Tagesspiegel", today Poland spends on armaments 1.95 percent of GDP, more than Germany (1.3 percent), but far less than in Russia (4.4 percent).

---------- Post added at 15:15 ---------- Previous post was at 14:29 ----------

http://wiadomosci.dziennik.pl/swiat/artykuly/456497,barack-obama-rosja-nie-chce-wojny-wie-ze-jestesmy-silniejsi.html

Russia is not interested in any confrontation with the United States, because it understand that our troops have a significant advantage over the Russian. We do not need war. What we need is the recognition that countries such as Ukraine can maintain relations with its all neighbors and no one, neither Russia nor the United States will not decide in this case for Ukrainians - said U.S. President Barack Obama in a television interview.

What consistently repeated that when every time Russia will take this kind of steps to destabilize the situation in Ukraine and the violation of its sovereignty will bear the consequences. We can already see that the Russian economy is weakening, capital flows from Russia. Mr Putin's decisions are bad not only for Ukraine, but also in the long term for Russia - said Obama.

---------- Post added at 16:52 ---------- Previous post was at 15:15 ----------

Yatsenyuk: Putin again tells fairy tales

According to Ukrainian politician Russia runs today one game, going on further tightening of the situation, taking over foreign territories and further provocations. He estimated also that Kiev has irrefutable evidence on presence of Russian troops in Ukraine. - On the World is only one man who believes that there is no Russian troops on the east. His name is Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin - he said.

He recalled that when the Russians have made military aggression in the Crimea, Putin also said that there are no Russian troops. - Today officially admitted that his troops were there, however. Today again tells a fairy tale that is it's not his saboteurs built terrorist network in Ukraine - said.

[arttem 1]

The heads of diplomatic missions in Geneva to discuss the document on exit from the Ukrainian crisis.

GENEVA, 17 April. /ITAR-TASS/.

http://itar-tass.com/mezhdunarodnaya-panorama/1129273

Heads of diplomatic departments of the Russian Federation, the USA and the EU develop in Geneva document on exit from the Ukrainian crisis.

This was reported by ITAR-TASS a source in the Western delegation.

"At the moment, the meeting continued without the participation of the Ukrainian side, - said the Agency interlocutor. - The sides are discussing a specific document on the way out of the current Ukrainian crisis."

[spooky lynx 73]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mp0PWQKG7o4

Kramatorsk, soldier opened fire at the side of protesters who tried to stop advancing column. Several protesters were wounded, some civil cars were slightly damaged by bullets.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Well, we don't see the soldier firing at the civilians, just over them. Anyway it's time for Ukrainian army to show what side they are on, they have been humiliated enough.

Edited April 17, 2014 by ProfTournesol

[Beagle 684]

last time someone shot at civilians the ukrainians brought down the government..oh wait...thats was against their constitution anyway so why schuld the Putschist Junta care about it. Double standards at its best.

[ProfTournesol 956]

last time someone shot at civilians the ukrainians brought down the government..oh wait...thats was against their constitution anyway so why schuld the Putschist Junta care about it. Double standards at its best.

Come on, do you see snipers shooting at protesters ? Protesters abducted and tortured ? Unless being blind, i don't see any double standard here, even if that's what Putin would like us to think, with his handful of radical protesters and Astan veterans.

[Beagle 684]

Come on, do you see snipers shooting at protesters ? Protesters abducted and tortured ? Unless being blind, i don't see any double standard here, even if that's what Putin would like us to think, with his handful of radical protesters and Astan veterans.

The sniper that started the shooting at Maidan were those shooting from Hotel Ukainia...the Putschischst Headquarters.

The current government are Terrorist now fighting Separatist. Ladt time something like this happened the US invaded Afghanistan. No, I see no difference here.

In Ukraine they are trying to fight the Devil by using Beelzebub as we use to way.

[arttem 1]

Nice ready-to-eat meals was send there.

Edited April 17, 2014 by ArtTem

[ProfTournesol 956]

Wonderful. And what did he say ?

[akm74 1]

look like CNN changing it stance first....

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/world/2014/04/17/pkg-black-ukraine-pro-russians-in-control.cnn.html

[arttem 1]

Wonderful. And what did he say ?

Explain to Ukrainian marines, how to use that equipment and weapons. At the beginnig he is telling that he have that buisness for 15 years. And never worked before with Ukrainian army. He was always working with structures like PMCs. He is saying that he is Ukrainian, from Ukraine.

Edited April 17, 2014 by ArtTem

[spooky lynx 73]

Well, we don't see the soldier firing at the civilians, just over them. Anyway it's time for Ukrainian army to show what side they are on, they have been humiliated enough.

That's why I've written "at the side of protesters" (maybe wrong phrase in English).

[mistyronin 1181]

It seems that the Pro-Russian Government in Donetsk is asking jews to register.

( Think Progress ) Someone Is Ordering Eastern Ukraine’s Jews To ‘Register’

Also in the BBC: Deal to 'de-escalate' agreed in Geneva

Mr Lavrov said the crisis must be settled by Ukrainians themselves and there must be long-term constitutional reforms.

Mr Kerry said the extent of the crisis had been highlighted in recent days by the "grotesque" sending of notices to Jews in eastern Ukraine, demanding that they register themselves as Jewish.

- - - - - -

Some more information about the subject.

The heads of diplomatic missions in Geneva to discuss the document on exit from the Ukrainian crisis.

Geneva Statement of April 17, 2014

The Geneva meeting on the situation in Ukraine agreed on initial concrete steps to de-escalate tensions and restore security for all citizens.

All sides must refrain from any violence, intimidation or provocative actions. The participants strongly condemned and rejected all expressions of extremism, racism and religious intolerance, including anti-semitism.

All illegal armed groups must be disarmed; all illegally seized buildings must be returned to legitimate owners; all illegally occupied streets, squares and other public places in Ukrainian cities and towns must be vacated.

Amnesty will be granted to protestors and to those who have left buildings and other public places and surrendered weapons, with the exception of those found guilty of capital crimes.

It was agreed that the OSCE Special Monitoring Mission should play a leading role in assisting Ukrainian authorities and local communities in the immediate implementation of these de-escalation measures wherever they are needed most, beginning in the coming days. The U.S., E.U. and Russia commit to support this mission, including by providing monitors.

The announced constitutional process will be inclusive, transparent and accountable. It will include the immediate establishment of a broad national dialogue, with outreach to all of Ukraine’s regions and political constituencies, and allow for the consideration of public comments and proposed amendments.

The participants underlined the importance of economic and financial stability in Ukraine and would be ready to discuss additional support as the above steps are implemented.

- - - - - - - -

last time someone shot at civilians the ukrainians brought down the government..oh wait...thats was against their constitution anyway so why schuld the Putschist Junta care about it. Double standards at its best.

We will have to see if they were civilians or militia ( armed civilians ). But that's one of the reasons why I would personally like UN peacekeepers to keep the security in the conflict zones.

I wouldn't like the idea of an army shooting against unarmed civilians, there are other ways to control riots.

Edited April 17, 2014 by MistyRonin

[akm74 1]

It seems that the Pro-Russian Government in Donetsk is asking jews to register.

Great. Seems like plane "A" just fail for Kiev completely..:)

[arttem 1]

Statements Lavrov in Geneva shortly. From that live:

Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov at a press conference in Geneva said that the negotiating parties have agreed about the following:

- Disarmament of all illegal armed groups.

- Release of all illegally occupied the building and the transfer of control of a legitimate owners.

- Release of all streets and squares.

- Amnesty of all protesters, except those who committed serious crimes.

- Immediate start a broad national dialogue, which includes all of the region and all political forces, in the framework of the constitutional process.

- To implement all of these measures are already working in Ukraine, the OSCE mission will receive special powers (will play a leading role).

- To solve all the problems should the Ukrainians themselves.

As Lavrov said:

- Russia is ready to discuss support for efforts to restore the economy of Ukraine as the implementation of those steps.

- Russia gave to parties the documents adopted by the Presidium of the "Party of regions", the Lugansk regional Council and the "movement of the South-East".

- Change the neutral status of Kyiv (EU, NATO) will undermine efforts to normalize the situation in Ukraine.

Crimea has no relation to the issues discussed at the conference in Geneva, as a part of Russia.

- Negotiations continue in different formats.