Vehicle Handling

[Smurf 12]

I think the subject deserves it's own thread.

I found out it was greatly improved in the last stable release, really enjoying just cruising around now. Of course it isn't perfect (brakes, handbrakes, overall lunar fell) but it is on the right track.

[Bee8190 10]

I'm not expecting sim-race simulator in mil-simulator but I hope driving vehicles will be far more satisfying in A3. Arma 2's physx weren't that atrocious except tanks flipping and these kind of quirks were...funny. I'd like to see improvements in suspension, making it more visually noticeable as well adding feel to it while driving faster over bumps but I hope gone will be the civilian 4x4 extremely bad climbing abilities. I don't think even the ATV needs to slow down any at all

As of the sync with gears / engine, I'm not sure why is it the exactly same as in arma 2 but that will surely get fixed. What I hope the most though is that engine RPM will got to high RPM's under load, like when climbing, and not lower. Period

Edited April 19, 2013 by Bee8190

[nodunit 397]

PhysX alone isn't going to really be enough for bumps and things of that nature, there needs to be audio feedback as well, and that goes part in part with what you said about the engine being defined based on power rather than speed.

[EDcase 87]

Vehicles certainly feel much better than ARMA2. Especially with the latest Dev build that makes them less floaty when going over small bumps at speed.

They still have the feeling of lack of power though.

I think on maximum power ('e' or 'w'+turbo) the wheels should spin until traction is gained depending on surface.

On grass traction would never be gained and the vehicle should slide. On gravel and tarmac it should do a little burnout and then get a grip as it starts to move forward. Obviously more slidy on gravel.

Also I think vehicles should slide/skid more when turning on grass/gravel and only do the tipping over on tarmac or occasionally on grass/gravel.

[heruon 1]

Handling is way better than A2, but there's still alot to tweak. Imo, the suspension is too stiff and the hunter and ifrit are not top heavy enough. Driving at full speed at the airport it's a challenge to achieve a rollover. Braking from +100km/h I would expect the weight to shift more to the front wheels.

And yes please, more torque, especially at the starting moment.

[dm 9]

As of the sync with gears / engine, I'm not sure why is it the exactly same as in arma 2 but that will surely get fixed. What I hope the most though is that engine RPM will got to high RPM's under load, like when climbing, and not lower. Period

But thats just the point, it isnt like it was in A2.

The sounds are not amazing, that I will agree with. Infact, they are pretty pathetic.

But if you watch the rev counter in the cab while climbing steep slopes, you'll see that it sits on 3000 - 4000 RPM (which is pretty high for a diesel engine) while you climb the slope.

I think if the vehicle HUD for drivers had more feedback about what gear you were in and what rpm you were doing, these sort of things would become a lot clearer.

Remember, having a real gearbox doesnt automagically mean you can zoom around up the steepest of slopes...

[heruon 1]

The sounds are not amazing, that I will agree with. Infact, they are pretty pathetic.

But if you watch the rev counter in the cab while climbing steep slopes, you'll see that it sits on 3000 - 4000 RPM (which is pretty high for a diesel engine) while you climb the slope.

Yes, I've noticed that driving feels alot better without sound. I guess it may have to do with the sound not matching the rpm.

[Zorg_DK 10]

The vehicle handling needs A LOT of work for sure.

[Lucasmnunesk 2]

Especially the mouse controls, they are weird

[gossamersolid 155]

The wheels on wheeled vehicles really need some more strength to them. I love going offroading with the vehicles in A3, but you can pop the tires so easily. I could see damaging them, but they shouldn't pop if you brush a rock.

[Smurf 12]

The wheels on wheeled vehicles really need some more strength to them. I love going offroading with the vehicles in A3, but you can pop the tires so easily. I could see damaging them, but they shouldn't pop if you brush a rock.

Yeah, was watching an AI driving around and it hit a rock straight on (!), the only thing that was damaged were both front wheels. Weird.

[DaRkL3AD3R 1]

I think part of the problem with vehicle physics in Arma is that we have such a fine level of realism and authenticity in the infantry portion of the game that when we get in a vehicle, we expect that authenticity to continue. Unfortunately it's not that simple and driving physics are a tough thing to nail down in virtual reality. The closest I've seen to proper driving physics came in the form of Grand Theft Auto 4, a game built around vehicles as a primary element. Arma is unlikely to achieve anything remotely close to proper vehicle physics as the devs have mentioned that infantry is the focus of Arma, and that vehicles are really just there to complete the package.

But believe me, I would love to see more responsive transmissions, beefier engines, and actual bouncing of the suspension as you traverse the land. Right now vehicles in Arma feel like shoebox cars just floating around on the ground with no suspension at all. And the way the automatic transmissions work is just really frustrating. It's one thing for the hefty diesel engine based vehicles to be shifting early, but the Off-road and ATV should be pushing closer to red line and getting more torque and horsepower to the wheels. There's no excuse why a 700lb ATV can't zoom up a hill even from a stand still.

[Bee8190 10]

mentioned infantry is the focus of Arma, and that vehicles are really just there to complete the package....

I have to slightly disagree on thisone. I personally don't see myself playing arma with few humvees for far too long. I'll probably get kick in the nuts for this one but the whole infantry thing would have to step up at least another level to keep me ingame with no other assets associated

[chrisb 196]

Might be my age, but I prefer the a2 vehicle handling to this in a3.

[Gorbachev 1]

I think they're on the right track but it's still atrocious. As said before, the power of a vehicle needs to be defined by the power of the engine, not its top speed. It should be possible to do fish tails, burn outs up against buildings and all sorts of things that I'm just not seeing yet in the game. Not that these are crucial to the game but it certainly provides a more realistic experience when a vehicle responds as it should in real life.

I'd like to see differentials, torque, gear ratios and plain old horse power modeled in some way. The devs should look at the (surprisingly realistic) way car physics were implemented in to GTA4 and improve on it.

[heruon 1]

I think torque and gears are modelled already, they're just not configured in a satisfying way, yet.

Has anyone else noticed the strange auto correction when a vehicle is about to roll? In situations where it's obvious that the vehicle is sure to roll over, it magically rolls back onto it's wheels.

[blu3sman 11]

Torque, gear ratios, differentials are all modelled and set up quite well. Also things like burnouts and drifts are possible. Source of current abnormal handling is bad configuration of parameters related to tire friction.

[Mattar_Tharkari 10]

Once I remapped 'car more left' and 'car more right' mouse steering responded normally - why is it mapped like that as default?

Why is it bumping into an 18" chicken wire fence in an ATV kills me (Agia Marina)?

The helicopter is too easily damaged - a gentle drop from 24" inches causes major damage and injures the player.

[Tonci87 163]

I think torque and gears are modelled already, they're just not configured in a satisfying way, yet.

Has anyone else noticed the strange auto correction when a vehicle is about to roll? In situations where it's obvious that the vehicle is sure to roll over, it magically rolls back onto it's wheels.

Yeah I hate that. It´s actuall pretty hard to flip the car.

[cinder 10]

Even arcade level physics in Generally seem better foundation for vehicle physics. Not sure how complex the conversion from 2.5D to 3D is, but you do not need sim level of driving physics (esp tire behavior) to allow for sim levels of tactical freedom. Drivability is what matters.

[Smurf 12]

1st: Generally is awesome! And they're doing a new "HD" version, must buy.

2nd: Given the fact that this Alpha focus is infantry and general fixes, I'm happy with what was done until now with the wheeled vehicles and Im sure in the Beta, when the focus change to vehicles, things will get even better.

Don't expect something like a dedicated simulator but something that is believable and fun to drive (DPV from BF2 comes to mind).

Edited April 22, 2013 by Smurf

[kamaradski 10]

As a dedicated driver in arma3 i cannot wait untill driving gets fully optimized, and i do agree some tweaks are needed.

I also am fully convident it will be awsome and BI will have some great fixes in store for us :)

[blu3sman 11]

How about some awesome fixes right nao?:cool:

Last couple of days I spent digging into car configs, painful experimenting, and learning tricky physics of Car Wheel.

Here is a little replacement config for offroad truck: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13416770/OffroadFix.zip

It contains 300 hp engine, RWD, minor tweaks to suspension, and some science magic.

I should note, that currently in alpha it is not possible to define behaviour for different surfaces (or I just dont know how).

Given configuration simulates handling on asphalt. Try it and give your impression. Vehicle physics is not so hopeless as you might think.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Blu3sman

[Bee8190 10]

So I gave it a spin ;)

The suspension seems to be more bouncy and thats good, feels more like 4x4 car. I was also able to reach 200km /hr on the stratis airfield :cool: but than run out of space.

The car could do IMO some 250km /hr if the runway was longer.

I haven't noticed any more power while going up hills though. If you're willing to play with the configs some more, I'd like to ask you if you could add more suspension travel (and thus even further softness of the suspension) but most importantly, if you can find sway bar values.

If you find sway bars and how to adjust those, try to stiffen them (maybe more than half as much than it is now) but try to keep the front more stiffer than the rear (it should allow the front of the vehicle to ''lead'' and should provide more responsiveness to it. Other than that, not bad at all but I felt the car was pulling slightly sideways for some reason.

http://youtu.be/41Z0hBWChyM

Config by blu3sman

http://youtu.be/Gieiq86BtJk

Edited April 22, 2013 by Bee8190
Added video

[blu3sman 11]

Nice video, but the main difference is handling in aggresive maneuvers. Try some 180 handbrake turns.

Sadly anti-roll bars are not configurable per each axis. I can add suspension travel BUT it gets mismatched with wheels animation, so they sink into ground.