Discussion about stances

[Sneakson 1]

Hey, I have some thoughts about stances and I wanna know what other people think about it and if we should make a feedback request or if there already is one.

Stances in ArmA3 work great but there are some inconsistencies that I hope will change!

Starting off I think that you should be able to adjust left, right, lean left, right and raise or lower your weapon in any stance.

Currently I think this is all only possible in two stances: default standing and default crouching.

I don’t see why anyone would object to this, agree?

Second I think the sitting stance in between crouching and lying down should be taken away of the adjusting stances and put on the “sit down†command.

I think it’s very inconsistent that there is exactly one stance while adjusting where you are completely stationary.

It’s impractical because it’s possible to accidentally get stuck in that stance when carefully crouching down behind a rock and you suddenly have to move.

It’s also just strange that there are two entirely different ways to sit down and when using the actual command you can’t use your weapon.

Why not merge them?

Third I think it would be nice if there was something of a “temporary raise†command.

Say you’re lying down in the grass. You have no idea what’s going on around you and the only way to see is to completely change your stance into crouching – exposing yourself!

In reality you would just try to carefully stick your head up just above the grass, wouldn’t you?

In Metal Gear Solid 3 you lean left on L1 (or L2, can’t remember), right on R2 and if you hold them both at once you stick your head up slightly which is really, really useful!

Say Q+E could make you just stick your head up without changing your stance – agree?

Finally I think that you should be able to activate a setting in the settings menu that lets you see a stance indicator on-screen at all times on any difficulty.

In reality you’d know what stance you were in because of the kinesthetic sense but just by looking at a screen it’s usually pretty hard to say.

I often find myself having been crouched for the past 5 minutes when I thought I was standing up.

See this stance indicator from Ghost Recon (sw corner):

Discuss and if I'm not all wrong and there are no very similar feature suggestions already perhaps we can create some.

[zimms 22]

You have some pretty good suggestions! I would like to see them implemented. They make sense and are easy to use.

The question is i BIS still has the time to make those changes.

I know the Alpha isn't feature complete, but this may be a little too much of a change.

[Sneakson 1]

You have some pretty good suggestions! I would like to see them implemented. They make sense and are easy to use.

The question is i BIS still has the time to make those changes.

I know the Alpha isn't feature complete, but this may be a little too much of a change.

Well this is Alpha. Anything should be able to change. Then again it's only six months until release. I am a bit worried that 6 months from alpha to retail is very, very short.

Anyways adding a stance indicator is just the matter of a small graphic and merging the sitting stance with the sitting command should be easy. The rest may take some programming but then again that's what they do for a job.

[Chocolate 1]

I love the Q+E idea while prone! Especially for No 3rd Person servers. (Its kinda pointless with the 3rd person camera)

Now if only we could get better mid-range textures so hiding in grass works better.

[Sneakson 1]

http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=426

Someone already made a visual stance indicator suggestion and it's got over 400 votes! Go upvote it even more and it's sure to be in the game eventually.

[almanzo 144]

http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=426

Someone already made a visual stance indicator suggestion and it's got over 400 votes! Go upvote it even more and it's sure to be in the game eventually.

That's all fine and dandy, but read the suggestions all over. This thread isn't about a stance indicator, but rather about another control scheme for the sitting down stance, in addition to have a way of looking over the grass.

[Sneakson 1]

That's all fine and dandy, but read the suggestions all over. This thread isn't about a stance indicator, but rather about another control scheme for the sitting down stance, in addition to have a way of looking over the grass.

Are you kidding me? YOU read the suggestions all over. I wrote them. I am the original only Author of the Thread. I know what I wrote 10 hours ago. And I did write about the stance indicator there at the end of the original post. I even put a small image in. Glad you noticed.

But yeah, if more people agree these are good ideas and I can't find any similar tickets I'll create one for being able to adjust and lower/raise weapon in all stances and merging sitting with and without a weapon into one command and another ticket for "peeking up."

Adjusting and sitting merge will just be one ticket since they are very closely related.

I think it would be great if they could get some of these nifty things into the game anyways. Modding has a tendency to get out of hand and also split people into those who have all the right mods and those who don't, I hear.

[viper[cww] 14]

Well this is Alpha. Anything should be able to change. Then again it's only six months until release. I am a bit worried that 6 months from alpha to retail is very, very short.

Don't worry too much. ArmA 3 was announced in 2011, and has took close to two years to get to alpha stage. Original release date was for Q2 2012 iirc.

[Sneakson 1]

I'm bumping this because there's some other stance discussion over in general.

[-=seany=- 5]

Third I think it would be nice if there was something of a “temporary raise†command.

Say you’re lying down in the grass. You have no idea what’s going on around you and the only way to see is to completely change your stance into crouching – exposing yourself!

In reality you would just try to carefully stick your head up just above the grass, wouldn’t you?

In Metal Gear Solid 3 you lean left on L1 (or L2, can’t remember), right on R2 and if you hold them both at once you stick your head up slightly which is really, really useful!

Say Q+E could make you just stick your head up without changing your stance – agree?

That's a very nice idea. You should submit a ticket so we can vote for it.

[Shadow_Vit 1]

Second I think the sitting stance in between crouching and lying down should be taken away of the adjusting stances and put on the “sit down†command.

I think it’s very inconsistent that there is exactly one stance while adjusting where you are completely stationary.

It’s impractical because it’s possible to accidentally get stuck in that stance when carefully crouching down behind a rock and you suddenly have to move.

It’s also just strange that there are two entirely different ways to sit down and when using the actual command you can’t use your weapon.

Why not merge them?

Man, this is brilliant idea. I'm totally agree with you.

[Kemeros 1]

What i'd prefer is having CTRL + MOUSEWHEEL modify the stance. That way you could actually change stance in a fluid and very precise motion. Having steps often leave you too high or too low for your needs.

What do you guys think?

Edited April 14, 2013 by Kemeros

[Wolfstriked 11]

Problem with mousewheel for me is you need to lift the fire weapon finger to move stance up and then move back to mouse button one to fire and then back and forth.Tried it on my game and it was cumbersome IMO so I put standup/crouch on the mouse wheel instead.BIS will most likely never move away from the standard keyboard layout they have been using for yrs but lately I have been thinking that it can be slightly improved.Z/X/C should be prone/Crouch/standup and tactical pace can be moved to the unused dbl tap W.This allows you to be certain what stance you are in as each key is a set stance instead of the way it is now where the Z key toggles prone/standup and the X key toggles crouch/standup leaving the player not knowing what stance they are in without a stance indicator.

Another thing I think could improve this is if each key cycled stances in each posture.So C key cycles the 3 standing stances and Z toggles crouched stances.So you are standing and press X to crouch behind cover and then cycle the 3 crouch stances with the X key with no need to hit an ADJUST key.Could simplify it a bit.

[Sneakson 1]

What i'd prefer is having CTRL + MOUSEWHEEL modify the stance. That way you could actually change stance in a fluid and very precise motion. Having steps often leave you too high or too low for your needs.

What do you guys think?

On the mouse wheel personally no thanks but for other players sure. In more steps than there already are sure but I'd rather see that in ARMA4. Gotta get used to going from 3 to 7 first.

[seamusgod 1]

Problem with mousewheel for me is you need to lift the fire weapon finger to move stance up and then move back to mouse button one to fire and then back and forth.Tried it on my game and it was cumbersome IMO so I put standup/crouch on the mouse wheel instead.BIS will most likely never move away from the standard keyboard layout they have been using for yrs but lately I have been thinking that it can be slightly improved.Z/X/C should be prone/Crouch/standup and tactical pace can be moved to the unused dbl tap W.This allows you to be certain what stance you are in as each key is a set stance instead of the way it is now where the Z key toggles prone/standup and the X key toggles crouch/standup leaving the player not knowing what stance they are in without a stance indicator.

Another thing I think could improve this is if each key cycled stances in each posture.So C key cycles the 3 standing stances and Z toggles crouched stances.So you are standing and press X to crouch behind cover and then cycle the 3 crouch stances with the X key with no need to hit an ADJUST key.Could simplify it a bit.

your fire finger is index, the middle finger is for mouse wheel and right click. still haven't learned how to use a mouse effectively for games i see.

[Wolfstriked 11]

your fire finger is index, the middle finger is for mouse wheel and right click. still haven't learned how to use a mouse effectively for games i see.

If I were to use my middle finger to scroll wheel then I would have to be lifting off of zoom at inopportune times.Stance adjusment for me is still WASD.Its all how you like to play the game I guess.

[Sneakson 1]

I use my index finger on mouse1 and middle finger on mouse2-3 also. I don't think it's comfortable to press mouse2 with my ring finger at all. Depends on your mouse I'd say.

[Larrow 2819]

In all im loving the new stances but there are problems. With all the key binding options we have and the different ways we can set our keys up to do the same things like stand and crouch or up to toggle between the two, why suddenly are we locked in to a modifier key and forward and back to change our stance. Unlocking this so we can bind it how we like is the number one issue.

Beyond that, the rest in no particular order.

Fluid movement between the stances would be excellent. Thought :- Maybe a rubber band effect for TIR y-axis (can only shrug my head down into my shoulders so far). By rubberband i mean like erm mmm example, freelancer or some other space sims where your ship changes direction towards your mouse cursor, where the speed of change is dependant on the distance. Moving your head down half an inch is enough to get your character to slowly start down stancing, an inch would make the transition faster and the same for moving your head up, this would leave a nice deadzone in the center.

I also agree that the sit down in the stances does not seem right and would much prefer this to be incorporated into the sitting with the different poses dependant on weapon and/or whether your looking down your sights.

Prone low (where you roll onto your right side) or what ever you want to call it, should have a roll left aswell and be tied to leaning or stance left/right. Dont really see a need for a prone low.

Absolutely love the OP's idea of having a head high in prone so you can have a quick look around (meerkat stance :) can picture the battlefield now in the long grass with all the heads bobbing up lol ). What about even adding it as prone high if the sitting stance was reassigned to sitting. Make prone high only available from prone - may look strange going from crouch low to prone with your head up.

Edited April 13, 2013 by Larrow

[Sneakson 1]

Hey!

http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=7149

I made a pretty big suggestion overall asking for more consistency in movement and such across all stances.

Go upvote!

I'm writing the peeking suggestion separately right now.

---------- Post added at 19:56 ---------- Previous post was at 18:56 ----------

Aaand here's the request for being able to stick your head up for a quick peek!

http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=7150

Gameplay video (MGS3) inside.

[Von_Emmy 1]

Hi Sneakson

I just commented your feedback 0007149 as first and by making suggestions i also included your other feedback entree 0007150.

What do you and the community think about this?

much Love and Light

Von_Emmy

[Sneakson 1]

Hi Sneakson

I just commented your feedback 0007149 as first and by making suggestions i also included your other feedback entree 0007150.

What do you and the community think about this?

much Love and Light

Von_Emmy

A push-up stance that you only can look around in and that is auto-lowered into prone when you move etc sounds good.