Helicopter physics impressions - simplified

[max power 21]

Well why don´t they come up and simply announce this on the forum? Why do we have to browse through x E3 interviews to get this quite important bit of information

The Physx vs. rotorlib thing was mentioned on the forums.

-Even worse FM for helicopters than in A2

Are you perhaps basing this feedback on the alpha where the vehicles were not fully implemented?

[Smurf 12]

Are you perhaps basing this feedback on the alpha where the vehicles were not fully implemented?

Can I quote that then?

I couldn't care that much about TkoH FM because I just fly for fun and am not that good at it. But I don't like current FM, A2 was much enjoyable.

[Tonci87 163]

The Physx vs. rotorlib thing was mentioned on the forums.

Are you perhaps basing this feedback on the alpha where the vehicles were not fully implemented?

I´m basing in on the Beta and on the Alpha. It was bad in the Alpha, and it didn´t improve much until now.

[jxjcksn 1]

BETA Version has pretty much killed all interest I had in the MH-9 / AH-9 Littlebird.

How can every other FM that is meant to be 10 times heavier than Littlebird, outmaneuver it.

I know it was twitchy, but Hell it was a small NIMBLE insertion craft capable of popping down between trees.... Sometimes risk

of landing paid off ... sometimes not ... but now .... Pffft ... it's like flying a brick !

No need for that anymore when I can fly the Ghosthawk which turns faster and is more nimble !

Did I mention the Guns ?

Meh .....

Bring back the Nimbleness !

Jax

[Zorg_DK 10]

I agree, the littlebird is too sluggish to control now.

[The Hebrew Hammer 10]

Yes the Comache turns on a dime, helicopters were fine in Arma 2, I'm not sure why they made them all so sensitive to input, it actually makes it MORE difficult to fly in my opinion.

[max power 21]

Can I quote that then?

I couldn't care that much about TkoH FM because I just fly for fun and am not that good at it. But I don't like current FM, A2 was much enjoyable.

I´m basing in on the Beta and on the Alpha. It was bad in the Alpha, and it didn´t improve much until now.

I'm just basing my comment on the statement by the devs that the alpha was infantry focussed and the vehicles are in development.

[Tonci87 163]

I'm just basing my comment on the statement by the devs that the alpha was infantry focussed and the vehicles are in development.

So you think they will still change something? I hope so.

[max power 21]

They said that they have a focus on doing things 'right' this time so I hope so.

[Ghoulees 0]

The Helicopters in ARMA have always been 'arcadey'.

To be honest, the Take on Helicopter controls do fit spomewhere between arcadey and sim ( as Take On Helicopters is not very well regarded in the simulator community or by actual helicopter pilots either ).

Either way, there should be a way to balance between both extremes, otherwise helos do have the chance to be overpowered from an armaments point of view.

And as for the folks who are happy to trundle around in helicopters and move troops about in order to 'help the team', they are usually the folks interested in rotary wing flight to begin with, and do want a degree of realism for the challenge it presents.

If only ARMA and DCS Blackshark & Huey could combine and have a bastard child, I'd be in heaven. :)

[ric 1]

The Helicopters in ARMA have always been 'arcadey'.

To be honest, the Take on Helicopter controls do fit spomewhere between arcadey and sim ( as Take On Helicopters is not very well regarded in the simulator community or by actual helicopter pilots either ).

Either way, there should be a way to balance between both extremes, otherwise helos do have the chance to be overpowered from an armaments point of view.

And as for the folks who are happy to trundle around in helicopters and move troops about in order to 'help the team', they are usually the folks interested in rotary wing flight to begin with, and do want a degree of realism for the challenge it presents.

If only ARMA and DCS Blackshark & Huey could combine and have a bastard child, I'd be in heaven. :)

the game not just the helicopter flight models needs to have varying degree's of difficulty...you can always dumb down a flight model via options but the reverse is not true if the flight model starts out simplified. there should be game modes involving realism and difficulty that start from ..OMFG...BF3?!?!? to a mode as realistic and difficult as it can get this makes everyone happy along with providing a ground work for BF3 type players to get into A3 and eventually move up to more immersive and difficult options when the BF3 type mode gets boring which is something you cant actually do in BF3 itself.

[progamer 14]

I bought TOH recently and I enjoyed flying in that game a lot more than Arma 3, I could auto rotate, be to rough and break the helicopter, and I could carry object like they we hanging from my helicopter and not some stiff pole welded to the bottom of the helicopter and the carried object.

Granted I did crash and damage the helicopter many times but I acually feel like flying was more entertaining.

Edited June 25, 2013 by ProGamer

[.kju 3244]

My take:

# Who cares about 10 FPS drop when he gets a largely improved FM

# The FPS drop should be only happen for the pilot and not other clients, and only when you are actually flying, and not for the server either

# Disable (the problematic parts of) Physx for choppers when flying, if its really a problem - FM >>> PhysX

# Add at least engine support that the community can configure the FM for A3 or prior products choppers - release the MLOD of the models therefore

# With AiA one would have at least the choppers from TKOH already configured (light, medium, heavy plus Hind)

# And the TKOH FM configuration could be used as a base - would be better than what we have now

[stun 5]

I fully agree with kju. I also find the claim of a 10 FPS drop hard to believe, and a poor argument against including the flight model considering the implemetation of PiP kills at least that many FPS. At least give ToH owners the ability to port by enabling engine support.

[WalkerDown 1]

All the vehicles in arma (including the helicopters and airplanes) have been much simplified (or call them "arcade"), I don't think there would be any solution: (most of) the user base wouldn't like anything else. Who's used to play sims like DCS would be in the even to have a flight model like the UH1 in ArmA3, but I already see all those kids screaming "it's too hard to fly!!!" all around. So no, we'll never have anything "simulative" in Arma, unfortunately.

[byku 13]

;2422819']My take:

# Who cares about 10 FPS drop when he gets a largely improved FM

Well it might be unfortunately a huge problem. I've been playing lately on a pvp server with around 60 people, all my friends were achieving no more that 25/27fps, even though they had v. good pcs(at least i5 - because that matters, some i7). Now imagine lowering that to 15/17, it would be VERY uncomfortable to a pilot. Although i would love it to have it, but 10fps might be too much. In my opinion they should make the present flight model a bit more complex, and it should feel more realistic(ah/mh-9 in beta is a joke), but full implementation of TOH system is a bit too much(unfortunately :/).

Edited June 25, 2013 by Byku

[.kju 3244]

Sorry to say but you have no idea how the engine works.

The low FPS in MP come from too many entities (players, AI, objects) and general bad mission coding.

The FM probably would have no impact at all in those situations as the low FPS comes from the syncing - other parts are idle and the FM would be no problem.

[byku 13]

Well it depends, I suppose you know better ;). In MP game it's all down to cpu, my gpu has around 30/40% of usage. I bet that the TOH model will be calculated by CPU so it will strain it even more. A dangerous thing to do.

[.kju 3244]

It is cpu/thread/network data sync. Or do you see your CPUs (or at least one) near 100% use - i doubt it.

[byku 13]

I doubt if there is anyone here that see his cpu used to 100%.

Edit.: Also good point Smurf

Edited June 25, 2013 by Byku

[Smurf 12]

100% use = bad.

[WalkerDown 1]

100% use = bad.

While saying the CPU is not powerful enough while it's being used by only 30% is even worse.

[Ezcoo 47]

Why, oh why the responsiveness of aircraft controls was downgraded so much in the Beta...! The lack of weird smoothing, really nice response curve and barely existent input lag made it a pure pleasure to fly MH-9 and AH-9 that had pretty good flight models (compared to KA-60, IMO). The responsiveness and accuracy was great, loved flying in Alpha.

But now, in the Beta, flying feels worse than in A2... The weird smoothing of controller input is back. It increases the input lag massively due to its nature, thus rendering accurate and fast corrections impossible. Also, the response curve feels very odd now – the sensivity seems to be lower now and it feels very flat and linear compared to the Alpha's curve – eg. tilting chopper takes a lot of time now. Flying feels very, very arcadey now, it's like mouse smoothing and mouse acceleration would have been forced to the maximum. It's a huge downgrade IMO. :(

And I sincerely hope that there's at least option for the server hosts to turn off the ability to take controls of chopper as attack chopper gunner in MP...

Please, put the handling of controls in Alpha back in game or give us at least an option to use it instead of the one in Beta!

[Uglyboy 10]

The FM might be easier for new players in arma3, but it makes possible some pretty impossible stuff, took the liberty to report one to start, take a look and vote up if you think it shouldn't behave like this.

http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=10354

[gossamersolid 155]

While saying the CPU is not powerful enough while it's being used by only 30% is even worse.

I'd rather 30% CPU usage over 100%...

100% = Unstable OS and other applications running.