Situation update?

[raptor90 1]

What still wrong with IF44 ? Why is still so slow with patches ?

Its caused by greed of ? BIS ? DS ?

Why should not be BIS greedy ? If it they were...

Asking money for actually licensed engine is just stupidity which discourages the potentially other developers/publishers which wants to use RV engines...

Why should not be DS greedy ? If it they were...

Asking 30 eur for a game which is not finished ( some sort yes... ) is triple stupidity, and what about the customers ?

"Well, we are sorry but the game does not sales well atm and its pure loss for us, so we don`t care about the IF44 fans/customers and thank you for your money...

Have a nice joy with current IF44..."

I hope we will not see any announcement of this kind from DS, or else...

---------- Post added at 21:53 ---------- Previous post was at 20:11 ----------

Anyway, do you think that just more ( very much ) new units/models which don`t need BIS for help and royalties to do so ^^ would bring IF44 some refreshment ?

Its really that hard to make some ?

Really i don`t understand some things do i miss something ?

Edited February 3, 2013 by raptor90
Bit whit typo

[metalcraze 290]

Greed has nothing do with anything here. There's always a contract that dictates who will pay what and when and why. With UE3 you must either continuously pay Epic a percentage from sales or pay a big sum at once. A usual thing.

It's just a mere incompetence plus devs moving onto something new? Happens to most of games. A few months of patching and bye bye.

[raptor90 1]

It's just a mere incompetence plus devs moving onto something new? Happens to most of games. A few months of patching and bye bye.

Why would DS and Awar even do it with Sim of good potential ?

IF44 now uses maybe 25% of its potential, it lacks very much things which could change the sales of it drastically...

What if IF44 had all the things which have I44 at current IF44 quality ?

[LDU30 5]

The devs have finished killing a game with a great potential, a lack of respect for us fans, embarrassment about these russians devs.....BUAGGGH!"

Edited March 4, 2013 by LDU30

[ProfTournesol 956]

The devs have finished killing the game with a great potential, a lack of respect for us fans, embarrassment about these russians devs.....BUAGGGH!"

I'm afraid the issue isn't on the devs side.

[LDU30 5]

Is a matter of few sales?, then the game is already dead commercially, will start a new project they have to give the game to the Arma community so that together we can revive the title.

[A.Fudge 10]

From what I understand it is much more complex than that. For instance BI will require royalties in some form for use of their engine, which I imagine DS put up. Somewhere in the license IF is not allowed to freely enable mods, but the devs are willing to patch them into the game or sign them so they can work. The Devs require money to pay bills, purchase food. DS are unlikely to have unlimited money to keep giving to the devs to keep up 24/7 work, they will get their money from sales and DLC. If sales were not good enough then DS would be unwilling to fund another DLC.

[jinzor 31]

From what I understand it is much more complex than that. For instance BI will require royalties in some form for use of their engine, which I imagine DS put up. Somewhere in the license IF is not allowed to freely enable mods, but the devs are willing to patch them into the game or sign them so they can work. The Devs require money to pay bills, purchase food. DS are unlikely to have unlimited money to keep giving to the devs to keep up 24/7 work, they will get their money from sales and DLC. If sales were not good enough then DS would be unwilling to fund another DLC.

Then if that is indeed the case, why are the developers not saying anything? I'd be happy about them coming clean with us and saying how difficult it is to support IF44, due to low sales and/or other reasons, and want to give up on the game. But just leaving us in the dark and closing down the forums, as if the game and community never existed, without a warning, is cowardly. That is not the way to gain respect or future loyal customers, I expected better from them.

I was loyal to them until that happened; I was willing to buy the game three times over for my friends to help support them (which I was about to do, before the forums shut down), willing to make an American Campaign (for the D-Day DLC), willing to voice act for British soldiers in a possible British DLC and pay professional bilingual/north american voice actors for the DLCs, since the original D-Day DLC had no voice acting in their scenarios (in a private message, after I offered examples of my voice, Ingeneer (one of the AWAR devs I believe) said that a British DLC was their "hope for the future" and would reply back when he had dialogue to read, implying that that was the next DLC they could have possibly made after the D-Day DLC). But they really dropped the ball and I am not going to be hopeful or supportive for their next project, at all, as long as those forums are down and we still get no response/explanation for everything that's going on with IF44.

Why should I trust this developer when I know that they could act like this again? Who knows if they will do the exact same thing with their new project in the future?

Edited March 3, 2013 by Jinzor

[rknharry 10]

Although I hate speculating, it somehow dawns to me, that AWAR likely fell vitcim to sort of ARMA 2 sell out policy and now is clamped between the bizness monkeys. It´s obvious, that it´s not AWAR alone to decide on anything and that there´s also BI, DS and X1 involved. I´d say IFL44 comes 1-2 years too late and maybe it would´ve been better to go the invasion44 way of modding, instead of meddling with the hawks. :P I´d purchased ARMA, ARMA2, followed by ARMA X exclusively, in order to keep going smoothly with Invasion44 further development, so it mainly benefits BI comercially wise. Iron Front was a good gesture to feed something back to the WW2 community, but it looks like a rather half @rsed affair now and AWAR gets all the trashing for it. But as said, I´m just speculating and I hate it. ;)

[jinzor 31]

Although I hate speculating, it somehow dawns to me, that AWAR likely fell vitcim to sort of ARMA 2 sell out policy and now is clamped between the bizness monkeys. It´s obvious, that it´s not AWAR alone to decide on anything and that there´s also BI, DS and X1 involved. I´d say IFL44 comes 1-2 years too late and maybe it would´ve been better to go the invasion44 way of modding, instead of meddling with the hawks. :P I´d purchased ARMA, ARMA2, followed by ARMA X exclusively, in order to keep going smoothly with Invasion44 further development, so it mainly benefits BI comercially wise. Iron Front was a good gesture to feed something back to the WW2 community, but it looks like a rather half @rsed affair now and AWAR gets all the trashing for it. But as said, I´m just speculating and I hate it. ;)

That is probably very true, and if it is then I feel sorry for them. But that still doesn't explain why AWAR haven't said anything regarding this. I'm just angry at how they are keeping silent/mysterious, not the actual quality of the game. All evidence, so far, points to them wanting to move on, shutting down the forums and not saying anything about it (the last few times the forums were shut down, which were for maybe a day or two at most, they would come on this forum, say that it was a temporary problem and say it would be back up again. They haven't done that this time) could be their way of saying "it's over, we don't want to hear anything relating to this game anymore". The actual game is pretty good; big maps, original WWII location for the RV engine (except for the DLC).

If DS have told them to cease development, or for whatever reason they cannot support the game anymore, why not just say so and try harder to make their next game better after their experience with IF44? That would restore some of my faith in AWAR.

Edited March 3, 2013 by Jinzor

[rknharry 10]

Yep, but people involved in bizness relations are usually bound to treaties and the so called "non disclosure agreements". Even if they want to tell us what´s going on, they simply can´t, as otherwise they´d get into serious trouble and you could safely say good bye to AWAR then.

[tay-uk 13]

I don't think "Sorry the forums are going to have to close down for a while" message would constitute a breaking of any possible "non disclosure agreement".

[jinzor 31]

Yep, but people involved in bizness relations are usually bound to treaties and the so called "non disclosure agreements". Even if they want to tell us what´s going on, they simply can´t, as otherwise they´d get into serious trouble and you could safely say good bye to AWAR then.

That's the thing I'm worried about, maybe they do care and do actually want to say something, but then again they never said that they "couldn't" say anything, ever. All they've done is avoided questions or news since late-January, when the new patch was supposed to be released.

And besides, NDA's haven't stopped devs from anonymously giving status updates, explanations or other information before. A developer for OF: Dragon Rising unofficially revealed that Codemasters were going to halt development and start a new game (Red River) after the final patch and apologised, a confirmed anonymous developer for Aliens: Colonial Marines went to Reddit after the game was released to reveal what went wrong with the game. Even if AWAR can't say anything, they can say something. They haven't even tried.

Also, the closure of the AWAR IF44 forums, without even a warning, was a clear enough message from them I believe; we don't care/want to support the game anymore. That's not the way to go about it.

I don't think "Sorry the forums are going to have to close down for a while" message would constitute a breaking of any possible "non disclosure agreement".

I agree, I would have been fine with a warning or a message like that, from mlacix, on this forum after the other forums were shut down, as well.

Edited March 3, 2013 by Jinzor

[Beagle 684]

It's no surprise. After that one obscureshort message "There are troubles with patch 1.06" It was mre than clear the plug would be pulled.

Awar always made very clear that further support is all about the money...and you could always read in big letters beetween the lines that sales where rather bad and there is no money left to spend in further support. That was shown cleary before in the 1.04 debacle.

[jblackrupert 14]

I'm afraid the issue isn't on the devs side.

They spend an awful lot of time hiding when things need to be fixed and questions answered... but time to sell DLC... Here were are folks.. We missed you!...buy our DLC.

And boy do they love to blame others.

They are kinda like DICE, Conmasters and Hammerpoint got together and made a lovechild.

---------- Post added at 06:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:38 PM ----------

It's no surprise. After that one obscureshort message "There are troubles with patch 1.06" It was mre than clear the plug would be pulled.

Awar always made very clear that further support is all about the money...and you could always read in big letters beetween the lines that sales where rather bad and there is no money left to spend in further support. That was shown cleary before in the 1.04 debacle.

It was pretty clear within the first couple weeks the game was never intended to be supported for very long and they were going to do a DLC cash grab.

Edited March 4, 2013 by jblackrupert

[LDU30 5]

If they still have some decency, allowing the free development of addons, if they do not, Their only way is harakiri XD.:yay:the damn money corrupts everything slowly from the solid foundations. We'll always have the Arma 3 and invasion 44 team(saints).

IFL1944+R.I.P+

Edited March 4, 2013 by LDU30

[Nicholas 5]

I had high hopes for this game. I do believe it is an amazing game, but the support for the game is what really disappointed me. Try messaging the developers on the forums here.

Ingeneer

panzer_baron

SenChi

X1Steffen

[Gunter Severloh 4052]

We'll always have the Arma 3 and invasion 44 team(saints).

We also have Hell in the Pacific too, September 1939 mod (when it releases),

and the Army of the Czecho-Slovakia republic 1938-1945 mod (when it releases).

but you do still have Iron Front. I dont understand how people can ditch a game when you own it outright on your computer that you bought.

Yes i feel sad too that the developers, or whomever connected is not providing support, or doing something whatever, not communicating again thats for sure about updates.

But all in all the community is still here, there are still missions being made, still scripts being built, still coop groups playing,

and IDk about you but my game runs, it dont crash on me, or freeze, and I can build missions and what have you as well as download new ones

from my own MR website, which supports the IF community, as well as all the other mods I linked.

When OFP was just the main game back in the day before Arma, i remember just playing with a WW2 addon pack which only gave you

only so many units to play with, this was before I44 demo came around, and i remember being so excited, and so happy just to play with what

i had because there was nothing else, I mean nothing, as the years went on I44 had a demo released, Liberation mod 1941-45 aka today's Iron Front,

and even the FDF WW2 mod were available to play, and i played the shit out out them!

The point being lets not be so critical of a game itself it does have its features, and is what it is, if it gets updated then be happy, if not then you still have the game to play.

Its not like the game is on a network like an mmo, and they shut the thing down for whatever and your out of a game, that would be something to be pissed, or complain about!

But you do have a physical copy on your computer that is not on a network like an mmo, or dependent on anything else to run, other then steam (Why?) but you own the game.

Be happy with what you have, as for some people have nothing, or dont have the capacity to start, run, or even play the game, and maybe let alone

any Arma games because their computer is such a piece of shit, or other reasons.

Learn to appreciate what you have, or you go through life always looking out the window wanting something better

and not really seeing what you do own, what you can play.

If you dont like the game anymore then move on, we/i shouldn't have to read anyone's rants and complaining from someone

who dont even play the game or have it installed, if your at that point then why are you still here, go find another game.

[jinzor 31]

Hey Gunter, we're not criticizing or angry at the game itself (at least, I'm not), the game is alright. Sure, the campaign and some parts of the game has loads of bugs, but I still manage to find enjoyment out of it, that's the main thing. The D-Day DLC isn't as good though (simply because there's not enough, if there were enough then it would be good). I'm just angry at the lack of support for the game and this final kick in the teeth; removing the forums. That place was active, that had a lot of good discussions on there and we had a chance to speak to developers, and now it's gone.

And also sure, we now have the "fan forums" where everyone can go instead, but I'm not really sure I want to be much of a vocal "fan" of this game anymore given everything that's been going on with it. There's nothing much to discuss; support is dropped, modding is disabled and hardly anyone plays it these days (except for the couple of times where there is a sudden influx of people which plan to play the game on a set date). The only thing that I can think of discussing is mission making, but I'm sorry to say, why would I want to make missions for a dead game anymore? To me, it's like going back and making a mission for Dragon Rising; there's not much point, especially when there is a fairly big community right around the corner tied to a series of games on which the engine came from; the ArmA series. It'd be way more worthwhile making missions for that game, or even for the mods on that game. At least the chances of more people playing your mission(s) will be much, much higher and the game has longevity; it has modability. People will be coming back to those games for a long time.

And before you come back and tell me that I should leave if I think this way, let me just say that I still care about the game, I don't want to leave. I think that if you don't voice your concerns or displeasure then there is more chance that NOTHING will improve. I do want the game to survive, but I'm displeased with all the other stuff, that's why I'm ranting. If you don't want to read these negative posts, then you don't have to read them. There is a small possibility for the game to survive as well; modding. Modding fixed ArmA II, it can fix IF44. But how do we get that if support is now dropped and that no-modding agreement is still in place?

This is definitely not going to happen, but what I think needs to happen in order for Iron Front to survive, to allow modding, is for the rights/IP/whatever of Iron Front to move directly into Bohemia's hands, DS/AWAR will need to give it for a price. I mean, what will it be worth in the future? I doubt it'll be much. Re-name it (like what they did with the original Operation Flashpoint when they couldn't use the name anymore, due to it being trademarked by Codemasters; ArmA II: Iron Front?), maybe fix some things (especially the campaign) if they want and then allow mod/community to fix the game. Like I said, this is definitely not going to happen though.

Edited March 4, 2013 by Jinzor

[LDU30 5]

Gunter you believe that this is the best way to treat us?:http://forum.iron-front.com/showthread.php?1496-Official-Statement-from-the-Developer-on-the-future-of-Iron-Front/page36 without explanation or reasons for leaving the game in half/done status, right now I can not do anything with the game this made ​​a quagmire and do not even have the opportunity to use the title with mods to lengthen life the game, and our hopes? and all future projects?...:confused:

Bohemia please buy the game to these scammers....

I run Arma 2 60 fps IFL 30-40 fps with terrible lag at times unplayable is not only good or bad computer PC,It just works worse than ARMA2.using the same engine, And the game has more bugs that in a pond puddle. and yes, I'm very angry is my right and I want an explanation!

Edited March 4, 2013 by LDU30

[jblackrupert 14]

There is a small possibility for the game to survive as well; modding. Modding fixed ArmA II, it can fix IF44. But how do we get that if support is now dropped and that no-modding agreement is still in place?

There likely is no such rule in the contract they signed.

It was just a convenient excuse to deflect criticism and pump out the DLC.

they probably intended to pump out a lot more but the game tanked because

of the lack of modding, their poor communication, advertising....etc.

Wait and see, their new Cryengine 3 project will be another version of Red River.

and the usual crowd will forgive them, attack anyone who attempts to say anything

negative about AWAR and hand over their money, commumiaction will be shitty again

bugs will remain and they will pop up with some awesome DLC to sell right before they

screw off again.

[W0lle 1050]

The above link to the forum gives me a 404, http://iron-front.com/ says no website defined. So it's pretty safe to say they are gone for good.

Wait and see, their new Cryengine 3 project will be another version of Red River. and the usual crowd will forgive them, attack anyone who attempts to say anything

negative about AWAR and hand over their money, commumiaction will be shitty again bugs will remain and they will pop up with some awesome DLC to sell right before they screw off again.

That. Sad but true.

[Phantom Six 25]

I smell Rusty River... and Iron Front to me smells like Sunken Dragon... I should've just started off with I44 for making missions on a WW2 theater and should've waited for September 1939 for Eastern Front... so is it safe to assume that IF is a lost cause ? :/

[Beagle 684]

What really pisses me off with this is that the iron front wiki is also gone. Hampers mission making to the maximum since you need the classnames for that.

[W0lle 1050]

Eventually good old Google still has it in its cache?

Edited August 2, 2013 by W0lle