Syria - What should we do if anything?

[Tonci87 163]

Here we go :popcornsmilie:

[sgtsev3n 12]

since bashar al-assad is in power, there was no single massacre or anything recorded in syria. all people live well in syria, no matter if muslims, christians, druze etc.. when bashar is such a bad guy, why wasnt there a massacre for example in year 2002 or why wasnt there any refugees before the fake revolution 2011 ? i mean, if he is tortue his own people and if he is such a monster, refugees would exist before 2011.

and the funniest thing is: people in syria flee only from cities where the rebels are. in latakia, which is under control of the syrian army, there are no refugees, funny eh? but now the more funniest thing: cities, which were under control of the rebels but recaptured by the syrian army, the people who lived in the city are going back there. example:

a few days ago, the syrian arab army conquered successful the village Taybat Al Imam in Northern Hama, the civilians there welcomed the syrian arab army and thanked them for liberating the village from the "moderate" rebels. here a picture of it:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10603739_736866009715282_8494327819735344807_n.jpg?oh=94f84a2812eefffe698cedc48365e118&oe=548C6E51&__gda__=1422555277_a52d759022d54c7df7b5f14c93e70112

but eh eh, when western media tell us something, it must be the truth.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Here we go :popcornsmilie:

Nope, i can't discuss with Russia Today. So i'll leave that here.

[sgtsev3n 12]

Nope, i can't discuss with Russia Today. So i'll leave that here.

you can't discuss with eyewitnesses. so its better for you to leave that here.

[ProfTournesol 956]

you can't discuss with eyewitnesses. so its better for you to leave that here.

You should read my posts again, if you can.

[Jona33 51]

since bashar al-assad is in power, there was no single massacre or anything recorded in syria. all people live well in syria, no matter if muslims, christians, druze etc.. when bashar is such a bad guy, why wasnt there a massacre for example in year 2002 or why wasnt there any refugees before the fake revolution 2011 ? i mean, if he is tortue his own people and if he is such a monster, refugees would exist before 2011.

and the funniest thing is: people in syria flee only from cities where the rebels are. in latakia, which is under control of the syrian army, there are no refugees, funny eh? but now the more funniest thing: cities, which were under control of the rebels but recaptured by the syrian army, the people who lived in the city are going back there. example:

a few days ago, the syrian arab army conquered successful the village Taybat Al Imam in Northern Hama, the civilians there welcomed the syrian arab army and thanked them for liberating the village from the "moderate" rebels. here a picture of it:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10603739_736866009715282_8494327819735344807_n.jpg?oh=94f84a2812eefffe698cedc48365e118&oe=548C6E51&__gda__=1422555277_a52d759022d54c7df7b5f14c93e70112

but eh eh, when western media tell us something, it must be the truth.

So where do you get your news from, RT? I.e. an organisation that claims Alexander III was a kind loving and much loved gentleman who would never hurt a fly, let alone be responsible for brutal repression of his people. In addition you just claimed 9/11 is an inside job, grab your tinfoil hats everybody, I assume you think that gravity is a CIA plot to keep us all on earth as well? Nobody will take you seriously.

[sgtsev3n 12]

So where do you get your news from, RT? I.e. an organisation that claims Alexander III was a kind loving and much loved gentleman who would never hurt a fly, let alone be responsible for brutal repression of his people. In addition you just claimed 9/11 is an inside job, grab your tinfoil hats everybody, I assume you think that gravity is a CIA plot to keep us all on earth as well? Nobody will take you seriously.

cant you read ? i was in syria 2 times myself, visiting friends there. all my syrian friends also support bashar al-assad. i dont need Russia Today or any media to see the truth, especially no BBC, CNN and similar bullshit (i agree that in Russia Today not everything is the truth, but there are far worse media than RT, for example all western medias).

no one needs media to see the truth. go buy a ticket to syria and see yourself and stop believing bullshit from BBC, CNN, CBS and any western propaganda maschine.

[ProfTournesol 956]

(VICE NEWS) Ghosts of Aleppo (Part 1) : among the Islamic Front, which fights against Assad and against IS.

Aleppo is Syria's largest metropolitan area and a millennia-old commercial capital. Today, however, it is a relative ghost town, threatened by regime bombing from the air and a militant offensive on the ground. For two weeks over the summer, VICE News embedded with the Islamic Front, a coalition of Islamist rebels fighting the forces of President Bashar al-Assad on one hand, and Islamic State militants on the other. From their secret tunnels beneath the ancient city to their threatened frontline outposts in Aleppo's ruined medieval centre, VICE NEWS followed the Islamic Front as, against overwhelming odds, they battled to retain control of the capital of the Syrian revolution.

LwSnyQYy5SE

[ProfTournesol 956]

Bashar welcomes foreign strikes :

Full quote from President Assad of Syria on the air strikes: "Syria will continue to resolutely fight the war it has been prosecuting for years against... terrorism. It supports any international effort to fight against terrorism."

Funny when you know how many people were killed the last 30 years in Lebanon through Assad's (and Assad's father) backed terror operations...

[ProfTournesol 956]

(VICE NEWS) Ghosts of Aleppo (Part 2) :

9SwnHL9MvmI

Part 3 is out, but a little too graphic to be hotlinked here.

Edited September 24, 2014 by ProfTournesol

[oxmox 73]

Most of you remember that the USA did report about investing $500 mill. to train more "moderate" rebels for syria.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2014/06/27/obama-wants-500-million-to-train-syrian-rebels-now-what/

Syrien rebels talk about the plan about the "moderate" rebels who should get trainend in Saudi Arabia (Saudi Arabia doesnt fit at all with "moderate" anyway). But they demand suddenly not training and more forces but weapons. “We need anti-aircraft weapons. We need anti-tank weapons."

A significant part of Obama’s plan hinges on congressional approval of $500 million to train and equip Free Syrian Army rebels to “strengthen the opposition as the best counterweight to the extremists,â€

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/15/us-usa-syria-rebels-insight-idUSKBN0HA0QX20140915

In the meanwhile some of the syrian rebels are saying the following.........................

Syrian Rebel Group Armed With US Weapons Condemns Airstrikes In Syria

The Harakat Hazm rebel group, a western-backed rebel group in Syria, has denounced U.S. airstrikes in the country.

“The sole beneficiary of foreign interference in Syria is the Assad regime, especially in the absence of any real strategy to topple it."

The rebel group has an estimated 7,000 fighters.

http://www.ibtimes.com/syrian-rebel-group-armed-us-weapons-condemns-airstrikes-syria-1693804

Edited September 24, 2014 by oxmox

[ProfTournesol 956]

Well indeed, the bombing and training strategy is rather weird in Syria, it's very doubtful it'll have any positive effect on the Syrian mess.

[ProfTournesol 956]

(VICE NEWS) Ghosts of Aleppo (Part 4) :

8iA36FPD3H0

[ProfTournesol 956]

Ghosts of Aleppo Part 5 is out, but is too graphic to be linked here. It's very interesting though. Aleppo is a never ending Stalingrad, where governement forces and Islamic rebels are exhausted but still fighting, while the IS is now more powerful than the regime itself. The "non IS" rebels (most of them being radical islamists too, like the IF shown by Vice News) are said suffering more casualties from IS than from the regime, but sadly those footage don't show this fight between Islamists. A never ending war.

[.kju 3245]

How do you come to those conclusions - from the vice video?

[ProfTournesol 956]

;2784492']How do you come to those conclusions - from the vice video?

Yep, from what is said in those videos, by the local leader of Islamic Front (i should have quoted him...). So that's not my "own" conclusion.

[negah 26]

http://www.n24.de/n24/Nachrichten/Politik/d/5449538/zivilisten-sollen-bei-us-luftschlaegen-getoetet-worden-sein.html

Mindestens sieben Menschen, darunter fünf Kinder, seien bei einem US-Angriff auf ein nordsyrisches Dorf am letzten Dienstag getötet worden, meldete Human Rights Watch (HRW) am Sonntag unter Berufung auf drei Augenzeugen.

Rough Translation:

According to Human Right Watch, who are referring to three eye witnesses, at least seven civilians, of whom 5 were children, were killed during a US strike on a village in northern Syria last Tuesday.

[surpher 1]

(Bellingcat) Captured Russian Spy Facility Reveals the Extent of Russian Aid to the Assad Regime

On the 5th of October 2014, the Free Syrian Army captured the Центр С – المركز س ‘Center C or Center S‘ SIGINT (Signals Intelligence) facility jointly operated by the Russian Osnaz GRU radio electronic intelligence agency and one of the Syrian Intelligence Agencies.

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

coming from a half-ass site and so-called FSA so it must be right? really!

[oxmox 73]

On the 5th of October 2014, the Free Syrian Army captured the Центр С – المركز س ‘Center C or Center S‘ SIGINT (Signals Intelligence) facility jointly operated by the Russian Osnaz GRU radio electronic intelligence agency and one of the Syrian Intelligence Agencies.

The russians have an important military harbour in Syria, this plays a role aswell. And actually Assad is the lesser evil when you compare it to the IS, thats why the US is bombing them even it supports indirect the Assad regime.

By the way, I wonder why there is no UN mandate at least for formality.

Edited October 6, 2014 by oxmox

[654wak654 25]

Oxmox totally ninjad me, my answer is to the below post's first paragraph.

Let's not forget PKK is (or was) a terrorist organization that Turkey had to deal with since the 80s, way before rest of the world got introduced to this kind of Islamic terrorism. I don't want to sound like I agree with RTE in anything, never will I ever want to agree with him in anything, though PKK is fighting IS obviously for their own survival. Can't blame them, but that doesn't mean they're fighting for the good of humanity all of a sudden.

Edited October 6, 2014 by 654wak654

[oxmox 73]

PKK, ISIL are the same, says ErdoÄŸan

The Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) terrorist group is not different from the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL), President Recep Tayyip ErdoÄŸan said on Saturday.

"For us, the PKK is the same as ISIL. It is wrong to consider them as different from each other," ErdoÄŸan told reporters in Ä°stanbul as he criticized the pro-Kurdish politicians in Turkey, who have criticized the government for not helping the Syrian Kurds defend the Kurdish town of Kobani near the border with Turkey.

Kobani has been attacked by ISIL and the Syrian Kurds call for help, warning of a massacre if the town is seized by ISIL.

Erdoğan criticized the pro-Kurdish politicians for linking the crisis in Kobani to Turkey's efforts to resolve the Kurdish issue through talks with the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) jailed leader Abdullah Öcalan, saying those who try to end the process "will pay the price."

Coalition warplanes destroyed one insurgent vehicle and killed five fighters during raids in the countryside to the east and south of Kobani on Friday night, the observatory said. Ten Kurdish fighters were also killed in heavy fighting that carried on long into the night.

http://www.todayszaman.com/diplomacy_pkk-isil-are-the-same-says-erdogan_360766.html

Syrian Kurds say air strikes against Isis are not working

Isis fighters have pushed to the edge of Kobani and evade western strikes, says spokesman for Kurdish fighters

US-led air strikes in northern Syria have failed to interrupt the advance of Islamic State (Isis) fighters closing in on a key city on the Turkish border, raising questions about the western strategy for defeating the jihadi movement.

Almost two weeks after the Pentagon extended its aerial campaign from Iraq to neighbouring Syria in an attempt to take on Isis militants in their desert strongholds, Kurdish fighters said the bombing campaign was having little impact in driving them back.

He said Isis had adapted its tactics to military strikes from the air. “Each time a jet approaches, they leave their open positions, they scatter and hide. What we really need is ground support.

“The strategy of aerial bombardment is not going to work to destroy Isil [isis],†the South Carolina senator Lindsey Graham told CNN. “You cannot destroy Isil without a ground component.†He argued that training the inexperienced fighters of the Free Syrian Army in Saudi Arabia was “militarily unsound†and “will lead to their slaughterâ€.

“If Isis takes Kobani, they will be right on the border with Turkey. This concerns not only us, but Turkey, too.â€

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/05/air-strikes-isis-not-working-syrian-kurds

@654wak654

The PKK is still listed in the EU as a terrorist organisation. Thats actually the dilemma since the Yazidi who got chased by the IS and which was big in the media, got actually support from the PKK Kurds and not from the Peshmerga Kurds. "There are good Kurds and bad Kurds" - which is inconsequent in the fight against the Islamic State and is an issue in this conflict. Weapons are delivered into the Iraq for the Peshemergas, but there is still the danger of killings of civilians in Syria from advancing IS troops. At the end probably nobody can control the weapon deliveries, especially not if the Kurds start to organize among themselves between Iraq and Syria.

Edited October 6, 2014 by oxmox

[ProfTournesol 956]

Turkey indeed faces a dilemma : let the coalition arm the PYD (Syrian PKK affiliate), or let IS threaten its border. The only solution would be to create a defense zone inside Syria by sending Turkish ground troops. Turkey seems to be waiting for IS to weaken the PYD first.

BTW, (Vice News) Meet the PKK 'Terrorists' Battling the Islamic State on the Frontlines of Iraq

Edited October 6, 2014 by ProfTournesol

[oxmox 73]

Hundreds of millions of dollars and tens, thousands of tons of weapons into anyone who would fight against Assad

Except that the people who were being supplied were al-Nusra and al-Qaeda and the extremist elements of jihadis coming from other parts of the world.

US-Vice President Biden about the support of extremists by Mideast Allies:

"Our biggest problem is our allies. Our allies in the region were our largest problem in Syria. The Turks were great friends, and I have a great relationship with Erdogan, which I’ve just spent a lot of time with.

The Saudis, the Emiratis, etc. What were they doing? They were so determined to take down Assad and essentially have a proxy Sunni-Shia war, what did they do? They poured hundreds of millions of dollars and tens, thousands of tons of weapons into anyone who would fight against Assad. Except that the people who were being supplied were al-Nusra and al-Qaeda and the extremist elements of jihadis coming from other parts of the world."

US-Vice President Biden, 2nd October 2014

This message did start diplomatic turmoils and Biden was forced to apologize:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2781345/Now-second-Arab-nation-demands-formal-clarification-day-Joe-Biden-forced-apologize-saying-key-American-allies-Mideast-gave-weapons-cash-ISIS-extremists.html

Wonder what kind of "moderate" fighters will get training in Saudi Arabia with $500 millions support, which is only a smaller part of the support from the US for fighters since the start of the conflict, other countries from the EU were funding them aswell.

Arming Syrian 'Moderate' Fighters Emboldens Islamic State (Huffington Post)

For years, IS has recruited former FSA fighters and seized weapons funneled to Iraq and Syria from the U.S. and other countries.

Given the lack of a unified command structure, the FSA is more of a loosely affiliated band of militias rather than an entity organized enough to deserve the term "army."

As Middle East expert Mark Lynch has noted, "the FSA was always more fiction than reality, with a structure on paper masking the reality of highly localized and fragmented fighting groups on the ground."

The line between the FSA and IS has always been blurry, and increasingly so. Scores of former FSA fighters have reportedly defected to join IS and other Islamic extremist groups. These shifting alliances are par for the course amongst Syria's fractious opposition, and collaboration between militia groups is common.

That is not to say that IS and FSA are the one in the same.The power of IS largely comes from its ability to recruit supporters from the FSA and other so-called moderate opposition groups.

It is worth remembering that IS owes its existence to conditions created by U.S. military intervention in Iraq and the sectarian violence that it unleashed. Prior to the U.S. invasion of Iraq in 2003, neither IS nor al Qaeda existed in Iraq.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kate-gould/arming-syrian-moderates_b_5835546.html

Edited October 6, 2014 by oxmox

[oxmox 73]

They talk about a GRU installation ( which is the foreign military intelligence main directorate of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation ). You may know that organization because it's the one that leads most of the Spetsnaz operations.

In fact no. One of the articles say:

While it also says:

Which makes a lot of sense watching the video, with a good bunch of photos of Russian soldiers in that installation and Russian documentation ( like a map of the base ).

The media did report about russian military adviser and intelligence in Syria already almost a year ago - actually already in 2012, what is so special in this case ?

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/01/17/uk-syria-russia-arms-idUKBREA0G0MO20140117

Edited October 12, 2014 by oxmox