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Syria - What should we do if anything?

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Saudi Arabia is one of most hardcore religious countries in globe,

yes, it is ally to US - i do not understand why, cause in Saudi Arabia you can be inprisoned for travel alone when you are women, they are Islamic Sharia country, i do not understand friendly relations of USA with SA, SA is all but not "freedom , democracy, tollerance"

Edited by vilas

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Saudi Arabia is one of most hardcore religious countries in globe,

yes, it is ally to US - i do not understand why, cause in Saudi Arabia you can be inprisoned for travel alone when you are women, they are Islamic Sharia country, i do not understand friendly relations of USA with SA, SA is all but not "freedom , democracy, tollerance"

Google for geopolitics in the middle east :).

One of the most famous influeantial geopolitician for US politics is actually someone who is polish. His name is Zbigniew Brzeziński.

I did post in this forum somewhere infos about a very interesting book from him, will try to find it again.

Edited by oxmox

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i know who is this Brzezinski (who lived in America since late 30s)

but i forget about oil (i confused geographical position of Saudi Arabia with smaller countries in region, yes, SA is big country and strategic point)

joke is that big part of Islaimic terrorizm is supported by US ally

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Victims of Syrian regime honoured at DC's Holocaust museum

A video installation of images smuggled out from Syria puts them in the context of the 20th century’s greatest atrocity, and the impact is profound.

The images in the video were smuggled out of Syria by a military photographer, assigned to take pictures of the corpses of those who died at the hands of the Assad regime.

The 10 or so photographs projected are part of a cache of more than 55,000 images smuggled out on flash drives by Caesar, a pseudonymous regime defector. As the video states, the photos “are believed to show people killed at Syrian intelligence and security agency detention centresâ€.

The photos are stark: dead bodies, bloodied, starved, often naked and displaying signs of torture. A couple of the pictures show dozens of faceless corpses.

But as the world’s attentions shift towards Isis, Kobani and the US-led coalition’s campaign to eradicate this latest evil; and as the war has moved in the public consciousness from civil war to proxy war, and to existential sectarian battle, many have forgotten the genesis of the Syrian war and the brutalities Bashar al-Assad has committed against his own people.

The Holocaust Museum is a living memorial as much as it is an educational experience: a testament to the fact that the horrors of the last century happened, that millions died and that many did nothing to stop it. As the Syrian war continues to drag on with no end in sight, and thousands more die with every passing month, I wonder how this war will be remembered. Will there be a memorial museum to its sins?

More than 200,000 people have been killed in Syria, most at the hands of the regime.

There is no doubt a visual comparison to be made between the bodies of those starved and tortured by Assad and those murdered in Nazi concentration camps.

http://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2014/oct/22/victims-syrian-regime-honoured-dc-holocaust-museum

background story:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/holocaust-museum-shows-images-of-syrian-killings/2014/10/15/20c80bd8-547b-11e4-b86d-184ac281388d_story.html

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-25822571

http://www.dw.de/syrian-regime-accused-of-systematic-torture-and-killing/a-17375259

Edited by oxmox

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Syrian 'hero boy' video faked by Norwegian director

Millions of YouTube viewers have been captivated by the 'Syrian hero boy' who manages to rescue a little girl while under gunfire. Now a group of Norwegian filmmakers have told BBC Trending they are behind it. They say it was filmed on location in Malta this summer with the intention of being presented as real.

n fact the film received funding from the Norwegian Film Institute (NFI) and the Audio and Visual Fund from Arts Council Norway in October 2013. The filmmakers say their application for funding made clear they wanted to upload the film to the internet without making it obvious it was real or fiction. They also claim that those who financed it were aware of, and supported, these intentions. Within four days it had been watched over five million times and inspired thousands of comments.

http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-30057401

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Geopolitics and Syria: The Role of the US, Iran, Syria, Russia and Saudi Arabia (The Guardian)

Syria intervention plan fueled by oil interests, not chemical weapon concern

On 21 August, hundreds - perhaps over a thousand - people were killed in a chemical weapon attack in Ghouta, Damascus, prompting the US, UK, Israel and France to raise the spectre of military strikes against Bashir al Assad's forces.

Whatever the case, few recall that US agitation against Syria began long before recent atrocities, in the context of wider operations targeting Iranian influence across the Middle East.

In May 2007, a presidential finding revealed that Bush had authorised CIA operations against Iran. Anti-Syria operations were also in full swing around this time as part of this covert programme, according to Seymour Hersh in the New Yorker.

A range of US government and intelligence sources told him that the Bush administration had "cooperated with Saudi Arabia's government, which is Sunni, in clandestine operations" intended to weaken the Shi'ite Hezbollah in Lebanon.

"The US has also taken part in clandestine operations aimed at Iran and its ally Syria," wrote Hersh, "a byproduct" of which is "the bolstering of Sunni extremist groups" hostile to the United States and "sympathetic to al-Qaeda."

He noted that "the Saudi government, with Washington's approval, would provide funds and logistical aid to weaken the government of President Bashir Assad, of Syria," with a view to pressure him to be "more conciliatory and open to negotiations" with Israel.

One faction receiving covert US "political and financial support" through the Saudis was the exiled Syrian Muslim Brotherhood.

According to former French foreign minister Roland Dumas, Britain had planned covert action in Syria as early as 2009: "I was in England two years before the violence in Syria on other business", he told French television:

"I met with top British officials, who confessed to me that they were preparing something in Syria. This was in Britain not in America. Britain was preparing gunmen to invade Syria."

The 2011 uprisings, it would seem - triggered by a confluence of domestic energy shortages and climate-induced droughts which led to massive food price hikes - came at an opportune moment that was quickly exploited.

Leaked emails from the private intelligence firm Stratfor including notes from a meeting with Pentagon officials confirmed US-UK training of Syrian opposition forces since 2011 aimed at eliciting "collapse" of Assad's regime "from within."

So what was this unfolding strategy to undermine Syria and Iran all about?

According to retired NATO Secretary General Wesley Clark, a memo from the Office of the US Secretary of Defense just a few weeks after 9/11 revealed plans to "attack and destroy the governments in 7 countries in five years", starting with Iraq and moving on to "Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Iran." In a subsequent interview, Clark argues that this strategy is fundamentally about control of the region's vast oil and gas resources.

Much of the strategy currently at play was candidly described in a 2008 US Army-funded RAND report, Unfolding the Future of the Long War (pdf)

The report noted that "the economies of the industrialized states will continue to rely heavily on oil, thus making it a strategically important resource." As most oil will be produced in the Middle East, the US has "motive for maintaining stability in and good relations with Middle Eastern states":

"The geographic area of proven oil reserves coincides with the power base of much of the Salafi-jihadist network. This creates a linkage between oil supplies and the long war that is not easily broken or simply characterized... For the foreseeable future, world oil production growth and total output will be dominated by Persian Gulf resources... The region will therefore remain a strategic priority, and this priority will interact strongly with that of prosecuting the long war."

"Divide and Rule focuses on exploiting fault lines between the various Salafi-jihadist groups to turn them against each other and dissipate their energy on internal conflicts. This strategy relies heavily on covert action, information operations (IO), unconventional warfare, and support to indigenous security forces... the United States and its local allies could use the nationalist jihadists to launch proxy IO campaigns to discredit the transnational jihadists in the eyes of the local populace... US leaders could also choose to capitalize on the 'Sustained Shia-Sunni Conflict' trajectory by taking the side of the conservative Sunni regimes against Shiite empowerment movements in the Muslim world.... possibly supporting authoritative Sunni governments against a continuingly hostile Iran."

Exploring different scenarios for this trajectory, the report speculated that the US may concentrate "on shoring up the traditional Sunni regimes in Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Pakistan as a way of containing Iranian power and influence in the Middle East and Persian Gulf."

These strategic concerns, motivated by fear of expanding Iranian influence, impacted Syria primarily in relation to pipeline geopolitics.

In 2009 - the same year former French foreign minister Dumas alleges the British began planning operations in Syria - Assad refused to sign a proposed agreement with Qatar that would run a pipeline from the latter's North field, contiguous with Iran's South Pars field, through Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria and on to Turkey, with a view to supply European markets - albeit crucially bypassing Russia.

Assad's rationale was "to protect the interests of [his] Russian ally, which is Europe's top supplier of natural gas."

The Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline plan was a "direct slap in the face" to Qatar's plans. No wonder Saudi Prince Bandar bin Sultan, in a failed attempt to bribe Russia to switch sides, told President Vladmir Putin that "whatever regime comes after" Assad, it will be "completely" in Saudi Arabia's hands and will "not sign any agreement allowing any Gulf country to transport its gas across Syria to Europe and compete with Russian gas exports"

complete report:

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2013/aug/30/syria-chemical-attack-war-intervention-oil-gas-energy-pipelines

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The cutthroat competition against Russians gas supply is for sure not a conspiracy since there are official statements from politicians about it. To miscredit the whole article is quiete adventurous.

Edited by oxmox

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The cutthroad competition against Russians gas supply is for sure not a conspiracy since there are official statements from politicians about it.

I've edited my post, but don't believe Roland DUMAS, the life of this guy shows how unreliable he can be.

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Geopolitics and Syria: The Role of the US, Iran, Syria, Russia and Saudi Arabia (The Guardian)

Syria intervention plan fueled by oil interests, not chemical weapon concern

On 21 August, hundreds - perhaps over a thousand - people were killed in a chemical weapon attack in Ghouta, Damascus, prompting the US, UK, Israel and France to raise the spectre of military strikes against Bashir al Assad's forces.

Whatever the case, few recall that US agitation against Syria began long before recent atrocities, in the context of wider operations targeting Iranian influence across the Middle East.

In May 2007, a presidential finding revealed that Bush had authorised CIA operations against Iran. Anti-Syria operations were also in full swing around this time as part of this covert programme, according to Seymour Hersh in the New Yorker.

A range of US government and intelligence sources told him that the Bush administration had "cooperated with Saudi Arabia's government, which is Sunni, in clandestine operations" intended to weaken the Shi'ite Hezbollah in Lebanon.

"The US has also taken part in clandestine operations aimed at Iran and its ally Syria," wrote Hersh, "a byproduct" of which is "the bolstering of Sunni extremist groups" hostile to the United States and "sympathetic to al-Qaeda."

He noted that "the Saudi government, with Washington's approval, would provide funds and logistical aid to weaken the government of President Bashir Assad, of Syria," with a view to pressure him to be "more conciliatory and open to negotiations" with Israel.

One faction receiving covert US "political and financial support" through the Saudis was the exiled Syrian Muslim Brotherhood.

According to former French foreign minister Roland Dumas, Britain had planned covert action in Syria as early as 2009: "I was in England two years before the violence in Syria on other business", he told French television:

"I met with top British officials, who confessed to me that they were preparing something in Syria. This was in Britain not in America. Britain was preparing gunmen to invade Syria."

The 2011 uprisings, it would seem - triggered by a confluence of domestic energy shortages and climate-induced droughts which led to massive food price hikes - came at an opportune moment that was quickly exploited.

Leaked emails from the private intelligence firm Stratfor including notes from a meeting with Pentagon officials confirmed US-UK training of Syrian opposition forces since 2011 aimed at eliciting "collapse" of Assad's regime "from within."

So what was this unfolding strategy to undermine Syria and Iran all about?

According to retired NATO Secretary General Wesley Clark, a memo from the Office of the US Secretary of Defense just a few weeks after 9/11 revealed plans to "attack and destroy the governments in 7 countries in five years", starting with Iraq and moving on to "Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Iran." In a subsequent interview, Clark argues that this strategy is fundamentally about control of the region's vast oil and gas resources.

Much of the strategy currently at play was candidly described in a 2008 US Army-funded RAND report, Unfolding the Future of the Long War (pdf)

The report noted that "the economies of the industrialized states will continue to rely heavily on oil, thus making it a strategically important resource." As most oil will be produced in the Middle East, the US has "motive for maintaining stability in and good relations with Middle Eastern states":

"The geographic area of proven oil reserves coincides with the power base of much of the Salafi-jihadist network. This creates a linkage between oil supplies and the long war that is not easily broken or simply characterized... For the foreseeable future, world oil production growth and total output will be dominated by Persian Gulf resources... The region will therefore remain a strategic priority, and this priority will interact strongly with that of prosecuting the long war."

"Divide and Rule focuses on exploiting fault lines between the various Salafi-jihadist groups to turn them against each other and dissipate their energy on internal conflicts. This strategy relies heavily on covert action, information operations (IO), unconventional warfare, and support to indigenous security forces... the United States and its local allies could use the nationalist jihadists to launch proxy IO campaigns to discredit the transnational jihadists in the eyes of the local populace... US leaders could also choose to capitalize on the 'Sustained Shia-Sunni Conflict' trajectory by taking the side of the conservative Sunni regimes against Shiite empowerment movements in the Muslim world.... possibly supporting authoritative Sunni governments against a continuingly hostile Iran."

Exploring different scenarios for this trajectory, the report speculated that the US may concentrate "on shoring up the traditional Sunni regimes in Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Pakistan as a way of containing Iranian power and influence in the Middle East and Persian Gulf."

These strategic concerns, motivated by fear of expanding Iranian influence, impacted Syria primarily in relation to pipeline geopolitics.

In 2009 - the same year former French foreign minister Dumas alleges the British began planning operations in Syria - Assad refused to sign a proposed agreement with Qatar that would run a pipeline from the latter's North field, contiguous with Iran's South Pars field, through Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria and on to Turkey, with a view to supply European markets - albeit crucially bypassing Russia.

Assad's rationale was "to protect the interests of [his] Russian ally, which is Europe's top supplier of natural gas."

The Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline plan was a "direct slap in the face" to Qatar's plans. No wonder Saudi Prince Bandar bin Sultan, in a failed attempt to bribe Russia to switch sides, told President Vladmir Putin that "whatever regime comes after" Assad, it will be "completely" in Saudi Arabia's hands and will "not sign any agreement allowing any Gulf country to transport its gas across Syria to Europe and compete with Russian gas exports"

complete report:

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2013/aug/30/syria-chemical-attack-war-intervention-oil-gas-energy-pipelines

I've edited my post, but don't believe Roland DUMAS, the life of this guy shows how unreliable he can be.

Well, here is your chance to google and find infos about an agreement between Qatar and Syria and such pipelines if you want to dig deeper. I know only that Dumas was a french foreign minister and President of the Constitutional Council of France, cant say anything about the realiability of his statements.

---------- Post added at 06:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:10 PM ----------

Interesting to read just as additional historical info about Syria & gepolitics decades ago:

March 1949 Syrian coup d'état

"An overarching U.S. policy objective in Syria at the time was allowing the construction of the Trans-Arabian Pipeline, which the democratically elected government of Syria had blocked. The "Tapline" project was immediately ratified following the coup.[2]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_1949_Syrian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat

Edited by oxmox

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oxmox - probably 90% of wars in modern history were because small group wanted to make big money and get power , but in deeper history it was because of religions,

yes, there are different interests of US, Saudi Arabia, Russian , but also big role is religious fanatism , people who made most of attacks were not fighting for oil, but to establish caliphate, there is large group os islamists that are mad to set their beliefs as state law for others , they not look for profits - cause they believe in dying to get life after life, they fight not for money but to reach "eternal life",

in case of Syria man in rule was from other part of religion than society - which made society against him,

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oxmox - probably 90% of wars in modern history were because small group wanted to make big money and get power , but in deeper history it was because of religions,

yes, there are different interests of US, Saudi Arabia, Russian , but also big role is religious fanatism , people who made most of attacks were not fighting for oil, but to establish caliphate, there is large group os islamists that are mad to set their beliefs as state law for others , they not look for profits - cause they believe in dying to get life after life, they fight not for money but to reach "eternal life",

in case of Syria man in rule was from other part of religion than society - which made society against him,

Fanatic religion plays still a role nowadays, actually thats the premise to a certain point to exploit it by those who teach terrorism, organize or support and probably morph it for their political aims. Western influence, pressure and historical events in the last ~100 years is another point, maybe some call it "blowback". The whole middle east itself is estranged between shias and sunnites and a gruesome war of influence and power is going on.

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Protocols: Turkish intelligence is said to supplied weapons to al-Qaida (SPIEGEL report;google translated)

Turkey has long been suspected of supporting extremists in Syria. The government denies that. Now, hackers have published secret protocols, after which the intelligence sent three trucks to al-Qaeda. They contained weapons.

It is now nearly a year ago, on 19 January 2014 the gendarmerie in the Turkish province of Adana stopped three trucks on the way to Syria. The inspectors had received a notice that weapons were transported. Attorney Aziz Takci signed a search warrant.

The incident leaked to the public. But more than a rumor that there were weapons in the freight for extremists, was initially not known. Because shortly after a news blackout was imposed. The case was registered as one of many examples of weapons smuggling into Syria, which was reported cautious about it. Then Prime Minister and current President Recep Tayyip Erdogan publicly declared: "You can not have the truck - stop MIT, you have no authority to These trucks transporting humanitarian aid (d Red intelligence..!)."

The protocoll of the gendarmerie, which has the stamp "SECRET"/ "GÄ°ZLÄ°", and a group of hackers who tweets underLazepeM, published this week, tells a different story. The partly handwritten document boosts the suspicion that the government supported extremists in order to harm the hated Syrian ruler Bashar al-Assad. Accordingly, the freight for al-Qaida was determined, it says: weapons, missiles and ammunition. The convoy was accompanied by intelligence officials in an Audi.

Governor prevented further search

If you believe the protocol, the MIT agents protested loudly against the search. However, neither the prosecutor Takci nor inspectors did care about the matter, seized the three trucks and let them go into nearby barracks. The 13 soldiers who searched the load were insulted by the secret service. Undeterred, they searched more and opened six containers in which missiles and ammunition were found. The protocol lists the finding exactly. The boxes were labeled with Cyrillic letters, a reference to the Russian origin.

During the search the governor of Adana showed up, Hüseyin Avni Cos. He instructed the police to carry on the vehicles immediately. "The trucks drive on the orders of the Prime Minister personally," he said and handed the attorney a letter from the regional WITH chief and himself. The inspectors had no other choice than to let the convoy proceed.

Since then, Erdogan and his successors the Prime Minister have repeatedly stressed, the delivery would have been supplies for Turkmen. It was left unanswered, why actually the intelligence coordinated the shipment.

Government blocked websites

Instead, prosecutor Takci lost his job. The soldiers who were involved in the search are currently under investigation for espionage. If convicted, they could face long prison sentences.

Following the publication of the secret document in the early hours of Wednesday the government was blocking all sides who report about it. A court ordered even the blocking of Twitter and Faceboo, if they would not delete such content. All sites who report about the case must be closed, judges said. The Twitter account ofLazepeM was then no longer accessible by the turkish net.

The video platform YouTube and Twitter were closed in the past year for weeks because it had been published recordings of telephone conversations and discussions, among other things, with the participation of Erdogan. The Turkish Constitutional Court had conceded both bans again.

The opposition took advantage of the opportunity now to accuse the government, they support extremists abroad and is partly responsible for the chaos in the region. The publication of the secret protocol suggests that Turkey is facing a tough, dirty election campaign. In summer, the country elect a new parliament and a new government.

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/tuerkischer-geheimdienst-soll-waffen-an-al-qaida-geliefert-haben-a-1013499.html

http://www.handelsblatt.com/politik/international/staerkung-von-assad-gegnern-tuerkei-lieferte-angeblich-waffen-an-al-qaida/11243500.html

ZDF (2nd state channel) TV report:

http://www.zdf.de/ZDFmediathek/beitrag/video/2323968/Al-Kaida-Waffen-aus-Ankara%253F#/beitrag/video/2323968/Al-Kaida-Waffen-aus-Ankara%3F

Edited by oxmox

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U.S. troops for Syria training mission seen moving to region soon

Several hundred U.S. military trainers will begin moving to the Middle East in the next four to six weeks amid efforts to start training this spring for moderate Syrian opposition forces who will battle Islamic State fighters, the Pentagon said on Friday.

The U.S. military has said it is planning to send more than 400 troops, including special operations forces, to train Syrian moderates outside the country. The U.S. trainers would be accompanied by hundreds of support troops.

U.S. officials have said they plan to train about 5,000 Syrian fighters a year for three years.

Kirby said the training was expected to last several months and if it began by early spring, some opposition groups could be "getting back into Syria and into the fight ... before the end of the year."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/17/us-mideast-crisis-training-idUSKBN0KP28K20150117

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From the interviewer of Bashar weird interview posted above :

(BBC) What does Assad really think about Syria's civil war ?

cynical liar or a president fighting for the best interests of his country? As Syria enters its fifth year of conflict, how much responsibility does President Bashar al-Assad believe he bears for his nation's crisis?
I have been wondering why Bashar al-Assad said something to me that was patently not true.
Perhaps the president believes what he says. Perhaps his generals tell him they don't kill civilians and he believes him. Maybe he is a cynical liar. I don't know. It's all guesswork.

Ever since he inherited the job from his father Hafez al-Assad in 2000, diplomats, journalists and anyone with an interest in Syria have spent a lot of time trying to work Bashar out. Many of the questions over the last 15 years have revolved around one central issue - is Bashar al-Assad really in charge?

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Turkey & USA want to equip and train 15000 Syrian rebels

The training is expected to start in March, simultaneously with similar programmes in Jordan and Saudi Arabia, the Turkish official said. The aim is to train 15,000 Syrian rebels over three years.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/01/05/uk-mideast-crisis-rebels-turkey-idUKKBN0KE15420150105

I wonder how many of them will join IS after they got trained like it did happen before.....

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training islamists by west is far beyond my imagination of anything that could be called "self survive instinct" of west , first they trained Bin Laden, druglords like Escobar etc. now after all this caliphate they want to train islamists - i really do not understand it, maybe rich of this world do all to have WW3 and clash of civilisations (all this politcal correctnes together with tollearance to islamists and now training those who are known to be part of creators of caliphate (religious extremists fighting with Assad who was not religious extremist cause there were no problems for tourist sightseeing and even Christians had rights there opposite to other Middle East countries), this all in effect will only cause big problems in Europe in few years, when half of those trained will join caliphate and return to Europe to kill us here for being infidels, while we in EU are being disarmed more and more)

some western rulers do not want to understand that all this violence is due to religion, they do all to close others eyes and now even want to train those who fight shouting "Allah Akbar" ? Syrian rebels - i seen dozens of movies on YT what kind of rebels they are - they are just religious extremists who want to establish religious caliphate, nothing more, it will end like in other Middle East countries - like we know from Lybia, when thanx to Quadafii there was possibility to travel and sightsee, than first thing were destroying Christian graves from WW2

Edited by vilas

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New Study Says Climate Change Helped Spark Syrian Civil War

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2015/03/02/study_climate_change_helped_spark_syrian_civil_war.html

By now, it’s pretty clear that we’re starting to see visible manifestations of climate change beyond far-off melting ice sheets. One of the most terrifying implications is the increasingly real threat of wars sparked in part by global warming. New evidence says that Syria may be one of the first such conflicts.

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From 2006-2010, an unprecedented drought forced the country from a groundwater-intensive breadbasket of the region to a net food importer. Farmers abandoned their homes—school enrollment in some areas plummeted 80 percent—and flooded Syria’s cities, which were already struggling to sustain an influx of more than 1 million refugees from the conflict in neighboring Iraq. The Syrian government largely ignored these warning signs, helping sow discontent that ultimately spawned violent protests. The link from drought to war was prominently featured in a Showtime documentary last year. A preventable drought-triggered humanitarian crisis sparked the 2011 civil war, and eventually, ISIS.

Wow. Such an idiotic article. I believe that much of the western United States is currently in a drought, particularly California, yet no one has started a civil war there. No one is killing each other. The Dust Bowl in the 1930's sure didn't cause a civil war or people to form extremist groups.

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You the expert know it all. I guess we all should be relieved then. :)

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;2892010']You the expert know it all. I guess we all should be relieved then. :)

I did not say I was an expert. I simply voiced my opinion on the article. Humans have this amazing ability to adapt to climate changes. You cannot blame climate change when it comes to political instability.

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Did you read the article at all? It said it was (one of) the major contributing factor - not the only one.

Also you should follow all the references linked in there if you want to actually make an informed opinion.

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