P&C BETA first impressions

[Mr. Charles 22]

I think the Mantas fly very nice when you get the hang of it.

W thrust forward

Q thrust upward

Mouse - Turn left and right

A strafe left

D strafe right

s brake

[JaffaTheCake 10]

First impressions are really good. It definately feels like Carrier Command, but with all the extras one would expect.

One thing I had trouble with is meeting the enemy carrier while in the "Time Warp". It's pretty much game over. By the time I am out of it the enemy carrier has almost destroyed my ship. It would be nice to get a little extra warning and time to prepare for battle.

Also noticed the joypad support, which works really well. Is this going to be ported to the consoles?

[Gazzareth 1]

Also noticed the joypad support, which works really well. Is this going to be ported to the consoles?

They have said that is the case, hence the new engine - although they have not confirmed which consoles are on the list !!

G

[Derbysieger 11]

I agree with Mr. Charles. I like the mantas very much. I usually go with light armor, ammo box, gatling gun and rockets... Works really well. One hit with a rocket usually kills everything you can find on the ground and the gatling gun is awesome against mantas and even quite usefull vs ground targets.

I still find this game not easy. It's very challenging. I struggle the most against the other carrier - only destroyed it once and that was damn close. It can be quite hard to keep the supply lines up when you're under pressure.

I obviously never played the original (I was born in '88^^) so this is something completely new to me. And I really enjoy it so far.

[JaffaTheCake 10]

They have said that is the case, hence the new engine - although they have not confirmed which consoles are on the list !!

G

Ah thanks, didn't see that.

This could work really well with the Wii U pad...

[Coyota 10]

First impression is good. Need to play more though.

Nice graphics and very nice soundtrack.

Vehicle controls feels mostly ok.

When turning walrus it feels like it loses all power. This could be reduced some.

When assigning waypoint, path finding seems to work but when ordering attack enemy there was some problems.

Like walrus tried to drive thru my carrier instead of going around.

In manual theres picture of repair screen where prioritys are set Low,Mid,High & Top. How is this done?

I only managed to change between Low and Top (LMB).

One thing I had trouble with is meeting the enemy carrier while in the "Time Warp". It's pretty much game over. By the time I am out of it the enemy carrier has almost destroyed my ship. It would be nice to get a little extra warning and time to prepare for battle.

Enemy carrier by a island or middle of the sea?

i have only encountered carrier by island and at least then timewarp is dropped well before carriers are in range.

Carrier vs carrier causes CTD for me so not so much experience of fight itself.

[JaffaTheCake 10]

I was just leaving an island when I met the other carrier. By the time I had come out of the Timewarp it was next to me and attacking. I have met it again in another game and had enough time to prepare, so I'm not sure if it ill be a problem.

[EDcase 87]

My notes after playing several hours:

-I find the production too slow. Only one item at a time and each one takes ages even if all the islands are equally producing and mining (no defence) I even tried with settings giving me almost all the islands at start and its still really slow. Its very frustrating to lose equipment when a Manta or Walrus is destroyed and takes ages to produce then get supplied.

-You could say the 'Supply barge' is a submarine to explain why its not visible.

-The lists and graphics are too monotone blue. eg empty items could be pale red and full could be pale green.

-Needs error sound when item cannot be produced/loaded etc. At the moment it makes same sound if you load an item and if you cannot.

-Option to delete save games

-I would suggest renaming "Undock" to "Launch". (Would be good to have a 'Launch' and 'Dock' button under each vehicle icon)

-I don't know if its something I did wrong or a bug but if any of my islands are attacked or taken then all production stops.

-Mantas could have more turbulence when flying in bad weather?

-I would like to have a freeview option for vehicles to look around.

-More external camera views of vehicles like a more distant follow cam. (to appreciate the great rope dynamics of lifting a Walrus)

-Bug minor: In snowstorm Walrus 1st person look up and snow disappears.

-Bug minor: Report of bad weather even when clear.

-I've also had several crashes while attacking enemy carrier with plasma cannon. (maybe the AI is a poor loser :D )

Game looks and sounds great. Very atmospheric.

Would like to have longer viewdistance in good weather.

Will there be more music during gameplay in final?

Well done so far guys!

Edited April 8, 2012 by EDcase

[gunso 10]

Hey BIS great game as always, you should provide us a sample of the soundtrack earlier, it's great. I should have taken the package with the soundtrack if i knew it's that good.....

Overall from my view:-

- Island capture and fight is really great but could do with a few more improvement because it felt too easy if i simply use the AI to fight. They can kill any enemy easily while a player will less likely to land in hits. I would like to suggest that when a player took over an AI unit, it should gain some better rate of firepower to offset the human targeting capability. There should be more incentive to let the player take over the AI more frequently.

- I feel like BIS have concentrated a lot on the island, ground and air battle but the battle with the enemy carrier seems to lack a lot to me. I feel that it would be better if the carrier fights like actual warship, not zip and dash like the original version. It should have slow speed too due to the size in term of acceleration with all the mass and armor.

A few Suggestion:

- Upgradable carrier subsystems like armor weapons and etc, make it so player will have to choose to have the heaviest armor but will sacrifice speed for it and etc. Radar range, carrier weapons, type of weapons on front, sides or aft. Give the option to player to customize their carrier, would be a really great addition for long battle on bigger maps or even campaign.

- Factory to manufacture escort ships, carrier shouldn't really zip around without any escort anyway. Battle with the enemy carrier can be done using formation and attacking while passing like ship battle should. Player will adjust their formation base on their carrier configuration whether to shield the carrier, rear defense for retreating or exposing the carrier for maximum firepower.

- Increase carrier armor so that small guns on the carrier will not sink a big fully armored carrier anyway, carrier attack strategy should be to attack the ship subsystems to cripple it, then get in closer to give the killing blow. Any hit on the armored hull should be considered as minor and shouldn't give lots of damage. Manta and walrus will be critical in landing this pinpoint hits to the enemy subsytems. Then the carrier will be used to land in bigger hits.

Overall it's a great game but require a bit more work. come on guys, make it like arma. Give the player option based on his game style. I'm not talking about mod but the player ability to choose, it is what made arma2 a really engaging game. But do the same for carrier command in term of the sea battles too. Maybe throw in enemy ship in island defense too to keep the player in practice for the final confrontation with the enemy carrier.

[AstroMan 10]

I want to kick my self every time i start the game for not getting the supporters version, that soundtrack in the menu is just amazing.

The voice acting so far seem good aswell :p

The view distance while out at see isn't great. Would be nice to see further. When the enemy carrier shows up on my radar i freak out Because I don't no when it will be in sight, and then it turns up like a ghost.

Great game, hope we have a chance to get that soundtrack another way.

[mosh 0]

I have only put a couple hours in but here are my first impressions... this all coming from someone has has never played the original CC nor did I have a clue what to expect.

-runs smooth, all options defaulted to max so just kept it

-looks great but seems a little blurry and I don't see very far

-I was/am pretty much lost, might have to read manual eventually

-I enjoy being lost, not a simple game to figure out which is refreshing

-still at stage of just flying around\driving tank thing just blowing shit up or getting blown up

-haven't messed with supplies and repairs and stuff

-neat concept, like I said I had no idea what I was getting into

-no crashes but haven't had a carrier battle yet either

-great music, no surprise there

-didn't like time warp thing, why can't I just enjoy the journey?

-wish I could get get 3rd person view or at least scroll out a little to see how cool the vehicles look

I really didn't expect to have this much fun from a beta. :)

[Nicholas 5]

-didn't like time warp thing, why can't I just enjoy the journey?)

If you hit the little "Cancel" button below the screen during time warp, it will cancel time warp while keeping the waypoint.

[Amuro 10]

I think the Mantas fly very nice when you get the hang of it.

W thrust forward

Q thrust upward

Mouse - Turn left and right

A strafe left

D strafe right

s brake

Still want joystick support.

[shemone 1]

-wish I could get get 3rd person view or at least scroll out a little to see how cool the vehicles look

Pressing "C" Gives you 3rd Person, though it can't be used in the Carrier Dock or during the Docking procedure :)

[Averon01 1]

I haven't had any of the CTDs when facing the enemy carrier, tbh I haven't had any yet. I have encountered a bug when it was autosaving. All my vehicles that had been launched disappeared like that had been destroyed. It could of been some of the enemy carriers hacks to finish me off though as we were both kinda duelling in the middle of the ocean :).

[mosh 0]

If you hit the little "Cancel" button below the screen during time warp, it will cancel time warp while keeping the waypoint.

Pressing "C" Gives you 3rd Person, though it can't be used in the Carrier Dock or during the Docking procedure :)

Thanks for the info. :)

[1LT.Wolf.F 10]

Initial Impressions:

Wow!!! First things first, the Environment, Graphics, and Sound, are awesome if not perfect. I waited for the menu song to finish, watching the snow drop from tree's simple but nice effect. The weather, especially Thunderstorms are wonderful i love coming out of time warp into the storm.

Manual:

There is a little confusion in the "how to cap neutral islands" which I think would be fixed by adding to the manual the Map Icons for island buildings: say the Command Centre (down-arrow with Base line). I honestly thought I needed to build on the harbour building, then the Triangle Icon, then I tried all/each one I came across, until I scouted enough and found the Command Centre. (a forum user helped me out, )

In Game User Interface:

1st Person Control: Very nice, my only suggestion is the Mantes needs a mouse "free-look" or "Aiming Dead-zone" (akin to ArmA's) for Mantes, the turrets in the Carrier and Walruses cover this. There was Auto aim, which I haven't tested.

Map Controls:

It seems odd or frustrating that control (and visibility) of units is seemingly restricted to the inner most zoom levels (basically the zooms where the island map texture is drawn). Levels above this (when the island texture changes to the colour of the faction in control of the island) the walruses / mantes location/orders are not drawn.

If there is to be no Fluid zoom, can there be at least a zoom level which covers a) Telemetry zoom where you can see the entire Telemetry circle AND the units inside without having to scroll/pan an zoom the map. b) Island Tactical (close an detailed) and Strategic (see the whole island and unit positions)

Carrier Manual Speed Control resets to 0 or "all stop" when checking the map... Perhaps a "manual bearing & speed hold" so we can use the carrier tactically - i.e. engage at ranges beyond the enemy carrier's AA guns, or when skirting the island for jammer missions. I know you can set a way-point, but it's always followed @ full speed, great for intercepting, but fails for tactical control.

Things to consider adding:

I think we need a First Person Commander view from the bridge

I think the telemetry circle should have an inner circle which denotes perfect visual range or the range where telemetry data starts getting fuzzy...

a copy of the original? Licensing probably a bitch... I never played Carrier Command, back then I needed only Zarch, but I wish I played CC now...

System Specs:

Win8cp-64bit (sorry but FYI it's working perfectly)

Q9550 2.8GHz on Asus P5Q

8GB DDR2 Dual-Chanel RAM

AMD HD6850 (ASUS EAH6850 Direct Cu)

X-FI Fatality - PCI sound card

2 x SSD SATA-II (one for windows, one for games)

Edited April 8, 2012 by FedaykinWolf

[Gazzareth 1]

Initial Impressions:

I think we need a First Person Commander view from the bridge

a copy of the original? Licensing probably a bitch... I never played Carrier Command, back then I needed only Zarch, but I wish I played CC now...

1) Agree, that would be much better than just a 3rd person

2) Already freely available do a search for Carrier Command Abandonware and you should get it - PC version runs fine on DOSBox....

G

[1LT.Wolf.F 10]

True, I should have added that to my DOSbox list, that was short-sighted. ;)

As for the First Person Commander... I can't stop imagining Admiral Bosch from Freespace 2 at the helm, with that great dialogue, it seems utterly fitting for this game.

See:

[a1acrity 1]

I thought as this was a Beta I would put my first impressions down.

I remember CC from my Amiga in around 1988, what a great strategy game it was, so I was really pleased that there was going to be a new version using the full power of modern computers

the concept of paying for a Beta was novel, but if it gets a game out then OK I'm in. It also sets my expectations, I know the game will crash! That said I recently bought Wargame, European Escalation and that crashes too, perhaps they should have copied the Beta Idea!

So anticipation rising I paid and downloaded the game, the tension was rising! Then I installed it, I was on the edge of my seat, for the first time in over 20 years I was going to play CC! ALERT ALERT! AVG virus has found a virus WIN32/Heur! Bugger! Stop everything. Email support.

The next morning an email was back saying it was just a heuristic check and a false alarm. So I made an exception on AVG and got on with it. It installed. It started. Oh wow this was going to be great!

The mouse went sluggish on the opening screen, so I turned the graphics down.

Then for the moment, new game. Oh wow, the graphics are beautiful, the ship looks lovely, the walrus goes through the water with splashes on the screen (really nice touch!), the manta flies well, sluggish and hard to get right, just like it should be. So I crashed both (ooops) tried to fire missiles (still haven't worked that out) and generally worked out the other controls, they are very natural, nice.

So I set off to the first island, into time warp and locked up. Oh well it is a beta. Restart........

[max power 21]

Welcome to the forum a1acrity, and thank you for your feedback.

I will merge this thread into the existing first impressions thread. In the future please search before making a new thread to make sure there isn't a thread that exists with the same topic. Also, make sure you're posting in the right forum.

edit: I guess there are two betas out now. Do you have the P&C Beta or the steam one?

edit2: I guess by the little pin you have there, it's the P&C one!

Edited April 9, 2012 by Max Power

[a1acrity 1]

thanks Max, it is the P&C Supporters Beta.

I suppose I should have tried to find this out before buying but how often will there be updates?

[zopzodeman 2]

So after investing whole easter sunday in playing and testing heres my second impressions plus suggestions post :

- graphics are really nice , dynamic weather really looks believable , trees sway , windows get ice flowers when in blizzard , the moderate island really make you want to get out of a walrus or manta and have a leisure day at the beach or a nice lake.

- sound effects are ok , music is really realy nice and epical (want to be able to hear music all times)

- gameplay feels good and is fun , although the ai is of not much use in fighting/conquering because casualities are to high then and are hard to replace with the current speed of resource gathering and building , so i mostly fly a lonely fully upgraded manta out (gatling/laser,missiles, armor mk2 and ammo box) and take the "gunship"-approach ,slowly and cautiosly killing defences,manta hangars and walrus bunkers before sending in walrusses to hack command hq , science building(not of much use right now) and either hacking or killing the command center. I tried it with 4 walrusses to take an island (one quadgun/flak,two heat/shell and one with a repair laser) , but was to eager and so lost them after conquering half the island.Some Island are easy to take (the flat ones ,moderate) and others are really hard (winter islands with huge mountains) because you see the defences quite late and ai walrus have a hard time firing uphill.I also run across some foot soldiers/bots (not really sure,they were taken out fast by ai).Island defence is quite able to fend off attacks,especially mantas and walrusses get replaced fast there . Battling the enemy carrier can be hard,because it is able to deploy and use all assets simultaniously,but manageable if you get one manta low and fast (manual control) to it and manage to damage the outer engines and its turrets (it will turn around and flee) before he deploys its units and fires with guns.

Here are my suggestions :

- we need a third persons view thats further away than the current,often walrus blocks sight, and the HUD should also be visible in 3rd persons view

- radar ranges on all craft are way to short,when you see something on radar you already are close to be attacked,so please make the radar atleast twice the range (or implement a switchable radar wit 2-3 ranges)

- view distances are too short, in bad weather its ok to see only a few meters.also targets are recognized by the firing computer way too late.

- weapon ranges and especially auto-aiming weapons are to short,enemies will often fire at you from farther than that. Locking missiles is taking too long and are way to short,missiles should be longer ranged weapons than guns, although this would be a problem for the defenders,as i never saw them use missiles? we probably nedd automatic flares and such if they will fire missiles (or be able to outrun them?like in the old cc)

- reinforcements of enemy mantas and walrusses is to fast, i kill 9 mantas to get air superiority and before my second flight plus walrusses get in ,there are already 3 more mantas flying . same for enemy walrusses.so its always the best idea to get the manta hangars and the walrus bunkers at start of conquerung the island.its probably hard to balance.maybe each island only gets one hangar for mantas and walrusses,but have them patrol the island ? some seem to do so.

- waypoint planning needs definately more options for the waypoints themself (height (manta),speed,defend waypoint,attack waypoint, hauling a walrus for mantas...),formations....

- resupply for walrus on enemy island is possible at the corresponding stations, mantas need to get back to the ship? probably we need a landing pad to refuel/repair? i saw some helipads ,is this planned?

- we need a refuel-pod for the walrus to refuel mantas and walrusses out of fuel,we already got a repair-"beam".

- fuel for mantas and walrus seem to be infinite on the carrier,will there be seperate fuel for them?

- scanner-item for the assets looks a little unneeded , it should be implemented in the electronics of the assets or maybe should be to able the increase locking range with it?

- afterburner/turbo should be available all times,but use up more fuel (at the moment it feels too much like a need for speed NOS)

- we definately need a "bridge"-view when steering the carrier and a second view for the guns also, guns should be able to aim downward , right now they are limited to horizont and upward.

- bomb for the manta needs a "bombsight", a pipper like a jet uses to estimate impact point, maybe even a camera following the bomb/missile in a second window?

- carrier should be able to hold a full replacement complement of mantas/walrus...

- would be nice if we could see the resource barque dock, maybe even see the enemies undock from port (that building on the pier?) and be able to kill it while in range.

- resource gathering and building equipment takes too long in the beta,dont know what the full game it will be?

- we absolutely,definately NEED a option to get out of a walrus or manta and go on on foot, maybe even a "apc"-module for the walrus to bring in some footsoldiers/bots and bunkers should be enterable and usable.

- defence drones should be flying in other positions,or even be selectable which formation (like in the original)

- the description for the hammerhead missile says it will be automatically targetting the enemy hq? i do NOT like this one bit! i want to be able to choose where it hits!

- repairs on the carrier should not be using carrier fuel,but use "repair packs" or something

- enemy flak/AA is deadly to unarmored mantas,maybe turn it down a little?

- equipment cost is way too high for most parts, a full fit for a manta (gatling,missiles,armor mk2 , ammo box) cost over TEN times as much as a new manta , i suggest mantas and walrus should be the costliest parts, so you take care of them.

- automatic turrets should be able to fire even if i am steering the carrier or one of its guns

- ai pathfinding could be better especially in narrow environment and around the carrier when docking

- manta feels a little heavy controlling,not what i suspected from a VTOL with turning... but its learnable

- landing animation/flying seems awkward sometimes,maybe let the manta fly in higher and come down vertically?

thats it for now...

I had real fun with the beta , if improvements get in its definately going to be a real hit !

[Wh1sper 0]

@Zopzodeman: Very nice summary.

I couldn't have say it better ;-)

I second your wishes. Parts of them are already posted from various people.

[Gazzareth 1]

@Zopzodeman: Very nice summary. +1

2 points I would disagree with:::

- we absolutely,definately NEED a option to get out of a walrus or manta and go on on foot, maybe even a "apc"-module for the walrus to bring in some footsoldiers/bots and bunkers should be enterable and usable.

You are not in it, so how do you get out of it ??? It is remote controlled.

- fuel for mantas and walrus seem to be infinite on the carrier,will there be seperate fuel for them?

In the original and it's resource management this worked quite well. The way resources are done in the remake I think it would make an awful lot of micromanaging to keep your tanks topped up. Personally I would prefer that Fuel was taken out of that part of the supply chain and managed separately - although still delivered with the rest of the stock.

Not sure about the need to hold 4 Mantas and Walruses as stock - only having 2 is going to make you more careful.. .. ..

Just my 2 cents .. .. .. Now to try out those missiles .. ..

G