Iraq war Veteran Scott Olsen skull smashed while protesting in the US.

[walker 0]

Hi all

It has come to serious state of affairs when a US Iraq war veteran has his skull smashed in a peaceful protest.

9lbbWAgBy7E

You can clearly hear shots whistling by in the video.

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/10/28/us/occupy-wall-street/?hpt=us_c2

Many other peaceful protesters were seriously injured including one girl shot in the throat.

More and more US veterans as well, as retired police officers are joining the front line to protect peaceful demonstrators. A mass demonstration to honour Iraq war Veteran Scott Olsen and the other protesters injured in protests is being planned.

Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

Robert Johnson and Linette Lopez | Oct. 28, 2011, 8:28 AM

As the events that led to Scott Olsen's injury continue to unfold and investigations begin, we thought it important to offer some perspective. This comment is from a former Marine with special operations in crowd control.

He points out that shooting canisters such as those that likely hit Scott Olsen is prohibited under rules of engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan...

http://www.businessinsider.com/marine-with-crowd-control-training-points-out-oakland-used-methods-prohibited-in-war-zones-2011-10

As always follow the link to the article in full.

Kind regards walker

Edited October 28, 2011 by walker

[maddogx 13]

You might want to remove the video, as it could be percieved to violate rule §6. :)

[PELHAM 10]

A serious injury - it's speculated that a 40mm CS gas grenade was fired directly at the crowd instead of up into the air. I suppose that's why you see many protesters wearing cycle helmets?

If protesters want to occupy a public park I would disagree with removing them by force as it simply provides them with an ideal propaganda opportunity. I disagree with occupying private property or entrances to banks etc. and that is when the police should act.

Who knows where this will all end? In the UK the occupation of the forecourt of St. Paul's Cathedral is doing enormous financial harm to the building and is very disrespectful to a UNESCO World Heritage site. If they moved to one of the parks people would not mind as much.

[Beagle 684]

If they moved to one of the parks people would not mind as much.

That's the point. As a protester you need to be a attention whore, otherwisse you could also protest silently in your garage.

[-DirTyDeeDs--Ziggy- 0]

the cops were very wrong to use such tactics, but these aren't such peaceful protests as you would suggest...

[maturin 12]

This is good news for OWS, since in the U.S. all veterans are totally and utterly inviolable in any political environment, and can break petty laws and regulations by creating a popular furor at equally-applied enforcement.

[-DirTyDeeDs--Ziggy- 0]

I happen to know someone at the Denver occupy protest, and I can say its not all roses and candy living at these protests. He is acting as volunteer security (FOR the protesters) because of all the theft and assaults going on.

lets bring the family on down, eh?

[Blackhawk 0]

in a peaceful protest

Yeah, because that protest looked so peaceful.

[nettrucker 144]

As time moves on . . . the protests will become more and more violent. We are just at the beginning of what is about to come. you mark my words.

[abs 2]

Forget it.

Abs

Edited October 28, 2011 by Abs
Blah.

[PELHAM 10]

That's the point. As a protester you need to be a attention whore, otherwisse you could also protest silently in your garage.

Well I am not interested in anything they have to say unless it is a peaceful, lawful protest. So far I have not heard anything that makes any sense, you just get 20 second sound bites from them which are meaningless.

Edited October 29, 2011 by PELHAM

[Tonci87 163]

Using tactics that are forbidden in a war zone on protesters in the US? Shame on the Police officers that did so.

[mrcash2009 0]

Well I am not interested in anything they have to say unless it is a peaceful, lawful protest. So far I have not heard anything that makes any sense, you just get 20 second sound bites from them which are meaningless.

Im thinking that this view is very much what the police/cops feel like, so, going by the threads topic and not your blanket view of protests you dont like (that you make clear every time that subject comes up) ... do you feel that the response from the police in this case and various others heavy handed treatment (more militarised than crowed control) is justified and a good example of how it should be treated in the future? I ask this becuase this is an area that it points too but gets clouded about the protesters too much and the subject matter of it.

Off topic bit for Pelham:

Problem is Pelham peaceful & lawful is a fine line in any protest depending on how the system is arranged to tip it into unlawful (private owned land all over the place no matter where you go unless as you said you sit in a park and have personal happy times, then no doubt after time this will be complained about) and handled to create a situation of less peaceful (it takes 2 to tango as they say), funny thing when the protests are about unlawful and not so peace loving actions of the people upstairs pulling the strings.

If you want dinner parties, some banners and smiles with face painting in a park with juice and a garage sale atmos, where everyone is of a standard of an after dinner speaker and trained spokes person who is wearing nice clothes your happy with when the economy is going to shit and people are loosing out directly, you must be living in a dream world with rose tinted goggles on, I have a feeling you will be very annoyed allot later on mate :)

And that's coming form someone who isn't a fan of protests (best ways to go about things in some cases) and also have seen plenty of the "idiots" in such protests. Get over it Pelham as I said before it is what it is, your views on the protesters have been made very clear already.

Edited October 29, 2011 by mrcash2009

[nettrucker 144]

Well I am not interested in anything they have to say unless it is a peaceful, lawful protest. So far I have not heard anything that makes any sense, you just get 20 second sound bites from them which are meaningless.

The occupy movement is a peaceful movement. People are demonstrating all over in the USA because their country is being destroyed as it is their constitutional right to do so. These rights are constantly being violated by brutal police force. If it doesn't make any sense to you, than maybe you should do some more research on this accident at Oakland. There is longer video material availabe rather than 20 second sound bites.

It is happening all over the world. We are living in a world where corruption reigns above anything else. We have turned into police states where your constitutional rights don't count anymore. Every protest is slamed by brutal police action. What is it that doesn't make sense to you?:confused:

kind regards

[mrcash2009 0]

For the sake of keeping this thread unlocked I wont reply about the protests too much anymore as it does smack of the other thread that did get a lock, but I would like to see people views on what this does cover or highlight and that's the police side and militarised tactics on home soil .. now that is an interesting one. The other thread did touch on this with the protesting marine speaking about how he sees police/cops dealing in similar ways of what hes seen in warzones and crowed's knowing that it was tame in comparison.

Edited October 29, 2011 by mrcash2009

[nettrucker 144]

For the sake of keeping this thread unlocked I wont reply about the protests too much anymore as it does smack of the other thread that did get a lock, but I would like to see people views on what this does cover or highlight and that's the police side and militarised tactics on home soil .. now that is an interesting one. The other thread did touch on this with the protesting marine speaking about how he sees police/cops dealing in similar ways of what hes seen in warzones and crowed's knowing that it was tame in comparison.

It's all about the protest. I don't know why the thread of OWS was closed and I wish it would be reopened since it is an important movement in the history of mankind in my opinion. People are waking up all over the world. So if we don't discuss about the protest, whatelse should we discuss. You guys know that JP Morgan donated 4.5 Milion dollars to the NYPD. I personally believe that things will go a lot worse. The day will come where there will be Martial law in the USA the more the civil unrest grows. Than you will know what the FEMA camps are for.

[mrcash2009 0]

So if we don't discuss about the protest, whatelse should we discuss.

I wasn't suggesting we dont, I was just thinking about the debate going off into views on the protesters and not the results of things happening within it like the police handling etc and then repeating the other thread the exact same which (for whatever reason) got a lock, the fact it did means there is obviously some areas to stear clear of in this particular forum within that subject like it or not kind of thing.

Just dont "do a Minuteman" :):936:

Edited October 29, 2011 by mrcash2009

[binkster 0]

From what I can see all these people in these protest just want something for nothing... A true democrat if you ask me. They need to be protesting Washington.... Not this silly "Your company makes millions.... so pay for me a new car" crap...

[PELHAM 10]

It's looks to me like people are behaving like 2 year olds. It looks like a temper tantrum. "We will misbehave till we get what we want. I want money and an easy life and I will hold my breath and turn blue and stamp my feet till I get it!" Well sorry folks but living on handouts and credit is what got us into this mess in the 1st place. Just look at the mess Europe is in by borrowing money and creating millions of unsustainable civil service jobs.

The only debt I have is a very small mortgage. I could have borrowed 4x as much and in 2005 the guy at the bank looked at me like I was crazy for borrowing so little. I told my friends that over borrowing was wrong and something was wrong with the economy if we all lived on debt. They told me I was crazy and maxed out their credit cards. I watched the storm clouds gathering and sold all my shares when the price was high.

Well just a few years later it all crashed down. If we give stupid people handouts they will never ever learn self control. Sorry but life is hard for the stupid and the greedy. Some of my friends have had their houses repossessed by the banks and it's very sad to watch. One keeps broken TV's and other expensive looking junk near the front door in case the debt collectors call. They all took out 80 - 100% mortgages and thought nothing of it.

A little advice:

Some of us left school and worked 12hour shifts and lived at home with our parents to pay for our University fees hint, hint. There are many jobs that are very well paid. You just have to put up with unsociable hours and get a bit dirty. All you have to do is stick at it and put the money in the bank.

Pick the right degree too - 30% of University courses lead nowhere, they are simply there to keep academics employed and suck in government money. If you pick one of the courses where you are not in classes for at least 3/4 of the working week, you are going nowhere. Treat college and university recruiters and open evenings like walking into a US Army recruiting office. I have watched university staff tell such bare faced lies to young people that it would make an army recruiter blush. University staff promise everyone a guaranteed job at the end of the degree - the only guaranteed jobs are those of the faculty staff themselves. They are just as corrupt as everyone else.

The economy - If things seem too good to be true, watch out for the crash. That's what I was doing when it happened. I could not believe it took so long.

Protests that obstruct private land and intimidate the public and prevent people from going about their daily lives are not peaceful.

Edited October 29, 2011 by PELHAM

[mrcash2009 0]

Oh well, it looks like the same reading material as the last thread *gives up*.

Nicely put again, but you never did speak on the subject of this thread much directly or the question I asked above ..

WE KNOW YOUR VIEWS ON THE PROTESTERS, WE GET IT, THE OTHER THREAD HAS IT ALL LOGGED

Edited October 29, 2011 by mrcash2009

[PELHAM 10]

Oh well, it looks like the same reading material as the last thread *gives up*.

Nicely put again, but you never did speak on the subject of this thread much directly or the question I asked above ..

WE KNOW YOUR VIEWS ON THE PROTESTERS, WE GET IT, THE OTHER THREAD HAS IT ALL LOGGED

I believe in democracy mrcash and in democracies protests don't really count for anything because the protesters were not elected to represent anyone. If I have a problem with something I write to all my local MP's and present reasoned arguments and sometimes I visit their surgeries so I can have a brief debate face to face.

Many of these protesters seem to be involved in a game to see who can provoke the most violent reaction from the police and then get their face on TV. They have a great deal of press time and they don't put forward anything of substance. So why are they really there and what do they really want - I still don't know.

Firing 40mm CS canisters into the faces of protesters is not something that should ever be tolerated. We also can't tolerate people engaging in criminal behaviour and disrupting the daily lives of local residents every time they feel aggrieved about something.

Is it only me that has noticed that 99% of protest achieve nothing - particularly when it comes to changing government policy. They would do better to return home and start writing letters - personal letters, not mass photocopies - and using their brains (if they actually do have any) to put forward a reasoned debate.

[jblackrupert 14]

The fact that they started this whole we ain't going nowhere campout in the Fall just shows they're not exactly too bright.

But then again, chances are the professional protestors are likely paying homeless people

to occupy the tents at night while they go home to a cozy bed.

Thats what they do here in Vancouver. bribe homeless people with food, smokes and a bit of money for a crack hoot to boost their numbers and occupy the soggy tents.

[walker 0]

Hi all

In reply to jblackrupert:

Would they be the veteran protesters you are insulting or just any one who disagrees with your view?

Kind regards walker

[Baff1 0]

By veteran protestor do you mean one that has protested before?

[jblackrupert 14]

Being a veteran doesn't make you always right.

He got hurt because he chose to mingle with people who are intent on clashing with the police, this is no longer about banks, "Evil" corporations or anything of the sort.

It's nothing more then anarchists and criminals intent on committing as much mayhem as possible and getting as much Police "Brutality" on camera.

OWS was a clusterfuck waiting to happen because they invited everyone and anyone to the party with no plan in place to keep it peaceful in the event morons showed up.

Just holding this event in the fall was begging for trouble.

The campsite here in Vancouver has turned into a magnet for drug/achohol addicted homeless people looking for the handout. Many of the other cities are the same.

throw in cold, rainy weather and it's a recipe for disaster.

Edited October 29, 2011 by jblackrupert