Wish: Improved movement in buildings, through doors

[polar bear 10]

For me ArmA2/OA has always been primarily a long-range combat game. The reason is that moving around inside buildings is frustrating. The simulation of your body is nice, but the mechanics of actually getting yourself through a door and oriented the right way is just clunky.

In real life I can move through doorways without even thinking about it. I can edge around corners without bumping into them. In the game that's always been somewhat difficult.

If there is one single improvement made to the physics/engine in ArmA3 I really, really, really would like to see smoother and more fluid movement through close spaces like the interiors of buildings.

I understand the challenges in a simulator. I leave it to others how to address those challenges, but it really harms the playability in city settings. I hate getting shot because I can't figure out how to fit my body through a door and get to cover...

[Steakslim 1]

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=119263

[metalcraze 290]

Do you carry a 1 meter long weapon in front of you IRL as well?

[HyperU2 11]

Do you carry a 1 meter long weapon in front of you IRL as well?

Used to, it's easier than in ARMA.

[polar bear 10]

Do you carry a 1 meter long weapon in front of you IRL as well?

I just grabbed a broom and was able to navigate through the doors in my home easily. So yes, it's possible to do that in real life.

Do you have problems navigating your home while carrying objects?

This is a detrimental artifact of the simulation. The problem is that the game is simulating your entire physical body, including your gun, but the UI is not giving you the same level of physical awareness and dexterity that you have in real life. In this case it is making moving through buildings LESS realistic, and thus it is failing as a simulation of those environments.

It IS a problem, if you want to play in city environments. If you want to play only in outdoor, long distance engagement type scenarios then obviously it doesn't matter at all.

Edited August 24, 2011 by Polar Bear

[rye1 21]

It's the body that gets stuck, isn't it? It happens even with MP5's and pistols.

[dmarkwick 261]

Yep it's a problem, a long-standing one. I think there should be a higher level of "sliperyness" when moving against objects like interior walls, so that you can get a more fluid movement without having to rattle your way around. And your avatar should know how to move about in a confined space automatically, meaning that you're not always trying to wrangle your weapon around, your avatar does it. As such, some forgiveness could be in order for moving about.

BTW, if you lower your weapon while indoors, does it make a difference? I just only now considered that possibility, does your bounding box change shape?

[CameronMcDonald 146]

Yes. Place a Marine on Utes. Lower your weapon and walk up to a building. Raise your weapon. Boing!

Also, you can compare how close you get to the building with your weapon raised and lowered. Much difference.

[dmarkwick 261]

Maybe a lot of the problem is one of avatar handling then :)

[Undeceived 392]

Wasn't there an addon (from dyslexci?) that solved this movement clunkyness inside of buildings? BI could take a look at that one.

[smookie 11]

These things are definately being looked into.

[NoRailgunner 0]

Clipping gun barrels through walls is just a very cheap workaround and reveals players who are hiding themselves inside buildings and standing close to walls. :D

Some players are becoming so lazy that they expect that the avatar knows what the player likes to do - without any input. Perhaps setting up the keybindings for lower/raise weapon + remembering them would be a good start...

Still many shooter addicted players think thats an good idea to clear rooms with weapons that are made for long range combat eg M107/M82, KSVK, any heavy machinegun. Even if they got a pistol/handgun they dont switch weapons. :rolleyes:

[HyperU2 11]

I think it's okay to expect my avatar to know what to do without extra input, it's supposed to be me, not a puppet.

Pistols leave a little to be desired in the Armaverse.

[NoRailgunner 0]

So why don't you go and watch a action movie instead or play some console shooters with automatic positioning, covering and CQB fightscenes? :p;)

Good games let the player interact with ingame objects/stuff aswell giving him feedback about the things that do work and that dont work.

[polar bear 10]

I think it's okay to expect my avatar to know what to do without extra input, it's supposed to be me, not a puppet.

I think that would be a perfectly sensible solution--a little more "do what I mean" applied by the avatar when you ask it to move through a building.

With respect to raising/lowering the gun, it seems to me that if you ask an avatar to move somewhere, and the gun being out prevents the movement, the avatar should automatically lower the weapon, move as requested, and then raise the weapon again. Your weapon would temporarily not be pointing where you wanted, but you would get through the door--seems reasonable! Combine that with a bit more "slipperyness" of your avatar, where if I ask it to move to the left, and it can't, but if it only moved forward/backwards by 6 inches it would be able to, so it does that--it MIGHT solve the problem. Would need to be play tested.

In the extreme, and specifically for doors, how about using the "step over" key? If I approach a door and press "step over" the avatar would take that as a command to "do whatever you need to do to get through that door". With a little practice that might become fluid. It took me some getting used to pressing "step over" in ArmA when I arrived at an obstacle, but I did eventually kind of start doing it reflexively so maybe it would work for doors too!

What's not fluid right now is getting stuck, and having to wonder why I'm stuck, and then figure it out, and fudge around pressing different keys and wiggling back and forth until I get through the door. That is not realistic at all--in real life I do just sort of inherently know how to get through a door, and so should my avatar. You can't just say "simulation" here, while we simulate your whole body in ArmA, it's not to the point of me having to decide when to move the left leg, and when to move the right--my avatar just knows how to walk, and should just know how to get through a door.

In any case I'm fine with any solution so long as the end result is that, with a little practice, moving around through buildings becomes a fluid, natural, immersive experience. The goal is to preserve the realism of the simulation while at the same time it possible to move around the game world as easily as I move around the real one.

Edited August 24, 2011 by Polar Bear

[froggyluv 2130]

Have little problem moving through interiors, more I'd like to see AI using them proficiently.

[rye1 21]

and the conversation goes down hill.......... into hell!

What could really be improved is say rifle through door, too long, the character puts the weapon down a bit to fit in. Instead of insta-stuck. "Quick get the towing rope, get me out". It's stupid.

EDIT: I posted as someone said this same post.

[polar bear 10]

Have little problem moving through interiors, more I'd like to see AI using them proficiently.

Absolutely agree about the AI using them more proficiently! I'm surprised that you haven't had more trouble moving through interiors. Maybe you have not played the PvP mods much?

The classic situation where I get stuck is I'm standing in a doorway, I step in front of it and scan for enemies, take a shot, and then try and dart back into the doorway before they return fire (or because they return fire). Often I get shot trying to get back through the door. Absolutely appreciate and value the simulation that is causing the problem, and not wanting it to be CoD. Just want to get through the door!

Edited August 24, 2011 by Polar Bear

[wolfbite 8]

I think they should go for the Metal gear solid collision where when the gun is knocking against something that would stop him turning he raises or lowers it so it doesnt clip and as soon as he can realign it he does.... works well and doesnt need a noclip...

[roberthammer 582]

It only needs better weapon collision detection that's all

[smookie 11]

It only needs better weapon collision detection that's all

I wish this was so easy, Robert:)

[4 IN 1 0]

What I really want is something along the line of Infiltration mod for UT99

[roberthammer 582]

What I really want is something along the line of Infiltration mod for UT99

Yes - the best example :)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4039746535448300946

[BobcatBob 10]

i think they should go for the metal gear solid collision where when the gun is knocking against something that would stop him turning he raises or lowers it so it doesnt clip and as soon as he can realign it he does.... Works well and doesnt need a noclip...

qftthis!