Latency

[mosh 0]

So to conclude: Everyone still thinks the game is laggy, except walker because he has a different version than anybody else =)

I must have the same version as Walker then, I notice no problems whatsoever on a properly configured and capable server.

[twirly 11]

It's a mental condition, popularly known as fanboyism. With years and years of self-deception, he has become completely blind to the faults.

You hit the nail on the head here buddy! I think you are 100% right. It warps...period! I cannot understand why people suck up to BIS?.....as this will lead to nothing being done!

Would you suck up to the guy that just built you a house with a leaky roof?

[c0nse-0n3r 19]

For what it's worth,

I think BIS created a legendary game based on the scope/size of it. Multiplayer is certainly hard to enjoy lately though.

For some reason, I get this warping issue alot too. I can run the game fine, good cable connection and ping to the game doesnt seem to matter.

Theres some improvement depending on the server setups but still seem to get it regardless.

I still play multi quite a bit but this warping/lag issue is frustrating and hard to ignore.. glad to see i'm not the only one with the problem though

Hope BIS has a fix for this one day :confused:

[blurgh 10]

this place really is as bad as its reputation.

2 people give a negative view on the game and you get chumps like Walker telling you that you're the same person and trolling. It's ridiculous. So many people on other forums all talk about how bad the netcode is, its renowned for being poor and yet you come on the official forum and everyone is blind to it and blames it on server config. Even on the smoothest of servers the game still doesn't run smooth.

Infact my very first online game there were about 4 people in a chopper and the chopper was jerking through the air and i ask if anyone else has this and if their is a way to get around it and their response was "welcome to arma online".

Ask yourself why has this game developed a reputation for having such bad netcode ?

Why are so many people on Project Reality forums worried about the lag in the forthcoming Arma mod ?

I tell you one thing, its certainly not because the game has a reputation for having good netcode and lag free games !

---------- Post added at 01:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:55 AM ----------

If it's a case of the servers not being properly set up, then somebody's keeping these perfect servers very well hidden behind passwords for some reason

ain't that the truth !

[Maystor 10]

Hope BIS has a fix for this one day :confused:

Well, going by what they said here: http://dev-heaven.net/issues/1915

It is not bug, it is by design

full scale solution is not possible till A2:OA or next generation

I guess next generation it is then :(

I agree with you. The scope, the size and all the possibilities in the game are amazing. But I can't help but wonder, has the game become too big and more complex that it should have? If today's machines and bandwidth are not enough for something like ARMA 2 to run properly in multiplayer, you know, why do it then? People have pointed out that the reason why OFP runs so smooth in comparison is because ARMA 2 supports more units, larger islands and being so CPU hungry, cutting back on approximation was necessary. It's just my opinion, but I don't really see the point of supporting larger number of units and huge islands when the gameplay suffers like that. I mean, how many games of similar genre have a map that is as big as say Nogova? Just seems unnecessary to me.

[bangtail 0]

I get the warping on my gigabit LAN no matter what settings I use. It doesn't make the game unplayable but it is annoying as all hell.

There shouldn't be lag or warping of any description on a direct connection with that much bandwidth.

[millerhighlife 1]

Yes bangtail I agree, people are sucking up in here. This is a real issue and need's to be a number 1 priority for BI. No matter what when I hope in a vehicle and i'm not driving. The vehicle stutters. Watching AI or players walk around or move, It's always stuttering to some degree. The best games ive had are on the c5 server. But it's not really the type of matches I want to play. But because I can't ever find a good server that's not lagging I usally go there anyways. Anyone got some recomendations for tactical team servers.

[johnsey 10]

I totally agree. A game don't get a rep for having bad netcode just because some players have sucky systems or misconfigured servers. Thats B(I)S. Arma2 is the most awesome game i've ever played, and i would gladly pay for the game again just for a patch with netcode that is considered 100% awesomeness. Arma2 would take over the world with this game! :p

[twirly 11]

Well, going by what they said here: http://dev-heaven.net/issues/1915

I guess next generation it is then :(

Not good news!

By then they will have grandchildren and have no time for developing anything! ...and I will probably be too old to even get to my computer. LOL!

[bangtail 0]

Further to my last comment, I have noticed that sometimes I get the warping and sometimes I don't. Obviously, I have not changed any hardware settings in the interim.

:(

[walker 0]

Further to my last comment, I have noticed that sometimes I get the warping and sometimes I don't. Obviously, I have not changed any hardware settings in the interim.

:(

Hi BangTail

It sounds like an external cause.

Examine the possibilities of:

Are you using the same server each time?

Is an External Progam causing this?

Examples are Virus checkers or any program such as a TV subscription Program dowloading files with a regular update or checking even windows update. Check with Windows Taskmaster to see what is running. Check your fire wall monitor to see what programs are running and using badwidth.

Some one else using your bandwidth.

One case I recently had was a Wii console in the house. Check your flatmates are not downloading Pron. If you have a wireless network make sure it is not open to all and sundy and acting as a Free Wifi site. Secure it properly with encryption, make sure it is properly passworded eg not your name or address etc. people can and do download password crackers and wonder round the streets with a laptop in their car looking for idiots that do not know you can crack a none random alphanumeric password in less than 5 seconds. Make sure you use numbers letter and symbols and that it is 12 or more characters long. If you are using words or names you are by definition a numpty.

Make sure your broadband is working

Choose an ISP option that has a Low contention ratio. Too many people choose the FREE! GUARANTEED TEN MB BROADBAND! only to find they are sharing that 10MB with 100 people and so if they are all on at the same time your getting 0.1MB broadband. Run a trace program to make sure your ISP is not stiffing you or running a damaged router close to you.

Kind Regards walker

[bangtail 0]

Thanks for your response :)

However, I said on an internal gigabit lan.

Server is a 980x with 12 gigs of RAM and SSDs etc.

Sorry, it's the game, not my setup.

(I've tried every setting there is and it still happens).

Edited January 14, 2011 by BangTail

[synti 10]

I also think that it´s about time to admit that netcode is faulty. Game is great, there is no question about it, but it makes no sense to create a game so complex that it could only show you the possibilities and then fails to deliver them properly. BIS should really forget about making these DLCs and focus on improving the game core and multiplayer. The modding community has allready made mods so innovative, that BIS is going to have a hard time getting anywhere near with their DLCs. And let´s face it: modding community and large scale co-op multiplayer is what is keeping this game alive, year after year, starting from the original OFP. So why not make it playable and wipe the floors with BFBC2 and other AD/HD -shooters?

I know that BIS has to make money out of something, namely these expansions. But seriously; wouldn´t it be better to concentrate on what makes this game special and one day get the big money out from that.

After all, to a casual gamer (who I think is supposed to buy these DLCs) Arma II is still strange, resource-hog east european niché game with complicated multiplayer. For us, the devoted (who play the game mostly through Notepad and dream about working, lag-free multiplayer) it´s a way of life.

But we are soon tired of living our lives this way. I even started to play BFBC2, when I finally got fed up with warping enemies. They warp, whatever configuration / setup you try.

Pretty please BIS: make it work, make it simpler if that is what it takes, but for god´s sake; do something about it!

Edited January 14, 2011 by synti

[c0nse-0n3r 19]

synti sums it up best for me. had to 2nd these thoughts

BIS has no doubt has made a legendary game. So innovative bugs are expected. For a smaller, indy studio its amazing work. Rivals all FPS around. But...

And let´s face it: modding community and large scale co-op multiplayer is what is keeping this game alive, year after year, starting from the original OFP. So why not make it playable and wipe the floors with BFBC2 and other AD/HD -shooters?

Can't agree more. I still find I play so much ARMA despite the bugs as support, engine innovations and multiplayer/mod community still stays alive due to the epicness of the game.

A smoother, stable multiplayer experience would blow this game out of the water i think. No FPS can match really.

latest LOD fixes etc. where great too, dont get me wrong, but some optimizing for MP now takes my vote

After all, to a casual gamer (who I think is supposed to buy these DLCs) Arma II is still strange, resource-hog east european niché game with complicated multiplayer. For us, the devoted (who play the game mostly through Notepad and dream about working, lag-free multiplayer) it´s a way of life.

As an NA player, its only the avid/hardcore pc gamers out here who have found the joy of ARMA and be able to tweak it enough to be enjoyable. Some just play BF/Call of Duty for the stability.

Everybody needs to eat $$. So paying for DLCs are fine with me as long as theres not less focus on fixing whats here already for us and modders in ARMA2/OA.

There's always some steady improvement from BIS so for that..if multiplayer could get smoothed out I think community would explode.

[mrcash2009 0]

Just to chirp in, I use Kelly's Heroes allot and I have seen warping and its local to me. Although I have had players say they used Wireless and "they" warped as a result while driving with them etc. Then again I only see it when things get busy in a mission or someone enters with a large Dsync issue etc. So to me its a combination of a few factors, and cant be "its net-code" directly off the bat. KH was the best test for me and its not bad at all, very well set-up.

Only way to really test it is to stick to a local server and stay with it for a number of days/weeks, only then will you know. If you bunny hop around lots of different ones then process of elimination is pretty hard to call out net-code "only".

I bunny hopped around via the browser early on trying MP and never once found a server that worked right, slide show, stutter fest and warp party-time. Then I settled with local and KH mainly and its fine.

Also I had Zonrealarm set to ask me each time a process was used for OA / Arma2 and would accept it on MP when firing up MP session, then I found warping and cyclic stutters. After testing I realised that unless I accepted the process permanently It was re-checking and causing those issues .. just an example of other factors.

Everything can be improved, cant see fanboy crap here at all.

Edited January 15, 2011 by mrcash2009

[whisper 0]

I also think that it´s about time to admit that netcode is faulty. Game is great, there is no question about it, but it makes no sense to create a game so complex that it could only show you the possibilities and then fails to deliver them properly. BIS should really forget about making these DLCs and focus on improving the game core and multiplayer. The modding community has allready made mods so innovative, that BIS is going to have a hard time getting anywhere near with their DLCs. And let´s face it: modding community and large scale co-op multiplayer is what is keeping this game alive, year after year, starting from the original OFP. So why not make it playable and wipe the floors with BFBC2 and other AD/HD -shooters?

I know that BIS has to make money out of something, namely these expansions. But seriously; wouldn´t it be better to concentrate on what makes this game special and one day get the big money out from that.

After all, to a casual gamer (who I think is supposed to buy these DLCs) Arma II is still strange, resource-hog east european niché game with complicated multiplayer. For us, the devoted (who play the game mostly through Notepad and dream about working, lag-free multiplayer) it´s a way of life.

But we are soon tired of living our lives this way. I even started to play BFBC2, when I finally got fed up with warping enemies. They warp, whatever configuration / setup you try.

Pretty please BIS: make it work, make it simpler if that is what it takes, but for god´s sake; do something about it!

DLC are getting out so that the guys who can chase bugs get paid. You can't support a product without some $$$ support, whatever format this $$$ are (DLC, yearly release, whatever ....), no magic

[Cookieeater 10]

Lag is insane. Everybody warps. Even on LAN with 2 computers next to each other and the host hosting on a Quad core with 4GB of LAN it warps. I wonder how they could have screwed up the net coding so bad.

Battlefield 2 had 64 players, it had vehicle physics infinitely better than ArmA II. It had bullet drop and penetration on the same scale as ArmA II. Battlefield 2 was a lot more smooth than ArmA II. People will laud Battlefield 2 for it's bad net coding but then i'll show ArmA II, with soldiers rubber banding everywhere, vehicles driven by other players crashing into a tree, and then warping 10m away again.

[tacticalnuggets 24]

I'd have to say that the bullet simulation of battlefield games is no where near that of arma 2, sorry to shoot your bubble there. However, there is no excuse for the netcode. Everybody knows the netcode is bad. The first step in solving a problem is figuring out the problem, and the net code is obviously the problem. 30ping should run smooth, poorly configured or not. The state is being synchronized so fast that you cannot notice poor configuration. And if the configuration really can screw the game up that bad its still BIS's fault because nobody would have that terrible of settings by default.

As everybody has been saying, if there was a clear cut solution to the lagging it would have been passed on through arma2's well connected fan base by now. But no clear cut solution has really been passed through to my knowledge. So there are deeper problems here. Remember, the netcode has not changed that much compared to ofp, but the load on it has. The load has increased dramatically since the old ofp days, and it requires a very modern upgrade to match that of other games.

[Taxman 10]

We play 90 % PvP .... CTF, Dm whatever.... no AI, The lag u guys speak of must be down to the AI, YES occaisionally we get a lag spike on server (myabe I should turn off AUTO UPDATE LOL ), OR maybe one of the russian players might jump a little (and I do mean only occasionally) majority of the time we play a very enjoyable game, its possible the server you are playing on is at fault, or maybe your own setup, TRY playing with your GFX options.... dont try Ramping all the settings up, somthing has to give NO matter what super setup u have... bring the settings down a few notches, try it out and see what you get, the likes of WALKER aint on his own, there are many many peeps who actually dont get the lag u guys speak of, so is it slightly possible that its your setups that are the problems...... NOT sure if you guys that are screaming LAG have been around much, but im guessing that the more VET ofp/arma/arma2 guys have either just learnt to live with it, OR (more likely) have learnt to set their own machine up a little better (mostly down to gfx setups though)....

Anyway, LAG or NOT, I enjoy the MP side and wouldnt be playing the game without it.. ..

Have fun.

[Baff1 0]

AI is very definitely an issue for hosting games in ArmA 2. Frankly it's often an issue in SP also.

But like others in this thread, I run LAN servers with mighty system specs (and have been for about 3 decades now, making me so old and so bald!) and my players always complain about lag when they are sniping.

I noticed when I complained about lag on this forum, the replies I got went along the lines of...

"there is no lag in this game, you troll wanker. You clearly have a crap and underpowered PC... A shite internet connection (on my LAN). It never EVAR lags. Evar.

(Unless you are playing sniper, then it lags). "

Which explains why my mates who play snipers constantly all complain of lag while I who never does didn't notice any.

It's the sort of constantly teleporting AI that gets them. One second he is there, next second he is not. Then he is back again!

Few things are worse than people complaining about lag after you have spent tens of hours and thousands of pounds trying to eliminate it.

It really winds me up. Immensly.

My honest solution?

Don't include any scoped weapons in your scenario. Keep the AI numbers down low.

My really really honest solution. Play Quake Wars.

One thing I haven't been finished testing is whether it lags still on the stock campaign. If my problems are just poorly optimised misions. The problem here of course is that there is no dedicated server software for the campaigns.

So todate I haven't been able to ascertain to my absolute satisfaction whether CPU load has been my problem.

I asked on the board for peoples experience of how an overloaded CPU manifested in the game, but no one had any answers for me.

In all honesty, this game engine has always lagged in this way in the past, I think it has more to do with the netcode.

Unfortunately, due to the lag I got off of some missions I downloaded... getting people to play this game with me is pretty difficult anymore. So my next test won't be anytime soon.

Edited January 17, 2011 by Baff1

[TechnoTerrorist303 10]

When our server is running with under 10 people there is 0 rubber banding/warping of AI. I accept that I probably need to configure the .cfg settings better to allow more users with the same experience.

I accept the netcode could be better but really if you're getting problems all the time even on LAN then you're not trying hard enough.

[whisper 0]

Warping of distant AI unit as always been in effect since OFP. No clue where it comes from, the more AI on map, the more warping you'll see. A clear explanation of why this is still an issue (in other words, why is it an unsolvable problem) would be much appreciated, I guess. Not that I bother too much, I dislike sniping AIs. That's like limiting yourself to killing a target that can't retaliate, a bit "easy" (even if the shooting itself may not be), I like being in danger. Anyway, digression aside, I can see the reasons for frustration, and hope BI can resolve this or at least, explain ...

On a sidenote about comparing game engines : Can I see AIs 600m away in BF2, plz? :rolleyes:

Edited January 17, 2011 by whisper

[maddogx 13]

The warping issue can be somewhat mitigated (but not entirely fixed) by running a well configured dedicated server. That's why some people say there is no lag - okay, "no lag" is a huge exaggeration (even the best server config reduces lag to "barely acceptable" levels) but it is indeed possible to mitigate the problem.

Also it should be pointed out that Suma has been working on the distant warping issue, as you can see in the bug tracker. Last time I checked he had set it to "20% done".

Hopefully, some day, maybe in the next ARMA game, the net code will be better and the interpolation will be smoother.

[Baff1 0]

Is there some way to up the tickrate on the server then perhaps?

If it is a prediction problem more gamestate updates should help.

[HitmanFF 6]

Is there some way to up the tickrate on the server then perhaps?

If it is a prediction problem more gamestate updates should help.

Decreasing MinErrorToSend will will (it's similar to the tick rate you mentioned). Check this thread for some recent discussions.

The biki states

Minimal error to send updates across network. Using a smaller value can make units observed by binoculars or sniper rifle to move smoother.