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rksl-rock

RESEARCH - KTS and Feet vs KPH and Metres

KTS and Feet or KPH and Metres.  

94 members have voted

  1. 1. KTS and Feet or KPH and Metres.



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Both ArmA HUD and aircraft HUD in meters\KPH or both in KTS\Feet for me.

AFAIK isnt possible to convert ARMA HUD to Feet\KTS, so voted in Meters\KPH.

He's asking what you want, not what you think's possible. ;)

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Voted for meters for gameplay reasons, the HUD is useles for me if it shows info I cant read, this is something that could maibeeeh be selectable via userconfig?

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On British aircraft, I wouldn't mind as much because I didn't know they used English Std but it would certainly be odd to see it on the US ones.

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Both ArmA HUD and aircraft HUD in meters\KPH or both in KTS\Feet for me.

AFAIK isnt possible to convert ARMA HUD to Feet\KTS, so voted in Meters\KPH.

Its perfectly possible. Infact nearly all of the "new" generation 4 addons RKSL has waiting in the wings have it set to KTS and Feet. This entire topic came up as a result of last night's beta testing session when 2 people passed comment.

Incidentally results so far form the two other sites are:

- DAR-V site poll (~80% US players) poll is 89% for and 10% against, 1% Dont care

- SOG site poll (~70% European players) 55% for and 42% against with 3% dont care.

Interesting trend, seems those that dont use the imperial system in thier nations dont want knots.

---------- Post added at 17:47 ---------- Previous post was at 17:45 ----------

On British aircraft, I wouldn't mind as much because I didn't know they used English Std but it would certainly be odd to see it on the US ones.

Why odd? US aircraft use exactly the same measurment systems as UK ones.

Edited by RKSL-Rock

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He's asking what you want, not what you think's possible. ;)

Whats this?

Both ArmA HUD and aircraft HUD in meters\KPH or both in KTS\Feet for me.

If its possible to do (what I didn´t know), reality first.

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People who got used to or grown up with "their" system dont like to change it or at least they will find it strange to use another. Troubles and misunderstanding which system is actually in use might lead to frustration if there is more than one measurment system for planes/helicopters in A2.

A KTS-feet/KPH-metres switch would be imho the best solution for A2/OA and the second best - all aircrafts in game are using the same system. A2/OA wont be a flight simulator no matter how hard one is playing the realsim-card. ;)

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Its perfectly possible. Infact nearly all of the "new" generation 4 addons RKSL has waiting in the wings have it set to KTS and Feet. This entire topic came up as a result of last night's beta testing session when 2 people passed comment.

Incidentally results so far form the two other sites are:

- DAR-V site poll (~80% US players) poll is 89% for and 10% against, 1% Dont care

- SOG site poll (~70% European players) 55% for and 42% against with 3% dont care.

Interesting trend, seems those that dont use the imperial system in thier nations dont want knots.

---------- Post added at 17:47 ---------- Previous post was at 17:45 ----------

Why odd? US aircraft use exactly the same measurment systems as UK ones.

I don't think a lot of people know this ROCK...almost all over the world aircraft use feet and kts as units of measurement in fact places that use metric are in the vast minority (i know you know this already just spelling it out for non fly boys here). The only thing that screwed me up flying on both sides of the pond is the different way that they do pressure readings (QFE and QNH) in the states...

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NoRailgunner,

The fact that aircraft don't and probably won't handle a la dedicated flight sims within ArmA2 is only one piece of the puzzle.

Considering CAS missions only:

Effect on target is (as far as I can tell) very realistic, and has potential to be far higher fidelity than flight sims in this regard. Using Mando Missiles you can simulate a large array of modern weapons and their guidance systems, and things will only get better with Arrowhead's up and coming in-built FLIR.

Likewise for comms between aircraft and the human players calling them in (something you can't do in flight sims). Dealing with figures in knots and feet would then be essential and realistic.

To summarise

Flight Sims Only:

Ultra Realistic Flight Model

Ultra Realistic Cockpit systems and sensors

ArmA2 Only:

Effect on Target - more ground forces represented, higher resolution terrain and hard cover

Potential for ultra realistic air/ground co-op - troops in contact, strike missions, battle damage assessments, etc

EDIT: Not intended to derail the thread away from the topic of Metric vs Imperial in RKSL's UK aircraft.

Edited by Daniel

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No problem here but I doubt that BIS + another measurement system is comfortable for all players. Like I said above - have a switch or have the same measurment system for all A2/OA aircrafts.

Somehow I doubt that we will see a imperial system for air units from BIS - AI is another piece of the puzzle. Think they are working in the metric system.

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AI is another piece of the puzzle. Think they are working in the metric system.

This wont affect the AI in the slightest. What we are discussing in purely what is displayed to the users. Its actually very simple to do. Just a bit of maths and a few config entries.

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If its that simple: make the imperial and the metric system - so you can lean back and let the players deal with it. Why make it complicated when it can be simple?

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KTS and feet. I think that if you are going to put so much effort into all the details of your aircraft and make them look so realistic, then at least the systems in the aircraft should be as realistic as the outside and flight models that you've made. :)

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For the sake of simplicity I'd say KPH and metres. Even though I'd personally prefer to have the actual instruments display what they should display, and then have the UI display KPH and metres, I wonder if that is sufficient for easy, non-confusing access.

Actually I'd rather see an in-game option, native to ArmA2 rather than an addon, that lets you choose if to display road speed with KPH or MPH, and air speed with KPH or KTS depending on player preference.

Overall though the metric system is, as far as I know, more widely known than the imperial system, making it easier to adapt to even for countries native to the imperial system, than vice versa.

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KTS and feet. I think that if you are going to put so much effort into all the details of your aircraft and make them look so realistic, then at least the systems in the aircraft should be as realistic as the outside and flight models that you've made. :)

Exactly. Why make that detail "gamey" when you can make it "sim"?

Maybe its possible to release a small extra addon for your addons that will show meters and km/h on the ingame hud (up in the corner as in vanilla) in addition to the ft and kph on the models hud? Then its up to the users to add that extra game feature without compromising the addon.

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Have you realized that some of the vehicles do already feature that (not tested on all thought)

For example the hmmwv. Compare the HUD speed and the speed on the indicator and

you'll find out, that on the indicator the speed is in miles.

So the indicator shows 20 mph while the hud says 30kmh.

Isn't that enough?

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If its that simple: make the imperial and the metric system - so you can lean back and let the players deal with it. Why make it complicated when it can be simple?

It isn't that simple. It is an either/or scenario. You cant really have both.

For a start the latest build of the EuroFighter doesn't have the game UI HUD info in the top left corner. A feature requested by quite a few people. Myke has done the same with his F-16 and i know of a few others doing it too. It only has the speed displayed on the actual planes HUD itself. So disregarding dials or MFD displays the real HUD is the only place the speed is shown.

...Actually I'd rather see an in-game option, native to ArmA2 rather than an addon, that lets you choose if to display road speed with KPH or MPH, and air speed with KPH or KTS depending on player preference...

If you can tell me a way to do it I'd certainly be very interested. But right now I cant see a way to change the config setup on-the-fly without having to resort to 2 different classes.

Have you realized that some of the vehicles do already feature that (not tested on all thought)

...

Isn't that enough?

Yes I have and no it isn't. Simply because I'm not going to be displaying both sets of measurements.

....

Nearly all of DAR-V members have voted now. And since it is primarily a US based Sim group I'm not surprised with the result. Out of a maximum 127 members (including myself) 102 have voted. 91 voted for Kts/Ft. 8 for Kph/m and 3 don't care.

SOG which is a European based game group. Out of 79 total members 53 voted so far with 29 voting for Kts/Ft and 20 for Kph/M and 4 don't care.

So if we are going off total numbers Kts and Feet win. But I suspect the obvious bias is due to imperial vs. metric nations with a secondary factor being "Sim" vs "Game".

And as someone said yesterday on MSN. This is a sim :eek:

Edited by RKSL-Rock

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If you can tell me a way to do it I'd certainly be very interested. But right now I cant see a way to change the config setup on-the-fly without having to resort to 2 different classes.

Well, as stated it'd have to be built into ArmA2, since it can't be done easily with addons. Maybe with scripts and hidden textures to swap the grading on the speed meters and modify the UI, but they are far from pretty solutions. And when it comes to actual HUD display I guess you are right about two entirely different configs.

Just thought of it like it many racing and flying games/sims where one can choose the prefered measurements. Would be nice to have that in ArmA. But until it's done by BIS I'd settle with the rest of my post.

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Voted for knots and feet, as you most of your projects are British versions then best to stick with the way they are meant to be.

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Well take a look at default BIS measurements - somehow most people got used to it. But for the sake of trueness and your work - implement the imperial system. You should feel good too!!

Perhaps add a conversion table with some speed and alt data so "metric people" know roughly what is meant when they have to fly with the imperial system. Or you can add a simple training mission with bitching Betty bitchin about metric system. ;)

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It's quite normal with feet and knots for aviation, as far as I know, so Im voting Imperial. However, the metric system is far more accurate and easier when it comes to the other sections of ArmA 2. If this was a question about the whole system in ArmA 2 it would definitivley be Metric.

Edited by colossus

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