Armory feedback

[Lal 10]

The Armory is nice, but I would like to get an ability to select challenges manually(sometimes you only get boring ones and sometimes it takes a lot of time for them to appear) and deselect challenges you don't like. At least after getting all the points.

There are also amongst other things a target in a house in the kill house challenge that makes a sound as if it were real close but is impossible to find. This is especially annyoing since it appears every time and will make you lose the challenge if you have missed a couple of targets before it.

[lapa 1]

I think a bunch of comprehensive tutorial/training missions would be a better way to teach the player how to play the game. Through carefully planned training scenarios it would really "sink in" that the player is indeed playing a game that aspires for realism.

Armory, as it is now, is a bit out-of-place so to speak. It's not really so much of a tutorial rather than a sand-box environment in which to experiment freely. That said, a lot of people like that sort of thing. I think it might be worth retaining in further releases, if some of the more ridiculous/random challenges are weeded out. Additionally, it would be nice if there was an option to unlock all the weapons/vehicles straight away.

[An Fiach 10]

Personally, I've found it to be a aggravation. I like the challenges but many are not realistic, learning to fly a helicopter and doing a challenge to pick up and deliver passengers, the timer runs out when waiting for the granny AI to get in, things like that. It is more of a tutorial and practice than anything and I only found it useful in that regard, somewhat.

Unlocking things seems an unnecessary chore when you can access it all in the editor and an inconvenience when you just want to work with one specific piece of equipment and you haven't unlocked anything yet.

[Catahoula_Leopard 0]

Thank you Bohemia Interactive for both producing such an awesome game as well as continuing to support it with community feedback requests such as this one!!

I have to disagree with some of the above posters on here who say that the Armory is not in the "spirit of the game". What does that mean anyway? Arma is a sandbox simulator, and offers many different ways to enjoy it...and the Armory is just as enjoyable to some as the Editor is to others. I have been enjoying this series since the day the first OFP came out, and one of it's attractions is the wealth of playing options that we as players get to experience.

That said, I do play the Armory frequently...sometimes to learn things, and sometimes just to have a short break from a big mission or online play. What I would like to see changed/added in a future product are as follows:

1) An "Armory options panel" (or similar) where we can check off missions that appeal to us and disable ones that are not of interest. This way I do not have to be bothered with obstacle course missions when what I really want to practice is shooting or interacting with the enemy. Similarly, as said previously, I could disable "steal the weapon" challenges when I am flying...and yet still have other missions appear that do pertain to what I want to practice.

2)The ability to either disable "unlocking" entirely, or at least make the unlocks relevant to what I am practicing. The entire idea of "unlocking" screams "console", and although I do understand the challenge in doing so adds to the need to continue practicing, it also can be frustrating when trying to hone my flying skills hoping to be introduced to a new helicopter/airplane...and then something completely irrelevant gets unlocked. I cannot express how frustrating it is to work hours to earn points just to get "access" to practice something totally useless in-game. If I am flying a helicopter, please unlock helicopters...if I am driving a tank, please unlock armor. There is nothing quite so absurd in this game as working to unlock the next great prize only to get something as useless as mammary glands are on a boar pig: "Woo-Hoo! After flying around in my helicopter for an hour, I just unlocked a........Peasant Woman? WTF???" :mad:

While cute, the ability to unlock rabbits, sheep, peasants, call girls, and farmers should be optional at best. (what exactly ARE the challenges offered if you choose "call girl" anyway? Never tried any of those...) :eek:

3) As stated before, the ability to "re-try" a failed challenge without having to wait for it to be randomly offered again.

4) I disagree with some of the above posts regarding the "scene" option. I sometimes just click on that to sit back and watch the AI at work, and hope to see that in any future version of the Armory as well. (maybe I misunderstood the posters, though)

5) Somehow integrate the Armory with the editor, so that I could add targets of my choosing to practice on, while still earning points. If flying an attack helicopter or playing infantry, it would be nice to be able to place a dozen random targets around the island which if destroyed could earn me points towards the next unlock.

6) Allow me to choose the time of day of my Armory missions. I enjoy both night and day missions, but night missions are rare...and if I die while playing one, the chances are strong that the next respawn will be a day mission. (this could be solved by the above suggestion to allow replaying of failed challenges)

I am sure there is more I could add, but that is all I can think of for now that has not already been mentioned.

Regardless of all the above, I LOVE THE ARMORY! Unlike one of the previous posters, I do use the armory quite frequently as a "low-impact excercise"...and just for plain fun. I bought ARMA II the day it came out, and do not agree that the Armory is just for "newbies". It is a quick way to play without having to enter the editor, and although I also love the ability of the editor to create any mission I want...the Armory can give me a "quick fix" when I have limited time or just want to mess around.

THANK YOU again Bohemia Interactive for offering your customers the very best of experiences in both gaming and customer support!!! We love you! :bounce3: :bounce3:

[STALKERGB 6]

4) I disagree with some of the above posts regarding the "scene" option. I sometimes just click on that to sit back and watch the AI at work, and hope to see that in any future version of the Armory as well. (maybe I misunderstood the posters, though)

Not sure what others were getting at but I was meaning that the scene mode just took a while to load up so I'd rather when you first load an object for it to open it in the viewer mode as that loads quicker. But yeah I'm all for having the scene mode in there :)

[Daniel 0]

Completely agree with CM.

[Sniperwolf572 758]

Unlocking things seems an unnecessary chore when you can access it all in the editor and an inconvenience when you just want to work with one specific piece of equipment and you haven't unlocked anything yet.

That's what I think too, but from a very different reason, I've had many uninformed people talk to me about the game, with BF2-style unlocks in mind, saying how they found it repulsive having to unlock weapons in an SP "Armory" and only then you can play with it in MP.

But on the other hand, looking at it from "I have everything in editor" point of view, maybe it should be changed from unlocking things to be able to play with them in the armory, to having all gear available from the start, but completing "achievements" with each piece of kit, something like:

- Score over X amount of points on the shooting range with a Y rifle

- Kill a cow with your X aircraft gun while over Y meters altitude

- Do a barrel roll! (with an X helicopter)

- Kill someone from over Y meters with your X sniper rifle

- Get down that hill in your X motorcycle/bike without dying

- Dodge the barrels falling down a slope with the granny

- Cross a (busy) road with the chicken (Or another animal)

- Loose power and land safely using autorotation

- Complete the shooting range and score over X amount of points at night without using NV goggles after being shot in the hands and without releasing the hold breath key.

- Eliminate all enemies with your X silenced weapon in a camp without any of them being alerted at any point

- Fly upside down under the (Nogova) X bridge in your Y aircraft

- Crash a helicopter by shooting out it's tail rotor with an X rifle

- Make it X meters inland with your boat

- Navigate a minefield

- Walk to the store without breaking your back as a granny

etc, which could then also be incorporated for addons and addonmakers can pick which achievements can be done for their addon.

If you want to splice it up even further and include actual rewards for doing achievements in the armory:

- You could include some glasses, faces (already existing camo faces?) in the player customisation (Complete all achievements for 10 pistols to unlock facepaint set 1, etc)

- Things could be inserted in the campaign alongside already present gear (I.E. Completing Community-Made-Weapon-X would result it being placed in the FOB Manhattan gear box when you play the mission)

- Discounts in warfare for gear that you have completed achievements for

- Mission makers could also include such systems for their missions for extra replayablity.

It would then be a nice addition to the editor than just another chore to do in case you want to play with your favorite chopper in Armory without cheating.

Maybe include some MP functionality into it. (Official randomly generated steal the car with your friend/s/? Yes please!)

Community made plugins for Armory like additional random challenges.

Some of the suggestions might be far fetched, but I believe many of suggestions could be achieved even with ArmA2 trough the use of profile keys and such.

Bonus to it also being, if there is ever a console release of a future game, you'd already have existing setup for achievements which I hear MS is requiring for each X360 game, etc.

Edited February 21, 2010 by Sniperwolf572

[santafee 10]

I post my opinion here again, just to make sure its been read.

BI, please dont care about those things!

Nobody uses the Armory actually.

Please ask us for the CommandSystem/AI Controls, thats what people want.

I remember a old 1.4 Betapatch discussion were we was asked for our opinions on dangermode/overbound and such stuff with a poll.

The most SP players will agree with me, that this is the most important to fix/improve. Its the essential things here. The AI just needs way to much babysitting and micro. Please change this with the comm in upcoming betapatches! [if you dont even planned to change many stuff in this direction with OA]

To be true, im not going to buy OA if there arent improvements to the AI and CommandSystem. I love the scenario, but if i play SP only and all my Stuff isnt working cause the AI is frustrating me, screaming for milk and cookies, i cant see me buying it. Thank you and keep the support with the Beta Patches!

[Lal 10]

I post my opinion here again, just to make sure its been read.

BI, please dont care about those things!

Nobody uses the Armory actually.

I don't outright disagree with you per se, but I don't think they should outright ditch the armory. Sure I wouldn't want it prioritized, but I would rather see it improved when and if they have the time and made into a "real" gamemode than outright abandoned and left in the state it is currently in.

[santafee 10]

but why would use people the armory if they set up similar things by theirself in like 5 minutes after some practise?

We allready got soooo much possibilitys in this game, this it what makes it so unique. Now lets fix the core. AI, HUD, Spotting of Enemys, CommandSystem.

I just thing BI should focus a bit more on the important things.

I dont want them let down people who like the armory...

But everbody who likes this game is using the editor where

the possibilitys are allready endless.

[mr burns 132]

Armory --- never really used it. Only on some occasions when i wanted to test an addon real quick and could´nt find it at first glance in the editor, armory always has ´em on top of the list. So that´s all i ever really did with it.

Selectable tasks would be nice --- taxi missions for civi´s are in already but there´s so many crap missions besides them that you cannot be arsed waiting for the good ones to plop in. Look at GTA to know what fun sidemissions are like if you cannot come up with something original :D

On a sidenote: It´s close to being a crime that skeetshooting never was included as sp/mp mission (or selectable in armory), it´s a great mode to kill some time and should´ve been easily accessible from the start, imho (there´s a co3_skeetshooting on our gameserver btw *hint).

[Takko 10]

I always use the armory

for its preview function with detailed informations about the object.

Real good planning tool.

[Alex72 1]

Im not an armory user either. I guess when you develop moderate editor skills its not much needed anymore. If it was setup more like sniperwolf said with all gear unlocked from start but with more fun challenges i could see myself use it more to test things out and have a little fun. But i understand the unlocking though for new unexperienced players as they are forced to do good with the gear they have and then move on to the next instead of being overwhelmed of the shear diversity AA2 has.

Personally though the armory isnt for me since i know how to do most of it in the editor, and i usually expand it a bit further making it into a small mission in no time due to saved missions already made used as templates. So thats a superb if not the best testing ground for new gear. But sure - that comes a little later for a newcomer so the armory definatelly serves a purpose. Hope you get good ideas to work with. If any good ideas comes to me ill share them.

[Lal 10]

but why would use people the armory if they set up similar things by theirself in like 5 minutes after some practise?

We allready got soooo much possibilitys in this game, this it what makes it so unique. Now lets fix the core. AI, HUD, Spotting of Enemys, CommandSystem.

I just thing BI should focus a bit more on the important things.

I dont want them let down people who like the armory...

But everbody who likes this game is using the editor where

the possibilitys are allready endless.

Well, first of all it's really not the same to assault a camp of enemies you have placed yourself as opposed to a randomly generated armory challenge. Second, the Armory is a great introduction feature, it was one of the first things I finished and I loved every second of it. It's nice to be able to finish simple challenges and toy around when you're new to the game, as opposed to having to make it all from scratch with the editor.

I would like the armory changed though, and agree that it should not be top priority, but the editor does not replace its role imo. Just as the editor does not replace the role of the Scenarios, or the boot camp.

[Flash Thunder 10]

I honestly think BIS should just scrap the whole mode and use the time on polish or AI improvement.

I think its pointless since you can already toy with everything in the editor from the get go.

[DnA 5156]

Thank you all for the honest extensive feedback! I'll definately be checking this thread for a while, so keep it coming :)

As some of you have already commented: the Armory was never meant for everyone. I personally think it's a nice break from the main game for those who like and / or need it. I've read comments from people new to BIS games (outside of these forums), who were not yet playing around with the editor or did not want to at all. For them the Armory provides them the opportunity to quickly check out (community) content.

Asking for our developers to ignore one aspect of the game and try to improve completely different aspects, is not entirely realistic. Developers each have their roles and specialties and most designers cannot simply become an AI programmer overnight ;)

[myshaak 0]

I honestly think BIS should just scrap the whole mode and use the time on polish or AI improvement.

I think its pointless since you can already toy with everything in the editor from the get go.

I'm afraid I see both of your points as invalid.

First: I'm pretty sure removing the armory altogether won't speed the developement up. Armory doesn't take AI programmers to work on, that is most likely mission designers' job.. and they asking us for feedback and suggestions may indicate that some of them finished their job and now, to prevent themselves from being bored and feeling useless, they decided to spice some features a little bit more. If they want to be creative, by God, let them!

Second: Sure you can toy with everything in the editor, but that's not the point. You can also create mission there - does it mean that BIS should remove the campaign, because the players will create it themeselves? It is true that the armory concept feels half-finished at the moment, but with the addition of some above mentioned ideas (especially like Sniperwolf572's list), it may become a really fun mode to play. And I am not opposed the idea of unlocking either.. it just needs a bit more tweaking for it to be more understandable and user friendly.. maybe some list/unlock tree with all the armory items with the amount of points you need to achieve to unlock them.. or maybe the player could earn "money" by completing challeneges and then "buy" whatever armory items he desire. The possibilities are endless.. not to mention what the community could turn it into.

---------- Post added at 09:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:04 AM ----------

Developers each have their roles and specialties and most designers cannot simply become an AI programmer overnight ;)

Damn, you beat me to it! Must... write... faster! :p

Edited February 22, 2010 by Myshaak
typo

[Lal 10]

Second: Sure you can toy with everything in the editor, but that's not the point. You can also create mission there - does it mean that BIS should remove the campaign, because the players will create it themeselves?

Excellently put. This was what I tried to get through with my earlier post as well. Saying "why armory when you can use the editor" is pointless when you can make EVERYTHING with the editor.

The armory is amongst other things a great thing for less hardcore players since it allows some short tasks as opposed to mammoth-like missions where you may die and reload several times before you complete it. I know this since I am one of the players who didn't follow BI for the last 8 years but rather saw this game on sale on steam and thought "hey, this will be a nice break from TF2". That isn't to say I hate the heavier aspects of the game, I have discovered that although games like these might not be for everyone, there is certainly no rule saying you will not enjoy them if you are used to easier and less realistic games. Frankly I think a lot of "casual" gamers can be converted to this sort of immersive realistic military simulation. It might not be forgiving, but goddamn is it fun.

I think the Armory is a great addition in that it lets newer players ease into the game more softly, and as we all know, more players = more cash = BI might hire more programmers to speed up the overall developement process.

Edited February 22, 2010 by Lal

[Flash Thunder 10]

I'm afraid I see both of your points as invalid.

Yes you have proved the contrary, but if it requires a mission designer, then I would rather have more Scenario missions or FTE's whatever you want to call them, since im horrible at scripting and overall fail at making anything worthwhile. ;) Edited February 22, 2010 by Flash Thunder