ARMA 2 basic questions

[DocSnyder 0]

I'd really like to see an official statement of BIS, why they release an unfinished game with so many obvious and - sorry - stupid bugs.

I'm a BI games player from day one and I like their games - BUT...

This game was highly anticipated by both the player community and the press.

Minor bugs occur in every game. But - we are talking about major bugs here that occur during normal gameplay. Just following the story, without trying fancy alternative things. BASIC stuff.

Quality control / beta testers must have experienced the same bugs.

I think these bugs are basic problems of the game engine (AI not responding to commands, AI running through objects, unable to get into vehicles, bad destruction models, AI not entering buildings, bad building design, lack of many animations like getting into a vehicle, AI not able to follow roads, basic game logic things like being not able to finish missions,...), as similar problems always have existed in BI games and they can't get rid of them.

The worst thing - you save your game because it's gonna be difficult to accomplish something. After a couple of trys and reloads, the AI seems to learn which moves you'll gonna do next. :eek:

And why is it still not possible to jump??

So wouldn't it have been better to use an entirely new game engine?

I have to admit - this engine is absolutely gorgeous for vast landscapes. Stunning visuals . Good Job here.

But the game just lacks playability, physics of other state of the art games. I could have been done muuuch better.

Also the User Interface. it is a pain to use. horrible. very cryptic. you have SPACE, BACKSPACE and "`". Every one gives you different options to control your team.

EXAMPLE: I want to tell my team to go PRONE.

"`" Doesn't give me the option. neither does "SPACE".

So I select my Team w. "`" and use "BACKSPACE". Damn it. I have to use "BACKSPACE" first and then select my team with "`" to access the option.

Why not one KEY for all OPTIONS? Why not bind SPACE to a general Orders / Maps / Options menu that also pauses the game to help you choosing your tactics and your teams behaviour? Why not put more status / information on the screen?

In reality you can give clear orders very quickly. In Game you simply need time to give orders. especially if you want to give other orders to every team member. This takes you a very long time in ARMA. And if you're lucky, you don't get killed while assigning different tasks to all of your Teammates.

Markers and Reports from Team members are horrible and it's often unclear what's next or what's happening around you. We need clearly visible and understandable Markers and clear reports (WHERE, WHAT, HEADING, POSITION).

They had enough time. So what's BI's explanation for that. I'd really like to know.

I have to admit Multiplayer is really fun and It's the main reason I bought it.

[Baldman 10]

If you were a "BI player from day 1" you'd know that basically all of their releases have been the same and that the real quality comes from the patches and community when they have a wider test audience.

[celery 8]

You have very few questions considering the name of the thread.

And why is it still not possible to jump??

It is possible to jump, default key is V.

So wouldn't it have been better to use an entirely new game engine?

It is a new engine, not everything needs to be made from scratch.

Why not one KEY for all OPTIONS? Why not bind SPACE to a general Orders / Maps / Options menu that also pauses the game to help you choosing your tactics and your teams behaviour? Why not put more status / information on the screen?

If it was the other way, someone else would be asking the opposite questions. It's a design solution. Pausing the game doesn't fit into the whole real time simulation aspect and it wouldn't work in multiplayer.

[DocSnyder 0]

I AM a player from day1. I spent probably more time w. OFP, ARMA, VBS & ARMA2 as most people. And I know that patches made things better and Community Support is great, BUT THEY NEVER REALLY GOT RID OF THE CORE ISSUES.

V is not really jumping, but it's an improvement. :-D

It is not really a new engine. You can see that in many things. No matter what they tell us.

You have to admit that this GUI is really awkward and playability is not as good as it could be.

Why can't they just make the game palyable as any other game?

ARMA is a fantastic Game Concept. But is is not as good as it could be.

Why not combining an easy, intuitive GUI like Rainbow Six Vegas,

Player movements and controls of FARCRY2,

buildings of COD4+5 and

the fantastic Landscape and Atmosphere of ARMA 2?

Don't get me wrong, I like the game. But I'm really disappointed why they never do it right the first time.

It is NOT the right way to fix bugs 4 years after a release. A game should have GOLD status when it is released. NOT 4 years after. This time should better be used to improve the game.

Patch 1.01 has improved things a bit, but made the Single Player Campaign unplayable after the Manhattan mission (WHICH WAS GREAT!!)

P.S: Has anyone read my list of basic bugs: AI not responding to commands, AI running through objects, unable to get into vehicles, bad destruction models, AI not entering buildings, bad building design, lack of many animations like getting into a vehicle, AI not able to follow roads, basic game logic things like being not able to finish missions,..

MOST OF THOSE PROBLEMS exist for years now and couldn't be completely fixed. That's why I believe, those are BASIC problems with the engine that cannot be fixed and we have to live with that.

Edited June 7, 2009 by DocSnyder

[Xindar 10]

Why not combining an easy, intuitive GUI like Rainbow Six Vegas,

In RS:V you have only few options what to do but in arma u have more options so IMHO it wouldnt work.

buildings of COD4+5 and

CoD is full of scripts. This is why ai in CoD react so good in buildings. And "world" in CoD is really small compared to Arma. In CoD you have 1(maybe 2) ways how to go trough a level but in OPF/Arma/Arma2 you have one big Island/land. Same buildings like in CoD would be IMHO too difficult for PC. And Ai just dont behave good in buildings.

:coop:

[sic-disaster 311]

Please dont mention Vegas in the same sentence as ArmA or that ArmA could use features from that game, it makes me shiver in horror.

Vegas is what could be called my personal Pandora's Box, it is the symbol of the death of gaming to me.

It's not Rainbow Six, if you HAVE to mention an R6 game then by God, mention Rogue Spear or Raven Shield, or hell, even the first one, but not Vegas or that other fuck-up called Lockdown.

[yawnald 10]

Part of the fun is watching these BIS games evolve over the years through patches and user mods. You just can't compare a game of this scale and scope to an "on rails" shooter like CoD or R6. BIS is one of the only game companies still making open world sims like this. Most other companies have toned everything down for the mindless masses who enjoy pointless twitch games (console gamers).

I can only hope that BIS continues doing exactly what they're doing, which is making sims like ofp/arma. They might be a little rough at first, but they're all masterpieces.

[Heatseeker 0]

Far as im concerned Arma II isnt out yet ;) .

A beta version was released in Germany so blame the german publisher for being greedy.

[MulleDK19 21]

I'd really like to see an official statement of BIS, why they release an unfinished game with so many obvious and - sorry - stupid bugs.

BIS has never released any games. They're not even a publisher.

Morphicon released it, not BIS.

[zenith777 0]

I'd really like to see an official statement of BIS, why they release an unfinished game with so many obvious and - sorry - stupid bugs.

I'm pretty sure publisher chose the release date.

Minor bugs occur in every game. But - we are talking about major bugs here that occur during normal gameplay. Just following the story, without trying fancy alternative things. BASIC stuff.

Quality control / beta testers must have experienced the same bugs.

I think these bugs are basic problems of the game engine (AI not responding to commands, AI running through objects, unable to get into vehicles, bad destruction models, AI not entering buildings, bad building design, lack of many animations like getting into a vehicle, AI not able to follow roads, basic game logic things like being not able to finish missions,...), as similar problems always have existed in BI games and they can't get rid of them.

The worst thing - you save your game because it's gonna be difficult to accomplish something. After a couple of trys and reloads, the AI seems to learn which moves you'll gonna do next. :eek:

ArmA 2 runs pretty well for me without big or very noticable bugs

And why is it still not possible to jump??

Multiplayer. Bunnyhop.

So wouldn't it have been better to use an entirely new game engine?

Making new engine takes alot time and work.

Also the User Interface. it is a pain to use. horrible. very cryptic. you have SPACE, BACKSPACE and "`". Every one gives you different options to control your team.

User interface is simple and easy to use atleast in my opinion.

Markers and Reports from Team members are horrible and it's often unclear what's next or what's happening around you. We need clearly visible and understandable Markers and clear reports (WHERE, WHAT, HEADING, POSITION).

Gotta agree with this tho, "Enemy at north, about 200 meters from you" could be pretty humane and simple.

[von_paulus 0]

Part of the fun is watching these BIS games evolve over the years through patches and user mods. You just can't compare a game of this scale and scope to an "on rails" shooter like CoD or R6. BIS is one of the only game companies still making open world sims like this. Most other companies have toned everything down for the mindless masses who enjoy pointless twitch games (console gamers).

I can only hope that BIS continues doing exactly what they're doing, which is making sims like ofp/arma. They might be a little rough at first, but they're all masterpieces.

True.

People are always complaining about what they think what the game should be.

Nothing wrong with that. But they should be reminded that to keep things in balance it's a hard work and BIS, IMHO, has succeed in doing that since OFP.

No doubt there's always space for improvements. There's a section in this forum for such suggestions.

[Fred DM 0]

Most other companies have toned everything down for the mindless masses who enjoy pointless twitch games (console gamers).

yay! let's generalize some more and show elitist attitute in a gaming forum! :j:

[yawnald 10]

yay! let's generalize some more and show elitist attitute in a gaming forum! :j:

Prove to me that my statement isn't true, and I'll take it back.:)

[von_paulus 0]

yay! let's generalize some more and show elitist attitute in a gaming forum! :j:

It's not an elitist attitude at all. It's humble truth.

[yawnald 10]

It's not an elitist attitude at all. It's humble truth.

Thanks. I didn't feel that I came off as an elitist, either.

[Alex72 1]

Originally Posted by Yawnald

Most other companies have toned everything down for the mindless masses who enjoy pointless twitch games (console gamers).

yay! let's generalize some more and show elitist attitute in a gaming forum!

But true though isn't it.

OP is a BIS vet and asks for vegas(s) interface and jumping? Wow...

[Deadfast 43]

BIS has never released any games. They're not even a publisher.

Morphicon released it, not BIS.

Well, BIS holds a major share in IDEA Games who handles publishing in Czech Republic and Slovakia, but do you see the game released there? :p

[khenubaal 10]

Hmm, but you get it in two weeks which basically means that it should be already in print so you don´t necessarily get an ArmA2 that is already patched to 1.01. Even if yours is already patched to 1.01 that build is still not stable and release candidate worthy because it still includes game breaking bugs. It will probably take another 2-3 patches until playing through the campaign is a somewhat smooth ride. Whether publishers are to blame for insisting on the release date detailed in the contract or the developers since they couldn´t meet the release date for whatever reasons, in the end that scapegoat hunt is really pointless.

Don´t get me wrong, i was an avid OF:P player and am supporting BI with my money votes as i can. Can´t really blame us for getting the game when it is available here. And please don´t ridicule the OP just because of the jumping and Vegas comparisons, he has valid points in general. Just because ArmA is a complex game, it doesn´t justify the crude interface (basically unimproved OF:P interface but now even more expanded) it still has. I´d rather say it needs an accessible interface because it is a complex game. I think there is really a lot of room for improvement.

[Fred DM 0]

Prove to me that my statement isn't true, and I'll take it back.:)

i'm a long-time PC gamer and have played OpF, ArmA and now ArmA 2. i've also played Silent Hunter 4, Falcon 4.0, and countless other sims.

i also own a PS2, a GameCube and a PS3, on which i've enjoyed Metal Gear Solid 4, Gran Turismo 5 Prologue, Resident Evil 5, Killzone 2, Battlefield Bad Company, etc.

some of you seem to be stuck in a long forgotten time. lots of gamers have opened their horizon and own and play several systems.

[yawnald 10]

i'm a long-time PC gamer and have played OpF, ArmA and now ArmA 2. i've also played Silent Hunter 4, Falcon 4.0, and countless other sims.

i also own a PS2, a GameCube and a PS3, on which i've enjoyed Metal Gear Solid 4, Gran Turismo 5 Prologue, Resident Evil 5, Killzone 2, Battlefield Bad Company, etc.

some of you seem to be stuck in a long forgotten time. lots of gamers have opened their horizon and own and play several systems.

I don't know what "time" you're living in, but today's gaming world is quite the opposite. With companies running away from the PC platform left and right, or releasing poorly coded console ports, a company who releases pc games FIRST, and ports to console is a rarity. Also, the attention span of today's gamers seems to be getting shorter and shorter. They want to jump in, play a quick game for 5-10 min, and jump out. Games like arma2 don't cater to this very well, therefore they are in a niche market. I applaud BIS for not jumping on the bandwagon of releasing dumbed-down console games and later porting them to pc.

It's all too obvious. High-end pcs pack multiple times the graphic/processing power of today's consoles, but since the sheer numbers lie in the console market, that's where most developers focus their energy. Pcs are an afterthought. It's very lazy/greedy of devs to act this way. Though, in a business sense, I can understand why they do so.:(

I also own a ps2, gamecube, xbox, xbox 360, ps3, and wii. I don't use them very much anymore. That kind of gaming doesn't excite me, save for a couple like forza 2/gt5. Your mileage may vary. :)

[DocSnyder 0]

I only took the RSV GUI as an example. not the whole game. It is easy and quick to use. The ARMA GUI (at least in single player IS NOT).

Problem is... the graphics and some other things have been improved of course. many problems / issues are still the same. BI is just not living up to all the promises they made (see Physics, Micro AI, GUI... Bugs like the god like AI amazed me in OFP and OFP Resistance already:D). I have never compared ARMA w. the ego shooters. I am not dumb :D

Has anybody played the single player campaign to the end (with Patch)? If not... do it and you know what I'm complaining about.

Ok, guys... I'm off gotta play ARMA 2 Multiplayer. still the best part of the game. :cool:

[InFireBaptize 0]

most likely all the guys on this forum know that this game will have bugs, this isn't anything new but if you don't like the game simply put it away, don't play it! and no, we don't need the jump button, go put 50lbs of weights and jump then come and tell us how it feels. BI is the best developer out there and there are no other developers who can be compared to them PERIOD.

[DocSnyder 0]

READ before posting. I personally like the game but I'm disappointed because the game has a much bigger potential and could have been much better and INNOVATIVE.

As for JUMPING... I think it's just a joke to walk around fallen trees or rocks, just because I can't jump. Sure, "V" works good on fences. but it's very static. And what about cutting through wire fences or rapelling?

Sorry for the OT:

Baptize you don't sound like you have ever been deployed or on a multi day hiking trip or carrying a rucksack at all. Jumping w. 50lbs is definelty possible. You cannot do big jumps of course. How does it feel? Huh... what kind of question is that? :-D We sometimes had to carry loads up to 40 kg (88lbs) fully geared up ( backpack, weapon and equipment ) when I have been in the army.

And as for your 2nd statement: They are good developers. No question. They provide outstanding Community support.

The best? Of course LOL

Edited June 8, 2009 by DocSnyder

[InFireBaptize 0]

READ before posting. I personally like the game but I'm disappointed because the game has a much bigger potential and could have been much better and INNOVATIVE.

As for JUMPING... I think it's just a joke to walk around fallen trees or rocks, just because I can't jump. Sure, "V" works good on fences. but it's very static. And what about cutting through wire fences or rapelling?

Sorry for the OT:

Baptize you don't sound like you have ever been deployed or on a multi day hiking trip or carrying a rucksack at all. Jumping w. 50lbs is definelty possible. You cannot do big jumps of course. How does it feel? Huh... what kind of question is that? :-D We sometimes had to carry loads up to 40 kg (88lbs) fully geared up ( backpack, weapon and equipment ) when I have been in the army.

And as for your 2nd statement: They are good developers. No question. They provide outstanding Community support.

The best? Of course LOL

The potential is the transition of ArmaI to II, unless i see another game in the same genere by different devlopers this game has the biggest potential.

No i haven't been into hiking but i served in the army, and when we see a tree or a hole or a rock we simply go around it or do the "V" thing, we simply didn't stand thinking whether we can make that jump or not specially when you're loaded with equipments, bullet proof vest and supplies, it is not safe to do so. I played ArmaI a lot and never once i thought about the need of a jump button. If i feel like jumping i go and play BF or COD.

[kklownboy 43]

...

As for JUMPING... I think it's just a joke to walk around fallen trees or rocks, just because I can't jump. Sure, "V" works good on fences. but it's very static. And what about cutting through wire fences or rapelling?

Sorry for the OT:

...

And as for your 2nd statement: They are good developers. No question. They provide outstanding Community support.

The best? Of course LOL

Its a sandbox game....make your own wire cutters... or wait, or ask in the mod forum... OH you know this already, you just want it all out of the box... and less gui... There are GUI mods too...Oh you know this already... well not for A2 yet, but in time. Edited June 8, 2009 by kklownboy