ArmA-Raq!?

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

Ok, sorry about the description - just one of my tricks to lure you in - being the attention whore I am and all...

First off, this game sounds absolutely awsome, and i know I'm not gonna be disappointed as much as *cough*, *cough* GTA 4 - but hey, even if I am, at least I didn't buy a whole new system exclusively to play it. I'd definately like to buy this when it'll eventually come out.

Anyway, from the info on the recently-launched website, it seems there's a striking resemblance between this game's theem and the current Iraq War, that I felt I needed to just point out here. It first struck me when I read this:

Quote[/b] ]ArmA 2 features a player-driven, branching campaign. Your actions have consequences! Win the hearts and minds of the warring factions inside Chernarus, or play them off against one another! Your choices will shape the future country. Ultimately, you decide which faction (if any) survives to rule. Will you establish a lasting peace, or kick off a final war?

Yes, winning hearts and minds like the US is trying/supposed to be doing in Iraq, and warring factions - just like the militias there. Also, there is a "Guerilla" Section at the top, which is suggestive of a significant presence and central role irregular combatants in the game. I absolutely can't wait to see there new Guerilla designs - I dearly hope it's not the pseudo-regular forces of OFP - who even have bloody tanks!

Then there is this pic.

US digital Camo pattern, army surplus/old/Police SWAT style uncamouflaged bullet-proof vests and helmets, Soviet weaponry and to top it off - an nice intimidating-looking balaclava (ski mask to you Yanks). Who does that unfortunate chap remind you off....

Picture.

However, again brining back old peeve with the OFP Resistance unit design is that BIS has this habbit of making everyone a bit too well uniformed, especially those Resistance Soldiers. I can't really see the guys in the background of the OFP pic too well, but they seem to be identically uniformed to the guy in the fore-ground. Being Next-Gen, I really don't think it'll be that difficult to have a bit more variety in uniforms, especially with worse-funded units.

Maybe they can even make use of the system first introduced in last gen, first in GTA VCS as first as I saw it, where the units are each randomly given different clothing/colouring of clothing from a selection, so they all look unique.

I'm crap at explaining, and English is my second language. Basically, they can have variety for camo schemes, armour and helmets. So for Chernarus Security Forces, they either have US Woodland, Russian Woodland or US Digital Woodland camos, Black, blue or biege armour, and a black, green or Woodland Camo helmet. Each unit is given a random Camo, armour and helmet.

So at the end, say the Chernarus Security Forces look a bit more like:

Also, for the Resistance RPG fighters, they should not have both an RPG and an Assault rifle - as with the case of most guerillas - or even organised regular forces - in the world today. Also, I think that during the 1980's, Soviet RPG soldiers didn't have an assault rifle like their NATO counterparts.

Oh, and insurgents like them:

As an Iraqi who had relatives murdered and kidnapped by Iran-sponsered, armed, trained and controlled militias and even direct combatants from there, I'd love to fight those dirty exremist Ayatollah bastards in this game, but I guess Russia (one of there allies) will do somewhat, even if they'll never be able to be as evil no matter how much they try. So yeah, also, what role do you think the Russian army will play in this - the same as Iran in Iraq, or will they get directly involved and all-out war errupts again?

Anyway, I just wanted this to be a general discussion of what war/conflicts you think this game is set on, and how do you speculate the units will look like, and what are they based upon.

Anyway, I'd love to hear some of all you're thoughts on this, and see some more pretty pictures of what you want units in game to be based on . Sorry for this giagantic post - I never been good at summarising my thoughs - or anything for that matter.

Take care guys, and thanks BIS - this game seems awsome.

[Placebo 28]

You've been a member long enough to know about the >100kb rule.

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

You've been a member long enough to know about the >100kb rule.

Oh shit, no, I haven't been that active so sorry I didn't know about it.

What should I do to fix that, am I allowed to post another like continuation reply?

[The Masta 0]

the pics you post shouldn't be >100kb.

[Kristian 47]

I agree with all parts, expect the RPG-no rifle, it sounds kinda r'tarded, (no offense). Imagine a fight in town, and then yuo blast the fuck out of a tank with ur <3 loved RPG <3, but then there comez like 1o0o0o Infarty unitz and pwns u cuz u cannot fight back

[max power 21]

Arming like that can be accomplished by the mission maker.

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

I agree with all parts, expect the RPG-no rifle, it sounds kinda r'tarded, (no offense). Imagine a fight in town, and then yuo blast the fuck out of a tank with ur <3 loved RPG <3, but then there comez like 1o0o0o Infarty unitz and pwns u cuz u cannot fight back  

Lol yes, but you would have someone covering you. Also, then it's time to cut and run - that is basic guerilla tactics, and what they use in Iraq. You will never be able to realistically defeat a swarm of better equipped and better trained soldiers, who also happen to have better armour than your old Kevlar vets - so better live to fight another day.

Besides which, this is OFP not CoD, so you could just run up into the hills, <s>put twigs in your hair and call yourselves the Wolverines</s> scavange some better weapons, and pick off your regular-army enemies one by one, or set traps for them.

That is realistic guerilla warfare, not engaging in a full-blown firefight - unless it's with a rival, badly-armed guerilla faction, or the police or some other people you can easily take down with a few RPG's. Also, you can take the AK from a fallen comerade.

I absolutely love this approach, especially with the OFP resistance demo I downloaded before buying the game. The first base I completed with a long-series of hit-and runs, with a massive assault when the tanks got taken out.

The other place we ran into the hills and forests, took the sniper, and fought like we was Che Guevara and Fidel Castro.

[Brendon 0]

The first picture you posted isn't a resistance force that you're fighting, it's a Russian Soldier.

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

The first picture you posted isn't a resistance force that you're fighting, it's a Russian Soldier.

Hi mate, I never meant to imply he's a resistance guy. I thought he would be the US-backed/equiped/trained Chernarus Army soldier, or a Security Forces Officer (like Police Commando) - the equivalent of the Iraqi Security Forces in this war.

They aren't Resistance side, but with the West, and help them fight the Resistance.

I don't really think he's a Russian because of the different US army digital uniform. It looks just like the US Army/Newer Iraqi Army digital uniforms, but in woodland colours rather than urban grey/biege/blue. Also his helmet and vest look old and not camouflaged like those of the current Iraqi Army.

Lol, that's just my logic anyway bro.

[Spetz 0]

just curious... the second picture, which countries military is that?

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

just curious... the second picture, which countries military is that?

That's the Iraqi Police Commandos - a paramilitary branch of the police supposed to be the equivalent of the US SWAT Teams.

However, in reality they have been accused of using their US training to act as Death Squads to the initially US backed Maliki administration. Now Maliki's a mere puppet to Iran.

In Iraq, the Police Commandoes wear that bluish version of the US digital Camo or the Old US Woodland like they wore in OFP.

The Army wears desert Camo or plain biege. It is very confusing though, as they all have similar weaponry (AK's, PK's and RPG's) and similar bullet-proof vests and helmets. Recently even the regular beat cops are wearing military armour and helmets, but their normal uniforms underneath. They even use AK's, PK's/Fixed Browning Machine Guns and RPG's!

Hope that helped bro.

[Placebo 28]

You've been a member long enough to know about the >100kb rule.

Oh shit, no, I haven't been that active so sorry I didn't know about it.

What should I do to fix that, am I allowed to post another like continuation reply?

Just edit the pic to less then 100kb then edit into your first post, no harm no foul etc

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

You've been a member long enough to know about the >100kb rule.

Oh shit, no, I haven't been that active so sorry I didn't know about it.

What should I do to fix that, am I allowed to post another like continuation reply?

Just edit the pic to less then 100kb then edit into your first post, no harm no foul etc

Thanks again bro, I'll try doing that now.

[Heatseeker 0]

Russia is not in the game afaik, and neither is Iraq.

Chernarus is a fictional ex soviet country living some sort of escalating civil war, basically i believe we will have the evil commie zombies, capitalist pig wannabees, and freedom or death warriors, etc all split and fighting for supremasy.

But the US world police interveins to establish stability in the region, wich doesnt make alot of sense unless this is yet another Bush type excuse and they just want to export coca cola and piss off the Russians lmao .

So the usmc units are more likely the only units who will resemble a real world military fighting force.

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

Russia is not in the game afaik, and neither is Iraq.

Chernarus is a fictional ex soviet country living some sort of escalating civil war, basically i believe we will have the evil commie zombies, capitalist pig wannabees, and freedom or death warriors, etc all split and fighting for supremasy.

But the US world police interveins to establish stability in the region, wich doesnt make alot of sense unless this is yet another  Bush type excuse and they just want to export coca cola and piss off the Russians lmao .

So the usmc units are more likely the only units who will resemble a real world military fighting force.

LMAO!

QFT bro.

However, I think there might be Ruskies getting involved, especially with the Czech's utter dislike for their politic after the 1968 invasion, and even more so after the Soviet Union collapsed, fucking everyone over and out. Oh, and there's also a Russian flag on this ol' chap.

Also, I never tried to imply it was Iraq, but rather loosely based on the Iraq War: Warring Factions, Winning hearts and minds, who rules afterwards and a suggested heavy presence of Assymetric warefare and irregular combatant (the most common wars and combatants nowadays) with the section called "Guerillas" on the Official Site.

Really looking forwards to this section being launched.

[Heatseeker 0]

Could be a plot surprise BIS are hidding, maybe Russia is secretly supporting the commie party? Or maybe some corrupt, high ranked general is finacing the commies or selling weapons, etc.

Based on the plot part revealed so far the player is part of the elite Razor team (lol, how corny is that? ) so the US intervention in Chernarus sounds like some classified, top secret operation thingy prior to the usmc arrival.

With a bit of imagination and taste it would make for a very interesting story .

[badlymad 0]

The first picture you posted isn't a resistance force that you're fighting, it's a Russian Soldier.

Hi mate, I never meant to imply he's a resistance guy. I thought he would be the US-backed/equiped/trained Chernarus Army soldier, or a Security Forces Officer (like Police Commando) - the equivalent of the Iraqi Security Forces in this war.

They aren't Resistance side, but with the West, and help them fight the Resistance.

I don't really think he's a Russian because of the different US army digital uniform. It looks just like the US Army/Newer Iraqi Army digital uniforms, but in woodland colours rather than urban grey/biege/blue. Also his helmet and vest look old and not camouflaged like those of the current Iraqi Army.

Lol, that's just my logic anyway bro.

The soldier is definitely Russian- note that the camouflage he is wearing is not a digital uniform at all, but the "Partizan" camo suit that is popular among Russian spetznaz units:

http://img107.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vsnoh8.jpg

As for Russia's role in the storyline, it has probably been said before and will likely be said again, but parallels between their intervention in the game's storyline and what happened in South Ossetia will likely be unavoidable.

My guess would be that the Razor team's initial involement in halting and pushing back the rebels might lead to Russian incursion, which in turn causes a larger Marine taskforce to arrive to protect the Chenarus government and battle the Russians in a brutal, but brief conflict. That is pure speculation though.

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

The first picture you posted isn't a resistance force that you're fighting, it's a Russian Soldier.

Hi mate, I never meant to imply he's a resistance guy. I thought he would be the US-backed/equiped/trained Chernarus Army soldier, or a Security Forces Officer (like Police Commando) - the equivalent of the Iraqi Security Forces in this war.

They aren't Resistance side, but with the West, and help them fight the Resistance.

I don't really think he's a Russian because of the different US army digital uniform. It looks just like the US Army/Newer Iraqi Army digital uniforms, but in woodland colours rather than urban grey/biege/blue. Also his helmet and vest look old and not camouflaged like those of the current Iraqi Army.

Lol, that's just my logic anyway bro.

The soldier is definitely Russian- note that the camouflage he is wearing is not a digital uniform at all, but the "Partizan" camo suit that is popular among Russian spetznaz units:

http://img107.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vsnoh8.jpg

As for Russia's role in the storyline, it has probably been said before and will likely be said again, but parallels between their intervention in the game's storyline and what happened in South Ossetia will likely be unavoidable.

My guess would be that the Razor team's initial involement in halting and pushing back the rebels might lead to Russian incursion, which in turn causes a larger Marine taskforce to arrive to protect the Chenarus government and them off in a brutal, but brief conflict. That is pure speculation though.

You're right man - I just noticed too - the helmets are identical to the Spetsnaz's, and they got the exact same balaclavas on too!

And at the story, I think I agree that it will undoubtadly have major parallels with the Georgia conflict, but the game was in development before hostilities officially kicked off, so they probably added that "hearts and minds" winning thing from the Iraq war. Also in Georgia, it was mainly "Army Vs. Army", and the resistance played a very minor role. I think they again will borrow from Iraq in the irregular factions fighting one another.

Also, unlike the real conflict, here, Russia's side will loose humiliatingly and the US's will win.

However, the thing with choosing which faction rules and pitting them one against the other hints a much welcomed detatchment from the side-taking and "infinately good US Vs infintely evil Russia/Soviets" theme which I really disliked.

Hope they set new precidents with choosing your side via your actions in this game, like all the ground-breaking things the original OFP introduced to the world.

[Heatseeker 0]

As for Russia's role in the storyline, it has probably been said before and will likely be said again, but parallels between their intervention in the game's storyline and what happened in South Ossetia will likely be unavoidable.

My guess would be that the Razor team's initial involement in halting and pushing back the rebels might lead to Russian incursion, which in turn causes a larger Marine taskforce to arrive to protect the Chenarus government and battle the Russians in a brutal, but brief conflict. That is pure speculation though.

Nah, the Russian intervention in Georgia would be too obvious and that situation is too fresh, besides a possible conflict betwean the US and Russia in the near future wouldnt be digested too well. Chernarus is a torn up country, not a seperatist region/state.

I think Team Razors task will be to settle things down, before Russia steps in, wich it might at some point, since they are likely to indirectly support one of the parties .

I think i have a small novel cooking in my head .

[dentist guba 0]

i can see some parallels with the afghanistan war (y'know, that one) with russian and US backed factions. hopefully this storyline will be similar to that in that the americans aren't just the heroes like OFP 1 (some nasty man who's sort of russian but isn't has taken over stuff on his own) but something where both sides could be blamed.

[Big-Rooney 5]

It sounds similar to Iraq.

There are two warring factions within the country, and two external powers fighting within the country trying to sort it out.

In ArmA 2 with got the government of this Island (Can't remember the name) and the Rebel forces fighting them.

Then we got the US and the Russian stepping into the conflict trying to resolve it in their unique way with outcome decided who the Island will support, East or West.

[Neo-Babylonian 0]

i can see some parallels with the afghanistan war (y'know, that one) with russian and US backed factions. hopefully this storyline will be similar to that in that the americans aren't just the heroes like OFP 1 (some nasty man who's sort of russian but isn't has taken over stuff on his own) but something where both sides could be blamed.

I totally agree. OFP has always been head and shoulders above all the other games in terms of maturity and realism - though it is still a kick-ass action game that'll get you shitting bricks on some missions.

Anyway, the only single let-down in OFP - which is otherwise flawless is the story. I said this before, the Czechs hate Russia for the 1968 invasion, Soviet Oppression and finally how the Soviet Union let them down after it collapsed. They are dearly trying to shift to the West's sphere of influence.

However, that does not excuse a CoD storyline with infinately good verses the dark side. The only certain thing in war is there are no good guys - just two sides using barbaric stone-age violence with their most modern weapons. I also hope this will be mature in showing both sides are to blame - all you can do is try your best to be good.

You all probably know now (from the name too) that I'm Iraqi, and hate anything Iran with a passion after all they did to us. However, if I was gonna design a game about said war, I will at least show the less honourable things the US soldiers too, and how it is equally some of us Iraqi's fault for accepting to be puppets of Iran.

@Big Rooney: That would be a sweet idea - just exactly what I wish for. They show both Russian and US motives to be less than valiant and honourable despite both side's propoganda, and you are left to act to get the outcome you think is best for the people - or maybe you just wanna be evil and choose the bad outcome.