ATTN: Addon Makers - Rules of content permissions.

[Placebo 29]

Just a short note, most of you are aware of this stance but just to put it in writing again:

You must have permission to use something

As far as we're concerned, every person who uses something belonging to someone else, must have permission to use it for Flashpoint (if they use it in Flashpoint) and they must have permission to use it in ArmA (if they use it in ArmA). It's not correct to assume that because someone made something available for people to use in Flashpoint that you can use it in ArmA, express permission must be sought with the addon maker.

Need help contacting someone for permission?

Obviously there can be issues in contacting people due to their inboxes being full, them choosing to not make their Email address public, etc. etc. if you're having problems contacting someone to request permission I'm happy to help out, I can get PM's through to people who have full inboxes, I can send Emails to people who keep their Email address hidden, I'm here to help so let me, rather than breaking one of the cardinal rules of the community by using something that isn't yours.

If you want me to help you make contact please do the following:

Send an Email to: Placebo@bistudio.com with the subject: "Contact for Addon Permissions" (will help it get through the spam filters ) include in there your forum name & the forum name of the person you want me to contact along with links to both of your forum profiles as well as the message you want me to get across to them.

If you make the request via PM I'm only going to reply back "please send the request via Email", sorry

Consequences

Any threads discussing addons/mods using content for which applicable permission has not been sought will be closed, people who break this (rather common) courtesy face being banned from these forums, and probably much worse, face being shunned by the community they want to be part of.

We cannot enforce how people behave or treat the work of other people away from the forums but we can enforce how people behave and treat each other on these forums.

Edited April 10, 2009 by W0lle
Import bugs fixed

[Placebo 29]

For now I'll leave this open in case anyone has any questions/suggestions/feedback or whatever

[manzilla 1]

Will action be taken by you and other mods if someone releases content on these forums that is found to be in violation? As in remove links, etc.? Just curious if this is a mandate from BIS or just a reminder of community ethics.

Either way it's well said and much appreciated. That holds just a bit more weight then when we say it. Hopefully, people will take you up on your contacting abilities.

[Placebo 29]

Yes, threads will be closed and the links will be removed, if the member(s) involved were found to deliberately take something without permission they risk a permanent ban from the forums.

[sparky 0]

since OFP time , i was wondering.

Do we need permission to use BIS addons, for the same game??

and in particular, for retextures of BIS units, or remodell etc etc...

[roberthammer 582]

I think only for outside of Arma , for example CS , CSS , OFP , GTA SA etc.

[ShadowY 0]

I think that he ment any content...

So if I toy with a addon place a screenshot and trash the addon, then I probably face the same threatment as someone who`s releasing it (as his own)

If the mod/addonmaker starts to make sh*t out of the toying

[vilas 477]

addon is one thing, but very important is to keep "classnames" different in config too

i remember one situation when one guy did a reskins of my weapons, but he used the same classnames

so it was replacing values on my config

so it is important to keep configs/classes order too

if someone defined for example "my_ammo_762" than other who use his config as refference must use other name for exaple "my_signature_762"

otherwise addons will be conflicting with classnames and player will get silly result or disfunction

so you should not only take care about model, textures (things seen by an eye) but also on classes in config

[Placebo 29]

since OFP time , i was wondering.

Do we need permission to use BIS addons, for the same game??

and in particular, for retextures of BIS units, or remodell etc etc...

No you do not need BIS' permission for using our stuff within our own games, as long as it's not for any kind of commercial product.

[benreeper 0]

So does that mean we can use BIS OFP addons in Arma?

--Ben

[ravendk 25]

It dosnt sound like it ben. OFP and ARMA are both BIS games

[max power 21]

Clearly, it says you need permission for anything owned by someone else. So, if you aren't the creator of a particular thing, then you need permission. This includes *everything*. Placebo just stated that you can use BIS addons for use within BIS products so long as you don't sell the end result. That seems to include anything that BIS owns the rights to, as opposed to CodeMasters. Treat that as permission, and there you go.

[Messiah 2]

common sense prevails - I eagerly await to see how this proactive stance follows through.

I assume that this also includes if you source items from outside the ArmA/OFP community? I.e. take a public addon from CS and convert it to ArmA/OFP without permission?

[vektorboson 8]

common sense prevails - I eagerly await to see how this proactive stance follows through.

I assume that this also includes if you source items from outside the ArmA/OFP community? I.e. take a public addon from CS and convert it to ArmA/OFP without permission?

Every art is copyrighted and you need permission to use it (unless of course, the local laws say otherwise).

The best thing is, when that 'addon' has a License.txt (for example Creative Commons) where it clearly states what one is allowed to do and what not. Even better if the Readme has a short summary of the license.

[Messiah 2]

I'm aware that every addon, regardless of platform/engine, is subject to the same rule in principle, I was merely asking if those forms of copyright infringement would be as actively pursued on these forums, or mainly just the OFP/ARMA ones.

[quiet_man 8]

Every art is copyrighted and you need permission to use it (unless of course, the local laws say otherwise).

hmmm, good point.

If someone models real life weapons, vehicles, clothes or whatever without permission of the company owning the design, how can he claim ownership of the model?

just a question

QuietMan

[JdB 151]

Need help contacting someone for permission?

Obviously there can be issues in contacting people due to their inboxes being full, them choosing to not make their Email address public, etc. etc. if you're having problems contacting someone to request permission I'm happy to help out, I can get PM's through to people who have full inboxes, I can send Emails to people who keep their Email address hidden, I'm here to help so let me, rather than breaking one of the cardinal rules of the community by using something that isn't yours.

There is one thing I'm missing here:

What if I try to contact someone, and ask you to try to contact him, and it has been known that this person has left the community a while ago, no longer using the e-mail address and visiting the forums like before, in other words not being able to contact someone during an extended period of time. When for example that person decides to return after a long period of time and see his work has been used, will it be removed as well?

[sparky 0]

well, i think that you have some point there.

But it's a different thing the trademark, example take a look in BIS ArmA fuel station it says shnell instead of shell, also some other signs, possible there will be a problem cause it's a trademark.

But as for modelling, a model like car, tank it will never be the same as the original, only something that looks like the original, i believe that the creator doesn't claim copyright for the creation of the car, tank or whatever, BUT for the modell. There will be a law problem if you try and use the prototype CAD model of this vehicle.

But if someone uses your model/textures that you've created 1st, and you haven't give any permission then it's different, and it's violation of the copyright.

Copyright it's a very sensitive situation, and demands respect.

[straubinger82 3]

And in context with the brandmarks (sry for my english, trying my best), I do not understand the point of the Brands.

Brands like Coca-Cola, Pepsi or the hole bunch of the rest should run to all the gamedevolopers, asking for showing their brands in game. Shouldn´t they?

For the best example I will point on racegames.

Just for example, I guess we usally don´t discuss racegames in here. But all the brands should have an interest catching consumers with that medium to, shouldn´t they.

Imagine a ambisous kid driving racegames and got keen on Mercedes-Benz since he drove their classic DTM-Cars for example.

Perhaps he later gets money enough to makes his dreams come true....

Ok, I guess this doesn´t work really well with defensestuff^^.

But Shell for example could be proud for shown in a game, equalizing some dark times in the past. (that oilrig...sunked in sea... blabla)

Sry, this doesn´t meant as focus here... just an loadout.

Credits to addonmakers should ever be given.. their is no discuss. While giving permissions could be impossible by communications handicap.. ehm not getting the question even.

[Placebo 29]

I assume that this also includes if you source items from outside the ArmA/OFP community? I.e. take a public addon from CS and convert it to ArmA/OFP without permission?

One would hope that anything taken from anywhere else would be done so after permission is sought, in all practicality there's no way to know for certain that the addon maker really did request permission to use something even if he says he did, but certainly if someone comes along and says "hey I made this for "A.N. Other game", I was not asked permission" then the same rules apply as mentioned above, no matter what the item in question is.

What if I try to contact someone, and ask you to try to contact him, and it has been known that this person has left the community a while ago, no longer using the e-mail address and visiting the forums like before, in other words not being able to contact someone during an extended period of time. When for example that person decides to return after a long period of time and see his work has been used, will it be removed as well?

Obviously every situation will be a little bit different so will need playing by ear, but someone asked me essentially the same question via PM and my reply was:

Quote[/b] ]What I would suggest is that you Email to me (Placebo@bistudio.com) a "report" of the efforts you've gone to to contact him, such as sent PM's/Emails and the dates etc. etc. include a link to the person's forum profile and then I'll proceed from that and attempt to contact him myself, if no answers to either of us, then I think it's fair to release the addon/mod using this person's content, but you should include a disclaimer in the readme about attempting to make contact for permission as per BIS forum guidlines, unable to get a reply, if the originator of the used content finds this release and is unhappy about what you used to Email you blah blah.......

If the original creator of the used content finally comes out of his cave and does try to kick up a fuss (despite all good measures being used to contact them), I'll try to mediate in the situation to resolve it amicably for everyone.

And in context with the brandmarks (sry for my english, trying my best), I do not understand the point of the Brands.

Brands like Coca-Cola, Pepsi or the hole bunch of the rest should run to all the gamedevolopers, asking for showing their brands in game.

That's really outside the remit of this thread, at the end of the day using logos is free advertising for companies, but if they're unhappy with their logo being used all they need to is ask for it to be removed and I'm sure the addon makers would be happy to oblige.

[vilas 477]

in my previous OFP activity i remember situations as i get permission by PM and later that addon maker (who gave me permission year ago) said i use something without

so important should be issue "if i allow, i must inform that i took back later"

also i remember situations where i get the same photo using GOOGLE and someone had problems, that i have the same...

but if someone left community... ups... than there is problem, but what to do when game engine changes because of patch , like we hade in 1.07 when "class rifle:mgun" was replaced by "class rifle: riflecore" and one not compatible addon was causing fire from chest

than to delete old good addon or someone to update this to next patch ?

yes copright LEGAL issues are different in many countries and changes sometimes year by year , but it has nothing to do when addonmaking is just hobby, fun, to give people FREE of charge enjoy

i also know that in countries like Russia addons were sold on CD, so for example someone was earning money for selling people's addons on CD (maybe because of poor network and internet connections)

but when we talk about addon, we can talk about 3ds, photoshop and software

i am angry a little, when someone says my textures are poor, some things missing in addons, while all model i do in Oxygen and other 2d in OEM soft , but offtopic here, sorry :P other issue

new tools gave me ability to do normalmapps , and i am thanxfull to BIS

[quiet_man 8]

well, i think that you have some point there.

But it's a different thing the trademark, example take a look in BIS ArmA fuel station it says shnell instead of shell, also some other signs, possible there will be a problem cause it's a trademark.

But as for modelling, a model like car, tank it will never be the same as the original, only something that looks like the original, i believe that the creator doesn't claim copyright for the creation of the car, tank or whatever, BUT for the modell. There will be a law problem if you try and use the prototype CAD model of this vehicle.

But if someone uses your model/textures that you've created 1st, and you haven't give any permission then it's different, and it's violation of the copyright.

Copyright it's a very sensitive situation, and demands respect.

your arguments are weak, which modeler here is checking copyrights on what he is modeling and could try to defend his against a XX.000$ licence claim from a real company at all?

but we should separate legal and moral.

As long as no one is running business here with his addons, we (as community) should be relatively fine from the legal side.

On the moral side it is simply not acceptable for us to have someone participating in the community (forums and web pages) who copies stuff from others and claims it as his own.

And here I really see no problem as it works pretty fine. People acting against the (moral) rules get soon ignored. We only have to remind ourself and other from time to time of the rules.

People who think someone stole from them also don't need to jump into discussion "HE STOLE FROM ME!". A name needs time to build but is destroyed in seconds. They should politely ask "why is ... like the stuff I made before?" and depending on the answer it might have been an error on the one or other side.

If it was intention they can trust on the community that the man will not hang around for long here.

maybe people should also stop adding nonsense copyright claimers ignoring any RL copyrights of their stuff (and this could give real trouble)

QuietMan

[max power 21]

I think quiet man is 100% correct. This thread is not about national or international law, it's about forum rules. The forum rules are demanding ethical conduct, as are the laws of nations. They have the same basis, but are not the same things.

[Placebo 29]

Nice to see that already four or five people have sent me PM's asking for my help in contacting people which is great, although I'd prefer if you send the requests by Email please as I can then keep track of them much better (sorry I didn't say that before).

So if you need me to try to contact someone, send an Email to: Placebo@bistudio.com with the subject: "Contact for Addon Permissions" (will help it get through the spam filters ) include in there your forum name & the forum name of the person you want me to contact along with links to both of your forum profiles as well as the message you want me to get across to them.

Thanks

[jerryhopper 286]

Good news, this 'divine' intervention....

i really think that this has been creating lots of aggrevation amongst some people in the past.

now the ultimate 'authority' is backing the modders!

And oooh boy, i almost wanna make love with your sig paul!