Russian ‘spy’ planes put RAF on Cold War alert

[BloodOmen 0]

About three weeks ago i was at my cousins flat over in inverness where he is stationed with the RAF.

There is currently two submarines going around the UK and they have been following them.

Oh and while on the boat across to Scotland, a submarine decided to surface right beside our ship. If it was the russians i dont know :/

No signs on it to tell that i could see. Was remarkably close to it aswell, oh and guess what, no camera

My newphew has a s**t shot of it on his phone but thats all we got

[-ZG-BUZZARD 0]

No why would anyone do that? It just makes russia look bad, and they are not stupid. It's not rational.

Well, there's pictures of it so there's proof and no deniability. Any denial of that would be bs, and Russia, as a major power, has always done such things - in fact, it would rather be more surprising if Russia wouldn't do such things. Wether it is stupid or makes Russia look bad - seems like the heads in Moscow don't share your oppinion, otherwise they woulnd't have sent out the orders, accordingly...

[Spokesperson 0]

There's a picture of the bomb, but nothing else. Georgia also uses russian weaponry.

They have nothing to gain from doing what "they" did. The one who gains the most is responsible in 99% of the cases.

And in the case of RAF, Russia started to patrol the world seas, as RAF and the US do already.

Why can't Russia do it if RAF and US does it? Hypocrisy again.

[-ZG-BUZZARD 0]

Why can't Russia do it if RAF and US does it? Hypocrisy again.

I never said Russia couldn't or shouldn't be allowed to do so. It's just a fact that when "incidents" happen, due to the far reach of the media, such things get noticed and are given relevance in the countries which suffer such "incidents", and they're not at fault for it - the major powers are.

[TrevorOfCrete 0]

hey all, know a few people in the RAF and MOD.

These sort of interceptions have been happening for years and are nothing new. RAF fighters have been scrambling to russian reconacanse planes venturing near british airspace frequently and is concidered a routine operation by pilots. Recently it was brought to the public becuase the media wants to create an image of a new cold war.

[Baff1 0]

If a second Cold War breaks out I'm moving to Austrailia! They barley ever get in big fights and are pretty far away from Nuclear fallout. Lol.

I'm pretty sure the Australians have got in just about every big fight for the last 100 years.

[Baff1 0]

BUZZARD @ Aug. 23 2007,18:39)]

And, as much as I hate to admit it, don't forget that Churchill was the first to be suspicious of Stalin already during WW2, I think the Brits have a cunning ability to see the express train in the tunnel when it's farthest away, but sure to head in their direction...

He wasn't too at ease with Roosevelt either.

[-Snafu- 78]

If a second Cold War breaks out I'm moving to Austrailia! They barley ever get in big fights and are pretty far away from Nuclear fallout. Lol.

I'm pretty sure the Australians have got in just about every big fight for the last 100 years.

This has already been pointed out.

Quote[/b] ]He wasn't too at ease with Roosevelt either.

Your point?

[ran 0]

not a plane buff but can't the Bear be used for IMINT and SIGINT/ELINT ?

[Baff1 0]

Quote[/b] ]He wasn't too at ease with Roosevelt either.

Your point?

Just balancing the perspective.

I could go farther and say that ZG Buzzard's appraisal is point blank wrong of course, and that Churchill wrote of Stalin to his wife in 1944...

Quote[/b] ]I have had very nice talks with the old Bear. I like him the more I see him. Now they respect us & I am sure they wish to work with us.

Far from being suspicious of Stalin, Churchill famously failed to be suspicious of either Stalin or Roosevelt and they both historically conspired together behind his "too trusting" back to divide up Germany between them at the end of the war.

Stalin was noted for asking Roosevelt, why Churchill had not been invited.

The deep seated distrust of the Soviets is more commonly associated with the U.S. than with U.K.

We fell out with them after the revolution but they were our greatest allies during both wars.

British attitudes to Russia, the Soviets and even communism have always been significantly softer than those held by our American allies.

[billybob2002 0]

not a plane buff but can't the Bear be used for IMINT and SIGINT/ELINT ?

I guess so.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages....id=1770

[Gisen 0]

Stop.

Don't trust a word the daily mail prints. It's as bad as the sun but uses bigger words.

[billybob2002 0]

Stop.

Don't trust a word the daily mail prints. It's as bad as the sun but uses bigger words.

Ok then, but the BBC basically reported the same thing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/highlands_and_islands/6641999.stm

[red oct 2]

Georgia Fires at Russian Plane

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6963081.stm

[Kirby 2]

What the hell is going on?!

[TrevorOfCrete 0]

What the hell is going on?!

distrust. I wonder how many US spy planes regularly penertrate russian borders.

[-ZG-BUZZARD 0]

Quote[/b] ]He wasn't too at ease with Roosevelt either.

Your point?

Just balancing the perspective.

I could go farther and say that ZG Buzzard's appraisal is point blank wrong of course, and that Churchill wrote of Stalin to his wife in 1944...

Quote[/b] ]I have had very nice talks with the old Bear. I like him the more I see him. Now they respect us & I am sure they wish to work with us.

Far from being suspicious of Stalin, Churchill famously failed to be suspicious of either Stalin or Roosevelt and they both historically conspired together behind his "too trusting" back to divide up Germany between them at the end of the war.

Stalin was noted for asking Roosevelt, why Churchill had not been invited.

The deep seated distrust of the Soviets is more commonly associated with the U.S. than with U.K.

We fell out with them after the revolution but they were our greatest allies during both wars.

British attitudes to Russia, the Soviets and even communism have always been significantly softer than those held by our American allies.

I stand corrected, seems my sources were not too accurate. And yeah, I do remember from Erich Hartmann's book that he told that the US and Soviets were firing at each other during those raids in eastern Europe by the USAAF... Somewhat amusing considering the russians had some american planes...

[Spokesperson 0]

Yugoslavia, North Korea, and the Soviet Union has shot down US spy planes on numerous occasions.

Quote[/b] ]Somewhat amusing considering the russians had some american planes...

The first day of the war in the east. The luftwaffe blew huge parts of the Soviet airforce while being on the ground. Sure the US might have sent the USSR some vehicles in the lend and lease agreement. But one has to remember that these things weren't more than a few percent of the total armaments. The US sent poor tanks and similar things of limited use to the USSR.

Besides, it can't make the intentional delay of the opening of western front undone. The USSR annihilated more than 70% of the nazi troops that were killed during the war.

Btw. Churchill admired fascism and Mussolini.

[dm 9]

Quote[/b] ]Somewhat amusing considering the russians had some american planes...

The first day of the war in the east. The luftwaffe blew huge parts of the Soviet airforce while being on the ground. Sure the US might have sent the USSR some vehicles in the lend and lease agreement. But one has to remember that these things weren't more than a few percent of the total armaments. The US sent poor tanks and similar things of limited use to the USSR.

I get the feeling you're somewhat "anti-western"

You do realise that this "poor quality" equipment, ESPECIALLY the aircraft, formed the basis of a massive technological leap for the Russians at the time.

Much of "Soviet" aircraft technology (whilst not necessarily the design) during the 40's/50's/60's was based on what they learnt from the western aircraft they had bought/been given/captured.

[Iron+Cross 0]

Hell its about time, I mean Boris, & the others were just doing as NATO told em to.

I mean i dunno about you guys but if i was told/treated by NATO/EU like this for the past 15 years:

No you cant join NATO

No you (Russia) cant join E.U, But We will take any of the States that Break away from your Federation, after years of us, destablising the regions we want.

Trade sactions will be kept inplace almost indefinatly, to control you.

You cant move your own army's around your own country unless you ask us permission, Which you wont get.

You Cant make New types of Nukes, or Land mines but we can.

You Cant Trade as much Weapons with poor county's as we can or you will be be sanctiond.

You have to Give us (NATO HQ) full lists of all if any military movements & stocks of good's/munitions regularly, so we can put it up on our Big NATO map that only NATO countrys can look at, but you CANT.

You have to sell us your natural resources Cheaply like Titanium for our new F-35's Cheaply or your in trouble..

No You Cant Build Missle defence shields Near NATO country's but we can build near yours OR else.

No you cant have full strength Bases around the world but we can, & we can have them rite on your door step, but you cant.

We can have allies with places like Saudi but you cant or your Evil.

We can Fund Pro American/NATO political partys in countrys Near your borders, but you cant or your comiting a crime.

We have Used Nukes/Chemical weapons on people, but you cant. (U.S)

We can sell Chemical weapons to rebel groups that would overthrow the government & let us pump out natural resources we want, but if you do it its a CRIME! (U.S/U.K/NATO)

well i'd be telling those people to "Get it Up YEE"

Try puting yourselves in Russia's shoe's, Attacked on all side's politicaly, Financialy, Moraly, & Stratigicly.

Yet When you Help NATO they praise you for it, Yet they (NATO) treat you constantly like an enemy, in all respects.

Whats your options?

[Commando84 0]

i saw in a program at discovery channel that Churchill was going mental or something, cause he made some serious errors here and there but if it wasn't for churchill, the britts would have had to been liberated by the americans i think or the russians

churchill was a strong leader that could inspire the people with his speeches. I think the tv shows name was altered statesmen. Also in another show i saw that Kennedy was a drug addict but that was due to some illness that he needed pain killers and things got out of hand.. i always think of kennedy as the rock star president

[USSRsniper 0]

Nice   sooner or later Bush will have another "problem" , not only "terrorism", but now threat of Russians nuking US maybe even add to "axis of evil"

Maybe cold war was too much, but world wasn't going to hell as it is right now....   And why they call it "spy" airplane? They are outdated, its age of spy satellites...

Or "spy" airplane looks not that scary as bomber with nukes? so they use "spy" airplane on the news so people don't get scared

[-ZG-BUZZARD 0]

Probably they call it "spy plane" because during the Cold War spy stories were total media sellers...

Next we'll see a return of commando-like stories...

Oh, I just hope Hot Shots gets a threequel!

[TrevorOfCrete 0]

Yugoslavia, North Korea, and the Soviet Union has shot down US spy planes on numerous occasions.

Quote[/b] ]Somewhat amusing considering the russians had some american planes...

The first day of the war in the east. The luftwaffe blew huge parts of the Soviet airforce while being on the ground. Sure the US might have sent the USSR some vehicles in the lend and lease agreement. But one has to remember that these things weren't more than a few percent of the total armaments. The US sent poor tanks and similar things of limited use to the USSR.

Besides, it can't make the intentional delay of the opening of western front undone. The USSR annihilated more than 70% of the nazi troops that were killed during the war.

Btw. Churchill admired fascism and Mussolini.

im sorry but this is simply not true.  Russia hates to admit it but during the war it used thousands of tonnes of US and UK supplies.  Not only did this include tanks, aircraft and weapons but also food, medical equipment and gasoline.  As for the equipment being second rate, also not true, concidering the US was shipping brand new M4 Sherman tanks.  These tanks were so much better quality than the Russian equivalent they bagan to mount russian t-30 turrets for a fear of being unable to stockpile enough US tank shells.  Ofcourse there never was a shortage due to the vast amount the USA supplied to Russia.

Russia paid in human casulties true enough, but without the US industrial might, and UK and Polish inteligence the war could not have been won.  Imagine if Germany didnt have to divert millions of troops to defending Norway,  France,  North Africa and Italy,  not to mention the thousands used to guard Allied aircrew and Combat troops in POW camps.  I would imagine they would have sucesfully taken Moscow if they hadnt.  

As for the western powers deliberatly delaying the second front, firstly there was a war in the east against Japan (which Stalin took little notice of until the opertunity to grab some of Manchuria appeared),  Secondly a second front in europe already existed in Italy AND lastly and perhaps most importantly the planning for D-Day had to be complete and rigorous following the disaster at Dieppe which you have probably never heard of.

[baddo 0]

Good post Iron+Cross.

But.

I agree there is a lot of hypocrisy in the World. But hasn't there always been, and I must say in both sides.

I at first wrote here some long examples of hypocrisy from both sides, but decided to delete them as it went too much into the direction of an emotional rant. I'll settle for saying that there was lots of hypocrisy from Western countries and USSR/Russia when it comes to what happened in WW II.

Both sides give a picture of themselfs as being good, but at the same time there are crimes committed by both. I see this has unfortunately not changed since WW II. I guess that's just the way human nature is.