Bullet-Penetration...

[lone.wolf 80]

--(Sorry in wrong forum, plz move to ArmA)--

Hi guyz, just a question. I saw in one video that its now possible to shot trough some objects.

- Is there difference between what weapons and what the can shoot trough, fx the .50 cal. and silenced m4 (should be a significant difference)....

- Is some vehicles bulletproof to small arms, but not to .50 weapons...

Hope anyone know this, couldnt find any topics related to this.

NOTE: Dont have the game yet, gotta wait for the 16. feb  

[raedor 8]

Moving.

[teaser 0]

ive seen teammates taking cover behind trees, fences, and the bullets piercing through wooden wences lk metal slugs throught cardboard. pretty good, adds realism just lk in real life, you know that you would not stand behind a garbage can in a middle of some ak 47 firefight, youd take it behind an armored car or a damn thick wall. (= hope that helped.

[max power 21]

Some of it is a little wonky. I blasted some guy through the trunk of a palm tree with an m4 the other day. That shouldn't be possible. And the M2HB should be able to make swiss cheese out of the brdm.. but it doesn't. Likewise, the brdm's 14.5 mm cannon should reduce the humvee into a sieve full of red jello... but it doesn't penetrate.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Some of it is a little wonky.  I blasted some guy through the trunk of a palm tree with an m4 the other day.  That shouldn't be possible.  And the M2HB should be able to make swiss cheese out of the brdm.. but it doesn't.  Likewise, the brdm's 14.5 mm cannon should reduce the humvee into a sieve full of red jello... but it doesn't penetrate.

The settings may be off but the fact that the ability is there is what counts.

[NoRailgunner 0]

Is this a bug or an ...em "only shooting target":

if BRDMs are moving to positions all of the (own)team shoot at the vehicle with guns, rifles like rambo. Seen in Campaign/Single Player.

before some launches M136 AT4 he is shot down from BRDM

[max power 21]

The settings may be off but the fact that the ability is there is what counts.

I don't know if it is. Scenery blocks and units are vastly different (programming) objects. It may be possible or it may not be. We'll know if it is if some future patch includes this option or if we hear it from one of the BIS guys. Moreover, it doesn't seem that penetrable scenery is restistent to some kinds of bullets but not others... ie. 5.45 vs 14.5 mm. At least, I haven't noticed this ability. It may not be possible to make vehicle walls penetrable to some things but not to others, or anything else for that matter!

[baddo 0]

Is this a bug or an ...em "only shooting target":

if BRDMs are moving to positions all of the (own)team shoot at the vehicle with guns, rifles like rambo. Seen in Campaign/Single Player.

before some launches M136 AT4 he is shot down from BRDM

Hi,

in ArmA demo the BRDM's can quite easily be taken out by shooting at them with machine guns, especially if you put your whole team fire at the same BRDM at the same time. So it is OK for AI controlled soldiers to shoot at them. I bet the same goes for the full version as well. No need for AT weapons. A BRDM is only lightly armoured vehicle. If you do not want AI soldiers start attacking, then you must utilize "Hold fire" command and give them targets as you wish.

Baddo.

[NoRailgunner 0]

Yep, you are right with that, but the all AI-Soldiers fire at incoming BRDM-2 whether there are another enemy or tanks (i got the german version)

[simulacra 0]

5.56 bullets can easily go through palmtrees and kill whatever is on the other side.

[max power 21]

I'm not sure that they can. I've heard tell that the more massive 9mm pistol cartridge has greater penetration through housing materials (especially drywall). I'm going to go out on a limb here (har har) and say that if a 5.56mm bullet hit a 12 inch palm tree trunk that it would fragment, and certainly wouldn't travel a further 50 or 60 yards, straight as an arrow, and kill a man directly behind it.

I also remember a documentary about some us marines talking about the m14 or m21. During the briefing he said something to the effect of "This is a full on battle rifle. It's not like the m16. It will penetrate tree trunks..." and do on.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

5.56 bullets can easily go through palmtrees and kill whatever is on the other side.

Wow.. thanks for that completely random thought. Seriously you dug this up just to say that?

[urbanwarrior 0]

i would agree that 5.56's would go through palm trees, we tend not to have them were i'm from but i've shot through a birch tree before (was about as thick as a fat persons thigh) and it went right through, m14's or SLR's would definately do it, i think the question is more like what range they (5.56/7.62) could do it at.

[max power 21]

5.56 bullets can easily go through palmtrees and kill whatever is on the other side.

Wow.. thanks for that completely random thought. Seriously you dug this up just to say that?

It was mentioned earlier by me. Read up.

[simulacra 0]

I didn't dig anything up, it was at the top of the list, ergo, ok to answer.

[Col. Faulkner 0]

[...]m14's or SLR's would definately do it, i think the question is more like what range they (5.56/7.62) could do it at.

Dunno about the 5.56mm but I carry in the squalid junk-

room that is my memory the fact that British L2A2 7.62mm

ball rounds (nb. "ball", not "armour piercing") for the SLR and

GPMG (ie. much the same as the ammo used in the M240)

would completely penetrate about 40 inches of stacked pine

boards, or c. 2 inches of concrete, or c. 8 inches of cinder

block at 200m. Penetration in fact, and possibly surprisingly,

increased with range up to a limit, although I cannot off-hand

remember what the optimum was; I seem to remember that

it was 300m or so (but i may be mistaken in that last bit).

I once saw a GPMG demolish a brick wall in a demo, and

there were also occasions when 7.62mm ball rounds fired

from SLRs went right through houses in N. Ireland (in and

out through two brick walls).

[weegee_101 0]

What about the M107 though? I was toying with that last night with myself and a UAZ on Rahmani and I kept trying to shoot the driver through the door (not the window) and it wasn't penetrating. I also tried to toast the engine block and it didn't do anything either.

I did manage to get the driver to eject by unloading about 7 rounds into the side of the UAZ though.

Would it be possible to make some REAL anti-material ammo for the M107 and other .50-cal weapon systems?

Quick EDIT: While I'm just getting into ArmA editing... and I know this may be taking the thread slightly off topic... is it possibly to just add a new ammo class to the M107 through a mod? Like "B_127x99_SLAP_noTracer" in magazine "10Rnd_127x99_M107_SLAP"?

[Second 0]

[...]m14's or SLR's would definately do it, i think the question is more like what range they (5.56/7.62) could do it at.

Dunno about the 5.56mm but I carry in the squalid junk-

room that is my memory the fact that British L2A2 7.62mm

ball rounds (nb. "ball", not "armour piercing") for the SLR and

GPMG (ie. much the same as the ammo used in the M240)

would completely penetrate about 40 inches of stacked pine

boards, or c. 2 inches of concrete, or c. 8 inches of cinder

block at 200m. Penetration in fact, and possibly surprisingly,

increased with range up to a limit, although I cannot off-hand

remember what the optimum was; I seem to remember that

it was 300m or so (but i may be mistaken in that last bit).

I once saw a GPMG demolish a brick wall in a demo, and

there were also occasions when 7.62mm ball rounds fired

from SLRs went right through houses in N. Ireland (in and

out through two brick walls).

There's video in youtube (i don't remeber was USMC involved, if someone is intersted looking for it) about bulletpenetrations: 7.62NATO, 5.56NATO, 7.62x39, 9x19 + many others were shot to "house" which had different materials in wall, brick etc... 5.56 was lousy: it didn't penetrate even a brick. 7.62x39 penetrated brick and other materials with ease. 7.62NATO was a killer, better than 7.62x39. In that test there was only wall which had brick, cinder blocks etc... rest of walls were thin woodplates... And If i remeber correctly all those bullets were standart "ball" bullets (no AP etc...)

5.45 penetrates wood better than 5.56... Chinese video i once saw. I didn't understand language, but results were clear: something about 20-30% more wood plates penetrated. But what was that 5.45 which chinese shot... Somekind new chinese bullet? I don't know about PKM's and Dragunov's 7.62x54R (if name went right). Maybe it is bit better than 7.62NATO, i don't bother to check it's stats, but i'm not sure is it so in ArmA?

Oh well soon someone models volframs and russian's newest AP-rounds to ArmA. Oh joy...

[urbanwarrior 0]

how thick was the wall? the demostrations i've seen shows us why we shouldn't use cinder block walls for cover, they rattled 3 or 4 in to a wall and there were big holes on the other side of it, couldn't tell you where the bullet went after that but it did atleast come out the other side

[4 IN 1 0]

[...]m14's or SLR's would definately do it, i think the question is more like what range they (5.56/7.62) could do it at.

Dunno about the 5.56mm but I carry in the squalid junk-

room that is my memory the fact that British L2A2 7.62mm

ball rounds (nb. "ball", not "armour piercing") for the SLR and

GPMG (ie. much the same as the ammo used in the M240)

would completely penetrate about 40 inches of stacked pine

boards, or c. 2 inches of concrete, or c. 8 inches of cinder

block at 200m. Penetration in fact, and possibly surprisingly,

increased with range up to a limit, although I cannot off-hand

remember what the optimum was; I seem to remember that

it was 300m or so (but i may be mistaken in that last bit).

I once saw a GPMG demolish a brick wall in a demo, and

there were also occasions when 7.62mm ball rounds fired

from SLRs went right through houses in N. Ireland (in and

out through two brick walls).

There's video in youtube (i don't remeber was USMC involved, if someone is intersted looking for it) about bulletpenetrations: 7.62NATO, 5.56NATO, 7.62x39, 9x19 + many others were shot to "house" which had different materials in wall, brick etc... 5.56 was lousy: it didn't penetrate even a brick. 7.62x39 penetrated brick and other materials with ease. 7.62NATO was a killer, better than 7.62x39. In that test there was only wall which had brick, cinder blocks etc... rest of walls were thin woodplates... And If i remeber correctly all those bullets were standart "ball" bullets (no AP etc...)

5.45 penetrates wood better than 5.56... Chinese video i once saw. I didn't understand language, but results were clear: something about 20-30% more wood plates penetrated. But what was that 5.45 which chinese shot... Somekind new chinese bullet? I don't know about PKM's and Dragunov's 7.62x54R (if name went right). Maybe it is bit better than 7.62NATO, i don't bother to check it's stats, but i'm not sure is it so in ArmA?

Oh well soon someone models volframs and russian's newest AP-rounds to ArmA. Oh joy...

if you are talking PRC then they mainly uses 5.8mm now

[andersson 285]

But what was that 5.45 which chinese shot... Somekind new chinese bullet?

AK74 use 5.45

[Second 0]

But what was that 5.45 which chinese shot... Somekind new chinese bullet?

AK74 use 5.45

here's the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v....search=

Seems that it's russian ammo-box, not chinese... I've heard about some new chinese 5.45... But my memory is bad nowdays (and it is good excuse too )

[Second 0]

how thick was the wall? the demostrations i've seen shows us why we shouldn't use cinder block walls for cover, they rattled 3 or 4 in to a wall and there were big holes on the other side of it, couldn't tell you where the bullet went after that but it did atleast come out the other side

Here you go. Here's the clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKhMOfaYwvE

There's 40 mm grenade, .50 BMG, some SMAW also.

Yeah. Cinder block are bad.

Here's another clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0UdI1No82A

[general 0]

There is only one penetration value, which means every type of ammo uses the same penetration value. EVERY type of ammo ( dunno about explosives tough ). Pistols and machine guns are all the same in this matter Having a vehicle being penetrable by the M107 would make it penetrable by all weapons.

about the 5,45 vs 5,56

If I remember right the 5,56 penetrates less because the top of the bullet is weaker/stronger than the lower part. This will make is shatter upon impact causing a lot more damage to you, This because the pieces will go in different directions increasing the chance of some of your vital organs and arteries getting hit making the chance of you dying higher than if a bullet passes straight through you.

Saw this on national geographic, machine guns or something like that.

[max power 21]

Well, the 5.56 is a smaller bullet, has less mass, has less structure, has a cannelure (the weak spot you mention), and travels at a higher velocity. It's certainly got a lot of factors working against it being a great penetrator.