Helicopters in AA

[otester 0]

it was the AIM-9L

thnx for that.

[Maximus_G 0]

Speaking from some authority I can say these new flight model scharacteristics are really an improvement on OFP. There still remains some points of contention but I have every confidence they will be resolved.

Hi,

i agree totally. Heli FM in Arma is much better than in OFP. Though there are some drawbacks: for example we had some ground effect imitation in OFP, but now it seems to be gone.

I must say also, that 1.01->1.02 FM changes are ambivalent. From 1 point of view, helis are not that jerky now, that's good. And they can be controlled well with a mouse and keyboard only (imho in 1.01 they are controllable enough just in one way - by using a joystick).

But from another point of view, for a well-controlled flight, those complicated double stick movements are not needed any more in 1.02, though we have to use them in 1.01 and real life when piloting tail-rotor classics. That's really sad. I think those simplifying changes in 1.02 are a bit excessive. I definitely would like to see more FM tuning

[4 IN 1 0]

the only thing that i will not do with this flight model is to land a plane at the good old Kai Tak 13 approach(well, if someone ever going to built it)

[otester 0]

I still play OFP:SLX for air battles, more variety and better flight models.

[paelleon 0]

So how about introducing Veteral and Caded modes in the flight model? In the Caded mode, choppers can easily be controlled only by mouse and keyboard just like OFP. In the Veteran mode, joystic is the best device to control choppers. Some delicate and skillful technique is needed but realistic maneuvers such as barrel roll, loop and emergency landing are able.

edit: date and name tagged Pierrots quote

Hi, in OFP I too can handle every helo from the little OH-58 to the huge Mi-26 with relative ease by using the mouse and keyboard only. The risk of collision with the ground was scarce and all helos seemed to have a "terrain following" system. Helos acceleration and manouvering were easy going. I admit that this is not the the peak of realism, but it made the game very playable.

Now I'm playing the demo version of ArmA and I saw that helo handling is much more difficult.

The fact is that while in OFP all vehicles follow the crossair and stabilize their path when alligned with it, in ArmA moving the mouse "moves" the vitual control stick inside the cockpit, but when you stop moving the mouse the control surfaces of the aircraft does not go in flight straight position.

This is the same handling method of BF helos and is much more difficult to master considering the fact that in both games there isn't any "stick position display". How can I stabilize the helo if I do not know in which position the stick is?

There will be in the full version of the game the possibility to set helo controls like OFP?

[otester 0]

People can argue that ArmA controls are heli controllable, but cmon is it really AS FUN AS OFP

[Rg 0]

People can argue that ArmA controls are heli controllable, but cmon is it really AS FUN AS OFP

Fun as OFP? Hell yes! Even more so. It's MUCH improved over OFP. I don't play any flight sims, but I'm really liking this flight model, even though I'm sure there are some wrong things about it that other simmers can point out, but hopefully it will be continued to be worked on.

I wonder..... are the only people bashing this flight model using something other then a joystick?

[4 IN 1 0]

and bis have to look after the "swinging" feel when flying chopper, remember that choppers and fix wing are two different beast

[max power 21]

and bis have to look after the "swinging" feel when flying chopper, remember that choppers and fix wing are two different beast

Fixed wing aircraft don't swing... and I don't really know what you mean by helicopters 'swinging'. Of course, I only fly the blackhawks in the demo. What do you mean?

[shadow 6]

How can I stabilize the helo if I do not know in which position the stick is?

There will be in the full version of the game the possibility to set helo controls like OFP?

Helicopter controlls are all about minor input all the time.

The horizon is your best friend, then there's the speedometer, VSI and altimeter.

I'm flying mostly with mouse as cyclic and keyboard for the rest.

When you want to come to a hover, keep and eye on your artificial horizon and VSI. If the ground is flat there is nothing wrong in doing a rolling/skidding landing either. I havent tried landing any faster than 80km/h but that works fine with Littlebirds and Blackhawks atleast. Just make sure you touchdown very gently.

[maxqubit 1]

People can argue that ArmA controls are heli controllable, but cmon is it really AS FUN AS OFP ???

I have absolutely NO probs flying the heli's. The way they fly now is fun for me. Before v1.02 i didn't like it, but with v1.02 it feels good (in a game way)

Landing requires some skill though, and a bit more rudder control (at higher speeds) would make FFARing easier, that's for sure;)

[GAU-8 0]

im just wondering if part of the problem is the "play" for different joysticks/HOTAS..?

im an avid flight sim fan, and loved helos in OFP, but in ARMA, my controls have very little input thru most of the axis travel..then 3/4's of the way thru, it says "ok lets over do it"

for example, the "cyclic" for my X52 DOESNT even begin to lift the helo up, until im over 3/4s of the way thru travel...at 3/4s it finally moves up a TINY bit. add a tiny bit more travel, and its full blast. same with the controls. slowly SLOWLY bank...slowly..slowly... add a tiny bit more input, and she quickly snaps over upside down and plummets me several hundred feet , into the ground.

ive tried using the mouse/keyboard, just to see what happens, and its "picture perfect presentation" of how i want to control it

[icebreakr 3116]

Flying choppers is great now - skill is needed, screw arcade noobs :] err, BIS forgot to fix Cobra in the latest patch (1.02)

[otester 0]

OK sorry I should have replace heli with harrier.

[Kirq 0]

BIS forgot to fix Cobra in the latest patch (1.02)

Agree, cobra is still jumpy.

[Scrub 0]

im just wondering if part of the problem is the "play" for different joysticks/HOTAS..?

im an avid flight sim fan, and loved helos in OFP, but in ARMA, my controls have very little input thru most of the axis travel..then 3/4's of the way thru, it says "ok lets over do it"

for example, the "cyclic" for my X52 DOESNT even begin to lift the helo up,  until im over 3/4s of the way thru travel...at 3/4s it finally moves up a TINY bit. add a tiny  bit more travel, and its full blast. same with the controls. slowly SLOWLY bank...slowly..slowly... add a tiny bit more input, and she quickly snaps over upside down and plummets me several hundred feet , into the ground.

ive tried using the mouse/keyboard, just to see what happens, and its "picture perfect presentation" of how i want to control it

Someone here posted a joystick config that worked well for them. If sensitivity is the issue, I'd adjust those entries first, and then look at the stick (which should be fine IMO as it's an optical pickup to a digital signal).

[icebreakr 3116]

One more thing... why doesn't the ammo truck rearm the Cobra/AH6 if the pilons are empty (ammo=0)? For example hellfires/ffars? Cannon always gets full, is it a bug or a "feature"?

[Frans 0]

Well known bug, it's been in the Biki for over a month. Just wait for patch.

[blackdog~ 0]

I bought a Saitek X-52 joystick for this game for about $150... and the helo flight stuff seems a lot more enjoyable. It was so enjoyable that I was not only able to tolerate ArmA for more than 30 minutes in one sitting, I was also able to record this fun video too -- nothing special really but just another demo video with TrackIR + Joystick...

http://www.surfacezero.com/span/x52andtrackir.wmv

The ending is a great suprise.

[Scrub 0]

Nice vid, good flying, uh, except for the end of course  .  Have to get Track IR.

Gotta say Dyslexi is spot on, practice is key.  I never though I would be able to land a helo consistantly.  After making a point to land the MH-6 inside every city in saharani,  I can now say that it's much easier.  As a matter of fact, if you can land in tight spaces, you can do just about every other operation in a helo.  That 's the hardest thing I've been able to find with it anyway.  (except under fire   )

Nice job BIS

[funnyguy1 0]

Shall we start moaning about the weaponry now, please?

[Falken 0]

I was "fine" with the helo flight in ArmA with a mouse and keyboard. Then I got an X52.

Now I never leave the pilots seat. in Sgt. Ace's Aircav mission I am in the air for over 2 hours ferrying people about, doing gunruns in the AH1 and AH6.. great times.

There's a serious flaw with the AH6 though.

a) It attracts more gunfire than any helo and they just snipe you from the cockpit

b) Only the left minigun is functional. Second minigun has no tracers or even rounds hitting the targets. Makes the minigun aspect pretty annoying.

I'd love for the Blackhawk's M134s to be workable for 2nd players in multi too.

Also making helos not count a "hard" landing on a roof as a collision would be nice. I can land on a flat topped building softer than how I land on concrete runways and it damages the airframe.

A cosmetic thing I would change is the big ass hole that forms in the pilot's window when damaged. If a helo had a hole that big in the canopy i'm sure the pilot would be hamburger!

[otester 0]

I was "fine" with the helo flight in ArmA with a mouse and keyboard. Then I got an X52.

Now I never leave the pilots seat. in Sgt. Ace's Aircav mission I am in the air for over 2 hours ferrying people about, doing gunruns in the AH1 and AH6.. great times.

There's a serious flaw with the AH6 though.

a) It attracts more gunfire than any helo and they just snipe you from the cockpit

b) Only the left minigun is functional. Second minigun has no tracers or even rounds hitting the targets. Makes the minigun aspect pretty annoying.

I'd love for the Blackhawk's M134s to be workable for 2nd players in multi too.

Also making helos not count a "hard" landing on a roof as a collision would be nice. I can land on a flat topped building softer than how I land on concrete runways and it damages the airframe.

A cosmetic thing I would change is the big ass hole that forms in the pilot's window when damaged. If a helo had a hole that big in the canopy i'm sure the pilot would be hamburger!

X52 is nice, my m8 has one, I wanna get one soon as well.

Also AH-6 is so easy to take out, PKM makes it so easy.

[Kirq 0]

I bought a Saitek X-52 joystick for this game for about $150... and the helo flight stuff seems a lot more enjoyable. It was so enjoyable that I was not only able to tolerate ArmA for more than 30 minutes in one sitting, I was also able to record this fun video too -- nothing special really but just another demo video with TrackIR + Joystick...

http://www.surfacezero.com/span/x52andtrackir.wmv

The ending is a great suprise.

Jesus... dont tell me that You are listening music like thet when flying heli ? And could someone tell me whats the problem with that anoying voice ( like on fast motion) in the backgroud, ive noticed it during some MP games , and its hard to believe that someone is doing that in purpose ( some kind of modification ? ) cause it spoil all the immersion in a secon.

[Rg 0]

I bought a Saitek X-52 joystick for this game for about $150... and the helo flight stuff seems a lot more enjoyable. It was so enjoyable that I was not only able to tolerate ArmA for more than 30 minutes in one sitting, I was also able to record this fun video too -- nothing special really but just another demo video with TrackIR + Joystick...

http://www.surfacezero.com/span/x52andtrackir.wmv

The ending is a great suprise.

Jesus... dont tell me that You are listening music like thet when flying heli ? And could someone tell me whats the problem with that anoying voice ( like on fast motion) in the backgroud, ive noticed it during some MP games , and its hard to believe that someone is doing that in purpose ( some kind of modification ? ) cause it spoil all the immersion in a secon.

I believe people up the pitch which shortens the time of the comment to make the AI respond to actions faster (they don't act until they finish what they are saying)