AI walk through geolod

[Chris Death 0]

Well, first off i'd like to say;

i'm working on some new middle eastern objects:

Arabic_objects thread

Here's another view of the castle:

OK, shown you what is all about, let's go straight to the problem:

I got a few different types of walls, each of them 16 meters

x-axis (from left to right), 3 meters z-axis (thickness) and

5 meters y-axis (height).

2 with entrance (one bigger, one smaller entrance)

1 corner piece

1 normal wall (only a simple block)

1 with stairs (this is the one where it makes problems)

AI walk just straight through it, as it wouldn't be there (only walk - not fire through and not see throug).

Here's a pic of the o2 view (only link as it's more than 100kb): o2 View of geolod

Here's a pic of the geolod in buldozer:

I've tried to mark a few components, so that you can imagine,

how the arrangement of components look like.

There's the stairs component in front, a big component on the backside, 2 smaller stair components in front (above main stairs), and a component down in the middle.

No textures are applied to the geolod.

Also i have a working fire-geolod and a working view-geolod.

Then there is a roadwaylod and a pathlod, which everything

is working fine. The walls are walkable on top of them and

on the stairways. Both - roadway- and pathlod do not collide

at any point with one of the collision lods.

Now I've tried everything i know (and a bit more) to avoid that ai walk/run through it.

a) i've checked all vertrices and faces, nothing wrong there;

The number of components in relation to number of faces and

vertrices is fine. Also there are no gaps between the components, and no components are overlapping (colliding).

Also i've made structure/convexity/component convex hull

b) i've checked for wrong faces (which might look in the wrong direction);

Nothing wrong - each faces looks into the right direction

c) I've tried to vary the mass, which was applied to the geolod: i've tried 20000/100000/800000

No success

d) I've tried to remove the pathlod and the geolod, to see if

the problem is caused by them;

No success

e) I tried in properties:

e1) everything on "keep height fence"

No success

e2) everything but the ground vertrices on "keep height fence", and the ground vertrices on "normal"

No success

e3) everything but the ground vertrices on "keep height fence", and the ground vertrices on "on surfacel"

No success

e4) everything but the ground vertrices on "keep height fence", and the ground vertrices on "under sufacel"

No success

e5) everything on "normal"

No success

e6) everything on "above surface"

No success

f) I've made a script, which places the walls that way, that

no gaps between the single objects are - i thought that it

could be the reason, that editor placing is not that exactly.

No success

g) I've tried to make everything in smaller pieces, if maybe ofp

doesn't like the bigger ones.

No success

h) I've tried to add a roadwaylod on the outside of the wall

(from bottom to top).

No success

i) I've tried to add a component in geolod, which is as big as the whole object (to have one piece covering everything, and

i placed this component down under ground. Then i placed

roadwaylods over this, but only in front and on backside of the wall, so that you're able to walk to the real wall. This roadwaylod did not collide with the geolod at any point.

No success

j) I've tried to use standard BIS units, to make sure it isn't

caused by any 3rd party units.

No success

k) I've tried to make the whole addon one meter into ground,

what was then 5 meters above ground-level and one meter

below ground level.

No success

Summary:

It seems that OFP doesn't like geolods, which are not in one

single piece. The only object, where AI did not walk through

yet, was the simple wall-block. If this is the case, then the

whole useable/enterable building making idea will die, and turn

into rather eye-candy objects.

I hope that someone will come up here with some new suggestions/tips, or maybe even with a solution.

~S~ CD

[wheres my rabbit ? 10]

that pic of the lods in o2 the jpg is soo poor quality i cant see what the hell is going on there

which bits do they walk thru ? or is it all off it they walk thru ?

the stairs look a bit steep and that looks like a good place to start with AI problems

i found when making buildings that anything other than a cube wouldn't allow solid objects to work as geo lods by this i mean i had to make a wall for each wall if you know what i mean cos a block just wouldn't work even a a square unenterable house.

heres wot i mean

click

hmm theres no roof is but it shows wot i mean

thats my suggestion to try even tho it is a nooby 1

[Chris Death 0]

hmm - i can't look at the p3d file at the mo, cause i'm at work.

But if you mean that you made everything in smaller pieces,

i also tried this one already.

I've made a geolod where everything was only 0.5 meter thick,

and in the middle there was nothing - only the important sections were used in this one. This was then more looking like

an open box than a block (if you mean that).

No success

Also i gave it a try to look at BIS castle wall (from the castle

on nogova).

The geolod looks there like that:

it rages 4.5 meter under the earth, and the properties are

set for everything to "normal"

I've tried to make my whole addon like they made the wall, but

that didn't either help - AI still run through (like in french revolt: storm the bastie)

Also i've setup my addon in config.cpp, like BIS did: defined

as house

No success  

I've also tried to remove the main stairs so that only real wall

components were left.

No success  

Maybe i have to make the whole wall from scratch, and see

if something was screwed up, that cannot be corrigated afterwards.

And for the stairs to steep - they walk through from whatever

side they want - the stairs is the only place, where they don't walk through from infront of them, as there is the roadwaylod, and there they act like they should - they walk

upstairs  

But as i said, i've also tried it without stairs and that didn't help either.

As for the pic in o2 and it's quality - soz but i tried to prepare it for posting it here, so i lowered the quality, but it still was over 100kb - i'll replace it tomorrow with a better quality one.

~S~ CD

[Planck 1]

Hello CD,

I was looking at your config.cpp on the other thread.....just a quick scan.

But I noticed the cfgPatches section, where you have:

class chd_objects

But in the cfgVehicles section the p3ds are stated as being in

chd_oriental

Also noticed you have no cfgModels section although I am unsure whether you need one for walls

Planck

[wheres my rabbit ? 10]

But if you mean that you made everything in smaller pieces,

i also tried this one already.

I've made a geolod where everything was only 0.5 meter thick,

and in the middle there was nothing - only the important sections were used in this one. This was then more looking like

an open box than a block (if you mean that).

yer that pretty much wot i meant box the area off in seperate pieces

oh well

[SelectThis 0]

Did you try deleting all the selection names then running a Structure-> Convexity -> Component Convex Hull ?

Important to delete all selection names before hand to avoid doubling up.

STT

[Chris Death 0]

Did you try deleting all the selection names then running a Structure-> Convexity -> Component Convex Hull ?

Important to delete all selection names before hand to avoid doubling up.

STT

Yes ST, i did that - and it didn't help either

Quote[/b] ]a) i've checked all vertrices and faces, nothing wrong there;

The number of components in relation to number of faces and

vertrices is fine. Also there are no gaps between the components, and no components are overlapping (colliding).

Also i've made structure/convexity/component convex hull

b) i've checked for wrong faces (which might look in the wrong direction);

Nothing wrong - each faces looks into the right direction

The only idea which i have left is:

I will try to binarize it, and maybe binarize' error messages

could give me a hint, where the problem comes from.

@Planck - i'm not that genious at config scripting yet, so

i don't know if this is a big problem (chd_objects/chd_oriental)

I will try change this and see what can be.

I think i read somewhere that for static objects no cfgmodels

section is needed - also i've see this in other configs also.

Thx for your input guys

~S~ CD

[Silent N Deadly 0]

Try this: Make the model in the Geo lod a bit smaller then the 1st LOD Model, and make sure you give it a mass. Works for me! Hope that solves it. I didn't really read your post really carefully so if I missed something plz forgive me. Also try to use the least amount of points etc in Geolod possible, the less the better.

Edit- And don't forgot to define the components: Component01, Component02, etc...I see you did that already but that helps.

[Chris Death 0]

umm - Binarize brought no error message at all

@Silent'nDeadly: the size of the geolod has no relation to the

resolution lods. Only where it should be relevant is when kollisionlods and roadway- or pathlod come together.

But the "how it looks like" part and the "what is solid" part have nothing to do with eachother. And 5 components

should be less enough for that geolod.

A few ppl already told that there is nothing what can be done

in that case - ofp ai doesn't like physical barriers too much

I must admit that i've also already seen ai walk through solid

objects before, but in case of my wall this turns into a terrible

effect, as they treat my wall like there is none.

They even dodn't look for a way around - they just walk or run through the wall, wherever they are.

hmm - maybe i should rather make a t-rex addon and put that

one inside the fortress - i'd like to see if ai then still run through the wall without care

~S~ CD

[Guest RKSL-Rock]

It sounds like this is down to your geo lod being too complex.  If you make up wall with simplest shapes you can then:

FIND COMPONENTS

then

COMPONENT CONVEX HULL.

You may have to do each block separetly but it should work properly after that.  If not send me the files and i'll have look for you.

Cheers

Rock

[VipHeart 0]

Strange, may not fit exactly into that topic, but I've seen this Bug on the new modified Nogovo Island (you know, this one where the modern buildings/skyscrappers are exchanged with the old looking resistance houses) several times. My soldiers went straight through those houses - they didn't do that on the original map...

[nephilim 0]

max size for geo lod is 64m*64m*64m

anything above this will result in a lod hole...

if ur building is bigger then that

split it

[Chris Death 0]

The geolod is 16 meters x-axis (left/right)

Should be small enough to fit into the 64m limit.

@RockofSL:

I did that also already - i'm gonna send them to you, that

you can have a look into it. There's really nothing anymore that i could find that it's wrong. Thx for your offer.

~S~ CD

[Silent N Deadly 0]

Did you give it a mass?

And keep the geo lod simple.

[Chris Death 0]

Yep, as i mentioned already in first post, what else i already tried, i also tried it over mass;

20000 / 100000 / 800000

Nothing die help.

~S~ CD

[BraTTy 0]

I scanned thru your post.Only thing I can think of offhand is the cut-n-paste.Have you tried cut-n-paste parts back or even cut-n-paste the whole geolod back?

Weird its acting that way,you say you put some roadway planes up the ramps and that doesn't force AI up the ramps?

Have you tried using just blocks rather than the triangles you have? Angle the blocks the way you need them even with it intersecting? Kinda hard to say without a pic,lol

[Chris Death 0]

First off - sorry Bratty for not answering - i really thought

that i already did

Yes, i tried that - i created two new temporary lods - cut everything piece by piece into one of them - checked it out,

and cut/paste then over to the second one to rebuild the whole geolod over there.

Well, at least now i came a little bit further in investigation

on that problem - i could make a working wall and a not working wall, but now it's goin to drive me nuts

I've created a totally new set of walls and i tried doing this

exactly like BIS made their castle (the one on everon).

The problem was still the same - AI ignores any frontiers and

just walk through - until i added a wall piece with an entrance. Then AI stopped walking through - but the strange

thing is that this entrance was a not working one.

The faces of the roadway-lod did look into the wrong direction

(downwards instead of upwards).

Once i changed the direction of the faces, it did become a working entrance - but AI again started walk through the walls.

Now i tried just to place a long wall to make sure that this

is the reason:

here's picture 1, where you see a working wall, and no AI walks through:

As you can see - there's an entrance piece (don't tell me about the texture thingy - i know - that's no prob)

For this test i again remade the entrance into a non-working

one - i removed the roadway and path, which led through the

door in the middle. AI does not walk through any of the walls

here.

Now picture 2, where i only placed the walls and the ones to

walk up, but no entrance:

As soon as the entrance is replaced by a wall, AI starts acting

like there are no walls.

:note that i'm only talking about movement - they don't shoot

through the walls - they just walk through.

And now i really don't have anymore clue about what's wrong

here

Maybe this is a problem which only somebody from BIS can

explain - i really don't know.

However - i will not give up on this and i will keep you up to

date, once i find out something more about it.

~S~ CD

[Footmunch 0]

One thing you could try:

Instead of making the wall from one long block, try making it up of

4 or 5 smaller blocks with the same cross section, and place the

ends close to each other.

It may be a 'size' type thing, and it will work better with smaller

sections.

Apologies if you've mentioned it already, but can the player walk

through the walls? What about jeeps or M113's (player and/or AI)?

(I can take a look at the p3d if you want to PM me a link...)

[Chris Death 0]

Footmunch - yeah, i've already covered all what you suggested - tried smaller pieces or bigger pieces - no change

at all.

What i could get out now is:

let's say i build a fortress consisting of 4 sides;

If i put on each wall one piece with an entrance - they're acting fine.

As soon as i remove the entrance pieces, they start rushing

through the walls.

It's not some technical stuff - the problem must be some logical stuff - maybe even a game bug, because AI really don't

touch any of the walls once a door comes into play.

And no - only pure AI footsoldiers can walk through.

About the link - i ain't got place to host right now - how about msn or email?

And thx for yer offer

~S~ CD

[KKB 0]

I've run in the same problem, and I would go as far as to say it is a problem with the game, not the model. The geolod in my model is one box. 0.6m thick. It is named, it is a component convex hull, the mass is 13000. I tested the durability:

A tank breaks it (as it is supposed to), the wall stops the Hummer, the Bus, the tractor, every car except the fast ones, which will go through but are destroyed doing so (I can accept that). You cant fire throu, You cant walk throu, but here comes the kicker, place a squad on one site, add a waypoint on the other site and see them channeling Copperfield. They walk through, and no, it is not because the pieces aren't close enouugh, they don't care for that, they walk right through the center of one piece (interstingly though, always the same one). When I try to follow, the magic door has closed, no soup for me.

The only compareable structure on BIS islands is the fenceline on Kolgujev which shields the Office of the Dentist. I tried the same, and they stop. WTF?

Mhh, now that I think about it, on Kolgujev are two lines of fences right behind eachother, maybe thats it? will try later. Some Official Word from the fellows who wrote the engine and should know would be nice though.

Who f*cks up, we or the OFP engine? Answer would be highly apreciated

[Swan 0]

Chris Death, i can try to correct defects.

[KKB 0]

I think I did it.

I tried first with a BIS fence (pletivo_wired.p3d) and sure enough, AI didn't walk through. But it confirmed at least that there was nothing wrong with the map or my objectplacement, so it had to be the model.

I checked where my model and the BIS one differ (besides the look) and I had named selections in the View LODs and the weight in my GeoLOD wasn't evenly distributed (I was aiming for a low center of mass, which probably is not important for static objects anyway, as long as there is mass). So I deleted all named selections in the view LODs, geo and viewgeo have still the component01 etc from the component convex hull thing. and I did set mass to zero and then distributed mass evenly in the geolod, center of mass is now in the center of the box. I also did set mass to 100, since this is the way it is in pletivo wired, I'll try to set it higher later.

I tried it and they stop. In my case the problem was either named selections in view lods or the unevenly distributed mass in the geolod.

Hope this helps to fix your wall.

Oh, and I have no config for my wall.

[VXR 9]

Maybe it is already mentioned, but maybe by adding paths for the AI around the walls will make them walk around it and a path through the gate will make them walk along the wall to the gate.

[PRiME 1]

Yeah Im sure you have already tried defining In/Out/Pos etc paths.

Thing I'd suggest is make a stair by itself, and focus on it primarly tell it works rather then tackling the whole thing. If other people can make stairs work then Im sure you can to