Enthusiasts Eye Assault Rifles as Ban Nears End

[Ares1978 0]

With assault rifle you don't even have to be expert marksman to cause mayhem in a mall. Whitman was a trained marine.

Bullcrap, my friend. A miss is a miss and a hit is a hit. It takes the same amount of marksmanship to hit a target with an assault weapon (again, not the same as assault rifle) as with any bolt action rifle.

[Llauma 0]

To all those who think that no gun regulations make your country safer:

]http://www.ciahome.net/images/cookbook/COALITIONGCS0002.jpg[/img]

None of those countries is US alike.

What U have to understand is US is a multinational country beyond any measure. You keep comparing it to very uniform countries.

In US you have loads of national, racial, religious communities that will not live with each other in peace.

It is not that simple.

So because you have lots of problems in the USA everyone should be allowed to carry a gun? If two guys are angry at each other a good idea would be to remove their guns..

This discussion is just stupid. Sure, guns don't kill people but appearantly americans are incapable of handling weapons so the option it either to ban guns or ban the people...

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]None of those countries is US alike.

So what ?

Quote[/b] ]What U have to understand is US is a multinational country beyond any measure.

So you do want to tell us that you don´t have the same racial mixdown in other countries on this planet ?

Isn´t it even more tense to have the same variety of immigrants on much more less place like the european countries do have ?

Quote[/b] ]In US you have loads of national, racial, religious communities that will not live with each other in peace.

Examples ? Difference to europe ?

[Ares1978 0]

7. Democracy is democracy. Majority decisions done by a political process is representing the citizens attitude towards an issue. Your example is... again irrelevant.

That's a bit naiive, don't you think? Loud minorities have often overruled a silent majority. That's not democracy. For example, if there are 250 000 000 firearms in a country of about 250 000 000 people, what do you think the general opinion on firearms is?

[Gordy 0]

Quote[/b] ]There is no ground for to talk as I see.

1. yes you did refering to my brain functionality.

2. I am from and live in Poland. Can't be clearer about that.

3. I didn't say "you know shit and shut up" just a specialist with approx 20 years of experience in the field will know more than you.

4. No-one needs bans as human nature creates natural resistance to all kinds of "above steering" (not very English). One has to be a slave in nature in order to not question such laws.

5. China was never a democracy. It changes everything as people there, have completely different culture and mentality.

6. I doubt that you are capable (living in Bavaria) judge what a housewife needs.

7. Politics please the mob with strange laws that change nothing. So the mob knows that there is a law and a gunmen know they still can buy a .50 beawulf but just a bit more expencive. Is this a good example of democracy?

To 1: I did not know that come from Poland as you quoted US sources... anyway where was the insult ?

2. Now I know...maybe your profile could need a little update...

3. You did.

4. Irrelevant, see my examples on the previous page.

5. Irrelevant, it was just an example contradicting your logical plot.

6. I am, as I do cook a lot and do a lot of housework to support my girlfriend. What is the point of this anyway  

7. Democracy is democracy. Majority decisions done by a political process is representing the citizens attitude towards an issue. Your example is... again irrelevant.

I´m still waiting for some serious answers. And the comment about germans was not asked for and displaced, or did I say that you can find most of the german cars that were stolen here in Poland right now ? Something like that is mob´s attitude and talking. I do not participate in such mud throwing contest.

You want to make me look like this ?

Yes it true that a lot of cars are stole in Poland. I won't deny that because it's true. I am not happy about that which I stated very often. Poland as a country failed. Poland as a nation also failed. We are exemplatory country of democracy gone wrong. ANy aspect, just name it.

Ad. 6 I was reffereing to your "housewife needs a assault rifle"

BTW, let's stop this side talk about our differences, shall we?

I wanted to say that there is no superior democracy. There is no 100 % democracy without a fault. There is more to

"AR" (assault rifle) than just a ban. It's too short-sighted. If you ban people to have sth, they find a way to have this. It's better to convince them that they don't NEED "AR".

[Gordy 0]

Quote[/b] ]None of those countries is US alike.

So what ?

Quote[/b] ]What U have to understand is US is a multinational country beyond any measure.

So you do want to tell us that you don´t have the same racial mixdown in other countries on this planet ?

Isn´t it even more tense to have the same variety of immigrants on much more less place like the european countries do have ?

Quote[/b] ]In US you have loads of national, racial, religious communities that will not live with each other in peace.

Examples ? Difference to europe ?

I don't have the answer to this. You know, to compare sth you have to have grounds for it. There is no culture like US, there is no national, racial and religious mixture as US, there is no country on that planet with such a history and which would resemble US. Everything in US is 180 degrees different than in the rest of the world and you say it doesn't matter?

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]That's a bit naiive, don't you think? Loud minorities have often overruled a silent majority. That's not democracy. For example, if there are 250 000 000 firearms in a country of about 250 000 000 people, what do you think the general opinion on firearms is?

Well like it or not, that IS democracy. It´s the majority who decides. No matter if they are stubborn mules or highly educated rocket scientists...

I will not go into your example. It´s just too off.

Quote[/b] ]We are exemplatory country of democracy gone wrong.

Well, I can´t judge that, but taking into consideration that you are a really "young" democracy and just find connections to the rest of europe these days it will take a while but you will experience it happen during your lifetime.

There are big fears within the polish polpulation about the EU and germany in special. While I can understand that with the background of WW2 you need to come over that. We need to come over that if we want to form a united and strong europe wich I do believe very much in.

Quote[/b] ]Ad. 6 I was reffereing to your "housewife needs a assault rifle"

Well I don´t think anyway that any housewife in a civilized nation should need an assault rifle for her daily business. And as far as I know, speaking for the western countries, they don´t need them. I think we can agree on that, right ?

Quote[/b] ]If you ban people to have sth, they find a way to have this.

Sure, but if it is illegal they will be put to jail for trying to get an illegal weapon. That´s ok for me.

Quote[/b] ]It's better to convince them that they don't NEED "AR".

That´s what I was doing over the last pages of this thread....

Quote[/b] ]BTW, let's stop this side talk about our differences, shall we?

I didn´t start it as you know but I´m happy to shake hands now.

[Blake 0]

No, you are obviously missing the point here. It was gun ownership that allowed the anti-communist civilians to learn how to use firearms in the first place.

Law was the same for all and worked both ways. People had guns, even workers. You are missing the point by using 1918 as a reference in the first place, since gun ownership did not decide the faith back then nor it will now. And I'm still waiting for your answer on why gun ownership is more important now than ever - maybe there's a coup being planned secretly?

[Gordy 0]

I agree with the housewife thing.

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]Everything in US is 180 degrees different than in the rest of the world and you say it doesn't matter?

I don´t go conform with the 180 degrees.

And therefore I do say it doesn´t matter. Why ?

Common western sense ?

[Blake 0]

Quote[/b] ]It takes the same amount of marksmanship to hit a target with an assault weapon (again, not the same as assault rifle) as with any bolt action rifle.

Yeah but with assault rifle can hold 30 rounds in a clip, bolt action maybe 5 plus you have to operate the bolt all the time.

So you have a 6 x more chances to hit a guy with an assault rifle. Or take an account a situation in a crowded place.

That's the bullcrap for you. Why is it so hard for you to admit that an assault rifle is potentially more lethal weapon than a bolt-action rifle is beyond me.

[ralphwiggum 6]

does it come to mind of gun lovers that while claiming US's stance is unique and cannot be compared to other nations, you are also trying to compare how a crime rate would go up by trying to compare with other nations(which Bals refuted)?

On the subject of factory capacity magazine. I hardly see need for a 30rd magazine. since it only takes 2 seconds to change the magazine(as someone posted earlier) what is wrong with three 10 rounders? when people shoot at rifle range, they are not going on speed shooting.

one of the reasons why people want AR15, G3, G36s is because they needs masturbation. go to a shooting range and see if people will go on practicing room clearing drills. nope. they want to feel macho by holding same gun that commandos use. or they are too damn lazy and doesn't want to use bolt action and want gas to do their job.

for house defense, a nice 00 buckshot in a remington will do. you don't even have to fire that just cock it and robber will get the idea. or a handgun will do the trick. most self defense scenarios involve no more than a few rounds. why need 30rd magazine for a handgun?

[sputnik monroe 102]

Quote[/b] ]"Bottom line you have no reason to fear the guy with 300 rifles and other guns." <- Sputnik Monroe

Yeah nothing to fear unless he gets sacked from the post office, or finds out his wife cheated on him, etc. etc........

    Why does the amount of guns he owns matter in your example? So if he just owns one he's less likely to rampage than the man with 300? Any how if you boff his wife then you probably should be afraid. Even if he has no guns he'll kill you.

Quote[/b] ]Why shouldn't it have the right?

    The government should never have rights what so ever. It's a government by the people for the people. The people decide for the government not the other way around. The moment a government gains the right to decide on issues you have a dictatorship.

Quote[/b] ]2. Now I know...maybe your profile could need a little update...

 

   Why should any one wear their nationality on their sleeve Balschoiw? The moment every one found out I was an American my opinions didn't matter anymore. Being anonymous

has it's benefits.

Quote[/b] ]If two guys are angry at each other a good idea would be to remove their guns..

  Because it's the guns fault right? That isn't a solution at all, they'll still be angry at one another and attempt to take one anothers lives. I suggest rather than your worthless prop change you try to actually solve the problem.

    By your solution  you have removed two inanimate objects from the situation. The situation still exist and there will still be blood shed and death. How about if two guys are angry at another you try to mediate the situation to a peaceful solution?  

    Simply changing the scenery and props doesn't change the dialogue or plot.

[sputnik monroe 102]

Ralph I think you miss the point. The second Amendment was never about defense from burglars or hunting. The second amendment was put in place to back up the first. When public assembly fails or is crushed you move on to step two armed rebellion. It's a counter balance to the government.

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ] Why should any one wear their nationality on their sleeve Balschoiw? The moment every one found out I was an American my opinions didn't matter anymore. Being anonymous

has it's benefits.

If you had read through the conversation you´d know that it caused confusion because he quoted US sources for a US matter and threw in poland wich got me somehow confused. That´s why.

And I don´t think that anyone here that has grown within the OFP com would label someone for his place of origin by default. If someone does, he´s a craphead.

[ralphwiggum 6]

Ralph I think you miss the point. The second Amendment was never about defense from burglars or hunting. The second amendment was put in place to back up the first. When public assembly fails or is crushed you move on to step two armed rebellion. It's a counter balance to the government.

then what was all that 'it's for defense of people' that gun lovers talk about? defending homes?

[havocsquad 0]

I completely agree on limiting magazines to 10 rds for any handgun or semiautomatic weapon, those larger than the .22 Rimfire.

The US doesn't need C clips or a 30 round mag going back into production.  Their crime rate is high enough, as soon as this ban ends, you'll start seeing an exodous of assault weapon robberies increase.

No it's not an automatic weapon, but for the first 5 minutes for an armed criminal, he would do just as much damage on semi with a 30 rd mag.

I believe those sniper killings near Washington D.C. proved that logic, weapons designed for war should never be used by the public, even if they are semi only.  (AR's, AK's, and various European rifles as well)

If the political leaders in the US start turning the country into an authoritarian govt., then by all means arm yourselves very well and hoard weapons and ammo.

[gandalf the white 0]

Quote[/b] ]It takes the same amount of marksmanship to hit a target with an assault weapon (again, not the same as assault rifle) as with any bolt action rifle.

Yeah but with assault rifle can hold 30 rounds in a clip, bolt action maybe 5 plus you have to operate the bolt all the time.

So you have a 6 x more chances to hit a guy with an assault rifle. Or take an account a situation in a crowded place.

That's the bullcrap for you. Why is it so hard for you to admit that an assault rifle is potentially more lethal weapon than a bolt-action rifle is beyond me.

can't imagine what beta C-mags and AK-III mags could do

i think it's a mistake to legalise such weapns , there ARE idiots wich are going to abuse them, and as stated above: they do more dammage then bolt-action .

if the average IQ of all people was 130 id would be fine with me , but now... glad i live in the netherlands , where police shoots unknowing germans for carrying a BBgun ... (yea they actually did)

[Gollum1 0]

i think it's a mistake to legalise such weapns , there ARE idiots wich are going to abuse them

That's no good reason, the same could be (and is) said about violent video games causing murderous behavior.

edit: Or alcohol.

[DracoPaladore 0]

On the subject of factory capacity magazine. I hardly see need for a 30rd magazine. since it only takes 2 seconds to change the magazine(as someone posted earlier) what is wrong with three 10 rounders? when people shoot at rifle range, they are not going on speed shooting.

for house defense, a nice 00 buckshot in a remington will do. you don't even have to fire that just cock it and robber will get the idea. or a handgun will do the trick. most self defense scenarios involve no more than a few rounds. why need 30rd magazine for a handgun?

Because everyone envisions a scenerio where they'll leap over the railing of their stairs, wearing a bath robe and underpants, having a serious gun fight with a robber that'll leave scores of bullet holes all over the house. Dodging, shooting while in the air, rolling, tucking, firing at eachother for hours.

[GoOB 0]

The government should never have rights what so ever. It's a government by the people for the people. The people decide for the government not the other way around. The moment a government gains the right to decide on issues you have a dictatorship.

Errr.... I'm sorry WHAT? The people elects the government, the government acts according to the policy that got them elected, or deviate from said policies. If they do, come next term you don't vote for them again!

You seriously beleive that the "people" are more qualified to make new laws, or change existing ones? Please.... The job the people give the government is to GOVERN over them, and beleive it or not, that involves making decisions

[Llauma 0]

i think it's a mistake to legalise such weapns , there ARE idiots wich are going to abuse them

That's no good reason, the same could be (and is) said about violent video games causing murderous behavior.

edit: Or alcohol.

A violent video game or alcohol isn't a tool that can be used to kill someone. Sure they might be the cause but they're not compairable with a weapon. I wouldn't protest if alcohol was banned as it is the cause of alot of violence. The talk isn't about banning all weapons, just the assault weapons.

Cars can be used as a weapon but a car isn't created for that purpose while a gun is made to kill. You can even kill people with a peanut if you would want to do that.

There are many things that are illegal like heroin.. I am sure that there are some people who wouldn't use it if it was legal and many could propably handle the use of it but I don't think that there are many here who would prefair it to be legalised.

I don't really care whether Americans kills themselves or not I just can't understand the logic with it as the same logic is being used on a worldwide scale. The only reason I care about it is because the first step to a chance has to start in USA. The ten amandments were written 1791 so maybe you haven't noticed but the world has changed since that.

USA isn't special in any way, it's just a country with major problems behaving in a manner I can't understand. Perhaps it would be smart to consult other countries that haven't got the problem and see if there's something to learn.

[DanAK47 1]

Quote[/b] ]I just can't understand the logic

.. that makes people think people can't be trusted with "assault weapons", but can be trusted to follow a ban with loopholes wide enough to fly a 747 through..

.. that makes people think a rifle is so much more deadly with a knife attached to it, or that if someone wants to kill dozens of children, they won't do so because it's illegal to buy an AK47, not because it's illegal to kill dozens of children.

[GoOB 0]

Well, why do people need rifles with knives attached? If you aren't going to use the knife, then why have the option to attach one to your firearm?

Unless ofcourse people just want to attach knives to rifles to keep track of their knives.

[Llauma 0]

Quote[/b] ]Dog Wiggles Paw Free to Shoot Florida Man

PENSACOLA, Fla. (AP) -- A man who tried to shoot seven puppies was shot himself when one of the dogs put its paw on the revolver's trigger.

Jerry Allen Bradford, 37, was charged with felony animal cruelty, the Escambia County Sheriff's Office said Wednesday. He was being treated at a hospital for a gunshot wound to his wrist.

Bradford said he decided to shoot the 3-month-old shepherd-mix dogs in the head because he couldn't find them a home, according to the sheriff's office.

On Monday, Bradford was holding two puppies - one in his arms and another in his left hand - when the dog in his hand wiggled and put its paw on the trigger of the .38-caliber revolver. The gun then discharged, the sheriff's report said.

Deputies found three of the puppies in a shallow grave outside Bradford's home, said sheriff's Sgt. Ted Roy.

The other four appeared to be in good health and were taken by Escambia County Animal Control, which planned to make them available for adoption.

Now even dogs use weapons