Palm

[Dauragon 0]

Im thinking of buying a Palm, but i dont know which one is best, some advice would be greatly appreciated,i thought the Palm Zire 71 was nice

anyone know?

thx

[Skul 0]

You already have two palms!

ON YOUR HANDS!

[Gareth Gates must die]

[Warin 0]

The Zire 71 or the Tungsten T2 are both good.

Both of them pretty much kill anything that PPC does, unless all you want is flash without substance.  Productivity apps work way better on Palm

PPC = Windows 95 at half VGA resolution.

[denoir 0]

The difference between a PPC and a Palm is that the PPC is a handheld computer while the Palm is an electronic organizer.

While Palms have improved over the years, they're still always inferior since they lag in technology (CPU, Memory, Networking etc).

That doesn't mean that they are bad - just more basic. And it has its advantages: better OS, better battery time, smaller programs etc. Also Palms are noticable cheaper, which is a plus.

So it depends what you intend to do with it. If you want a calendar, then go with Palm. If you want a handheld PC solution then go with pocket pc.

[FSPilot 0]

These things bug me. There are a billion different types of them, and they all do the same thing, which you can do with a pen and paper.

[hellfish6 7]

I have a super basic Palm M100 and I love it. Then again, I don't do a whole lot of memory or graphics intensive stuff on it. Just take notes and (attempt to) organize my life.

[blackdog~ 0]

I have a super basic Palm M100 and I love it. Then again, I don't do a whole lot of memory or graphics intensive stuff on it. Just take notes and (attempt to) organize my life.

Have you scheduled your death anytime soon?

[Warin 0]

I'll ask you again Denoir:

Show me one thing you can do on a PPC that I cant do on a Palm.

Especially in productivity.

There is a reason Palm has 70-80% market share, especially in the corporate market.

[FSPilot 0]

I just saved you guys a few hundred dollars.

[hellfish6 7]

I tend to lose pieces of paper. I don't lose a $70 Palm.

[FSPilot 0]

That's what'd happen to me though. I'd end up losing it or dropping it or something.

[denoir 0]

Show me one thing you can do on a PPC that I cant do on a Palm.

Oh, there are tons of stuff. Here's just what I use that isn't posible with a Palm:

General:

[*] Input via a wireless digitizer unit & pen.

[*] Use the Ipaq as a phone through a Bluetooth link

[*] Internet acess throguh wireless 802.11g or bluetooth via GSM (or 3G) phone.

[*] Voice recognition

[*] Real internet explorer with support for Java and .NET components

[*] Real handwriting recognition (software called Calligrapher that can actually fully read my handwriting)

[*] Full MS Office integration.

[*] File sharing across wireless network.

Stuff I need for work:

[*] Matlab, Mathematica and Maple simulation software.

[*] HP 48/49 calculator emulation

[*] .NET compatibility

[*] C++, C# and Java compilers

Usable stuff:

[*]ICQ

[*]Photogenics (very similar to Photoshop with all the bells and whistles)

[*]PGP that fully utilizes the Ipaq finger print scanner

[*] Age of Empires for PPC

Those are just the things that make a difference for me and the reason why I could never go back to Palm. I'm sure that there are plenty of more examples in other areas.

Quote[/b] ]There is a reason Palm has 70-80% market share, especially in the corporate market.

Actually, it's 30.6 %

It's true however that Palm's are popular in the corporate mark because it fits their needs very well: it's an electronic planner, and a very good one. But that's all is. Sure, you can write other applications for it and plug in peripherals, but it only takes you so far.

Palm: One additional device for your productivity needs

PPC: Extension of your PC

To be fair, the recent Palm developments (notably Tungsten C etc) are actually PocketPC clones, running on Intel CPUs. They're still very much inferor due to the lack of proper software (I'm sure that as soon as they change to the Windows Mobile OS, that the situation will get better

). PPC has the big advantage that porting applications from windows to ppc is just a matter of recompiling them. The OS has basically support for everything, including things like Directx 9 compatibility. Should BIS be willing to sacrefice one hour or so of their time, they could port OFP to PocketPC!

[Warin 0]

Quote[/b] ]Input via a wireless digitizer unit & pen

If you are talking about the pad where you write/draw and it comes up on the screen, then the first one of those was actually for Palm.

Quote[/b] ]Use the Ipaq as a phone through a Bluetooth link

Tunsten T and T2, built in BT that works like that. Sadly, no CDMA BT yet, so I cant do it.

Quote[/b] ]Internet acess throguh wireless 802.11g or bluetooth via GSM (or 3G) phone.

If your iPaq doesnt have built in 802.11g, you need a sled. I can get 802.11g through an SD card. Tungsten C has it built in. BT can be added to the C is already in the T/T2

Quote[/b] ]Voice recognition

A non issue for me, so I've never bothered looking for it My Tungten has a voice recorder, which I use extensively.

Quote[/b] ]Real internet explorer with support for Java and .NET components

Why anyone would claim that being able to use Internet Exploder is a FEATURE, I am not sure ;) However, there are full web browsers that parse proper HTML. Java is also supported in the newer models.

Quote[/b] ]Real handwriting recognition (software called Calligrapher that can actually fully read my handwriting)

Tealscript, MyScript, there are a host of Palm applications that recognize handwriting, even my terrible scrawl.

Quote[/b] ]Full MS Office integration.

Documents to Go integrates seamlessly with Office. I have several spreadsheets, word docs, power point presentations, etc. In fact, depending on your versions of Pocket Excel, etc. DtG integrates better than the PPC version.

Quote[/b] ]File sharing across wireless network.

Another one I am not sure on. Not really an issue to me since I sync to my desktop daily. That lets me get what video and audio files I want/need for the day.

As for the work stuff, I am not sure on the programs you listed, and cant really be bothered to look them up. But Palm does emulate all of the HP calculators. And it can support those compilers (though C# I am not sure about, I dont think so)

ICQ has a compatible Palm client, and there are various image editing software packages that work like PS. Yes, you have A0E for PPC and I dont.

What I have that you dont:

Higher resolution

Larger base of free/cheap software

Far simpler user interface

More intuitive

More stable

As to Flashpoint on a PPC environment..

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

*calms himself after he stops laughing so hard*

First the resolution on the iPaq is low (1/2 VGA) and secondly the xscale processor is a total dog. (My 150mhz TI OMAP Processor tests as fast in most pocket benchmarks as the 400mhz xscale).

If you taqke JUST Palm, yes, it's 30%. But if you add everything up, Sony, Handspring, and all the other manufacturers, Palm still approaches 70% market share. Because it is a superior OS. Microsoft makes the mistake of assuming that an extension of a PC is what people want in a handheld. That is erroneous thinking. If one wants a PC extension, get a notebook. Then you are not sacrificing usability and simplicity by trying to cram Windows into a device it's patently not suitable for.

I respect your decision to use iPaq. It's sort of like buying a Lada instead of a BMW

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Usually at work when I ask people for quick answers and they pull their stupid palms I tend to give two answers:

Is is fashionable nowadays to forget things and then retrieve the information from an electric device?

Dont waste my time with that....just call me back when you know it okay!

[Warin 0]

Usually at work when I ask people for quick answers and they pull their stupid palms I tend to give two answers:

Is is fashionable nowadays to forget things and then retrieve the information from an electric device?

Dont waste my time with that....just call me back when you know it okay!

LOL!

Good point. However, I use mine to keep track of all my coursework, due dates for papers, predictive grade tracking, and all of my professor's phone numbers and email addresses. Plus I play games, watch video, and listen to music while in transit to/from work and school. Plus I have a nifty winamp controller that works via bluetooth, so I can change songs while I am playing Flashpoint without having to alt tab out

It's not a matter of forgetting things. It's a matter of organising things that used to end up written on little slips of paper in my pocket

[denoir 0]

If you are talking about the pad where you write/draw and it comes up on the screen, then the first one of those was actually for Palm.

Not pad. It's called InkLink BT. Here is a picture of the older, wired version:

Quote[/b] ]

Quote[/b] ]Internet acess throguh wireless 802.11g or bluetooth via GSM (or 3G) phone.

If your iPaq doesnt have built in 802.11g, you need a sled.  I can get 802.11g through an SD card.  Tungsten C has  it built in.  BT can be added to the C is already in the T/T2.

I have built in 802.11 in my Ipaq and if I had not it would have been just a matter of plugging in a SD sized controller.

Quote[/b] ]Tealscript, MyScript, there are a host of Palm applications that recognize handwriting, even my terrible scrawl.

LMAO. TealScript? Haha. Good one. That program is utter crap and it does not even support continuous text.

Quote[/b] ]Documents to Go integrates seamlessly with Office.  I have several spreadsheets, word docs, power point presentations, etc.  In fact, depending on your versions of Pocket Excel, etc.  DtG integrates better than the PPC version.

Not surprisingly, they're lying at the Palm site (no doubt preying on gullible customers like you . Not a single of those statements is true. Also what they conveniently forgot mentioning is PocketOffice's full integration into Pocket Outlook's database/work groups. Not to mention such "details" as equation editor, .NET component plugins etc etc

Quote[/b] ]

Quote[/b] ]File sharing across wireless network.

Another one I am not sure on.  Not really an issue to me since I sync to my desktop daily.  That lets me get what video and audio files I want/need for the day.

Probably not. Linux has been around for how many years? They have yet to manage to include support for Microsoft Windows Networks. So I doubt very much that little PalmOS supports it. And I understand that you don't need it. That's why you use a low-end system as the Palm. Apart from constant full access to my files I can do nifty things like listening to streaming mp3's via the network, wherever I have 802.11 coverage (which includes the entire campus of my uni).

Quote[/b] ]As for the work stuff, I am not sure on the programs you listed, and cant really be bothered to look them up.  But Palm does emulate all of the HP calculators.

No it can't. It was one of the reasons why I threw away my Palm in favour of a PocketPC. I also looked it up now.

Quote[/b] ]What I have that you dont:

Higher resolution

Thanks to my superior OS, I can set my superior OS and software for it, I can have a resolution up to 1024x768. What's your max? 320x320?

Quote[/b] ]Larger base of free/cheap software

Very questionable as more or less the entire GNU library has been ported to PPC.

Quote[/b] ]Far simpler user interface

More intuitive

More stable

Absolutely - because it's more primitive. A rock has all those features compared to a computer.

Quote[/b] ]First the resolution on the iPaq is low (1/2 VGA) and secondly the xscale processor is a total dog. (My 150mhz TI OMAP Processor tests as fast in most pocket benchmarks as the 400mhz xscale).

Funny you should say that as the Tungsten C uses the Intel XScale processor. So you're saying that Palm decided to downgrade the CPU in their flagship product.

Quote[/b] ]Microsoft makes the mistake of assuming that an extension of a PC is what people want in a handheld.  That is erroneous thinking.  If one wants a PC extension, get a notebook.  Then you are not sacrificing usability and simplicity by trying to cram Windows into a device it's patently not suitable for.

I'm sure that your profession does not require you to have more than in your Palm. Mine does. A notebook is too big and impractical. A Palm is too limited and incompatible. Pocket PC is the perfect solution for me. And I'm not alone. If you look around you'll see that very few engineers with any self-respect use PalmOS based devices. While Palm is the corporate standard, PPC is the industry standard. The difference is like between a Macintosh and a PC.

Quote[/b] ]I respect your decision to use iPaq.  It's sort of like buying a Lada instead of a BMW

You have it reversed. Palm is the cheaper, slower and more basic. As I said, I'm sure it's good enough for salesmen and managers that need an organizer, but for any more serious technical usage, you can forget about Palm OS.

Also, remeber, I used to be a Palm user. I've had three Palm devices. Have you owned an Ipaq? If not, I recommend that you try one out. It was a completely new world that opened up to me, when I switched. Suddenly I was not holding a primitive organizer in my hand but a real computer. And the PDA stopped being a cool gadget/toy and became something really useful.

Edit:

Quote[/b] ]However, I use mine to keep track of all my coursework, due dates for papers, predictive grade tracking, and all of my professor's phone numbers and email addresses.  Plus I play games, watch video, and listen to music while in transit to/from work and school.  Plus I have a nifty winamp controller that works via bluetooth, so I can change songs while I am playing Flashpoint without having to alt tab out  

It's not a matter of forgetting things.  It's a matter of organising things that used to end up written on little slips of paper in my pocket

A Palm is perfect for you! If those are the needs that you have then there is absolutely no reason for you to get a PPC. On the contrary it would be a waste of money to invest into something that by far surpasses your needs.

[Warin 0]

The C isnt the flagship product. That's the T/T2

How about we agree we arent going to convince each other of anything?

Palm = Elegant

PPC = Windows 95

I'll leave it at that.

[denoir 0]

Regardless, it's pretty much safe to assume that PalmOS is a doomed platform. Microsoft policy has always been the same:

1) Quickly introduce an inferior product into an expanding market

2) Get market shares through agressive marketing

3) Improve the product

4) Eliminate all competition

They've done it loads of times and their strategy has not failed yet. Windows and internet explorer are two examples. The same goes for Pocket PC. When it was introduced, Win CE 1.0 was a horrible OS. They managed however to market it and get a piece of the market. Then they started improving it. Windows Mobile 2003 is quite a good OS as is Pocket PC 2002.

Just like they crushed Netscape, they'll crush PalmOS.

[Renagade 0]

Hey,whats so bad about a filofax

as for M$

[cam0flage 0]

Ok ...

I just got myself a Palm i705. My mother brought it to my father from the States, but somehow he didn't like it and it started gather ing dust, so I had to save it and take it for a test drive :P

I've been trying to google here and there, but most of the results I got were some commercial sites with little or no info.

What I need to know is:

1. What's a good site for overall Palm discussion/support/reviews etc.?

2. Are there any dictionaries available for handheld computers? I study English philology, so it would be very good to have one in my Palm.

3. Is there a lot of free software available for Palm in the net?

Thanks ...

[ale2999 0]

srry Warin, but denoir is right. i dont kniw when u last used a ppc, but they are EXTREMELY powerful. I've had my ipaq 2210 for not even a week, and i just love it. (i am in hospital now and I am using it to post!) palm is doomed

[Dauragon 0]

Ok so i bought a PPC , i have a couple questions

with what program can i use the built in microphone

is there any good sites with free softwares or sharewares ?

Edit: A Scientific calculator program would be cool

Edit2: And how do i change the bloody windows green hill background

[blackdog~ 0]

First, what PPC do you have because I just have a simple button to press when I want to record things

I'm not sure of any free software sites, downloads.com is always a good place to start though.

Don't know of a scientific calculator, search downloads.com as I said.

I don't have no green hill background on mine. Search for Pocket PC themes on google and use your cradle thingy to sync it in or summit. I forget how to do it.

PS: Denoir you need all this for that evil nook place Ralph is always on about?

[NavyEEL 0]

i have a Palm Tungsten T and it works great. it offers note taking, a calendar, bluetooth services, and other handy features such as portable word, excel, and powerpoint. i haven't tried any other portable devices, so i can't comment on them, but i can strongly recommend the palm tungsten--you wouldn't be disappointed with one.

[Badgerboy 0]

Perfect, it seems the that resident 'Portable elctronics' geezers are around. Just a couple of things.

1. I looking to pick up a PPC sometime soon, but have no knowledge of the differing brands and their capabilities. Considering my mobile phone has Bluetooth, a video camera, MSM, AOL, ICQ and Yahoo message support, C64 and Gameboy emulator, full net access, and can stream video from the net, (Plus loads of other things) I want to get something that has all those features and then some. (Hopefully wireless Ethernet, plus a multifunction card port, Office support, and buckets of software)

As the phone (A Nokia 7650) has only 4mb on it (A major design flaw), I can only cram so much software onto it, even with compression programs. It's useful for fooling people that I'm in work when I'm actually in the pub (MSM), and other odds and sods, but I'd like a bt of power and my finger tips. Any ideas? Denoir? Not too pricey though please!

2. My boss has picked up a XDA 2, (PPC and mobile in one) which I have yet to have a look at. Your opinion on its capabilities?

Linkage

They are a bit pricey, but if they are all singing and dacning, my mobile phone contract is up, and I can get one for Å300.