Mod Updates...

[ayjay 117]

Anyone else dislike it when a modder upgrades his work but doesn't post what he's done here, or on Steam or his own Discord?

[Gunter Severloh 3949]

Yup!

Because with his update, by not informing you of what hes added, changed, fixed, and or removed your version of the mod being the latest could create conflicts with the mission you built with

the modder's previous version, so you could be pounding your head for weeks trying to figure out why your mission dont work or is doing what its doing vs what you want it to and all to find out if you do,

the modder did something and didn't say shit about it.

 

     Stupid shit like that will bite the player in the ass, a way around it is to check through arma3 launcher prior to getting ingame, and see if something updated,

and if it did, and the modder didn't provide any change notes, then best you post a comment on the mod's page and find out.

 

    To me a modder that cant post a changelog, or info on what was done is lazy and has no business in releasing his work to the public, if your not going to

supply a changelog then keep it to yourself, public means just that public, its also common courtesy to let people know what you did, its like if BIS updated the game

with their mile long changes, and didn't say anything all a sudden you have new features, assets, things work different better or worse, things are broke, or things are fixed,

so common courtesy goes a long way imo.

 

When i update, and have updated my missions, as im making the changes, additions, ect,. what have you, i have an open notepad listing all the things i did as i do them, i find it rather fun tbh

but i also enjoy what i do, and each change, fix or whatever in my mind and letting whomever is playing with the mission/mod makes me feel better that they are getting a better version of what i created

which gives them more enjoyment of my work, i mean why build it if you dont care about what you build and care about what the player will run into.

 

Sorry i cant just agree, and thats it, imo my posts need something with some functional content that provide

value to the reader, otherwise im just adding useless shit to increase my post count and reputation. But ya i agree 😄

[ayjay 117]

Well said Gunter! 

[EO 11230]

While I can't say I've come across that particular phenomenon very often, I think Gunter sums it up pretty well. ^^

Hell, I'm on the other end of the spectrum, I still love posting about my WIP stuff, especially on the eve of a wee update. 

 

[Dedmen 2588]

On 8/6/2019 at 2:58 PM, ayjay said:

Anyone else dislike it when a modder upgrades his work but doesn't post what he's done here, or on Steam or his own Discord?

Ever used like.. any bigger app for Android?

Here is a average changelog:

Quote

Updates and fixes.

 

This is not really Arma specific. I guess it depends on how much time people have.

On 8/6/2019 at 5:39 PM, Gunter Severloh said:

a modder that cant post a changelog, or info on what was done is lazy

Yup. Exactly that.

 

On 8/6/2019 at 5:39 PM, Gunter Severloh said:

its like if BIS updated the game

with their mile long changes, and didn't say anything all a sudden you have new features, assets, things work different better or worse, things are broke, or things are fixed

Well that actually happens quite often. BI changelogs are often missing things that were either overlooked or deemed "not important" or were only summarized in a single line without giving any details about what specifically was changed.

 

Also not everyone uses some version control software (even though IMO everyone should, even mission makers, always have a backup handy with that too) so modders might not even remember what they really changed when they release a new version.

Or they think noone cares about their small mod and thus don't think it's worth making the effort.

[Gunter Severloh 3949]

1 hour ago, Dedmen said:

BI changelogs are often missing things that were either overlooked or deemed "not important" or were only summarized in a

single line without giving any details about what specifically was changed.

An interesting point, maybe as a developer they are mainly focusing on the bigger specifics when it comes to fixing, and updating something,

whereas adding assets are fairly clear in their changelog.

1 hour ago, Dedmen said:

so modders might not even remember what they really changed when they release a new version. 

I dont see whats so hard about it, have a notepad ready, when you make a change, fix, or removed something, put it down, even if you have been working on the thing for 2yrs.

1 hour ago, Dedmen said:

Or they think noone cares about their small mod and thus don't think it's worth making the effort.

If their at the point of thinking like that then why go through with releasing it in the first place, on another note, maybe there was quite a bit of work, coding and what have you

and their to tired to write up a changelog for what they did and want to get it out.

I been there with my WarMods in the past, if you dont put down the changes as you make them then imo to me your just adding in line of whats next to do as more work for yourself,

would be more efficient to multitask and do it while you make the changes, give them this tip, sharing is caring 🙂

[joostsidy 682]

1 hour ago, Gunter Severloh said:

I dont see whats so hard about it, have a notepad ready, when you make a change

Unfortunately development doesn't always work like that. There are planned changes that you are working on, but also accidental changes, temporary changes, experimental changes, unexpected changes that have to made as part of bigger changes. With some jobs there is a real risk that recording the job takes as much time as doing the job.

 

A professional developer should give a good report that is both not too short or too long.  Toward a non-professional, I am a bit more lenient, but if there is no update description at all, it is lazy and a bit insulting to your audience.

 

My advisory update template:

Spoiler

Version 2.11

 

GAMEPLAY:

- AI driving: they drive differently now. Not better.

 

ASSETS:

- All weapons have been overhauled, they are more fun now.

 

ENGINE:

- We looked carefully deep in the engine. Memory address at #FBGF0002 has probably changed.

 

 

 

 

[Gunter Severloh 3949]

22 hours ago, joostsidy said:

With some jobs there is a real risk that recording the job takes as much time as doing the job.

I know how it goes been there with my own mods, more especially my biggest WarMod (COWarMod) which took me 6 months to build,

and my IFA3WarMod which i updated 15 times over the course of 2yrs!

Unless you have a deadline i can see the work adding up, so then you must find a way to report what was done in a fashion that dont add to the work.

 

Simailer concept also applies to compiling, my change logs for my AI compilation list are usually big, they are time consuming, but as i update the list, i also

add to a new post the changelog, so in effect imo, im saving myself time because the workload is not updating the list, then creating another list

to report what i updated, its equal, same amount of work.

[PuFu 4591]

On 8/6/2019 at 6:39 PM, Gunter Severloh said:

     Stupid shit like that will bite the player in the ass

the "player" is not always the objective of a mod developer. it can also be a side effect. 

 

On 8/6/2019 at 6:39 PM, Gunter Severloh said:

 

    To me a modder that cant post a changelog, or info on what was done is lazy and has no business in releasing his work to the public, if your not going to

 supply a changelog then keep it to yourself, public means just that public,😄

shit is never as black and white as you describe it to be. 

[BRPVP 69]

Modders put the change log if they want. We are on modders hands if choose to use their work, it's free, and you can only say thanks or bye bye.

[dragon01 902]

Says someone without a single released mod to his name...

 

Changelogs are documentation, and documentation is important. It's true whether it's a small mod or a multimillion dollar software project. Documenting changes as you do them is also good and should be a universal practice, exactly because there can be temporary changes for debugging. Neglecting that can and does lead to releasing with a "dev switch" flipped the wrong way somewhere, and if you don't have a robust tester base (and sometimes even then), it may lead to frustrating attempts to debug it and an embarrassing hotfix once the problem is finally uncovered. Changelogs are really the most basic form of documentation, and aside from being just plain easy to read (as opposed to, say, trawling through a sprawling wiki), they're also, by definition, up to date. 

[BRPVP 69]

You is completely wrong.