The Iraq Thread

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Schoeler @ Mar. 19 2003,22:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Allright, then consider this:

Do you think that the Democrats who suffered stunning defeats in the last two elections wouldn't hesitate to leap on this opportunity to totally annihilate and discredit the Bush administration and the Republican Party?<span id='postcolor'>

I'm not saying that average GI Joe would be part of a cover up or any larger number of military personel. There are however those that are willing and capable of supporting the cause in more unorthodox ways with the quiet blessing of the government. Bush is not going to order to create forged evidence, he has people lower in the organization to do that. If it will be the military, the CIA, the DIA - who knows? And there is no certainty that it will happen.

All that I am saying is that it has happend repeatedly before and based on that we can induce that it can happen again. I am not aware of an "ethics" program that has been introduced to the military intelligence agencies the last two years. On the contrary, the vibes that are given from Bush is "do what is necessary to get the job done" (including political assasinations). So why should we believe that there has been a sudden change?

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (FSPilot @ Mar. 19 2003,22:19)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Balschoiw @ Mar. 19 2003,16<!--emo&)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Tarik Azis, vice premier of iraq possibly shot. Latest reports indicate he was shot at while trying to flee a governmental bunker. It is not confimed yet. Also it is unknown if he was injured or killed.<span id='postcolor'>

Tarik Azis says otherwise<span id='postcolor'>

Yeah right, I think we all know who that was.

<span id='postcolor'>

You should work for the CIA

[Winters 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 19 2003,22:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">5--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Schoeler @ Mar. 19 2003,225)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Denoir, I've offered otherexamples of U.S. whistleblowing.  The point is not when it comes out or how long it takes, but the odds that it will be revealed eventually.  It isn't worth the risk or the trouble of faking it.<span id='postcolor'>

I don't deny that some things are bound to come out. I am however very sure that there are at least as many examples of situations that never got out. The only thing what we can say is that USA is known to plant evidence before. That makes it not unlikely and certainly not impossible that it will happen again.<span id='postcolor'>

USA is not the only country to plant evidence.

[FSPilot 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,03:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (FSPilot @ Mar. 19 2003,22:19)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Balschoiw @ Mar. 19 2003,16<!--emo&)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Tarik Azis, vice premier of iraq possibly shot. Latest reports indicate he was shot at while trying to flee a governmental bunker. It is not confimed yet. Also it is unknown if he was injured or killed.<span id='postcolor'>

Tarik Azis says otherwise<span id='postcolor'>

Yeah right, I think we all know who that was.

<span id='postcolor'>

You should work for the CIA <span id='postcolor'>

Who says I don't?

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:28)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">USA is not the only country to plant evidence.<span id='postcolor'>

No it certainly isn't. Everybody does it during war. We were however discussing the possibility of planting WMDs and some here claim that USA never would do such a thing.

[Longinius 1]

"2. Yes, I do. But this is the difference between you and I. As I already stated, I think you have serious misperceptions about the American people and our government. You apparently see us as a warmongering bloodthirsty people who support a government that is evil, corrupt, and willing to go to any length to further its interests. I think that opinion is far-fetched, innacurate and tragic."

I have said nothing what so ever about the American people. I have nothing against them, nothing at all. I do however not trust politicians who are put into power by various companies through lobbying. I am generally very suspicious about politicians, because power tends to corrupt even the best of people. Even more so when there are millions of dollars involved. If the leaders of the US were elected simply based on the opinion of the people, then it would be another thing all together.

"Perhaps thats why your view of our government is so jaded. We may be the only nation on earth that cannot effectively keep people from revealing embarrassing secrets and therefore you have heard about ours and not those of other countries."

Yes, of course you are. The rest of us communists simply shoot anyone who catches our leader with a mistress, since its the worst thing ever on the political scene.

Come on now, the US is far from the only country where scandals are exposed. The biggest difference is that when most other countries have scandals, they are usually very local and very petty. It seldom has to do with invading other countries or effecting third parties.

[Winters 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 19 2003,22:30)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:28)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">USA is not the only country to plant evidence.<span id='postcolor'>

No it certainly isn't. Everybody does it during war. We were however discussing the possibility of planting WMDs and some here claim that USA never would do such a thing.<span id='postcolor'>

Although things that are being said are true. I am afraid this forum is becomming nothing more than a place to come to and vent your frustrations out about America.

We may not have the greatest government in the world (but then again who does?)

[Renagade 0]

http://www.ananova.com/news....adlines

speak of the devil...

[Winters 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 19 2003,22:30)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:28)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">USA is not the only country to plant evidence.<span id='postcolor'>

No it certainly isn't. Everybody does it during war. We were however discussing the possibility of planting WMDs and some here claim that USA never would do such a thing.<span id='postcolor'>

But what does this have to do with OFP?

to quote Suma:

Even if this forum section is called Offtopic, it is still part of Operation Flashpoint discussion board - and any topics that are completely unrelated to OFP can be closed or deleted. We see no reason why we should dedicate our bandwidth and hosting space to such discussions.

So i ask again, what do WMD's have to do with OFP?

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:35)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I am afraid this forum is becomming nothing more than a place to come to and vent your frustrations out about America.<span id='postcolor'>

It will pass. Unfortunately many Americans that indeed do not support Bush get caught in the crossfire.

The rethorics is always very polarized. Those that are pro war will try by any means to show that their cause is righteous and just while those that are anti war are going to do their best to disprove that. So on one hand you have a image of "USA the Saviour of the World" and on the other hand is "USA the Great Satan". Don't take it personally and average the claims out to get an objective picture.

[Winters 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 19 2003,22:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:35)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I am afraid this forum is becomming nothing more than a place to come to and vent your frustrations out about America.<span id='postcolor'>

It will pass. Unfortunately many Americans that indeed do not support Bush get caught in the crossfire.

The rethorics is always very polarized. Those that are pro war will try by any means to show that their cause is righteous and just while those that are anti war are going to do their best to disprove that. So on one hand you have a image of "USA the Saviour of the World" and on the other hand is "USA the Great Satan". Don't take it personally and average the claims out to get an objective picture.<span id='postcolor'>

Maybe i am slightly biased having been in Gulf War 1, it hurts me to see what is going on in my government. I only hope the next President decides to clean up the international mess this jerk is making.

But i will give him credit for one thing and one thing only. He was right when he said the UN must step up i mean what does "Serious Consequences" mean anyway? that could be interpreted in many different ways and i think this is the major contributor to all the political strife and upheaval thats going on.

They could have simply said "Or face another Attack" that would have been clean and simple. I fear the UN will soon become a non-entity as no one will take them seriously.

[R. Gerschwarzenge 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,23:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">But what does this have to do with OFP?

to quote Suma:

Even if this forum section is called Offtopic, it is still part of Operation Flashpoint discussion board - and any topics that are completely unrelated to OFP can be closed or deleted. We see no reason why we should dedicate our bandwidth and hosting space to such discussions.

So i ask again, what do WMD's have to do with OFP?<span id='postcolor'>

You left out this part

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"about wars, military conflicts and everything what pertinent to Army"<span id='postcolor'>

[nolips71 0]

i would like to add my support for the war in iraq. and i wish luck to the airmen of the Royal Air Force and the United States Air Force and soldiers of the UK and the USA.

[Winters 1]

Ok here ya go, but what i said still stands, this is NOT about OFP.

"about wars, military conflicts and everything what pertinent to Army"

Even if this forum section is called Offtopic, it is still part of Operation Flashpoint discussion board - and any topics that are completely unrelated to OFP can be closed or deleted. We see no reason why we should dedicate our bandwidth and hosting space to such discussions.

Notice the part about "Completely unrelated to OFP"?

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:49)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ok here ya go, but what i said still stands, this is NOT about OFP.

"about wars, military conflicts and everything what pertinent to Army"

Even if this forum section is called Offtopic, it is still part of Operation Flashpoint discussion board - and any topics that are completely unrelated to OFP can be closed or deleted. We see no reason why we should dedicate our bandwidth and hosting space to such discussions.

Notice the part about "Completely unrelated to OFP"?<span id='postcolor'>

Politics are included in the sanctioned topic.

It's very simple. Me moderator, me say so. End of discussion

[Winters 1]

so then its "feel free to bash the US but dont dare bash anyone else or i will lock the topic"

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:53)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">so then its "feel free to bash the US but dont dare bash anyone else or i will lock the topic"<span id='postcolor'>

This is a topic on the war on iraq and it's political consequences. It's not my fault that USA is the one that the majority feels is behaving like an ass. As long as it is reasonably on-topic and is not in violation of forum rules, it's ok. Many people have expressed their anti-French (political) views and that too is fine. This thread is about politics and war which are both sanctioned topics.

If you personally don't like what is being said or don't like the people who are saying it - then stay away. Nobody is forcing you.

Btw. This discussion has no place in this thread. You can PM me or you can post your questions about the rules in this topic. And I would like to point your attention to the board rules, §2.6

[Longinius 1]

"Even if this forum section is called Offtopic, it is still part of Operation Flashpoint discussion board - and any topics that are completely unrelated to OFP can be closed or deleted. We see no reason why we should dedicate our bandwidth and hosting space to such discussions.

Notice the part about "Completely unrelated to OFP"?

Notice the part where it says "CAN be closed or deleted"? It doesnt say "will", "should" or "must". Its simply a pretty basic disclaimer giving the company the right to stop any discussions not related to OFP. They are obviously chosing not to do that right now with this thread.

So thanks MODs, Suma and the rest of BIS.

[Renagade 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Winters @ Mar. 19 2003,22:49)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ok here ya go, but what i said still stands, this is NOT about OFP.

"about wars, military conflicts and everything what pertinent to Army"

Even if this forum section is called Offtopic, it is still part of Operation Flashpoint discussion board - and any topics that are completely unrelated to OFP can be closed or deleted. We see no reason why we should dedicate our bandwidth and hosting space to such discussions.<span id='postcolor'>

just a quick point on that im sure bis are well aware of the potential of having multiple users coming to their forums.

u can pm mods about issues u may have and theres a thread just below this one that u can also ask mods questions on

[joltan 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Schoeler @ Mar. 19 2003,22:05)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Denoir, I've offered otherexamples of U.S. whistleblowing. The point is not when it comes out or how long it takes, but the odds that it will be revealed eventually. It isn't worth the risk or the trouble of faking it.<span id='postcolor'>

Sure, everything will come out eventually - the question is if it will still matter then. The incubator story surfaced, but who cared? The war was already won. The faked attack that started the US involvement in Vietnam, who cared when it finally surfaced (don't remember how the incident was called, but I'm sure some fellow writers can supply the info)?

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (joltan @ Mar. 19 2003,23:08)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The faked attack that started the US involvement in Vietnam, who cared when it finally surfaced (don't remember how the incident was called, but I'm sure some fellow writers can supply the info)?<span id='postcolor'>

The Bay of Tonkin

[Renagade 0]

back on topic,b52s based here are getting set to go or so the news says.

Do they still use laser guided bombs,the same style as how ofp ones work,spec ops paint target then the bomb locks onto it? in modern times and will they be used now?

[Mora2 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Renagade @ Mar. 19 2003,04:29)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">6--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (SGTKOPP @ Mar. 19 2003,046)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 19 2003,03:37)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The bad thing is that we won't be getting any reliable info on this war. In Kosovo one could average out US and Yugoslav propaganda to get some form of objective picture.

I don't think however that Iraq is capable of getting out their point of view.<span id='postcolor'>

most IRAQ citizens dont even know whats going on in there own country<span id='postcolor'>

and u do ?<span id='postcolor'>

He is not iraqui.

[Necromancer- 0]

B-52's.... death from the air.

[Othin 0]

An Iraqi's conversation with an anti-war protester

I agree with him though, there is far to much ping-ponging and simplistic Nikolodean diplomacy going on!