Special Ops Campaign

[Jackal326 1181]

True. What do you propose? Perhaps if they didn't make a full campaign as I stated (for example East Wind) but a small, concise group of special forces missions. Maybe 10-12 extensive missions for £10 (or your equivalent). It doesn't necessarily have to have an engrossing story, just something that gives a bit of purpose to what you're doing. This DLC would be pretty much all about the gameplay.

Why would I pay £10 (or any money) when I can join a quality milsim community/squad and enjoy such a mission with other people? I get what you're saying, but unless a LOT of new weapons/equipment came with the campaign, I wouldn't be interested.

[OMAC 254]

Hum, as its an expansion, I doubt the campaign will be long enough - just lie in all expansions…

Hope so, but really doubt it.

And I think we'll only have 2 or 3 SP missions too...

Yep. But we can still hope... Hopefully they'll do something akin to OA (medium-length campaign + ~10 SP missions). But I still feel I'm not quite done with Altis/Stratis yet...

Perhaps if they didn't make a full campaign as I stated (for example East Wind) but a small, concise group of special forces missions. Maybe 10-12 extensive missions for £10 (or your equivalent). It doesn't necessarily have to have an engrossing story, just something that gives a bit of purpose to what you're doing. This DLC would be pretty much all about the gameplay.

^ ^ I'm all for this. Big time. And I'd pay for it even if there weren't a single new weapon or vehicle in it.

[froggyluv 2136]

I'd like to have a more scripted, movie-like campaign (but I doubt it with the AI problems).

No offence man but god this statement is nuts. What your asking for already exists in the multitude of story FPS shooters. The entire reason this franchise stands different is the "hey, but what if I approached the objective from THAT hill .." aspect type gamer. Allowing the player to go outside or better, have no bounds also forces the designer to work on the AI so that it can survive and even thrive in a world in which the player can do or come from anything/anywhere.

Game titles that were once more open-ended gone movie shooter generally let AI development go by the wayside as they no longer have to develop the AI to cope with galaxy of variable -one simply traps the player in the proper dressed up corridor and wipe their hands of it. Why work on the complications of an AI Machinegunner trying to set up in a window frame when one can simply script the event very much like what happened in an Arma 3 episode. Why refine the AI ability to survive a gunfight using tactics appropriate to it's skill, profession, nation when they can simply make that NPC invincible to keep the story moving, immersion be damned.

So no, never, ever go that route BI.

[jakerod 254]

Why refine the AI ability to survive a gunfight using tactics appropriate to it's skill, profession, nation when they can simply make that NPC invincible to keep the story moving, immersion be damned.

So no, never, ever go that route BI.

I think they already did. Mission #1 of the A3 campaign and maybe other places too. But yeah I would rather not continue to go that direction.

[IndeedPete 1038]

I think they already did. Mission #1 of the A3 campaign and maybe other places too. But yeah I would rather not continue to go that direction.

Yes, seems like they do that with certain characters. But there aren't many other options from a narrative point of view. Some characters need to stay alive to advance the plot. However, they did handle it quite well for the less important NPCs. At least in Survive your squadmates can die and in the next mission others will fill in the blanks. Not sure how far that goes, never tried to get my whole squad killed in every mission. Fun fact: I recall Thomas Ryan (Zipper) saying in some live stream that they had to do the same voice acting with several dudes because of this system.

[jakerod 254]

Yes, seems like they do that with certain characters. But there aren't many other options from a narrative point of view. Some characters need to stay alive to advance the plot. However, they did handle it quite well for the less important NPCs. At least in Survive your squadmates can die and in the next mission others will fill in the blanks. Not sure how far that goes, never tried to get my whole squad killed in every mission. Fun fact: I recall Thomas Ryan (Zipper) saying in some live stream that they had to do the same voice acting with several dudes because of this system.

My whole squad died on the fourth of fifth mission. I'm fairly certain they were still talking to command after they were dead. And you really don't need to put literal "plot shields" on characters to drive the narrative; you just need to have something in place to drive it if they do die. Not to mention there are other ways to maintain character survival without making them invincible.

[bw1231996 11]

Just came across this thread. I have just started creating scenarios and I am learning quickly and getting pretty good, all while enjoying it. So if anyone decides to do a community project for a SF campaign type thing, I would be interested.

[Wiki 1558]

No offence man but god this statement is nuts. What your asking for already exists in the multitude of story FPS shooters. The entire reason this franchise stands different is the "hey, but what if I approached the objective from THAT hill .." aspect type gamer. Allowing the player to go outside or better, have no bounds also forces the designer to work on the AI so that it can survive and even thrive in a world in which the player can do or come from anything/anywhere.

Game titles that were once more open-ended gone movie shooter generally let AI development go by the wayside as they no longer have to develop the AI to cope with galaxy of variable -one simply traps the player in the proper dressed up corridor and wipe their hands of it. Why work on the complications of an AI Machinegunner trying to set up in a window frame when one can simply script the event very much like what happened in an Arma 3 episode. Why refine the AI ability to survive a gunfight using tactics appropriate to it's skill, profession, nation when they can simply make that NPC invincible to keep the story moving, immersion be damned.

So no, never, ever go that route BI.

No offense taken :)

But what I meant wasn't something only scripted like in CoD, but not something only sandbox like we could have in ArmA 2.

I wish for something more linear, following a story - like they tried to do in East Wind - but in which we really feel bein part of an entity.

A campaign in which we don't have the feeling to be the guy who makes a difference (like they did for the side missions in which the player is alone and go Rambo style, one-man-army), but be part of a squad, platoon, army and whose mission make a difference.

For example, in CWC, first mission "Flashpoint" in which we had to take Morton:

the player wouldn't do it alone, but there were 2 infantry squads supported by 1 Abrams and 1 Patton + 1 Cobra for air support.

The village was taken by the whole TF, and it happened sometimes I didn't kill any enemy.

I felt to be part of something.

Now, if they made this mission today, it would probably happen this way:

you lead a 5 men squad et go take the village.

See what I mean?

[IndeedPete 1038]

My whole squad died on the fourth of fifth mission. I'm fairly certain they were still talking to command after they were dead. And you really don't need to put literal "plot shields" on characters to drive the narrative; you just need to have something in place to drive it if they do die. Not to mention there are other ways to maintain character survival without making them invincible.

Might be a bug.^^ And someone is always talking to command, hence they had to record these sentences with different guys. But what if a miracle happens and BI actually creates a lovable and unique character? Looking at other games with a strong narrative here: What would Mass Effect be without Mordin Solus? You can't just replace a singing Salarian with some random dude! I'm exaggerating here but sometimes a certain character is important for the story. Not saying that's the case with the East Wind though. But there might be other ways than invinvibility: I recall a video or article somewhere where a dude tried to kill all mortal NPCs in Fallout 3 and the story actually progressed somehow. On the other hand I recall myself killing the head of the Mage guild in Morrowind back in the days and got a popup saying: "That character was important, now you can't finish the story line, f*cker." (Just in fancy words.) :D

[jakerod 254]

Might be a bug.^^ And someone is always talking to command, hence they had to record these sentences with different guys. But what if a miracle happens and BI actually creates a lovable and unique character? Looking at other games with a strong narrative here: What would Mass Effect be without Mordin Solus? You can't just replace a singing Salarian with some random dude! I'm exaggerating here but sometimes a certain character is important for the story. Not saying that's the case with the East Wind though. But there might be other ways than invinvibility: I recall a video or article somewhere where a dude tried to kill all mortal NPCs in Fallout 3 and the story actually progressed somehow. On the other hand I recall myself killing the head of the Mage guild in Morrowind back in the days and got a popup saying: "That character was important, now you can't finish the story line, f*cker." (Just in fancy words.) :D

I don't even get why they had to record different voices. All of them sound the same to me in terms of who my squad leaders have been and I know for a fact that 1 is always KIA in every mission. Not to mention since half the squad dies in every mission I never really get attached to any of them or can recognize their voice. They could've done the OFP thing of slightly changing the pitch of the voice and I would never notice.

Which brings me to another point. My favorite ArmA series mission of all time is Ambush. I don't get why they couldn't make more missions similar to that. If your whole squad dies in that the mission the objective changes from "take the town" to get the hell back to base in one piece. It would be nice to have more conditional things like that in the campaign. For example, I was playing a mission where you have to rescue we'll call them Zulu squad to not ruin any surprises. My whole squad got wasted on the way into the town. It would've been cool if the objective then changed to "Escape" instead of me having to go be a one man army. Now it would also be cool if I could continue on with the mission to rescue them if I want to be rambo but the objective should change. This is again similar to Ambush when you're told to evac to the beach but you can choose to stay behind and fight off the enemy attack if you want. If you succeeded in defeating it then you won. So in that sense there were 3 different endings; evac to the beach, your squad is dead get back to friendly lines, and you stopped the attack. If you don't rescue them then I guess Zulu squad can end up dying or getting captured leading to a rescue mission. Maybe they did this later on in the ArmA 3 campaign. I am only Wet Works so I don't know... which really makes me think he is special forces.

OP should buy ArmA: CWA and go back and play the SF SP missions and the Gastovski missions in the campaign. A lot of the Resistance missions would fit well too.

SF are meant for stealthy operations. By the time the enemy knows what's happening, special forces should be long gone. As I said in the OP missions would generally be at night and all weapons would be silenced. If there was something to happen that was loud (for example we're tasked with taking out a communications hub) we would set the charge and only set it off once we were either extracting or about to extract. Or if we were tasked with taking out an officer, a sniper would take care of that so the officer would die and the enemies would never even know where we were. It's about operating like ghosts.

A lot of the ArmA: CWA SF missions were like this. There is one in particular where you are first tasked with reconing for targets and then in the second mission (a few missions later) you come back and destroy them. You can be stealthy and wait until you're extracting to blow the targets. Assuming you timed things right.

Edited February 16, 2015 by Jakerod

[twangydave 7]

There's masses of really good SF type missions available through Steam Workshop, here, Armaholic etc - have you looked around much? I'd be surprised if you can't find stuff you'd like.

There is also a staggering amount of high quality mods that will give you any of the SF units or equipment you need to create your own scenarios and run with friends.

As a first point of call, look at some of the stuff in the Make Arma Not War contest, a lot of that stuff is up to commercial standard.

How about this?:

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?186690-SpookWarCom-Darker-Immersion-amp-Spec-Ops-Gameplay

Edited February 16, 2015 by twangydave

[ARMAKrush 10]

There's masses of really good SF type missions available through Steam Workshop

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?186690-SpookWarCom-Darker-Immersion-amp-Spec-Ops-Gameplay

I had more of a look on the workshop today, and you're right, there are a lot of high quality spec ops missions. However it only makes me want a spec ops campaign more! The fun gameplay the theme offers with the expertise and resources of BIS is something that would result in a fantastic gameplay experience. The scenarios also made me notice something - why is East Wind always played in blistering sunlight? The game looks beautiful with the wind swaying the grass, the grey skies and raindrops falling. Not to mention some of the missions that require a stealthy approach during the campaign would've been better played during rain/overcast. I played a mission today (or part of it - I had to go about half way through but I intend to finish it tomorrow) and swimming up to the coast, listening to the seagulls and the waves crashing, it's something you don't really experience in Bohemia's scenarios/campaign. It's all played in bright sunlight or complete darkness.

I also checked the link - I don't really understand what it is or what it does :(

Edited February 17, 2015 by ARMAKrush

[twangydave 7]

I had more of a look on the workshop today, and you're right, there are a lot of high quality spec ops missions. However it only makes me want a spec ops campaign more!

I also checked the link - I don't really understand what it is or what it does :(

The SpookWarCom -- Darker Immersion & Spec-Ops Gameplay link that I posted makes it easy to set up the types of scenarios that you want to play in the Editor. I haven't used it yet but will be doing so in the future. If you haven't messed around with the editor yet then I strongly recommend you give it a go, it's one of Arma 3's best features. It's really simple to use and, with mods engaged, you can produce exactly what it is you want without the shortcomings of the official content. The greatest thing BI did was to give us the tools to make the game the way we want to play it. I, like you, enjoy the spec ops stuff, here's an example of a scenario I've just finished which showcases UKSF. AS you can see, you can do pretty much what you want!

Following the toppling of Saddam Hussein's regime in Iraq, 2003 it has been reported that an SAS Squadron has been assigned to a joint US/UK group of Special Operations units operating in the country, known previously as Task Force 145 (TF-145).

Now reportedly renamed to TF-88, this cream of Western Special Operators consists of several elements:

•TF Black - - made up of an SAS sabre squadron, supported by a Company of SFSG (TF Maroon). Some SBS operators are thought to be attached to TF Black.

Takistan is a lawless and remote kingdom whose rulers ignore the poverty of their people and instead fill their pockets by supplying opium to the world-wide drugs trade and by providing a safe haven for international terrorism.

Intelligence reports reach Western agencies and alert them to the fact that leading figures in the many disparate terrorist cells that ply their trade in the region are due to meet in the militarised town of Rasman to discuss co-ordinated action against NATO forces.

Wanting to 'cut the head off the snake', military planners begin to formulate a mission to assault Rasman during the meeting and kill or capture the terrorist leaders. Their plans soon hit a brick wall as Takistan is spectacularly inaccessible and the few mountain passes that lead into the country are narrow, mined with explosives and so heavily defended that they are effectively impregnable.

The operators of United Kingdom Special Forces (Task Force Black) come up with an audacious plan to assault Rasman from the air, taking their famous Land Rovers with them slung underneath the Chinooks that will be transporting the troops. They will launch the raid from a covert CIA air base that lies to the South of Takistan in a friendly country. Fast air will also fly out of the base to support the assault and protect the helicopters.

Several specialist teams of saboteurs, Forward Air Controllers and demolitions experts are infiltrated into the country before the assault launches. Their job will be to cripple the logistics and vehicles at Rasman Airbase so the Takistani Air Force cannot launch its few jets, they will also designate targets for the fast air. Once the assault begins, local resistance forces will secure the roads out of Rasman and prevent anyone escaping. Once troops are clear, explosives will be set on the towns infrastructure and detonated.

Amazing Mods by the following hard working and inspirational authors:

Takistani Army by EvroMalarkey

All in Arma Terrain Pack by Kju

Blastcore A3 by OpticalSnare

UK Special Forces by Massi

Nato SF and Russian Spetsnaz Vehicles by Massi

Nato SF and Russian Weapons by MassiCAF Aggressors by Ohalley

JSRS 3 DragonFyre by Lord Jarhead

Lifter for Arma 3 by Raven

Boeing/SOAR MH-47E by konyo

Arma 2 Mil Mi-24 Hind Port by Chairborne

bCombat AI Mod by fabrizio_T

Blood Mist by Lao Fei Mao

Death Screams by LAxeman

Community Base Addons by CBA Team

Community Upgrade Project by kju

East Tank Pack by Reyhard

F-16C Fighting Falcon by Firewill

Joint Rails by Robalo

Middle East Conflict Mod by Drongo69

RDS East Static Weapons Pack by Reyhard

RHS: Armed Forces of the Russian Federation by Red Hammer Studios

STI A-10A A3 by Stiltman

Tactical Beards by Interbred

TMR Modular Realism by Taosenai

F/A-18 Super Hornet and Su-35S Flanker E by John_Spartan and Saul

I think that's everyone but apologies if I missed anyone!