Cross-compatible weapons packs. They seem like a myth.

[C-Young 10]

CROSS COMPATIBILITY

We need some

Why a really odd title? Well its an odd scenario. See, ARMA 3 is in a really odd place. Its young and fresh but still has traits of its predecessor. Its new and vibrant but has modders with experience tending to it. Its like a new born with an experienced father. Bad analogies aside I have begun to notice something in the ARMA 3 modding community. Something that is detrimental to the broader modded gaming community. Something that could effect 2 man team all the way to the company sized play groups. Its magazine compatibility.

Magazine compatibility? Really is this C. Young guy for real? What about dinosaur mods or super cool commando tactical spec ops black ops delta ranger snipers? Thats so much cooler. This C. Young guy is full of it........ or is he?

The reason I want to address this and bring it to the common eye is because at the moment we are "ammo-segregated" with weapon mods.

For example, Your super cool M16 pack, or your super fly snipers, or your shiny new M4 and carbines pack all work great but do all the magazine work together? Do they "compat" with each other? Well, if your most people you will say no. Its a sad but true fact at the moment. RH weapons mags wont compat with MK18's M4 pack mags and U100 weapons pack wont Compat again. Now, this might seem irrelevant to some of you small solo or small team players but to the larger communities, 30 and up players, this is a serious issue. The default ARMA 3 weapons are as help full as a dead horse at the Melbourne cup races so most communities use modded weapons pack.

Now under the pretense of larger communities using mod packs they usually need, an automatic rifle platform in 5.56, a rifleman's standard rifle in 5.56, a rifleman's rifle with a UGL on it for grenadiers and then some form 5.56 PDW or short barrel firearm. This structure allows fire teams to be formed and then in greater sizes squads and eventually a company.

What does this have to do with compatibility? Well right now in the ARMA 3 community it is hard to find a single weapons pack the checks all the need AND looks good, isnt buggy and plays well.

So what do you do if there isn't a pack with all your needs? You use another pack encompassing your needs as well as the prior pack covering other needs. Now you have 2 mods running just for basic load-outs and guess what.....the mags aren't compatible. Well now what? Your bogged down in a firefight and your Grenadier has spare mags but his don't work with anyone elses so they have become combat ineffective and your down to one gun for the fight. Well.....that's no good.

I hope I have addressed the issue of cross compatibility well enough. If your still unsure just ask me personally, I'll explain in more depth. 5.56 Mk318's, 5.56 262's and all the other variants in reality are compatible with any weapon bored for the round. So WHY are we restricted via mods?

So that's the introduction and issue, but whats a thorough well thought out post without a suggested solution and conclusion (essay 101 baby!)

Let's address the problem then. We need compatible magazines across mods. Something where modders can begin modding and use a predefined magazine set up that isn't horrible or the.....do I dare say it....the default BI 5.56 mags.

Something like joint rails or joint muzzles but for Magazines. Imagine the possibilities. Modders could worry less about the magazines and compatibility issues and focus more on the models and handling. 1 third of the work load would be removed for weapon modders.

Multiplayer Units in ARMA 3 would be able to use any weapon mod they felt fit the theme of their unit. Not just the ones that work with the mags then need them to. German units could rock G36's and Marine units could rock M4's, British units could rock the L85, French units could rock the FAMAS and Australian units could rock F88's and all the mags would be cross compatible. International units could use all of the above and mission makers could use different nations and not worry about ammo for each type. Just one ammo crate full of 5.56 cross compatible mags.

Finally modders could worry about putting out packs of weapons in larger sizes. Less work on the magazines could equal more work on the pack itself.

All in all I want to raise awareness of magazine compatibility and the possibility of a ASDG joint rails styled magazine mod for weapon modders. The Idea has been spun gentlemen, is there a modder able to set up to the plate?

Signed; C. Young

[bricks 6]

If you want something done; do it yourself.

[Ckrauslo 12]

Nice presentation, agree that would be nice, but some modders might like the idea, others might not, this might be a issue more of scripts...and cfg files...

Again nice presentation, but wrong area...The mod request thread exist for this reason

[JimiEZ 10]

One of the biggest problems of ARMA mod community is that modders just keep making the same stuff over and over again. How many different M4s, Abrams tanks or "USMC" units do we really need? Much more would get done if modders pooled their resources, but I suppose everyone's been modding on their own with dollar signs in their eyes thanks to MANW.

[slatts 1978]

One of the biggest problems of ARMA mod community is that modders just keep making the same stuff over and over again. How many different M4s, Abrams tanks or "USMC" units do we really need? Much more would get done if modders pooled their resources, but I suppose everyone's been modding on their own with dollar signs in their eyes thanks to MANW.

Modders have been doing their own things and making their own M4, Abrams and USMC since OFP and long before MANW.

To the OP. It is an unfortunate result of modding. If I wanted my own weapon to use the STANAG magazines of others I would have to get define every single magazine class from every other mod. Which can be a pain at the best of times. But I would agree, a ASDG for magazines would be a great thing to have.

Until then, I'll just stick with the BIS 5.56 :)

[Tacti-Cool 10]

If you want something done; do it yourself.

Thats a pretty closed minded attitude to have. Not everyone is as educated or talented in the creation of custom content and relies on the work of others to have an enjoyable game play experience.

I think if he was able to make such a mod a reality, he would be, instead of posting here, asking for input or help.

Agreed with the OP. a JSDG Magazines mod would be a excellent addition to Arma 3, allowing users utilising RH, RHS, U100 and Vanilla weapons to all share magazines with hit values greater than BIs vanilla mags.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Tacti-Cool

[corporal_lib[br] 396]

Lukrop did it some months ago - made compactibility between massi´s/RH/toadie/sudden/vanilla and used increased damage for 5.56mm/7,62mm/5.45mm calibers... but them BIS updates fubared his scripts and the development/contribution halted...

OPF had a JAM mod, a joint munition mod for all main mods that time... arma3 needs it, but someone has to grab the wild horse by it´s hair and tame it... there goes the bad metaphor again lol

[instagoat 133]

Question is wether or not something like JAM can be organized again, because as far as I understand, ammo is now more complex, and there's also a higher standard players and modders themselves expect of ammo performance with regards to the adherence to real world data.

[Rydygier 1309]

I don't now, if there exist any modder willing to do so (I'm not), or if all the authors of weapon mods would like to permit such thing, but AFAIK this stuff, which is not much really, it's mainly about creating separate mod, that would require all the mods, it aims to make cross-compatible, that would "simply" modify magazines array in the config of each weapon to cover mutually appriopriate magazines from all the other mods. If there are any other obstacles to work out, I'm unawared about them. Alternatively, each author of each weapon pack has to agree to introduce such change in his mod. Well, either way, good luck. :)

[Defunkt 431]

Alternatively, each author of each weapon pack has to agree to introduce such change in his mod.

Please don't put about misinformation like this. A separate mod which merely references classnames in another (unaltered) mod does not need anybody's permission to do so anymore than a mission maker needs additional permission to reference those classes in a mission.

[Rydygier 1309]

You're right, I should be more clear on this. I don't say it need permission to stay fair. I agree so fairness doesn't need asking the modder at all. Still, I would consider as more respectful (kind?) behaviour to ask for permission even in such case knowing, how emotionally some modders sometimes treat own creations and how bad they think about any attempts of the others to do some "wild modyfing" on their beloved creations. It's just safer if you like to avoid any risk of discord. Personally I'm far from such objections, I can understand them though. Reference in the mission is yet another, more clear case.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Rydygier

[serjames 357]

*Shouts* - Robalo... where fore art thou ?

This sounds right up your ASDG street.....

Big effort to backport existing mods to accept the adaption though. But worthy indeed.

Might be nice to combine some community agreed statistics in there too, i.e. ballistics values, real-world loads *shouts* Spartan... we need you too !

[Defunkt 431]

Might be nice to combine some community agreed statistics in there too, i.e. ballistics values, real-world loads *shouts* Spartan... we need you too !

This I would see as the better solution, an addon backed-up by in-depth research and a comprehensive implementation of every ammo/magazine type you're likely to run across that could be (*should* be) referenced by every new addon.

[serjames 357]

This I would see as the better solution, an addon backed-up by in-depth research and a comprehensive implementation of every ammo/magazine class you're likely to run across that could be (*should* be) referenced by every new addon.

Indeed, didn't Fallout 3 have such a thing ? Not sure I was too buisy getting eaten by mutants to really worry about which bullets I was using, but I'm pretty sure I read about some sort of Generic Master Ammo mod

[kklownboy 43]

Some mods just sux. Bad models, performance and redundant. Why waste time on suky mods. Sooo really there are only a few mods, and some ok popular mods that could use the "compatibility", and they are basically already going this rout.

[Tacti-Cool 10]

Some mods just sux. Bad models, performance and redundant. Why waste time on suky mods. Sooo really there are only a few mods, and some ok popular mods that could use the "compatibility", and they are basically already going this rout.

Why waste time on correct spelling and grammar?

What mod are you referring to that is already going this route. Because its news to me.

[miketim 20]

@serjames

Yes it did, called CALIBR

Anyways, shouldnt OPs post be moved to request thread?