Advanced Helicopter FDM Feedback

[RuecanOnRails 10]

The "input lag" while a little extreme I believe is part of the way they simulate control system effect and phase lag. Of course I could be completely wrong too.

Try the demo of x-plane, dcs huey, fsx, or other flight sims, they all simulate phase lag differently, but they generally results in delayed angular movement from control input.

I would like to see some G-Force induced head/camera movements when flying, a static model feels weird and out of place. A slight head movement during rolls could add a lot of immersion.

Edited August 15, 2014 by RuecanOnRails

[KeyCat 131]

Weird input delay you got there, is it still present when checking the customize controller window?

I checked it with a ps3 sixaxis controller and there's no noticeable input delay.

Maybe some other joystick owners can chime in on this one, do you experience this in other games too?

I mainly fly the xH-9 and I experience it as well, since I never flown a heli in real life I thought this was how things supposed to be. I aggree with BlackPixxel that it feels kind of wierd and makes flying harder. Maybe the delay is to long? Would be nice to hear you RL helicopter pilots as well as dev's comments about this one.

I fly with Thrustmaster HOTAS Cougar + pedals using the following sensitivity...

...
class Joystick1
{
	guid="8D3B88F0-B345-11E1-8001-444553540000";
	name="Thrustmaster HOTAS Cougar";
	offset=256;
	isXInput=0;
	sensitivity[]={-0.47757506,0.043056097,0.043056097,-1,-1,-1,-2.9802322e-007,-1,-0.47757506,0.043056097,0.043056097,-1,-1,-1,-2.9802322e-007,-1};
	deadZone[]={0,0,0,0,0,0,0.045684464,0};
	steepness[]={1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1};
	mode="Custom";
};
...

/KC

[worldsprayer 0]

Can you provide a link so that we may read your findings?

Here you go

https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/Helicopter_Flight_Model_Config_%28XML%29

[Henry Rollins 10]

I mainly fly the xH-9 and I experience it as well, since I never flown a heli in real life I thought this was how things supposed to be. I aggree with BlackPixxel that it feels kind of wierd and makes flying harder. Maybe the delay is to long? Would be nice to hear you RL helicopter pilots as well as dev's comments about this one.

I fly with Thrustmaster HOTAS Cougar + pedals using the following sensitivity...

...
class Joystick1
{
	guid="8D3B88F0-B345-11E1-8001-444553540000";
	name="Thrustmaster HOTAS Cougar";
	offset=256;
	isXInput=0;
	sensitivity[]={-0.47757506,0.043056097,0.043056097,-1,-1,-1,-2.9802322e-007,-1,-0.47757506,0.043056097,0.043056097,-1,-1,-1,-2.9802322e-007,-1};
	deadZone[]={0,0,0,0,0,0,0.045684464,0};
	steepness[]={1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1};
	mode="Custom";
};
...

/KC

I can tell you that it is unrealistic. The affect is called Gyroscopic Precession which is when a force is applied (cyclic input) the reaction occurs 90 degrees later. So think about how long it takes for a rotor blade to cover 90 degrees and that is the amount of lag you should feel when making cyclic inputs.

You all can test this by going from a hover into forward flight. Your helicopter if it's NATO should roll to the right (or to the left if it's a hellcat. This is called Transverse Flow Effect - as the helicopter accelerates into forward flight induced flow (downforce) drops to near 0 at the forward rotor disc area. This increases the angle of attack at the front rotor disc area causing the forward blade to flap up, and reduces the angle of attack at the aft rotor disc area causing the rotor blade to flap down. Because the rotor blade acts like a gyro (gyroscopic precession) maximum displacement occurs 90 degrees later in the direction of rotation. The result is a right roll as you accelerate past around 20 kts or right before ETL (effective translational lift).

[worldsprayer 0]

To whomever asked before about adjusting joystick sensitivity in game, if you go to edit the axis in the controller screen, there is a multiplier you can select if you click "show"...this will multiply the max sensitivity. I just upped mine to an amount that i can barely tap the joystick.

Oh and is anyone else missing engine sounds in the cockpit now?

[doveman 7]

Well, TOH really feels a bit smoother, there might be less delay. At least the TOH littlebird is much easier to fly than the A3 one. You just have to trimm the tailrotor, then it will hover steady, while you have to trimm nick and roll axis in A3 too.

I just finally gave up on TOH and deleted it (only paid a few quid for it and Hinds anyway), after giving it one last chance trying to land my helo in the career step "Easy Landing", with my Sidewinder FFB2 and Saitek Pro Flight pedals, which work great in DCS. I probably spent about an hour gently trying to nudge her backwards to stop forward flight, only to start going backwards and vice versa. I know there's meant to be a delay between moving the controls and the effect it has on the chopper's movement and was allowing for that but it was just ridiculous and more like piloting a large, heavy ship than a chopper!

[blackpixxel 53]

I can tell you that it is unrealistic. The affect is called Gyroscopic Precession which is when a force is applied (cyclic input) the reaction occurs 90 degrees later. So think about how long it takes for a rotor blade to cover 90 degrees and that is the amount of lag you should feel when making cyclic inputs.

You all can test this by going from a hover into forward flight. Your helicopter if it's NATO should roll to the right (or to the left if it's a hellcat. This is called Transverse Flow Effect - as the helicopter accelerates into forward flight induced flow (downforce) drops to near 0 at the forward rotor disc area. This increases the angle of attack at the front rotor disc area causing the forward blade to flap up, and reduces the angle of attack at the aft rotor disc area causing the rotor blade to flap down. Because the rotor blade acts like a gyro (gyroscopic precession) maximum displacement occurs 90 degrees later in the direction of rotation. The result is a right roll as you accelerate past around 20 kts or right before ETL (effective translational lift).

Now it gets interresting. I didn't know that this 90° delay is also there by real helicopters. I just know it from remote controlled ones. That means that the pilot would tilt the swashplate to the left to achieve a forward flight, right? (If the rotor is moving clockwise)

But this knowledge also allows us to calculate the "input lag". The MD 500 (civilian littlebird variant) has a main rotor rom of about 480 (source: http://www.aviastar.org/helicopters_eng/mcdonnel-500.php). This equals 8 rotations per second, which means that the rotor makes all in all 32 90° rotations per second. And that finally means that there should be a delay of 1/32 second, or 0.03125 seconds.

But 0.5s is waaaaay larger than 0.03125s .

In conclusion, the current Arma joystick delay has nothing to do with the gyroscopic precession you where talking about. It must be the built in joystick-smoothing-function, like somebody else said a few pages ago.

Fact is that it does not really help us, it just makes it a lot harder to controll the helicopter. The joystick delay has to go!

I hope that my calculations are right

[das attorney 857]

Re input lag:

It might be worth taking a look at this page (similar issue on FSX/IL-2)

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/421313-possible-solution-windows-8-and-81-joystick-solution-for-fsx-and-prepar3d/

Seems the issue can be caused by the device manager power savings (USB selective suspend settings)

Not sure it will help here but worth trying if you're having input lag.

[worldsprayer 0]

Thanks to the restart nt happening, autorotations are working GREAT now. I just knocked out a bunch in different helos. However, I found an odd situation with the PO-30. When the engine goes out in flight, unlike the other helos the PO-30 orca does its absolute dangist to roll left. I literally had my joystick all the way to the right trying to keep the aircraft level. The first time it went into a tumble so fast I couldnt see it and my computer crashed, likely from a physics fault. (Its anti-torque also needs to be reversed!) But the rest perform quite well. Im finding my control touch needs a very specific setting with my joystick, which is getting a lot of focus. I think thats a major problem for me, since flying a real helo and flying a joystick...requires very different handling of the device.

[blackpixxel 53]

Re input lag:

It might be worth taking a look at this page (similar issue on FSX/IL-2)

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/421313-possible-solution-windows-8-and-81-joystick-solution-for-fsx-and-prepar3d/

Seems the issue can be caused by the device manager power savings (USB selective suspend settings)

Not sure it will help here but worth trying if you're having input lag.

But as I wrote before, the pedals/sticks in the 3D cockpit don't have any delay. That means that everything is fine with the link between my joystick and Arma. It is something else in the game, not the hardware-

[gatordev 215]

I can tell you that it is unrealistic. The affect is called Gyroscopic Precession which is when a force is applied (cyclic input) the reaction occurs 90 degrees later. So think about how long it takes for a rotor blade to cover 90 degrees and that is the amount of lag you should feel when making cyclic inputs.

You all can test this by going from a hover into forward flight. Your helicopter if it's NATO should roll to the right (or to the left if it's a hellcat. This is called Transverse Flow Effect - as the helicopter accelerates into forward flight induced flow (downforce) drops to near 0 at the forward rotor disc area. This increases the angle of attack at the front rotor disc area causing the forward blade to flap up, and reduces the angle of attack at the aft rotor disc area causing the rotor blade to flap down. Because the rotor blade acts like a gyro (gyroscopic precession) maximum displacement occurs 90 degrees later in the direction of rotation. The result is a right roll as you accelerate past around 20 kts or right before ETL (effective translational lift).

All good stuff. Something for the Devs to take onboard, though, is that just because something is happening aerodynamically (like described above) doesn't necessarily mean the end user actually has to deal with it much. For the larger military aircraft, the systems take a lot of the aerodynamic reaction out. That's important for something like the Ghosthawk, but in a perfect world, shouldn't apply to the MD-500.

I guess the question is how much can Rotorlib flex? The answer may be "not much" and it may be up to the player to mess with settings, but something to consider. In a perfect world, if a player wanted to play with hardcore settings, the game should make it that he has to really dance on the pedals for the MD-500 when messing with power/collective. But if he hops in the Ghosthawk, then it's pretty much feet off the pedals (as far as input goes). I get the impression that Rotorlib doesn't quite have the flexibility as it's used, though. Correct?

[blu3sman 11]

I guess the question is how much can Rotorlib flex? The answer may be "not much" and it may be up to the player to mess with settings, but something to consider. In a perfect world, if a player wanted to play with hardcore settings, the game should make it that he has to really dance on the pedals for the MD-500 when messing with power/collective. But if he hops in the Ghosthawk, then it's pretty much feet off the pedals (as far as input goes). I get the impression that Rotorlib doesn't quite have the flexibility as it's used, though. Correct?

Here, read Control Systems section: https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/Helicopter_Flight_Model_Config_(XML)#Control_Systems

I can't say if it's possible to write some complex FCS. I tried to make basic mixer and it works fine.

BTW theres some amount of stability augmentation by default in all aircraft even without autotrim. This part:

latCyclic = latCyclic - clamp(rollRateRad * 0.7, -0.1 , 0.1 ),
lonCyclic = lonCyclic + clamp(pitchRateRad * 0.7, -0.1 , 0.1 ),
pedals = pedals + clamp(yawRateRad * 1, -0.2 , 0.2 ),

It takes angular velocities and converts them to control deflection (up to 10% for cyclic and 20% for pedals), and then substracts\adds them to input.

[gatordev 215]

Interesting. Thanks. Looks like there's at least a foundation for it to be messed with, which is good.

[seth0351 11]

So after a few flights here is my feedback for the new flight models

- There should be no yaw when the collective is full down, at that point the helicopter is in an auto-rotative state and not producing torque, thus no tail rotor input is needed.

- The helicopters with skid type gear should also do faster running landing/takeoffs, skids should also keep the helicopter moving in the direction of momentum as long as the skids are parallel with it

- The rotor RPM shouldn't decrease unless you're pulling too much pitch or nosing over in an auto rotation. Currently, a flare or a nose up maneuver will lower the RPM when it should spike it.

- I think Effective translational lift and ground effect should have much more of an effect than it does now.

- Main rotor Torque may be a bit much in the ghost hawk, you dont need full left pedal to compensate the MR with a tail rotor that big. Also, the Ghost hawk is unable to take off with orange ENG

I'm also a helicopter pilot so I maybe asking a bit much but whatever; the MD-540F is what the M/AH-9 are based off of and that thing is light and is powered by a 700shp engine, the helicopter has bawls even when its loaded with troops or munitions. All of the helicopters feel a bit anemic actually. The MD-500/OH-6 series is know for survivability, it would be nice if could be a bit more resistant to ground contact, or at least able to get a few orange components instead of red.

Thoughts?

[quickvenge 10]

Thanks to the restart nt happening, autorotations are working GREAT now. I just knocked out a bunch in different helos. However, I found an odd situation with the PO-30. When the engine goes out in flight, unlike the other helos the PO-30 orca does its absolute dangist to roll left. I literally had my joystick all the way to the right trying to keep the aircraft level. The first time it went into a tumble so fast I couldnt see it and my computer crashed, likely from a physics fault. (Its anti-torque also needs to be reversed!) But the rest perform quite well. Im finding my control touch needs a very specific setting with my joystick, which is getting a lot of focus. I think thats a major problem for me, since flying a real helo and flying a joystick...requires very different handling of the device.

The Orca rolls left anytime you drop the collective. You increase the collective it rolls right. It behaves as the rotor, or CG is off laterally.

I am actually thinking the CG being off may be the cause of a number of weird unexplained behavior rolling/pitching and translating tendency on a number of helicopters in hover.

Are you sure about the anti-torque being in the wrong direction in the Orca? It's main rotor spins clockwise. I have to input right pedal at hover though very slight. Though the input of anti-torque is all over the place on the helicopter depending on collective setting.

[b00ce 160]

So after a few flights here is my feedback for the new flight models

- There should be no yaw when the collective is full down, at that point the helicopter is in an auto-rotative state and not producing torque, thus no tail rotor input is needed.

- The helicopters with skid type gear should also do faster running landing/takeoffs, skids should also keep the helicopter moving in the direction of momentum as long as the skids are parallel with it

- The rotor RPM shouldn't decrease unless you're pulling too much pitch or nosing over in an auto rotation. Currently, a flare or a nose up maneuver will lower the RPM when it should spike it.

- I think Effective translational lift and ground effect should have much more of an effect than it does now.

- Main rotor Torque may be a bit much in the ghost hawk, you dont need full left pedal to compensate the MR with a tail rotor that big. Also, the Ghost hawk is unable to take off with orange ENG

- Full down collective should require right pedal to keep it straight, counteracting the tail fin

-Agreed

-If you are sitting on the ground, cyclic forward and aft bleed rotor RPM, which is no bueno

-Again, agreed

-Perhaps orange engine is the aircraft with an engine out. The blackhawk, usually, does not have single engine hover capability. At least mine don't. ;)

[quickvenge 10]

Now something for you real life UH-60 drivers to ponder. I was trying to figure out why the Ghosthawk rolls left during hover. Part of it seems like the neutral stick position is off. Even in straight line flight it rolled left. I can trim that effect out and in forward flight that left roll goes away. But in hover it always wanted to roll left requiring right cyclic. I also noticed applying more left pedal induced more left roll. Then I noticed something. The tail rotor is canted opposite from a real UH-60. If they actually applied that angle to the model, won't it roll left like it does?

[worldsprayer 0]

The Orca rolls left anytime you drop the collective. You increase the collective it rolls right. It behaves as the rotor, or CG is off laterally.

I am actually thinking the CG being off may be the cause of a number of weird unexplained behavior rolling/pitching and translating tendency on a number of helicopters in hover.

Are you sure about the anti-torque being in the wrong direction in the Orca? It's main rotor spins clockwise. I have to input right pedal at hover though very slight. Though the input of anti-torque is all over the place on the helicopter depending on collective setting.

just rechecked...I was definitely wrong...not sure how I wound up thinking that was the case regarding the anti-torque.

---------- Post added at 08:05 ---------- Previous post was at 07:59 ----------

The rolling of the ghosthawk has been brought up. There is something wrong with the aircraft, as real helos are designed to be as stable as possible, not leaning like that. And that canting of the tail rotor in real life is for CG (center if gravity) reasons. Since the TR is on such a long lever arm, just a little upwards force (relatively speaking) results in much more actual toque, which means the aircraft is allowed to have more weight aft (usually in the form of troops or fuel). You would get lateral translation (as with all tail rotors) and some pitch effect combined because of it, but it wouldn't create a rolling motion. The would require either an offset CG to the side, or a vertical thrust to the left or the right (think of those helos from the movie pandora!)

---------- Post added at 08:07 ---------- Previous post was at 08:05 ----------

- Full down collective should require right pedal to keep it straight, counteracting the tail fin

-Agreed

-If you are sitting on the ground, cyclic forward and aft bleed rotor RPM, which is no bueno

-Again, agreed

-Perhaps orange engine is the aircraft with an engine out. The blackhawk, usually, does not have single engine hover capability. At least mine don't. ;)

Nor does the apache...on a very good day at sea level I hover around 69% DE. I frankly would love to see single engine failure capability in this game *drools*

[cochise 10]

The roll to the left is from the advancing blades (when viewed from above) being on the right half of the rotor disk, the retreating blades being on the left. The right hand half of the disk will produce more lift causing the AC to roll left. Assuming this is a helicopter with counter clockwise rotating blades. This will have to be counteracted by a right cyclic input.

Not sure about the hover...

[worldsprayer 0]

The roll to the left is from the advancing blades (when viewed from above) being on the right half of the rotor disk, the retreating blades being on the left. The right hand half of the disk will produce more lift causing the AC to roll left. Assuming this is a helicopter with counter clockwise rotating blades. This will have to be counteracted by a right cyclic input.

Not sure about the hover...

I assume you're talking about the ghosthawk, but dis-symmetry of lift as you're discussing is not a factor except at extreme airspeeds by all modern helicopters due to flapping and cyclic feathering now. That was a problem fairly quickly defeated in the helicopter development world. Since the thing rolls to the left in game no matter what your airspeed is, I'm willing to say there is an incorrect value in something somewhere, since it's fairly obvious now that BI is NOT simulating air or anything related to it, but rather simply attempting to mimic the effects of helo flight. This can be seen by flying a modded aircraft in the engine...it doesnt see the advanced flight changes. It'd be nice if it was a universal system, but all it is is variables tacked onto the aircraft that are watching speeds and directions and trying to make input based on what it sees. That means every aircraft has to be edited individually instead of changing an overlaying system.

[nodunit 397]

Wouldn't each aircraft have to be edited individually anyway considering their weight and handling?

[seth0351 11]

- Full down collective should require right pedal to keep it straight, counteracting the tail fin

-If you are sitting on the ground, cyclic forward and aft bleed rotor RPM, which is no bueno

-Perhaps orange engine is the aircraft with an engine out. The blackhawk, usually, does not have single engine hover capability. At least mine don't. ;)

I haven't heard of requiring right pedal to compensate for a tail fin, I know right pedal is needed during the entry of an auto, but shouldn't the tail fin keep the helicopter relatively straight in the direction of movement? I don't know if its just a characteristic of the UH-60 or what. What my biggest complaint would be is say your engines are red, you enter and auto and when you go to cushion (up collective) there is simulated torque which then flips right and you roll *boom*. And of course your tail rotor isn't very effective at this point because its probably gone.

With the RPM decay/gain I was talking more about in flight, especially during autos. What I would like to see is a flare generate rotor RPM for cushioning the landing, I know there is something like that now, but not enough in my opinion.

And now that I think about the bigger helicopters should have heavy inertia rotor systems right? The RPM may fluctuate a bit much during low power settings.

And last, could the UH-60 do a rolling takeoff? Thats what I was attempting, and failing at. Mostly because *boom*

[gatordev 215]

The roll to the left is from the advancing blades (when viewed from above) being on the right half of the rotor disk, the retreating blades being on the left. The right hand half of the disk will produce more lift causing the AC to roll left. Assuming this is a helicopter with counter clockwise rotating blades. This will have to be counteracted by a right cyclic input.

Not sure about the hover...

For a hover, this is not correct. Picking up in a hover in a -60 requires a "J" motion on the cyclic, which ends up giving the helo a left input to counter the right roll (and an aft input to counter the 2.5% lift generated by the tail rotor).

I haven't heard of requiring right pedal to compensate for a tail fin, I know right pedal is needed during the entry of an auto, but shouldn't the tail fin keep the helicopter relatively straight in the direction of movement? I don't know if its just a characteristic of the UH-60 or what. What my biggest complaint would be is say your engines are red, you enter and auto and when you go to cushion (up collective) there is simulated torque which then flips right and you roll *boom*. And of course your tail rotor isn't very effective at this point because its probably gone.

The -60 has a built in electric trim function that programs in right pedal to counter the aerodynamic force of the camber of the tail fin. I'm thinking that's what booce is talking about. As for the right roll, I wouldn't doubt it's over-exaggerated in-game, but that's not abnormal for the -60. Recovery does require right stick for drift.

With the RPM decay/gain I was talking more about in flight, especially during autos. What I would like to see is a flare generate rotor RPM for cushioning the landing, I know there is something like that now, but not enough in my opinion.

And now that I think about the bigger helicopters should have heavy inertia rotor systems right? The RPM may fluctuate a bit much during low power settings.

The -60 (and it's family) have a low-inertia rotor head, so turns drop fast. You actually don't want Nr to build too much since it increases your rate of descent which causes you to need more "oomph" at the bottom to arrest vertical energy...something the low energy head may not have. But I agree, Nr should spike like crazy in a flare/large nose up attitude.

And last, could the UH-60 do a rolling takeoff? Thats what I was attempting, and failing at. Mostly because *boom*

Yes, I used to screw around doing single-engine "running" takeoffs in the -60B, which is usually a bit heavier than the conventional Army variants (and probably not much lighter than a 160th variant). You can trundle down the runway for a couple of tens of feet and then it will get up into ground effect and be on its way. With a heavier bird, (like my current ride) it will obviously take a little longer, but it's certainly possible.

---------- Post added at 16:51 ---------- Previous post was at 16:49 ----------

Nor does the apache...on a very good day at sea level I hover around 69% DE. I frankly would love to see single engine failure capability in this game *drools*

That's downright luxury. Try 90% HIGE.

No doubt the upgraded engines (and I'm guessing blades) help with that in your case.

[seth0351 11]

The -60 (and it's family) have a low-inertia rotor head, so turns drop fast. You actually don't want Nr to build too much since it increases your rate of descent which causes you to need more "oomph" at the bottom to arrest vertical energy...something the low energy head may not have. But I agree, Nr should spike like crazy in a flare/large nose up attitude.

Yes, I used to screw around doing single-engine "running" takeoffs in the -60B, which is usually a bit heavier than the conventional Army variants (and probably not much lighter than a 160th variant). You can trundle down the runway for a couple of tens of feet and then it will get up into ground effect and be on its way. With a heavier bird, (like my current ride) it will obviously take a little longer, but it's certainly possible.

---------- Post added at 16:51 ---------- Previous post was at 16:49 ----------

That's downright luxury. Try 90% HIGE.

No doubt the upgraded engines (and I'm guessing blades) help with that in your case.

Alright all you mil guys make me jealous. All I've got is 145HP recip in a 1200lb bird. All your fancy electronics and what not. Anyway, the birds in arma 3 should all have some type of FADEC or govenor right? All up unitll the engine is tapped out (pull to much collective) or you auto. I know the RR M250 in the MD540F has FADEC, so the RPM should always be right where it should until there is an engine failure or you over pull. Right?

I'm gonna go try to get the ghost hawk to take off while eng are orange

[worldsprayer 0]

For a hover, this is not correct. Picking up in a hover in a -60 requires a "J" motion on the cyclic, which ends up giving the helo a left input to counter the right roll (and an aft input to counter the 2.5% lift generated by the tail rotor).

The -60 has a built in electric trim function that programs in right pedal to counter the aerodynamic force of the camber of the tail fin. I'm thinking that's what booce is talking about. As for the right roll, I wouldn't doubt it's over-exaggerated in-game, but that's not abnormal for the -60. Recovery does require right stick for drift.

The -60 (and it's family) have a low-inertia rotor head, so turns drop fast. You actually don't want Nr to build too much since it increases your rate of descent which causes you to need more "oomph" at the bottom to arrest vertical energy...something the low energy head may not have. But I agree, Nr should spike like crazy in a flare/large nose up attitude.

Yes, I used to screw around doing single-engine "running" takeoffs in the -60B, which is usually a bit heavier than the conventional Army variants (and probably not much lighter than a 160th variant). You can trundle down the runway for a couple of tens of feet and then it will get up into ground effect and be on its way. With a heavier bird, (like my current ride) it will obviously take a little longer, but it's certainly possible.

---------- Post added at 16:51 ---------- Previous post was at 16:49 ----------

That's downright luxury. Try 90% HIGE.

No doubt the upgraded engines (and I'm guessing blades) help with that in your case.

Good god what do you fly? I've 60 K/L/M friends who don't hover that high, my 47 friends laugh at our hover requirements...only thing I know of so power limited these days are -58s.

---------- Post added at 10:21 ---------- Previous post was at 10:20 ----------

Alright all you mil guys make me jealous. All I've got is 145HP recip in a 1200lb bird. All your fancy electronics and what not. Anyway, the birds in arma 3 should all have some type of FADEC or govenor right? All up unitll the engine is tapped out (pull to much collective) or you auto. I know the RR M250 in the MD540F has FADEC, so the RPM should always be right where it should until there is an engine failure or you over pull. Right?

I'm gonna go try to get the ghost hawk to take off while eng are orange

Since this game is simulating 20 years of advanced technology...frankly it wouldnt be to ofar off to say those aircraft should be screaming with fancy electronics to make things easy.