Israel General

[mistyronin 1181]

[shay_gman 272]

As said before I feel sorry for lose of civlians but of course for a journalist it looks bad but judging by the eyes of a military man the IDF is super humanitarian.

Don't believe me see Col. Richard Kemp who was the UK's forces commander in Afghanistan:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOKAL_Y3xYY&feature=youtu.be

BTW you don't have a clue what Jihad means

This is Jihad and who do you think they will come after? or are you like europe in the late 1930s saying that "They are just taking" "They only took Poland they won't take the rest of europe"?

This is a wakeup call

You would think this picture of guys holding the Jihad (Daash) country from the video to be taken in Iraq or Gaza but this is from Bradford UK

[mistyronin 1181]

You would think this picture of guys holding the Jihad (Daash) country from the video to be taken in Iraq or Gaza but this is from Bradford UK

http://static3.demotix.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/a_scale_large/1400-2/photos/1348861089-peaceful-protest-against-antiislamic-film-in-bradford_1485082.jpg

If your solution is that EU / US copy the same strategy as the IDF in Gaza... blowing up their houses, shooting hospitals, UN camps, etc. killing hundreds of civilians...

Well something like that ( more moderate though ) has been before in Iraq and Afghanistan, and it worked really well... Nowadays these countries are ones of the most peaceful on earth. There are no more terrorists training camps there ( remember the attacks of the 11M in Madrid or July 7th in London, etc ).

And now we all live more relaxed ( levels of terrorist alert ), the security measures have decreased ( extended security checks in airports and now in trains ). We have more privacy ( NSA, drones, etc. ).

With the actual IDF system, you have more civilians dead, live long injuries, mental illness and more... and what's the product of all that: You got motivate more people to fight against Israel and commit all kinds of suicide attacks ( as they have already lost all their belongings and family ), etc. You even attract foreigners to fight and support the fight against Israel. In fact the Hamas support inside Gaza has increased.

So the IDF strategy is a total success. Bravo!

Edited August 11, 2014 by MistyRonin

[cozza 24]

yeps. looks super humanitarian to me. Writing that on the walls of a girls high school in gaza.

[froggyluv 2136]

@shay_gman: yes, we know there are Jihadists in the world and that they would like nothing more than to align there cause with Palestinian militants who want an end the occupation. We also know that Israel Gov't loves to lump all Palestinian militants in with Jihadists. Would be similar if the U.S was occupied and the freedom fighters were lumped in with Far Right Christian militas who want to bring about apocolypse to bring back the mighty carpenter.

[shay_gman 272]

@MR all I hear is blah blah blah IDF is shooting UN camps, hospitals and more blah blah - as I said before i'm not arguing with you as you are one sided and very narrow and all you do is flaming this war by posting false info as still none can prove the IDF broke any Geneva laws and as mentions above and as been posted above by Col. Richard Kemp who was the UK's forces commander in Afghanistan the IDF is one of the most humanitarian army in the world.

If I wan't clear before - I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST ISLAM - I have against extremist and the call for Jihad. I have against terror and excuse me it is ok to immegrant to another country to have a chance for better life it is not ok to bring your old country to the new one and start forcing my old way of living in my new country as if i'll hospital someone in my house and I'm a non-smoker I would not appreciate if he will just light a cigarette in the living area.

I still remember Bradford in flames, and the riots in Paris for 3 days. There is peace and low level of security because you are afraid - very afraid to say or do anything that will upset anyone.

You are trying to make peace with Iran, peace with North Korea and now peace with the Jihad - you think the live and let live policy is working in this side of the globe.

Well I have news for you - it ain't tell that to the Yazids - they only wanted to live in peace http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/10/us-iraq-security-yazidis-killings-idUSKBN0GA0FF20140810

Remember this picture bellow this is the most shameful picture in the history of the world.

The Munich Agreement in September 1938 just a year before the outbreak of WW2 Czechoslovak was given to Hitler (without of course and represent of Czechoslovak actually in the meeting) in exchange for a promise of no further territorial demand, a month later he was already in Hungry. I thought europe has learned it lesson but it didn't.

You think you can reason with ideology that call for the extermination to all that who are not muslims (Jihad)?! You think you can reason with people that celebrate their child's death if he blew himself up taking some infidels with him?!

You are so wrong, so poorly understand what you are dealing with.

http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080427113322/althistory/images/b/b9/Munich_Agreement.PNG (112 kB)

http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/infocus/gaza080714/s_g09_53215390.jpg

yeps. looks super humanitarian to me. Writing that on the walls of a girls high school in gaza.

OMG the IDF wrote on a chalkboard?! someone call the police...

@shay_gman: yes, we know there are Jihadists in the world and that they would like nothing more than to align there cause with Palestinian militants who want an end the occupation. We also know that Israel Gov't loves to lump all Palestinian militants in with Jihadists. Would be similar if the U.S was occupied and the freedom fighters were lumped in with Far Right Christian militas who want to bring about apocolypse to bring back the mighty carpenter.

I agree with you the PLO or the West Bank - have a legitimate demand to have a country and I support that. I'm not saying all muslims are terrorists god forbid or all muslims are extremist but you can't take side with the ones that are.

In the West Bank Israel should make a truly independent country for the Palestinians (if the can stay away from terror) I don't think any nation should be occupy by another and all should strive for a place they can call homeland. Just leave Hamas out as this is Jihadist terror organization.

BTW what Israel is trying to do now with Egypt is giving Mahmoud Abbas the legit prime minster of Palestine the control over Gaza - for some reason the Hamas don't want to - you have idea why?

BTW2 you do no that there is no occupation by Israel at all atm not in Gaza since 2005 right?

Edited August 11, 2014 by shay_gman

[mistyronin 1181]

shay but what are you talking?

No one has defended Hamas in this thread nor any Islamic extremist group, and no one has said that Israel has no right to self-defense ( at least I have not ).

People, Govs, UN, me, complain because of the atrocities the IDF commit, are proven and I have already gave you data, some of it from the same IDF or former IDF combatants, also UN, US Gov one, etc. Also the images are quite explicit too; and it's hard to believe that all the world's media is in a conspiracy against the IDF.

It's nothing about sides, in any case my side is the civilians one ( no matter if from Israel, Palestine, Jews, Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, whatever ). And it's clear by far who is the main enemy of the civilians. In fact in my broad family you can find members of all those religions ( my core/close family could be considered Catholic as my parents are ).

I understand that your point of view is highly biased, as you are part in the conflict. But a bit of auto critic would help a lot to understand the situation, specially if your aim is to find solutions.

But justify the mass murder and war crimes just make things worst, and weakens whatever cause you have.

---------- Post added at 21:42 ---------- Previous post was at 21:24 ----------

Col. Richard Kemp who was the UK's forces commander in Afghanistan the IDF is one of the most humanitarian army in the world.

The former British colonel Richard Kemp is known for his blind pro-Israel position, he has been paid by Israel organizations to give speeches around the world of how good is Israel.

BTW he himself acknowledged that he has never been in Gaza.

But let's just hear his words:

[vilas 477]

Israeli gov. has a lot of sins, a lot of frauds (examples: giving shelter to communist criminals, who were of Jewish ethnic roots, many Jewish criminals who were in Stalin administration escaped to Israel cause 40% of NKVD, UB officers were Jews, example 2 : Israel demands from Poland to pay for... what Germans made, Jews see nothing wrong in it, it is like you went on holiday, someone broke into your house by breaking doors , than he kidnapped girl on the street and rape here - according to Jewish logic - you are responsible for that rape and you should pay compensation too, whole world should pay compensation, maybe guy who made doors in your home too)

but Jihad is 1000000 worse,

enemy of your enemy is your friend , in this war, when Israel will fall, than European values (such as sexual freedom, alcohol, short skirts and any wear style, any food , any music, secular state that respect traditions) will fall, you will have ISIS and Sharia in EU, already in few cities of West some Muslims demanded ban of Christmass tree, we have it already in the west,

Jihad, Sharia, Islamist terror is 10000 times worse than any stuff made by Israel, Israel allow to eat what you want, Israel allow wine and beer, Israel allow porno, Israel allow heavy metal (i read some Muslim forums, they said that music and dance is worse than alcohol and drugs, and music should be forbidden) , they don't kill gay, they don't burn face by acid for taking selfie, they dont behead or stone to death for taking photo of face etc.

Hamas doesnt want peace, Hamas doesnt want good life for Palestinians, Hamas wants violence and make others die in the name of religion (local Muslims moan about Hamas setting rocket launcher near their homes)

Edited August 12, 2014 by vilas

[shay_gman 272]

Vilas

I agree that Israeli gov did some wrong decisions but regarding your examples:

1. Giving shelters - I don't know what are you talking about in particular but after the fall of the Glasnost in USSR a lot of Jewish or claimed to be Jewish escaped to Israel some of them later to be found were not Jewish and even criminals but this has been done in a hurry and unfortunately we are stuck with some of them. So if you are talking about this then yeah I agree this is a bad decision made by Israel government.

2. Regarding the pensions that Poland is paying to war veterans and victims of Nazi Germany. I've read all over the web since last night when you opened my eyes about it and I can come to some conclusion:

First, no one forced Poland to give pensions – it was voluntary act by Poland government.

Second, this apply to all the citizens of the world not only Jewish or Israelis quote Sebastian Rejak, the Polish foreign minister

"For example, a soldier of the Red Army who, during his march westward in World War II, stopped in Poland and married a Polish citizen, leaving the country after the war, can apply for the pension. “And if a child was born outside of Poland in the Soviet Union,†Rejak said, “that child never got Polish citizenship but suffered as a child of a Polish family in the Soviet Union – that child, who is now a grown-up, is eligible to apply for that status of war veteran or oppressed person. His parents might be long gone, he never ever had Polish citizenship, but he can still apply.â€

So please don't blame Israel for number 2. I agree with you that if the suffering made by German Nazi there is no sense that Poland will pay but I'm not master in foreign laws.

Regarding the rest I totally agree if you care about the citizens do not condemn Israel but Hamas for profiteering their civilians and provoke Israel into a war and then refuse to stop it.

The condemned of Israel only provoke Hamas to keep on shooting missiles from civilian area and hospitals and keep on letting their civilians to be dragged into a war zone to get more support.

This is what terror organization does.

And if you haven't understand it yet there is an outgoing war not just in Israel between West and East between freedom and Prohibition, between the way of life that we as westerns offspring's fought for since the French revolution: Freedom of speak, freedom to work, freedom of religious, freedom to men and women.

This is Tel-Aviv:

This is Caliphate of Islam

Now choose how you want to live your life.

I'm signing out enough said.

With hope for peace and love between nations and neighbors a like.

[vilas 477]

i was talking about some officers that were ordering tortures , which after fall of communism escaped to Israel, they were actual Jews , but it is not only Israel, also it is Sweden, who keep criminals cause "their crimes are deceased" (you have example of Breivik, he get funny 20 years , while in our law you HUNT murdered for 30 years, in Sweden they decent it in 10 year or like this, and someone who committed crimes in 50s for Swedish law is "innocent", so of course it is NOT ONLY Israel, but also Sweden ) in case of Israel also some economical criminals are kept because they had double passport - they had Polish passport and Israeli, they committed crime in Poland, and Israel refuse extradition (some fake banks from 90s, when some guys cheated people on wanna-be bank companies )

so i was not talking about USSR criminals but even our criminals who escape to Israel cheating they escape "before antisemitism" while they escape before justice,

half of people i talk about now are dead, there is 25 years since comunism fallen, but this sits inside a lot of people when they know, someone who killed their family lived till last day in peace, without any revenge and prison (not only Jewish religion believe that "eye for an eye" is just, i do belive in it too ;) )

maybe in 90s people in Israel had no idea whom they hidden before courts of Poland, but several worst communism agents, who were torturing people in 40s, in 50s, lived till their death in Israel after 1989

as Israel hunts 90 years old SS-men, i wish to hunt communist officers even if they are 90 and on wheelchair , just like you do (good for you, bravo) with SS-men, cause for us there is no difference if it was SS uniform, or UB (Polish security service 1945-1956) uniform, if someone commited crime, there should be no place on this planet he can hide and no stupid "20 years passed so all is okay" like in Scandinavia (they are really sick to treat criminals like usual honest men) , when killer who killed 70 people gets funny 20 years

This is Tel-Aviv:

girl, ass, boobs, girl, ass , boobs

Edited August 12, 2014 by vilas

[Bee8190 10]

That individual is so full of shit and that I can only assume the peoples applause is for his performance as an actor

[vilas 477]

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/234983796-how-haram-is-music/page-4

how sinful and bad is listening to music

i can find 1000 links of when Muslim husband killed wife for not-Sharia food or for taking photo, i can find links to 100 women faces burned by acid

this man say to destroy democracy to force people obey Sharia and that women cannot dress the way they want

[mistyronin 1181]

And if you haven't understand it yet there is an outgoing war not just in Israel between West and East between freedom and Prohibition, between the way of life that we as westerns offspring's fought for since the French revolution: Freedom of speak, freedom to work, freedom of religious, freedom to men and women.

It's an interesting argument, Israel as the frontline paladin of the western ideals. :rolleyes:

Specially seeing how Israel apply and respects that ideals in Palestine.

Most likely the kids that have mistakenly killed in Gaza were innocents but do their uncle, or father might have been Hamas members? Did their mother or brother voted for Hamas? Civilians are part of war this days as ever and they pay the price. We don't want to kill civilians but it happens and it sad I wish I could say the same about Hamas.

[froggyluv 2136]

@Shay_gman: Are you serious with those videos? "Which would you pick to live".....gimme a break. Alls that was missing for the Israeli way of life was the free pizza. And again you use ISIS as the alternative to the frat boy life rather than a Palestinian faction -what Hamas wasn't bad enough so you had to go full on fanatic!? One could easily show some idyllic life in Dubai contrasted with those nasty, diabolical IDF busting 16yo heads while protecting the bearded, fanatical settlers in a nasty, dusty landscape...

@Vilas: True that it's a shame many Muslims in that region still live by tribal like, cut your head for a sin ideology. A very cool caribbean Rabbi once told me that Islam is just now going thru what Christianity went thru a 1000 years ago. Theres a muslim community near my neighborhood and they don't live in that tribal way at all and actually get along well with their Hassidic neighbors.

[katipo66 94]

It's a bit of a sick joke when the IDF are slaughtering women and children.

[shay_gman 272]

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/234983796-how-haram-is-music/page-4

how sinful and bad is listening to music

i can find 1000 links of when Muslim husband killed wife for not-Sharia food or for taking photo, i can find links to 100 women faces burned by acid

this man say to destroy democracy to force people obey Sharia and that women cannot dress the way they want

Yeah but they only want peace and love don't they?!

The funny part is that this guy, salafi Abu Mounisa, is preaching from UK and is calling for the destroying the democracy that the british people fought for hundreds of year, while this guy still have the accent of his origin land.

While europe has lost its nationality by going into the EU the muslim immigrants nationality is raising, already public schools in UK are providing Halal food, and in Norway muslims extremist demand breakaway Islamic nation or another 9/11 threatened.

This is the real problem, and I can't understand the hypocrisy of the so called liberals that support them: how can you support a group that called for the destruction of democracy, a group that threat women as object, allowing them to hit them, abuse them and kill them if god forbid they will shame the male. How can you support a group that have zero freedom of speech when it comes to them and their religion (remember

carton).

If you are real liberal and care about civilians, care about your civilians and their rights for freedom, liberty, equality, democracy and the religion's oppression or as Bee well quoted MLK "fight for liberty!"

Now back to the topic about the Geneva rules and excessive use of force by IDF.

The basic thing in a contract is the agreement of both sides to the obligations and rights of each side. Now I don't remember Hamas ever signed the Geneva conventions rules, and if they did they should have been judge for terror activity for at least 10 years of shooting rockets into civilians areas.

So if the agreement is one side why would this one side take on himself obligations that the other side do not respect?

Now if you are saying we don't care about Hamas we care about the civilians in Gaza or that Hamas is not a country but a terror group and the civilians are just hostage there, let me remind you that Hamas is the government that the civilians in Gaza have chosen in 2005.

So if i've voted for my government and my government decided to start shooting rockets on much stronger country let's say Russia and does not stop even when offered cease fire by Russia then I should blame my country for Russia bombing the hell out of me.

@Shay_gman: Are you serious with those videos? "Which would you pick to live".....gimme a break. Alls that was missing for the Israeli way of life was the free pizza. And again you use ISIS as the alternative to the frat boy life rather than a Palestinian faction -what Hamas wasn't bad enough so you had to go full on fanatic!? One could easily show some idyllic life in Dubai contrasted with those nasty, diabolical IDF busting 16yo heads while protecting the bearded, fanatical settlers in a nasty, dusty landscape...

First, know the facts: There are no settlers in Gaza - we left in 2005. Because we believed the world that if we'll leave them peace will come- we got rockets instead. Just like in munich agreement you thoughts that if you just give Czechoslovakia you can avoid war with an ideology that call to extermination of all that are not them.

Second: yeah send me the video of Dubai native women dance in bikini top... not tourists.

We are in war with extremist a war that will eventually come to your door step in europe or US, as you can see now with ISIS is just the beginning the amount of weapons and unconventional weapons left behind will impact europe and US and US is already in this mud - so far just from the air but we were just attacking from the air in Gaza just last month... so lets just wait and see.

You are failing to see the big picture.... but time will tell.

Edited August 12, 2014 by shay_gman

[mistyronin 1181]

Shay change the Muslims in your monologues for Jews or Communists and you got a similar point as a short Austrian guy with funny mustache a few years ago.

He also thought that was fighting as a paladin of the Western world, and that all Europe & the US should join him in his crusade.

[shay_gman 272]

Shay change the Muslims in your monologues for Jews or Communists and you got a similar point as a short Austrian guy with funny mustache a few years ago.

He also thought that was fighting as a paladin of the Western world, and that all Europe & the US should join him in his crusade.

As never Israel called for the death of any nation or individual although we are surrounded but enemies that call for our death - never Israel called for the obliteration of another nation.

In Israel all religions are equal, muslims, jews and christians live together in peace.

Israel did never called for the expending of its territory, the other way around Israel just gave and gave and gave territory for the promise of peace.

Israel is democracy with equal rights for all.

Thouse who calls for a state without any religion but Islam, those who call to ban the internet, the democracy, those who call for murder, for death - that is racist.

Go and help your Christian's brother in Iraq as they are getting slaughtered before you aid the Palestinian why when it comes to Israel we are on the center of the new?!

You should ask yourself that

Edited August 12, 2014 by shay_gman

[mistyronin 1181]

BTW not from dubai but, Haifa Wehbe, a Shia Muslim girl from Lebanon:

[shay_gman 272]

@MR you really don't know nothing about arabs or muslims.

First lebanon is very liberal thanks to large amount of christians in there. TBH lebanon look and feel a lot like Israel too bad Syria is controlling them through the Hizbala.

Second, Shia is not Sunni.

ISIS, Hamas, the Muslims brothers are all Sunni - they call for obliteration of Shias for them Shias or Christians are the same.

Go and study before you post more hate.

http://www.hrw.org/news/2014/07/19/iraq-isis-abducting-killing-expelling-minorities

BTW I'm sorry to spoil it for you but Israel beauty queen for 1999, Renne Rasslan is Shia muslim arab from Haifa - yeah we are very racist as you can see

Edited August 12, 2014 by shay_gman

[froggyluv 2136]

First, know the facts: There are no settlers in Gaza - we left in 2005. Because we believed the world that if we'll leave them peace will come- we got rockets instead. Just like in munich agreement you thoughts that if you just give Czechoslovakia you can avoid war with an ideology that call to extermination of all that are not them.

Second: yeah send me the video of Dubai native women dance in bikini top... not tourists.

We are in war with extremist a war that will eventually come to your door step in europe or US, as you can see now with ISIS is just the beginning the amount of weapons and unconventional weapons left behind will impact europe and US and US is already in this mud - so far just from the air but we were just attacking from the air in Gaza just last month... so lets just wait and see.

You are failing to see the big picture.... but time will tell.

1.Your comparison was between Israeli party life and Syrian ISIS, not Gaza -how am I at fault for drawing in the settler issue that is very real in the West Bank and Jerusalem? Speaking of which Israel loves to say how Gaza should be more like the West Bank and Fatah, the former PLO group who once also held the same beliefs as Hamas -destroy Israel. How has the better behave Fatah and citizens been rewarded for being more civilized? More settlers encroching on their land with IDF support? Real talks of a two state solution?

2. I didnt realize dancing bimbos in bikini was the pinnacle of achieved Democracy? I said idyllic not Girls Gone Wild. Maybe Im old but theres a difference.

3. "They're coming for you!!". :rolleyes:

Who? Hamas? Or have you yet again muddled them in with the global jihadists. Ya see, thats why I don't take Israeli politicians seriously. Since 911, they've bent over backwards trying to tie their occupation problem to global jihadists saying "See!! This is what we are dealing with!!", yet somehow forgetting that they have created their own problem. That these militants aren't interested in world caliphate but just some land, water and self government. Yeah we Americans already got fooled by that "They've got turbans! Attack!" -it was called the Iraq War. We ain't having it again..

[mistyronin 1181]

@MR you really don't know nothing about arabs or muslims.

That's really funny because that video was suggested by one of my Sunni Iraqi friends when I asked about cute arab singers.

ISIS, Hamas, the Muslims brothers are all Sunni - they call for obliteration of Shias for them Shias or Christians are the same.

Go and study before you post more hate.

But I'll tell him that he doesn't know anything about Arabs and Muslims. And that the should go and study about them... LOL :rolleyes:

[shay_gman 272]

@MR

Yeah you should do a study group together and learn why I put the Hamas, muslim brothers, al-qaida, Daash and the ISIS in one hand and the rest of the muslims in the other hand.

I'm no racist I have more then one arabs friends, I live in a mix city - this extremist Jihad is not good for anyone not for the muslims and not for anyone else.

@froggy

Guess you haven't read my previous posts- if this is about occupation - then yeah the Palestinians should have a land, now days Israel is willing for peace we just want to make sure that we can live side by side before we make strategic errors. We want to give land to the Palestinians we want to live side by side and I can assure you i'll be more then happy to live on half the land Israel now if I could not send my kid to the army and I could travel all around without roadblock or the care for my life.

Regarding global jihad - we made our own problems and we'll solve them please do not interfere that is all we asking. as apparently the rest of the world have no clue about how to handle this side of the globe.

Thanks to the war on Iraq we now have nuclear iran and the ISIS (Iraq was the enemy of Iran, now that its gone Iran can become again the bully around) Thanks to you the Arab Spring came and we have 150,000 civilians death in Syria and counting, 25,000 deaths in Libya, almost another country lost to Jihad (Egypt), over 170,000 civilians killed in Iraq, over 150,000 in Afghanistan and what have you achieved? global instability.

All i'm saying - is leave us alone - we will not massacre the Palestinians as you think - for god sake we are democratic country that throw away prime misters for much less then that, don't judge us as you judge it with western eyes that have no clue whats going on. The aboured is that most of the Islamic countries are not even go against Israel as much as europe do - hell even Egypt who was the Palestinians shield blame Hamas - so my point

stay out of it.

[froggyluv 2136]

Your telling me the current ruling Gov't in Israel honestly wants a two state solution? Yes previous administration have but not this one. The settlers will not stop until all Palestinian aggression ceases yet it appears to the rest of the world that Israel wants no part of stopping expansion especially considering the Israeli Arab population problem.

LOL, your really blaming US (pun intended) for your problems?!?! Wow. Guess we really do need to stop getting involved starting with the huge financial and military aid we give Israel. Add to that much lower hostility by the Arab world toward us as we can finally stop veto'ing the UN security council infractions against Israel. So yes, please LET us stay out of it and let you guys fight your own fight.

[shay_gman 272]

Lol im not blaming US. Im just saying that no good deed go unpunished you wanted to liberate Iraq and this was honorary of you but the end result is the opposite - believe me no one really understand the middle east not even us. It is just a crazy place that I haven't choose to live in and i'll be happy to get the hell out of here if I could.

And by leave us alone I didn't mean US I ment europe. US is Israel greatest ally - and I don't see much flame is coming from the US and mostly when it comes it is for just cause.

And yes this government don't really want peace but they don't want war either. But as long as Israel is being attacked from inside or outside things become more militants on both sides and peace is slipping away.

That is why the best thing is to leave us alone let us throw away our government and work for peace. As long as boycotts are established, economy is slowed, rockets are fired we become more afraid and more turning to the right just like US after 911.

Leave us and we tear ourselves just like we left Gaza, lebanon and Sinai.

Maybe i'm crazy but I do believe Israel can be one day a great example of a country that live together in peace - we have a long way to come and since 1995 it look like we are off-truck but I truly will always believe in peace because I refuse to believe the other way around. But in order for peace to come we all should leave our extremist beliefs - jews and muslims.

Edited August 12, 2014 by shay_gman