Ukraine General

[vilas 477]

http://wiadomosci.wp.pl/kat,1329,title,Separatysci-to-swieta-wojna-przeciw-Zydom-i-heretykom,wid,16725812,wiadomosc.html?ticaid=113017

separatists call for "holy war against Jews, heretics, deviants and Bandera fascists" cause this is "holy war, defend Orthodox Church against Vatican"

i said some time ago - those 2 different values cannot be connected together (pro EU and this almost Taliban-like stuff, guys mixing together Jews and Bandera Neo-Nazis)

guy is of course probably cyco (he generally says that this is war to defend against traitors of Christ), but shows that you cannot be optimistic that 2 groups of people with different wishes for future of their neighborhood can live together under one or another system only (either it is pro-Russia puppet like Yanuk or EU puppet)

without judging values of those groups and problems of Ukraine such as oligarchy system - those 2 groups are divided by very deep ocean of values that cannot coexist for some years

-----------------

Russia claims that Ukrainian troops fired rounds at Russian territory, border guard post

Edited July 1, 2014 by vilas

[spooky lynx 73]

Funny thing is that there's a watermark of "Espresso-TV" (Ukrainian media outlet) at the video. But there are only few UA journalists at the Donbass. So I don't know where do most of UA media outlets get the sources of their news.

[negah 26]

http://wiadomosci.wp.pl/kat,1329,title,Separatysci-to-swieta-wojna-przeciw-Zydom-i-heretykom,wid,16725812,wiadomosc.html?ticaid=113017

separatists call for "holy war against Jews, heretics, deviants and Bandera fascists" cause this is "holy war, defend Orthodox Church against Vatican"

i said some time ago - those 2 different values cannot be connected together (pro EU and this almost Taliban-like stuff, guys mixing together Jews and Bandera Neo-Nazis)

guy is of course probably cyco (he generally says that this is war to defend against traitors of Christ), but shows that you cannot be optimistic that 2 groups of people with different wishes for future of their neighborhood can live together under one or another system only (either it is pro-Russia puppet like Yanuk or EU puppet)

without judging values of those groups and problems of Ukraine such as oligarchy system - those 2 groups are divided by very deep ocean of values that cannot coexist for some years

-----------------

Russia claims that Ukrainian troops fired rounds at Russian territory, border guard post

Vilas, I highly doubt the seriousness of that website you're quoting all the time. Should it be real, it would be reposted everywhere. However even the german Bild magazine, which is known for posting absolutely unproven BS, has not posted it, much less more serious magazines. And such videos can be faked, btw. As someone said it, this war is mainly an informational one.

Edited July 1, 2014 by negah

[vilas 477]

fact that something is not in German media only shows how German business (Rheinmetal) do all to clean Russia in Germany opinion eyes because for busines reasons (German export) Germany doesn't want to harm German-Russian good economical relations,

also western media are biased with "politicall corectness" issues, so for example when imigrants do some crimes, they not report to not cause "racism" and etc.

so do not be surprised that media in one country show, what media in other country NOT

just like in Russian tv i often watch consumer-protection broadcast why ? cause noone in west, and especially in my country, will say anything wrong about big corporations and harm of their products to our health,

media in different countries look for different things cause they are sensitive to some issues,

Germany cooperates with Russia, so German busines know it, Poland was since centuries under Russian occupation or violence, so we inform when Russians do something not right with pleasure ,

makes difference

so do not look at media from point "my national media doesn't show something so this is fake" - i do not do it, i listen to Russian TV, i listen to BBC, i listen to anti-NWO Youtube channels as well, i read from time to time far-left or far-right websites too, to get info from different sources, because there i no website that informs about everything that happens,

cause every website, every TV station, every radiostation - has OWNER and owner has BUSINESS with someone (gov./corporations/church/political party/other entities)

Edited July 1, 2014 by vilas

[negah 26]

fact that something is not in German media only shows how German business (Rheinmetal) do all to clean Russia in Germany opinion eyes because for busines reasons (German export) Germany doesn't want to harm German-Russian good economical relations,

also western media are biased with "politicall corectness" issues, so for example when imigrants do some crimes, they not report to not cause "racism" and etc.

so do not be surprised that media in one country show, what media in other country NOT

just like in Russian tv i often watch consumer-protection broadcast why ? cause noone in west, and especially in my country, will say anything wrong about big corporations and harm of their products to our health,

media in different countries look for different things cause they are sensitive to some issues,

Germany cooperates with Russia, so German busines know it, Poland was since centuries under Russian occupation or violence, so we inform when Russians do something not right with pleasure ,

makes difference

so do not look at media from point "my national media doesn't show something so this is fake" - i do not do it, i listen to Russian TV, i listen to BBC, i listen to anti-NWO Youtube channels as well, i read from time to time far-left or far-right websites too, to get info from different sources, because there i no website that informs about everything that happens,

cause every website, every TV station, every radiostation - has OWNER and owner has BUSINESS with someone (gov./corporations/church/political party/other entities)

I admit I didnt express myself clearly enough. I havent seen that news anywhere except for the link you posted. And I also check different sources, not only my national magazines.

Oh and if Germany is so in love with Russians, why is there so many negative news about Russia in our media?

Russia condemns some stupid chicks who break law --> BAD (although they wouldve got longer sentence in Germany than what theyve got in Russia according to German law).

Russia captures some greenpeace activists on one of their oil stations --> BAD (its good if it happens in Germany though, then theyll be called eco-terrorists).

Olympic Games --> BAD.

Russia does not want to let itself f**k by NATO like every other country does --> VERY VERY BAD.

[Tonci87 163]

[surpher 1]

Simon taking part in webcast live now.

[Tonci87 163]

There is a new interesting Vice report but I can't link it right now.

I'm off to Split, Croatia and won't be around until I get myself a Croatian Sim card. Keep it civilized ;)

[mistyronin 1181]

Here it is. Enjoy your holidays Tonci.

BTW I'm almost the same age as Simon, but I'm in better shape hahaha

[barakokula31 10]

Here it is. Enjoy your holidays Tonci.

BTW I'm almost the same age as Simon, but I'm in better shape hahaha

I haven't been following the news much recently, but are they actually using 152mm howitzers against the guerrillas in Sloviansk? That's kind of overkill, isn't it?

There is a new interesting Vice report but I can't link it right now.

I'm off to Split, Croatia and won't be around until I get myself a Croatian Sim card. Keep it civilized ;)

huehuehue

[mistyronin 1181]

I haven't been following the news much recently, but are they actually using 152mm howitzers against the guerrillas in Sloviansk? That's kind of overkill, isn't it

Well the "guerrilla" that has rocket artillery, tanks, etc. So it makes sense to me. BUT obviously we will have to see how they end using them ( if they shoot volleys against high populated areas... :rolleyes: )

[Tonci87 163]

My favourite Beach bar has free Wifi :)

[mistyronin 1181]

( BBC ) Separatists deny fleeing Sloviansk base

---------- Post added at 12:06 ---------- Previous post was at 10:57 ----------

( Interfax ) Document declaring martial law in Donetsk and Luhansk regions already drafted - NSDC secretary

[mistyronin 1181]

( BBC Flash news ) Ukraine forces raise flag in eastern city of Sloviansk after pro-Russian rebels flee main stronghold, officials say

( RT ) Donetsk militia confirm leaving stronghold city of Slavyansk

The self-defense forces of the Donetsk People’s Republic have left Slavyansk, which is surrounded by the Kiev military, Russian media reported, citing the republic's headquarters.

“The Ukrainian military is in control of Slavyansk,†Channel One reported citing the headquarters of the Donetsk People's Republic. “Early in the morning, the self-defense fighters were forced to leave the city.â€

According to Channel One’s information “there was massive shelling†and then armored vehicles entered Slavyansk and street fighting began. That’s when the self-defense forces took the decision to leave the city, the channel said.

“Despite the massive shooting, the fighters stormed out of the city and headed for neighboring Kramatorsk. Part of their hardware was shot down in the process,†the channel said.

Rossiya 24 channel also reported that self-defense forces had quit Slavyansk, and moved their HQ to Kramatorsk.

( BBC ) Rebels abandon Sloviansk stronghold

( Al Jazeera ) Ukraine pushes rebels from eastern stronghold

Defence minister says national flag is flying over Slovyansk after the retreat of outnumbered pro-Russian separatists.

[Tonci87 163]

That is very meaningfull.

[mistyronin 1181]

It's a shame that RT has removed their masterpiece on propaganda, but at least you can read the comment section.

( RT ) ‘Leaked plan’ on E. Ukraine suggests internment camps, executions

A leaked memo suggests the Ukrainian govt should engage in an all-out war in the east, including placing citizens in internment camps and killing all who resist such actions. RAND corporation think tank however denies producing such document.

Now is:

Error 404

Page not found

This might be because:

— You have typed the web address incorrectly, or

— the page you were looking for may have been moved, updated or deleted.

[mistyronin 1181]

Ukraine's flag in Slaviansk:

( from BBC's Ukraine President Poroshenko hails 'turning point' )

BTW a bit off-topic, but does anyone knows what kind of AK 74 is the one of the guy in the photo?

[lesscubes 1]

Ukraine's flag in Slaviansk:

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/76075000/jpg/_76075031_76074892.jpg

( from BBC's Ukraine President Poroshenko hails 'turning point' )

BTW a bit off-topic, but does anyone knows what kind of AK 74 is the one of the guy in the photo?

It's not a 74. It's in 7.62x39 (look at the curve on the mag) I'm assuming usual Ukraine AK's are Russian-made? (I've never seen an AK marked as being Ukrainian, but that's the US civilian market... Most of our new ones are Russian or Bulgarian, rebuilds from parts kits are typically Yugo or Polish.) It's got Israeli furniture on it- the buttstock and handguard are from MAKO or FAB I think. Also, his optic (A Aimpoint T-1 or copy thereof) is on backwards.

[vilas 477]

it is modernized AKM

but hard to tell who produced those parts Misty ,

it can be US-origins upgrade (seen some on internet as well as those parts are loved by ASG) and seen similar in Ukraine,

only by searching details it could be told who produce elements, which could be put together by individual person

https://www.zfi-inc.com/en/m4-akms-p-buttstock-an-m16m4-collapsible-side-folding-stock-with-a-polymer-joint

but buttstock for 99% looks USA-made

http://www.wallpino.com/weapons-equipment/akm-kalashnikov-modernized-117225.html

foregrip looks very similar to this above

or Ukrainian made by Fort:

http://www.fort.vn.ua/en/products/modernization-of-ak47-akm-ak74.html

Ukrainian Fort company seems not to produce those buttstocks as above, but foregrip , maybe it is from Fort, maybe from USA private company

[spooky lynx 73]

It's not a 74. It's in 7.62x39 (look at the curve on the mag) I'm assuming usual Ukraine AK's are Russian-made? (I've never seen an AK marked as being Ukrainian, but that's the US civilian market... Most of our new ones are Russian or Bulgarian, rebuilds from parts kits are typically Yugo or Polish.) It's got Israeli furniture on it- the buttstock and handguard are from MAKO or FAB I think. Also, his optic (A Aimpoint T-1 or copy thereof) is on backwards.

All AK's in Ukraine army inventory are either of USSR or Russia origin. Those 'produced' by Fort are 'civilized' (with semi-auto fire only) USSR-made AKM and AKMS from warestocks left by Soviet army. The only one AK derivative produced in Ukraine was bullpup version of AK-74.

As for the photo - look here - it may be 'hunting carbine Fort-206' - IRL semi-auto AKM with blackjack and hookers.

[mistyronin 1181]

Uhm, I just wonder how could that AK end there with all that modifications.

[spooky lynx 73]

Man from a pic could be from various NG or other non-army batallions, they arm themselves often. BTW it's not forbidden to mount any stuff you can buy at your weapon in army too. Moreover UA army seniors would be happy if servicemen will equip themselves:)

[surpher 1]

Current situation.

[mistyronin 1181]

BTW it's not forbidden to mount any stuff you can buy at your weapon in army too. Moreover

That's there, in the army I served as a professional the only "customized" thing I could get were boots, and only during a mission.

[negah 26]

That's there, in the army I served as a professional the only "customized" thing I could get were boots, and only during a mission.

Same goes for the german Bundeswehr. Although some of our NCOs would sometimes wear non standardized headgear and camo parka, but if they dared to appear this way to the muster, they were sent back by the officer, and that officer didnt care that he was reprimanding our commander in front of us. However it can be different in other armies. For instance I wouldnt be surprised, if the UA army would even encourage their soldiers to arm themselves, seeing how funding is one huge problem for them.