Death Valley: WTF, BI

[instagoat 133]

Okay, I am a bit angry right now, so my post may not be up to cuts, but I feel somewhat validated in voicing a complaint.

1: this is exactly the same as the demo mission

2: It has the same problems

3: Difficulty of this mission is bonkers.

I have played on veteran through the campaign, with 0 to 1 reverts on each mission, mostly 0.

This mission I have 12 ish reverts now and never even got past the first checkpoint. Out of all of those retries, only once did any teammembers survive past the alpha point casualty (as in, they walked up to the rock there, and got shot immediately.). I had one occasion where my team didn`t even get off one single shot once spotted, and was wiped out wholesale.

Can you please explain to me how you are supposed to win this mission without hanging back, waiting for your team to get killed, and then lone-gunning it? (Which isn`t possible outside of CQB because the AI for some reason is -freakishly- accurate in this mission. In all previous ones, no hits, this one, people sniping from 400 meters (beach) up to the hill to the right side of where alpha point was, with ironsights, and killing me by faceshots. Meanwhile, my own "team" (the only time someone survived, literally only -one- guy made it past the first checkpoint) bungles down the valley floor, and gets shot. Literally, one single shot.

No spoilers since I haven`t even gotten to the meat of hte mission, because you can`t even survive the flipping intro.

All settings are default, no mods are used, no dev version is used. I have done no tweaks to the config as far as AI either.

[Sniperwolf572 758]

Yeah, it's like Showcase Infantry, but it's not a 1:1 copy as it's obvious even by intro alone.

The strategy that worked for me is to not follow the team and additonally don't go into the forest on the south. You are way too exposed there due to the enemy locations. The enemy will just pick off your squad and then you'll be a lone wolf. Go up the north hill a bit, behind one of the rocks that will give you cover from the enemies in the valley AND the enemies on the ridge that way you can spot them before your team gets ambushed by the enemies advancing through the trees in the valley. Apply grenade launcher to the enemies in the valley then engage the enemies on the hill. After that cross the valley to the forest side and engage the village from behind the rocks that are on the east side of it.

From there on, you shouldn't have any issues. I used this tactic in Showcase Infantry and when I realised it's like Infantry, I just did the same and it worked on the first try.

I'd agree that you'd probably have a very hard time if you don't take the initiative as that's how Infantry plays out as well. It's a brutal mission if you just follow your squad around where the other missions are ok.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Sniperwolf572

[instagoat 133]

Yeah, it's like Showcase Infantry, but it's not a 1:1 copy as it's obvious even by intro alone.

The strategy that worked for me is to not follow the team and additonally don't go into the forest on the south. You are way too exposed there due to the enemy locations. The enemy will just pick off your squad and then you'll be a lone wolf. Go up the north hill a bit, behind one of the rocks that will give you cover from the enemies in the valley AND the enemies on the ridge that way you can spot them before your team gets ambushed by the enemies advancing through the trees in the valley. Apply grenade launcher to the enemies in the valley then engage the enemies on the hill. After that cross the valley to the forest side and engage the village from behind the rocks that are on the east side of it.

From there on, you shouldn't have any issues. I used this tactic in Showcase Infantry and when I realised it's like Infantry, I just did the same and it worked on the first try.

I'd agree that you'd probably have a very hard time if you don't take the initiative as that's how Infantry plays out as well. It's a brutal mission if you just follow your squad around where the other missions are ok.

I`d be okay with that if I had any Idea wether or not losing the team has any impact on the campaign. But then I wouldn`t get why they introduced the Orbat view: I thought the point of that was to see which enemy units have been knocked out?

But, generally, I think the harsh jump in difficulty is bad design. I never managed to finish infantry either, because the mission always broke for me when my team got killed. Once I got into the building bravo is in, and nothing happened. (Got script errors, though). That was in early beta. I abandoned the mission then, which is why I am so annoyed to find it now in the campaign, unaltered and still as badly designed as before. I mean, nice demo, but this kind of difficulty would go better with a late game mission rather than this early in the game.

[x3kj 1247]

Played on regular and had to do 3 reverts because i had to figure out the drone controlls first (and to find out that for some reason i cant controll it via mouse - only keyboard), then find the spotters and keep the thing stable while aimed at them, with a keyboard...

I think 1 or 2 guys died on the way to the village but nothing too terrible.

However i dont directly follow the idiot AI. I always are on slightly above them left or right. That way i can also see enemies earlier.

[Sniperwolf572 758]

I`d be okay with that if I had any Idea wether or not losing the team has any impact on the campaign. But then I wouldn`t get why they introduced the Orbat view: I thought the point of that was to see which enemy units have been knocked out?

But, generally, I think the harsh jump in difficulty is bad design. I never managed to finish infantry either, because the mission always broke for me when my team got killed. Once I got into the building bravo is in, and nothing happened. (Got script errors, though). That was in early beta. I abandoned the mission then, which is why I am so annoyed to find it now in the campaign, unaltered and still as badly designed as before. I mean, nice demo, but this kind of difficulty would go better with a late game mission rather than this early in the game.

Yeah, I agree, jump in difficulty for that mission is probably frustrating in a campaign setting because you are accustomed to following your team and dealing with things as they come where in this scenario you kinda have to play it as a babysitter for your AI. Even in Infantry it doesn't seem to be that bad.

But anyway, to answer your question, I had only one casualty on it with that strategy as when you spot the enemies early, your own squad becomes much more alert and effective, otherwise they all just run into the enemy and get slaughtered if you don't spot for them.

People dying doesn't seem to have any effect in this part of the campaign as there's another silly behavior from the AI in "Radio Silence" where my squad all died and I couldn't do much there. I believe they fixed that so the dead people won't come back, but you also won't run out of teammates by the end.

Edited November 1, 2013 by Sniperwolf572

[jeza 5416]

I was killed once on the hill trying to flank, then fine till having to use the drone which I crashed into the enemy. Eventually got by it though by playing regular mode.

[x3kj 1247]

I believe they fixed that so the dead people won't come back, but you also won't run out of teammates by the end.

Camp maxwell is kinda pointless, because it's always the same (always the same amount of people doing the same thing) except you have to always report to another dude in another location. Sooo exciting *yawn*

So much for the "survive" part of the campaign.

[antoineflemming 14]

Has no impact whatsoever. Don't sweat it. The mission design isn't the best IMO. Not smart to go through the valley...

[Sniperwolf572 758]

Camp maxwell is kinda pointless, because it's always the same (always the same amount of people doing the same thing) except you have to always report to another dude in another location. Sooo exciting *yawn*

So much for the "survive" part of the campaign.

Yeah, I agree, it appears dull as a mission hub after you've seen it once. I'm not even sure what you mean by "report to another dude in another location", because all the visits to Maxwell after the first one, for me slowly devolved into running straight to Miller and launching the next mission as it didn't seem to noticeably change.

But this thread isn't exactly the right place to discuss that.

[x3kj 1247]

Has no impact whatsoever. Don't sweat it. The mission design isn't the best IMO. Not smart to go through the valley...

It's not the only mission with unrealistic behaviour... in Wet Work they drive off in a Truck with lights shining bright, in Crossing Paths they walk up to 150m near an enemy outpost right on the street and fight with IR-laser enabled the entire time... Luckily the enemy as well which makes them easy to find. Pretty stupid and immersion breaking if you ask me.

[NeuroFunker 11]

i had problems spoting that spotters, failed about 4 times because of them, yes its more hardcore then showcase one, but i had more trouble with soppers, then fight through to the village.

[MissionCreep 12]

Like snpierwolf said, separate from the squad and stay left and uphill, scouting and providing covering fire for your squad from the high ground. Meet back up with the squad leader down the hill once you are out of the woods near the village.

Regarding use of the drone, I searched for the spotter using the thermal camera on the drone (the spotter is seen peering through binoculars) and then put the laser on him. Within a few seconds, he was hit by an explosion (presumably some kind of laser-guided munition). There are lots of "functional easter eggs". You can end "radio silence" (much of the time) by going the large map on the easel at the briefing area, clickng on it and then use the scroll menu to "Start Briefing". I don't think this is documented anywhere but it beats having to listen to the same old lame conversations at the base.

Edited November 1, 2013 by MissionCreep

[Fushko 59]

Completed on regular, first person only, 0 reverts, my whole team died very early in the mission, but I managed to kill all the enemies.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Well, i retried a few times until i master the UAV piloting, but i didn't have other problems.

[artemas 1]

The squad lead even tells you to stay on the hill on the left.

[instagoat 133]

The squad lead even tells you to stay on the hill on the left.

My problem is the AI not doing that. I can just hang back and then lone wolf the mission if necessary, but I expected the mission to be set up better for the AI to do their job. Or maybe I am just a really bad player by now? idk.

[lavbo0321 5]

I have enjoyed Survive very much so far. The only time I came close to actually dying was when trying to link up the Brits. I kept running into AAF patrols and had to use my picked up enemy GL and then throw out some white smoke and hook around them fine.

I have had no bugs or glitch's and the enemy AI seems well balanced in regards to skill levels. Some are wicked good and some suck balls. Just like in real life.

The only thing I have noticed is that every encounter with the enemy in these BI games are meeting engagements. I suppose if the enemy behaved like real professional infantry, and would dig in on key terrain and/or set up ambushes, the game wouldn't be that much fun. You would be running around like a chicken with your head cut and getting killed. And not to mention that Stratis is a very small island. If the AAF had a mortar section and zeroed in on camp Maxwell, it would be game over.

[maffa 29]

i can only relate to OP frustration and the second poster's advice. Also, mind that 40mm ARE BROKEN. They should have a 15m mortality range and 15m lethality range, but if you dont manage to deliver it into their hands you are not likely to get much result -much likely a .5 meters mortal range and 1.5 lethality.

I also played the whole mission on veteran, and no other missons made me sweat like this. Not the best scripted mission out there (together with the last one, both alpha and bravo get swept out as soon as you all approach the base you are supposed to clean up just after rejoin, and there's nothing you can do).

My advice/playthu.

Equip yourself with an RCO sight, and take plenty 40mm HE grenades, at least 10.

Climb to the first rock on the right uphill, shoot a couple grenades to the enemy squad coming from center, whether you get them or not youll divert some fire from your squad leaving them a little space to take cover ad pick their shoots. Try to stay in cover and at the same time look for the contacts from far right skyline ridge, so stay prone to the right side of your beloved rock. I usually pick them up with long shoots, again trying to get their attention, but regardless if you get them or not, after a few bullets (5-6) change side of your rock and return fire to those inside the valley again.

Keep the enemy offguard and let the squad do the rest.

In CQC i usually stay on the right side climbing the cliff a little and try to get as many enemies as possible. Keep in mind that it's highly likely you may lose all your squad in this phase, nothing you can do about it. You cant do a thing because enemies can shoot even if you are under concealement so bushes wont help you, only them.

Once you manage to clear the village, take the ruck from the UAV operator as it is and the UAV terminal, place it on the ground and take it again: i had to do it in order to make the contextual "OPEN UAV TERMINAL" command appear. Assemble the quadricopter, fly high and move toward the valley you came from, change control to the turret, go thermal, zoom all in on your targets, and "fire" the laser designator on them: someone will instakill them. If nothing happens, change control back to UAV, move closer, rinse repeat. Then run like hell back to Maxwell.

This is it.

[NeMeSiS 11]

16+ tries, edited regular, friendly skill @ 0.75, enemy skill at 0.60.

My team died every single time as soon as they saw the enemy, barely fighting back. After dying on that hill trying to cover them for 16+ times i decided to just move to a better position (straight into town, where it was harder for the enemy to suppress and flank me) and i managed to do it straight away with 2 surviving teammembers. Well, maybe they magically respawned after i completed the objective.... :p

This was the only mission i did not like. I hated it in the alpha and i hate it now.

Edited November 2, 2013 by NeMeSiS

[jblack9 10]

Like snpierwolf said, separate from the squad and stay left and uphill, scouting and providing covering fire for your squad from the high ground. Meet back up with the squad leader down the hill once you are out of the woods near the village.

Regarding use of the drone, I searched for the spotter using the thermal camera on the drone (the spotter is seen peering through binoculars) and then put the laser on him. Within a few seconds, he was hit by an explosion (presumably some kind of laser-guided munition). There are lots of "functional easter eggs". You can end "radio silence" (much of the time) by going the large map on the easel at the briefing area, clickng on it and then use the scroll menu to "Start Briefing". I don't think this is documented anywhere but it beats having to listen to the same old lame conversations at the base.

FINDING THESE SPOTTERS IS DRIVING ME FUCKING CRAZY! I even went and walked around on foot to try and find them no luck!

How do you turn the thermal cam on when using the dart?

[barakokula31 10]

FINDING THESE SPOTTERS IS DRIVING ME FUCKING CRAZY! I even went and walked around on foot to try and find them no luck!

How do you turn the thermal cam on when using the dart?

Have you tried N?

[purepassion 22]

FINDING THESE SPOTTERS IS DRIVING ME FUCKING CRAZY! I even went and walked around on foot to try and find them no luck!

How do you turn the thermal cam on when using the dart?

You take over the turret controls and then switch to FLIR with "N"

[jblack9 10]

You take over the turret controls and then switch to FLIR with "N"

Thanks guys I turned on N, but still can't find the spotters, can somebody PLEASE describe to me where they are

[barakokula31 10]

You take over the turret controls and then switch to FLIR with "N"

Haha, ninja'd you!

[jblack9 10]

Can anybody give me any directions, I'm seriously about to stop playing the campaign this is so frustrating.