A message for all modmakers

[Snoopy 0]

BAN THEM ALL, LET HILLY SORT EM OUT

just kidding

[N.o.R.S.u 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Well Hilly made a pinned thread for people to show what they were working on, but everyone whined at him so he removed it.<span id='postcolor'>

Hilly's thread was too early, he made it when Kegetys released his Hawk and everybody (including Hilly I think) were thinking that new O2-made addons are made very rapidly after Kegetys's Hawk. But that wasn't the case and the topic hadn't any point because there weren't any addons around, only unfinished models. But now things are changed and the topic would work .

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> sometimes wonder why us modmakers do this....

I mean we just create some stuff that looks very nice ingame for us, and if we do not release it to the communtiy, everybody will be whining at us. So when we HAVE released it to the community, all you get are a bunch of people complaining about bugs.

Well anyway we do this for fun, not for the respect of the community (probably some people that we never knew with nicknames)<span id='postcolor'>

Most people think (including me ) that modmakers are some kind of "chosen ones" who have the "magical tool" called O2 . Not everyone has it, so those who don't have it, they want to see something made for their use because they can't do it even if they had the skill for it.

[nolips71 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jakerod @ Aug. 12 2002,15:22)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ya the van is pretty cool but why is there a russian gunner and an american flag on it? Why would there be a russian in an american van?<span id='postcolor'>

maybee has is after the tv in the back of the tv repair mans van? and is willing 2 defend it?

[Antichrist 0]

WE ARE THE CHOSEN ONES!!!!!!!!

[STS_SolidSnake 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Antichrist @ Aug. 13 2002,03:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">WE ARE THE CHOSEN ONES!!!!!!!!  <span id='postcolor'>

and i am The One

[colonel_klink 0]

And I am the Other One! Interesting thread.

[Scorpio 0]

And i am the Other Other One.

[Guest]

And I am the one who is going to close or move this topic unless it goes back on track

It is an interesting and releveant discussion you have going, don't spoil it.

[Supah 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Scorpio @ Aug. 12 2002,17:26)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">. So when we HAVE released it to the community, all you get are a bunch of people complaining about bugs.

Well anyway we do this for fun, not for the respect of the community (probably some people that we never knew with nicknames)<span id='postcolor'>

One could argue that those people who "complain about bugs" are actually helping you work out anything you may have missed in the process of making the addon, somethings you may never have ran into due to the crazy things some people do but you dont. Dont see it as nagging but just as helping!

[Rastavovich 0]

@supah: Yes, of course they all want help (well not actually all, there are also some which only want to demonstrate that all can be done better).

The problem is, that a lot of people doesn't critizise in a helpfull way. For example: They see that a texture is missing or not correct placed (what can happen sometimes, all addonmakers are still humans) and their bugreport is not "There is a texture missing", it sounds more like "Haha, learn how to skin". That can really piss addonmakers off.

Also that 100%-perfect-thinking is something that can really be disturbing. Something like: "Well in real life that screw is 2mm more to the left" or "Why can't this vehicle transport 8 ppl + 2 crew?".

Then there are also the "think-they-know-all-better-because-they-saw-it-somewhere"-ppl. Those are my favourits. For example:

"Why can't your patria swim, cause I know the real patria is able to swim" (that complain I saw about 8 times in different forums). Well, the problem there is, that the version we have released cannot swim due to heavier armor.

In general I would say: let around 2-3 days go by before you place the first bugreports (then you have enough time to check all aspects of an addon). Believe me, there is nothing more annoying then getting the first whiners, when you released your addon 15 minutes ago. (In that place I wanna say sorry to BIS because I critisized their 1.2 patch, guys you did a great work and I was just to blind to see the work behind it).

Now back to the main topic: Why we release prerelease pics of addons?

We don't do that for fun (well ok, we also do it for fun), we most time do it to check the feedback of the "end-users". If they all say allready there: "naaa, what a crap", I don't have to spend hours/days to make an addon release rdy.

[Adammo 0]

hmm some very interesting and telling info in this thread...

btw did u notice that I don't show pic of the C130 anymore.. yes it is being skinned right now by an EXPERT skinner.. and wow he is doing a good job..

Us mod makers spend lots of time working on these addons..and when they are released people complain about them.. and that takes ALL the fun out of the hundreds of hours of trying to get the thing to look and play right...

so don't spoil the fun guys.. or the addons will slow down.. this is only human nature..

example when the "screw" chopper was relased most people complained that the mod maker should have spent his time working on something else.. like something THEY wanted..

I think that thread would have gone better if it had constructive critizism and or praise... they both help alot.. because you never know.. he could have made his NEXT addon when you wanted.. but now.. (who knows)

Capt Moore

[Scorpio 0]

i agree with Rastavovich and Adammo, some good points there.

[Supah 0]

Rastavovich: I agree some people need to express themselves better. I understand it must be a pain to slave over some addon only to have some "kid" put it down. But what ever you do you will always have those kind off people. Just use the constructive critizisme and endulge in the compliments:) I dont make addons but it must be nice to see people enthousiastic over something you made. Ignore the whiners. I think thats the only way to still keep it a fun thing.

[Antichrist 0]

That is why you should never make what people want, but make what you want! If they don't like it tell'em to get lost!

[Supah 0]

Antichrist: Well thats a good point too! But do you still release it to the public? I mean i enjoyed kegetsys his DIY addons ALLOT great fun shooting enemies with a nailgun.

[Antichrist 0]

Well that's another point I made in some other topic, I will never release any separate addons to the public, only with a campaign or at least couple of good quality missions (briefing, intro, outro, custom sounds etc.)

[Major Fubar 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (STS_SolidSnake @ Aug. 11 2002,19:42)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hello fella modmakers

i suggest you only talk about your addon only when finished and released , like kegetys does, so we wont be hoping of something to come out and that never comes out (ie: Vixer's UH-1N)

It's better to talk about your addon when you release it

My opinion  <span id='postcolor'>

Couldn't agree with you more...well said.

The only time I like to see in progress stuff is when the creator is asking for feedback from the forum members.

[rat 0]

why not simply adopt a universal classification to indicate addon status

ie......ver.99 is 99% complete.....ver 75 75% etc

then ver 1.0 is 1st release 1.1.....1st revision etc

everyone can have their cake.........ie u know what to expect so dl if u want it or wait for 1.0

[Antichrist 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (rat @ Aug. 18 2002,04:29)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">why not simply adopt a universal classification to indicate addon status

ie......ver.99 is 99% complete.....ver 75  75% etc

then ver 1.0 is 1st release 1.1.....1st revision etc

everyone  can have their cake.........ie u know what to expect so dl if u want it or wait for 1.0<span id='postcolor'>

The problem with that is that I might consider addon to be .75 ready, but some other ModMaker might consider same addon to be 1.0 ready!

[VXR 9]

yeah but thats up to the modmaker i think he says about his addon if its done or not

[mahuja 12]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (rat @ Aug. 18 2002,05:29)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">why not simply adopt a universal classification to indicate addon status

ie......ver.99 is 99% complete.....ver 75  75% etc

then ver 1.0 is 1st release 1.1.....1st revision etc

everyone  can have their cake.........ie u know what to expect so dl if u want it or wait for 1.0<span id='postcolor'>

Because after a bit of feedback he finds it isn't 90% done anyway, it's more like 45%.

I believe an incremental versioning is best (e.g. v 0.1 first beta 0.2 second until 1.0 which is the 'release' with such a "percent done" optionally on the side.

But again, someone can probably point out flaws in that too. No system is perfect.

[CrunchyFrog 0]

This is TOTALLY up to the individual addon author...

if he wants to sends out some pics of his work, before its complete/released... dont critise him for it!

[USSoldier11B 0]

I agree. Modmakers bragging about all the mods that they are going to make really clogs up the add-on/mods section of the forum. Plus the dissapointment of seeing good ideas never get realized get painful after a while. Such as the elusive C-130. Will someone just make one so I can die happy?