Where is everyone?

[chortles 263]

I don't think it's BI's fault to be honest. It's more Day/WarZ's fault than BI's. BI is the vehicle, Wasteland/Zombie kiddies are the passengers. Destination: fail lol

Sounds like a case of "why shouldn't Maruk milk the hype for all it's worth"? :lol:

Seriously though, the early days of the public alpha and the sheer rage were hilarious. Heck, even the Steamworks announcement's immediate aftermath was amazing.

Going to be interesting to see how the population sorts out between stable and dev now that the MP security patch has come to stable branch.

[Ginastic 10]

I'm waiting for new content, mostly Altis

[DaRkL3AD3R 1]

Sounds like a case of "why shouldn't Maruk milk the hype for all it's worth"? :lol:

Seriously though, the early days of the public alpha and the sheer rage were hilarious. Heck, even the Steamworks announcement's immediate aftermath was amazing.

Going to be interesting to see how the population sorts out between stable and dev now that the MP security patch has come to stable branch.

It's going to go back to 90% of the population on stable builds playing their Wasteland 24/7 servers.

Whatever. I'll stay on the dev branch and look forward to day by day updates and fixes.

[Elutheral 10]

dunno if anyone mentioned it but it is finals week for schools. Might count for some missing players, including myself :P

[WalkerDown 1]

Yes, they have clearly overestimated the average intelligence of their target market.

Nor only overestimated, they simply ignored it, and now they (in reality it's us, they are still ignoring it.. lol) are pointing it is... alpha.

[Mattar_Tharkari 10]

Yes, the "error" (if we could call it as an "error") has been to put this alpha on Steam.

They already explained the logic behind all this and I think it was a good decision. As for all the serial whinging, impatience and general short sightedness, takes me no time at all to ignore it lol. I just hope some of them spend some time in the editor and explore some of the community made mods and scripts so they can see what this game is capable of if used properly. I haven't found a single published MP mission that is anywhere near pushing the boundaries.

[Hillsbills 1]

I bought the Alpha to get on board early, no desire to really play it as is. I mess around in the editor, other than that I'll be back later.

[mr.g-c 6]

I dont see a problem... i play tested the ALPHA!!! also some time in MP and now i just continue checking for other bugs/long-term glitches in the editor, test improvements, etc.

For me MP only again with beta testing and then final with ACE3 mod.

[jw custom 56]

I bought the Alpha to get on board early, no desire to really play it as is. I mess around in the editor, other than that I'll be back later.

Which is just fine and expected of the majority of the alpha buyers(just a guess).

The real problem lies in people not being able understand the term ALPHA, in game terms that is.

[WalkerDown 1]

Again? BIS decided to put a "something" (alpha, beta, gamma, delta.. whatever) on STEAM <<< S T E A M ... are you so naïve to believe that GAMERS on steam thinks beyond those terms? No matter how logic it appears to YOU, we are talking about a bunch of persons that know how to turn on a PC (or better a console) to only play certain GAMES, they doesn't care at all at those developers stuff, they ONLY WANTS TO PLAY A GAME, and in the moment you give them "something", they expect to play that "something" as they play anything else (a finished game in example). Again, for the 100 time, this is steam not kickstarter, the audience is complete different.

You're going to sell a prototype in a traditional car shop, then you're blaming the customers because they doesn't understand that the PROTOTYPE is missing the headlights.. saying they are "stupid" because they doesn't understand what "prototype" means.. and the word PROTOTYPE was so big, how they missed it? Nope: it's YOUR mistake to have chosen the wrong platform (or to be exact: the right platform on the paper, but the wrong platform if you look at the customers).

People aren't "stupid", they just doesn't care.

[chortles 263]

But who's blaming who? At this point I think BI is too much in love with these "GAMERS on steam"'s money to mind. ;)

[Harzach 2517]

Nope: it's YOUR mistake to have chosen the wrong platform (or to be exact: the right platform on the paper, but the wrong platform if you look at the customers).

People aren't "stupid", they just doesn't care.

Again, buyer beware/caveat emptor. It is clearly labeled "Alpha" and "Early Access Game". That so many customers choose to ignore or remain ignorant of what that means is not BI's fault.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Again, buyer beware/caveat emptor. It is clearly labeled "Alpha" and "Early Access Game". That so many customers choose to ignore or remain ignorant of what that means is not BI's fault.

Exactly. I fail to see what the distribution platform has to do with this.

[ak1287 1]

Exactly. I fail to see what the distribution platform has to do with this.

Elitism, mainly?

I honestly don't see the correlation either. The fact that people are being stupid (yes, Walker, that's EXACTLY what they're doing, since willful ignorance is the same as stupidity) has nothing to do with Steam, other than the fact that Steam exists in a culture that fosters this type of behavior.

[Gunter Severloh 4057]

Lets not forget those that are unable to get the Alpha due to computer's issues, or unable to meet system requirements, and or pay for upgrade replacement of computer.

Shit cost money, so you wont see me in it probably til its complete and released.

[WalkerDown 1]

Exactly. I fail to see what the distribution platform has to do with this.

The distribution platform determines the target customers. If you sell Arma on a dedicate website, you will have a certain number (probably the majority) of ppl that understand perfectly what they are purchasing and what to expect. If you place ArmA3 on the homepage of Steam with a full screen advertising, saying: "BUY ME NOW!" .. you will have another type of users: kids, gamers, chaps that MAY not understand what an alpha is. You may call em stupid if this makes you feel better, but they are the majority, and so you have to accept you did a mistake (even if the mistake is to pretend to teach what's "alpha" means to a "bunch of idiots").

[jw custom 56]

Well when "those" people who doesn't understand the meaning of an alpha comes in here complaining about lack of content etc. and then get an explanation yet still complains in every post they make, then i refuse to believe it's because of ignorance!

[chortles 263]

At this point, why would BI mind? They've got "those" people's money, and all they have to do in return is push out the beta and final release content when those roll around. :D

[.kju 3244]

Because it affects future sales and player numbers overall negatively.. it is not that hard to understand, is it?

[WalkerDown 1]

Well when "those" people who doesn't understand the meaning of an alpha comes in here complaining about lack of content etc. and then get an explanation yet still complains in every post they make, then i refuse to believe it's because of ignorance!

It's because the lack of information given to these users (look at the change logs.. we had to ask for them many times before having some.. and it's not even complete!).

Most of the complains are about:

- Very bad performance (mainly due to the old game engine): BIS recognized the problem only partially, they didn't even mentioned about it on the website (when you say: it's alpha! ..but they are someway "hiding" some important game issues, while exposing the minor ones), but they gave no detailed explanation of how they will solve the problem, neither they confirmed they WILL solve the problem... and so these ppl continues to complain in every post;

- Cheaters all around (due to the no-anticheat presence): they said there's no anticheat, but they didn't told us WHY there's no anti-cheat, they didn't even mentioned WHY there's no script-logging, they only said there will be one... but when? And so ppl continuously asks for it...

- Lack of contents: ppl are asking to have more, but they are still developing the game, but they could give a less generic roadmap of when we could expect more contents (example: In June), so these ppl will stop asking for it, and will return in June.

...BIS may be working hard behind the scene, but their "PR" department is very poor, they doesn't communicate very well with their customers, and this is another point that you should consider when you decide to put your product on steam: until "yesterday" here on this forum we had only a bunch of hardcore gamers and arma "experts", but then it got full of "traditional gamers" asking for questions and complaining about things, BIS wasn't/isn't prepared for this, their level of communication is (IMO) not acceptable.

[nodunit 397]

Would you rathe be given an expected release only to have it pushed back a dozen times over or just a rough guestimate?

[jw custom 56]

but then it got full of "traditional gamers" asking for questions and complaining about things, BIS wasn't/isn't prepared for this, their level of communication is (IMO) not acceptable.

Oh i thought those "traditional steam gamers" were used to play traditional games where dialog/interaction with the devs are rare.

[WalkerDown 1]

Oh i thought those "traditional steam gamers" were used to play traditional games where dialog/interaction with the devs are rare.

Yes, finished games (or we assume they are...), with a alpha you should expect to have much more communication (especially because of the complains) and you must be prepared to handle "the mass", giving em some reasonable replies, not by just repeating: "it's alpha!" ... it won't lead you anywhere, and you'll have those ppl asking about the same thing over and over again.

Usually a alpha (or even a beta) would be tested by selected people (that would sure understand the difference), but this is a PUBLIC alpha... and nowadays I see so many developers vomiting out their products to "normal" gamers (most of them to collect some easy cash) in a very early stage, without being prepared to handle the (obvious) situation that will come.

[Sneakson 1]

Where people are? Other places.

The Alpha is essentially a demo in content. After you're through with it you move on to other things until there's new content. Where do you expect people to be? Playing the demo non-stop for 6 months?

I'm currently concentrating on other games and in the past week I've been playing Ninja Gaiden and the next week I'm hoping to get started on the 1st generation of Pokémon games.

I think people are being extremely impatient and immature about this whole deal. Especially those mentioned by WalkerDown.

I'll give you some answers right away:

1) The general quality of the game engine will improve over the next several months of development.

2) There is no anti-cheating because it's not ready to be deployed yet. But there will be anti-cheating.

3) There is no road-map because there is no road-map. We don't know. They don't know either. Video game developers make their own deadlines to a certain extent and the game will enter beta when it is ready.

There is nothing wrong with their PR. Evidently 99% of all the alpha testers are idiots and don't deserve answers. If they spent all their time here they wouldn't have time to develop the game.

People are freaking out thinking the game will be released unstable, without anti-cheating and without notice.

But what would BIS gain in doing so?

BIS are working their best because their economy, sales, ratings and reputation are on the line and they have no reason to want to intentionally create a bad game.

So chill the fuck out people.

I'm not even going to go into greater detail explaining how I know the engine will improve or why there is no anti-cheating or road-map right now because of how fucking dumb it is to even ask.

---------- Post added at 03:58 ---------- Previous post was at 03:52 ----------

Yes, finished games (or we assume they are...), with a alpha you should expect to have much more communication (especially because of the complains) and you must be prepared to handle "the mass", giving em some reasonable replies, not by just repeating: "it's alpha!" ... it won't lead you anywhere, and you'll have those ppl asking about the same thing over and over again.

Usually a alpha (or even a beta) would be tested by selected people (that would sure understand the difference), but this is a PUBLIC alpha... and nowadays I see so many developers vomiting out their products to "normal" gamers (most of them to collect some easy cash) in a very early stage, without being prepared to handle the (obvious) situation that will come.

Communication isn't great? I think it's great. You want to get in touch with them do it through the feedback tracker, I've had nearly half of my reports looked at personally by BIS.

And as to why they're not in the forum reading every single post -- why would they? It would be a ton of work and most bullshit people say here is just ranting the same thing over and over again.

Once you reach a meaningful conclusion on a topic and you want to share it bis BIS seriously you use the feedback tracker in a respectable way. If people agree they upvote, otherwise you'll have to accept your issue is minor.

And why ISN'T it enough to say "it's alpha"? It's the truth and nothing but the truth. Saying it's alpha should be enough.

BIS have already confirmed that sounds will be changed etc but people still complain about various sounds ALL the time. But it's alpha. Just saying that implies that things will change. And they will.

A lot of people seem to think they're entitled to some sort of opinion because they bought the alpha but they're not.

They're entitled to a finish product and getting to play the alpha and beta is just a bonus.

What BIS get in return are the loads of helpful user reports in the feedback tracker that undeniably exist. And we get to have some fun.

Currently we're having a very fruitful exchange with BIS, even if it is not apparent to everyone.

Edited May 5, 2013 by Sneakson

[jw custom 56]

Yes, finished games (or we assume they are...), with a alpha you should expect to have much more communication

I thought those "traditional steam gamers" had no expectations regarding alpha's as they are be too stupid to know what an alpha is... no seriously i think the majority of complainers are just "me me me, it must be my way or no way" people.